Mariners Interested In Edwin Jackson, Curtis Granderson

Granderson, Jackson, and prospects for Felix Hernandez. GOGOGO!

I dont think these guys will get traded, if they get traded, in the same deal. The tigers will divide them and put one of their bad contracts (Robertson, Bonderman, etc.) as an add on the team making the trade must take.

Jackson makes sense for the M's, but Granderson does not. He's expensive, not that valuable in left field and they have Ackley in the system with a major league contract ticking away.

Having said that, I wonder what it would take for the Mariners to pry Jackson from the Tigers....?

probably a two decent hitting prospects, or a good pitching and hitting prospects. That would be a minimum.

I'd say the latter since they'd be giving up one of their strong starters in the trade.

Remember Bedard? M's will probably trade Felix/Gutierrez for Curtis/Jackson hehehehe

Does anyone see Dayton Moore making a move for Granderson? I would think that that move would make some sense. The only reason it wouldnt would be because of an intradivision trade...serious opinions?

This would be an absolutely perfect trade for the Mariners. The trick is going to be trying to hold on to Brandon Morrow and still make it work. A pitcher of Jackson's caliber for his price, added to the insane defense that Granderson will add is amazing. Granderson can then be traded once Ackley is ready to take over seeing as how Granderson's contract isn't really all that bad for his skill set. I really didn't put that much thought into the idea before, but this really makes sense. The only thing is...whats it gonna cost Seattle in the farm system.

Felix would'nt be traded for a pitcher that is older than him(25)(23)i bet you have fun thinking about it because Felix is the best in the game.If the Mariners could get Jackson and Lackey their rotation would be amazing GO MARINERS!!!

I don't believe Granderson is going to be dealt this off-season. He a fan favorite in Detroit and a really good ambassador for the Tigs and baseball away from the game.

I expect Jackson to be dealt, but not sure it will be for young pitching, Detroit needs a power bat to protect Miguel Cabrera with long term and I think they'll use Jackson to try and fill that need - LF, RF, 3B who can hit for power and solid average type of youngster.

Does anyone see Dayton Moore making a move for Granderson? I would think that that move would make some sense. The only reason it wouldnt would be because of an intradivision trade...serious opinions?

Posted by: clrm8d | November 16, 2009 at 05:06 PM

I brought this up in another Tigers thread that I can absolutely see Moore having interest in Granderson. The rumor is that KC will try to re-sign Coco Crisp to an incentive laden deal, but he is coming off of surgery on both shoulders.

I mentioned that I could see Callaspo making sense for Detroit since Polanco is probably too expensive to re-sign.(I know Sizemore will be considered for the job). But if Detroit to get Callaspo plus for Granderson that would essentially save them Granderson's $5.5m, and whatever Polanco was making.

As a Mraniers fan i iam on borad with trying to get both Jackson and Granderson. Iwould go after Granderson more though because of the follwoing reason. First of all Granderson is a 30/30 player. He could repalce ichrios speed because Ichrio is starting to get old. Also here is a guy who can play great defense and who can hit for opb. I iam not high on Franklin Guttieruz. Also tradeing for Granderson means that the Angels wont get him. However i wouldnt put Mrowwo or Adam Moore in the deal.

I brought this up in another Tigers thread that I can absolutely see Moore having interest in Granderson. The rumor is that KC will try to re-sign Coco Crisp to an incentive laden deal, but he is coming off of surgery on both shoulders.

I mentioned that I could see Callaspo making sense for Detroit since Polanco is probably too expensive to re-sign.(I know Sizemore will be considered for the job). But if Detroit to get Callaspo plus for Granderson that would essentially save them Granderson's $5.5m, and whatever Polanco was making.

Posted by: bigscott | November 16, 2009 at 05:23 PM

this might work. i dont know if i would give up much more than callaspo if i was dayton though. granderson is good, but callaspo is cheap for another year or two. and giving them a good young player that could haunt us for years to come for 3 years of a player that is going to probably be vastly overpaid in a couple years is already hard enough...

Morrow in a deal with Jackson would be awesome but I don't think that the Tigers are that stupid. As for Granderson he would probably be in the boat of DH. Yes Ackley has a big leauge contract but he is no where near read even if he has a huge ST, he probably starts out in AA or AAA. Id do like Morrow and 2 other specs for Jackson. I have strong doubts that Morrow makes the MLB line up next season.

