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« Rangers Sign Sidney Ponson | Main | Odds and Ends: Loretta, German, Belliard, Baldelli »
Sox Not Interested in Marquis or Fuld for Crisp
Coco Crisp may be on the Cubs' wish list, but neither Jason Marquis nor Sam Fuld will be enough to get a deal done with the Red Sox. Diffusing the rumblings from earlier today, Nick Cafardo in the Boston Globe is reporting tonight that the Sox aren't particularly interested in either player.
"If the Cubs were to talk trade with the Red Sox," he says, "it would have to be for a different set of names - either prospects or bullpen help."
Posted by Andrew Stoeten of Drunk Jays Fans
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Well no surprise there. I'm sure Theo won't just give Crisp away for nothing.
Posted by: SierraM | March 09, 2008 at 08:43 PM
After watching Pie this week, We dont need Crisp. We have Colvin and Fuld to back up in CF. If we trade Colvin then we have others or could make a trade later if we need someone.
Posted by: uww1 | March 09, 2008 at 08:57 PM
My hope was Marquis going to Boston in a package more than Crisp coming to Chicago. Next...
Posted by: studio179 | March 09, 2008 at 09:00 PM
Wow I'm shocked Theo would reject a pile of crap.
Posted by: GoBoSox420 | March 09, 2008 at 09:25 PM
I think Wuertz would get it done, but thats a steep price because he is real good.
I'm with UWW, we don't need crisp. Pie offers the same defense with a better arm and higher upside offensively. He projects to be better offensively this year according to the projection systems, although they are very close. So why would be bring in Crisp, who costs about 10x as much for the same production, while ruining the development of our best young prospect? (Soto might take that title pretty quick though...)
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 09, 2008 at 09:33 PM
why would they think Crisp is worth more than that? He is a backup outfielder. A good #5 pitcher and a decent CF prospect should be enough. But it doesnt matter as the Cubs dont need Crisp. Pie may not give a ton at the plate, but he will play good D. Not every postition has to hit 25 hrs
Posted by: Sabinus | March 09, 2008 at 09:34 PM
Can anyone refer me to some stats that indicate Pie provides the same defense crisp does?
Posted by: GoBoSox420 | March 09, 2008 at 09:43 PM
Look at Pie's UZR and RZR ratings. Then look at scouts analysis of his defense, and his arm as well.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 09, 2008 at 09:49 PM
To me the only reason to get Crisp would be if Pie is headed to Baltimore . I won't say I will be furious if that happens , disappointed maybe , but not furious . What will tick me off is if the Cubs mess with what they have in the bullpen .I will get ticked off if Wuertz, Wood , Marmol , Eyre , or Howry are traded . They say championships are built with good pitching , that means good pitching from start to finish . Though none of those guys are the best there ever was , as a whole , the Cubs have a good bullpen and it shouldn't be messed with .
Posted by: hawkeye26 | March 09, 2008 at 09:50 PM
I think it's foolish to simply state Pie's defense is as good as Crisp.
I mean, personally, it's equally foolish to refer to a prospect like Pie as anything close to a sure thing. If anything we've seen his stock gradually fall over the last season plus.
I'm not advocating a crisp trade. I'd love him in the 4th of role, or even starting. Sox fans need to remember ellsbury is still a young guy whose playoff performance really isn't indicative of his normal production.
Posted by: GoBoSox420 | March 09, 2008 at 10:00 PM
finally... someone brings cubs fans back to reality. the world does not revolve around the cubs...
Posted by: bronx | March 09, 2008 at 10:15 PM
I really highly doubt Pie is in the same class as Crisp defensively, but he is probably going to be the same or better offensively for much cheaper and no players so yeah...
Posted by: gogopalehose | March 09, 2008 at 10:24 PM
cubs fans are not in denial of how good pie is.....we just don't want to give up any more than we have to. is crisp going to bring us a championship? hell no! so why would we give up a pitcher (no matter how subpar he may be) and one of our top prospects for that?
Posted by: msk86 | March 09, 2008 at 10:30 PM
I am going to speculate a trade. What do you think: HA
Cubs GET Roberts, Sherrill
O’s GET Gallagher, Veal, Cedeno, Jorge Sosa (from Mets) Gonzalez (from Padres)
Red Sox GET Schoeneweis (from Mets), Thatcher (from Padres)
Padres GET Murton, Marquis
Mets GET Crisp
Posted by: uww1 | March 09, 2008 at 10:39 PM
So the Sox turn down the over-priced and ineffective Marquis. (And Cubs fans don't spew the drivel about him being any good..if he was he'd be on your playoff roster)
And instead elect to pursue Schoeneweis who is also over-priced and ineffective but also a loogy the sox absolutely do not need. Regardless of how bad lopez is.
Posted by: GoBoSox420 | March 09, 2008 at 10:43 PM
I meant to add a Mid-level Prospect to the Red Sox.
Relax "gobosox420". I am just having a little fun.
Posted by: uww1 | March 09, 2008 at 10:56 PM
And thatcher is acually a pretty good bullpen prospect for the padres.
Posted by: uww1 | March 09, 2008 at 10:59 PM
Pie has been given the moniker of "gold glove caliber" defense by many top-100 prospect lists.