"Not so sure about Granderson being looked at by other GM's as a Top 5 CF...

Posted by: DipSpit | November 16, 2009 at 05:11 PM"

Here are the value rankings for centerfielders over the past three seasons:

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=cf&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=6&season=2009&month=12

... although Granderson fell in the 2009 rankings:

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=cf&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=6&season=2009&month=0

cirm8d and bigscott: I'm not quite sure that Granderson makes sense for the Royals. They're not poised to break into the playoff mix next year, and that seems to be the only reason why they should acquire him. After the Teahen trade, and a possible Dejesus trade, it seems Moore is looking to reinvest into younger players similar to how the Rays and Marlins conduct business.

Gamel for Jackson?

"Why in the world would they want Granderson when they have the best defensive CF in the game?"

As the post says Granderson would be played in LF. They'd want him for his bat (at least against righties), his reasonable contract and his defense. Gutierrez would continue to play center no doubt.

"I bet Seattle wishes they still had Adam Jones. They wouldn't need to trade prospects for an outfielder at this point."

If Seattle still had Adam Jones last offseason, the Mariners would not have traded for Franklin Gutierrez, who is a significant upgrade over Adam Jones:

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=cf&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=6&season=2009&month=0

However, the Mariners wish they had not traded Shin-Soo Choo for Ben Broussard:

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=rf&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=6&season=2009&month=0

YOYOYO, I'd get into a big argument over the gold gloves, but I already did that and I'm not going to waste my time educating you.

Just remember, meth is a one-way street to your grave.

Yoyo you use gold gloves as your first statement for the best defense? If only the best defensive players won gold gloves then I would agree with you.

yoyoyo, tell me you arent serious. gold gloves are quite possibly the least important statistic when measuring defensive capability.

see: jeter, derek

You take that back about Jeter. You and your new-fangled statistics, Jeter had a -15.3 UZR in 2006 and won a Gold Glove while Alex Gonzalez had a +11.8 UZR, blah blah blah. Statistics aren't everything you know... I saw Jeter dive headfirst into the stands and his face was bleeding. BLEEDING. How many bloody-faced dives did Alex Gonzalez have? ZERO. Come back when you can recite stats that matter, son.

Ship it.

Out of curiousity, why does one believe fangraphs or Bill James is the all-knowing on who is the best glove at a certain position.

Too much credit is attributed to sabernomics when it comes to fielding.. too many variables..

"Baseball isn't statistics, it's Joe DiMaggio rounding second base."

- Jimmy Breslin

dunkin, thats an awful point. by that logic, jeter didnt deserve to win this year because he didnt bloody himself diving into the stands. definately a must-have for all gold glove winners.

anyways, back to my original point (i dont wanna start a derek jeter argument on a board that has nothing to do with him), franklin gutierrez is the best CF in the league. even if you dont wanna put a lot of stock into sabermetrics, when a guy is almost doubling the runner up in any stat ("new-fangled" or not, you know he has to be pretty good. and yoyoyo, the fact that you couldnt even infer that humannature was referring to Gutz when he said the M's have the best def. CF in the game shows that you clearly don't know enough about this subject to even be presenting an argument. go back to your 20th century home filled with worthless stats like RBI, errors, and W-L records.

"dunkin, thats an awful point."

Then I suppose I accomplished my thinly-veiled mission.

"sorry in that post i said gutierrez was the best CF in the game. please dont tear me to shreds for that. i meant best DEFENSIVE CF in the game.

Posted by: lftyg33 | November 16, 2009 at 07:22 PM "

By one measure, Franklin Gutierrez was the best centerfielder in baseball last season:

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=cf&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=6&season=2009&month=0

Gutierrez certainly was better overall than Adam Jones, who may have had the slight hitting edge with a league- and park-adjusted OPS+ of 106 to the 103 posted by Gutierrez.

Jones played his home games in a park far friendlier to hitters, but Gutierrez had 110 more plate appearances in 2009. With those caveats, here are the remarkably similar numbers the centerfielders posted in 2009:

Jones 519 PA, 22 2B, 3 3B, 19 HR, 83 R, 70 RBI, 10 SB, .277 Ba, .335 OBP, .792 OPS, 106 OPS+

Gutierrez 629 PA, 24 2B, 1 3B, 18 HR, 85 R, 70 RBI, 16 SB, .283 BA, .336 OBP, .773 OPS, 103 OPS+

I apologize for straying from the thread's topic.

you could arguable say that Gutz is a better hitter than Granderson. Almost as many jacks, higher average, OBP and he can actually hit leftys AND rightys.

Gamel for Jackson?

Posted by: Jack Boulia | November 16, 2009 at 05:54 PM
________

to me, that would work out well for both teams,
but I wonder if the Tigers can hold out for a little more?

Clete Thomas and Jackson for Gamel and Lawrie?

"you could arguable say that Gutz is a better hitter than Granderson. Almost as many jacks, higher average, OBP and he can actually hit leftys AND rightys."

Sure, but how many All-Star game appearances does he have? SCOREBOARD. Game, set, match, Granderson.

Posted by: DunkinDonuts | November 16, 2009 at 08:01 PM

Is Tim Wakefield an elite pitcher? That's almost like basing defense off gold gloves. The managers vote for gold gloves, you idiots. And only one person's commented on a trade idea I had. Where did we get to Gold Gloves?

Because you state your case rationally, I'll tone it down for one post (just one, thought):

Jeter: 150 games, 206 putouts, 340 assists, 67 DPs

Andrus: 145 games, 261 putouts, 407 assists, 87 DPs

While the discrepancies may be attributable to any number of variables, including pitchers' tendencies and sheer luck, you should also account for the likelihood that Andrus simply gets to a much greater number of balls. Combine that with official scorers' tendency to give errors to fielders who get in position quickly but fail to make the play cleanly, and it stands to reason that players with greater range will generally get significantly more errors than players who don't get to many balls to either side of them.

It would be interesting to see how many of Andrus' "errors" would be clean hits that Jeter never got near enough to flub.

I think my larger point (which I can't back up because I don't know how to read all those funny charts) is that errors are assigned by fallible team employees, and are not always given for "routine" plays.

Agreeing to disagree with me is just a euphemism for being wrong. Just concede defeat and I'll let Jeter keep one of his Gold Gloves (he still has to give back the others).

The ONLY way that Granderson OR Jackson are getting traded, are in exchange for multiple major league players that can immediately fill a roster spot. Their contracts are not a problem.

DunkinDonuts is quickly becoming my favorite poster. As for yoyoyo, if you have to resort to the "you need to get laid line", chances are you've lost.

If the Tigers are going to try and get Felix then they better sweeten the deal with Magglio too!
I would trade. Granderson, Jackson, and Magglio for Felix and Beltre and move Inge to SS!

The ONLY way that Granderson OR Jackson are getting traded, are in exchange for multiple major league players that can immediately fill a roster spot. Their contracts are not a problem."

Multiple major league players that can immediately fill a roster spot? Are you crazy? Granderson's play has gone down every year for the last few and if you look at Jackson's stats beyond ERA and win/lose, they scream decline, and fast

The ONLY way that Granderson OR Jackson are getting traded, are in exchange for multiple major league players that can immediately fill a roster spot. Their contracts are not a problem."

Multiple major league players that can immediately fill a roster spot? Are you crazy? Granderson's play has gone down every year for the last few and if you look at Jackson's stats beyond ERA and win/lose, they scream decline, and fast
-----------------------------

Well then, you don't trade for him, do you?
The media here, led by Joel Sherman, is waaaay off the mark in thinking that the Tigers need to shed payroll. They don't. They are maxed out, and have four positions to fill, two in the middle infield, and two in the pen. They have $ 72 million in BAD, immovable contracts, they've already sold the farm and haven't grown prospects to deal yet, and so the focus is on the few young players that still have value. But THOSE are the players that the team can be built around for the future.
Jackson is a bit different, because Boras doesn't generally do extensions. He insists upon a bidding war- playing clubs against each other. If he's at his peak value, then it may make sense for the Tigers to trade him, but it's not because of money. It's because they can upgrade the team NOW.
Granderson isn't going anywhere, and certainly not for mere prospects.