Do you seriously think that defensive stats/metrics don't transfer from MiLB to MLB? The laws of physics change in major league parks? Yes, balls are hit harder and parks vary more but these are hardly factors involving a player's athletic ability to play their position.
Now, with all that being said, I can imagine why Theo didn't bite on this deal. However, to say that Pie is in the same defensive category as Crisp is hardly a stretch.
Posted by: Goat | March 09, 2008 at 11:20 PM
And that's not to mention that Crisp has a league average arm and Pie has plus accuracy and arm strength.
An outfield of Soriano, Pie, and Fukudome is going to be deadly to run on in 08'.
Posted by: Goat | March 09, 2008 at 11:22 PM
Alright Boston fans...since you wouldn't believe me...
RZR ratings for 2007
Pie - .937
Crisp - .909
Crisp 2006 - .857
Crisp 2005 - .818
Like I said, you can see that his defense is obviously at least as good as Crisp, being that his range seems to be better, or at least it was last year, and his arm and accuracy are rated as plus, and Crisp's is said to be average.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 09, 2008 at 11:35 PM
Actually, with players that had over 50 balls hit to them, Pie led ALL OF BASEBALL in RZR rating. Please don't act like he isn't gold glove caliber right now.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 09, 2008 at 11:40 PM
Now that we have beat that dead horse (Brian Roberts) rumors and sent it to the glue factory, lets start a daily Coco rumor. Personally the only players I would like the Cubs to trade for the prospects being talked about 1 Joe Nathan or 2 Carl Crawford
And just remember ARam has 4 years left and has bad knees so it might be wise for the Cubs to keeo Colvin he will close to ready when ARams contract is up.
Posted by: ryno23 | March 09, 2008 at 11:45 PM
"finally... someone brings cubs fans back to reality. the world does not revolve around the cubs..."
Yes, but this post does.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 09, 2008 at 11:45 PM
Vitters will be the person that takes over for Aram if all goes well...as long as he produces, there isn't a prospect in the world who would take his place at 3rd. He just has to prove he can play it defensively. He should hit...but he hasn't played much at all yet. He was supposed to be the "best hitter" in the draft last year though, so we'll see. But if all goes well, he will be ready when Aramis is done.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 09, 2008 at 11:47 PM
"finally... someone brings cubs fans back to reality. the world does not revolve around the cubs..."
Bronx, please tell me you are not an east coast team fan. Because the world obviously does revolve around any east coast team as ESPN shoves that message square into the rest of the country's viewing info.
Right on, Adun. Pie is GG caliber right now.
Posted by: studio179 | March 09, 2008 at 11:48 PM
Hey Ryno. I dont believe Colvin plays 3rd base. But we have a GREAT prospect working his way up the ladder in Josh Vitters.
Posted by: uww1 | March 09, 2008 at 11:51 PM
Ryno, Just so you know, Colvin does not play 3B. Ramirez's knees are not going to fall off.
Btw, where whould you put Crawford even if you could get him? We just signed Soriano LF in '07 and Fukudome RF in '08 to longterm deals. Crawford has been on record as saying he will not play CF if he is traded. You buried the Roberts rumors. I would bury the Crawford to the Cubs rumors. They have long, long been over.
Posted by: studio179 | March 09, 2008 at 11:59 PM
I have not heard Crawford saying that he wouldnt play CF if he is traded. Thats too bad if he did say that.
Posted by: uww1 | March 10, 2008 at 12:18 AM
For those getting excited over Pie's spring, I offer you the following:
Angel Pagan, .429
Jorge Cantu, .407
A. Cintron, .345
Hoffpauir, .423
This is just a sample; I could list another dozen if I tried.
It's waaaay too early to get all giggly about spring at bats. Wait until the last week of spring training, when the minor leaguers and hanger-ons have been dispatched.
Posted by: Devlsh | March 10, 2008 at 12:29 AM
Who lit the fire under Angel's ass? Dude, he's got 15 hits already!
Posted by: jrfukudome | March 10, 2008 at 12:46 AM
Devlsh, they're not making a statistical argument. Pie looks good, he's drawing walks, he's taking the ball the other way. He's doing what they're telling him to do. Plus, he's still he's jubilant self. That's a good sign.
Posted by: jrfukudome | March 10, 2008 at 12:48 AM
Michael Wuertz, Kevin Hart, and someone else for crisp.
Then O's and 'Stros will have a deal for Loretta
Then the Cubs will trade Ronny Cedeno, Sean Gallagher and who ever else for Roberts and maybe George Sherrill replace people in bullpen
Posted by: CUBBIES2008 | March 10, 2008 at 08:14 AM
"Michael Wuertz, Kevin Hart, and someone else for crisp."
If the Cubs had to trade that alone it would be a steal for the Sox. He means nothing to them but a backup
Posted by: Aduncaroo | March 10, 2008 at 09:56 AM
Sorry my bad bout the Colvin/Vitters mix up. I do however think the Cubs could use Crawford in CF you pay him enough and get him a possibillity thet he might get a ring he would move.
Posted by: ryno23 | March 10, 2008 at 12:43 PM