Odds & Ends: Rangers, DeJesus, Westbrook, Happ

There's still plenty of news in the baseball world outside of today's surprising deal.  Let's dive in..

49 Responses to Odds & Ends: Rangers, DeJesus, Westbrook, Happ Leave a Reply

  1. aap212 5 years ago

    Is any Mets hitter besides Bay significantly underperforming at the plate? I’m no huge HoJo supporter, but Frenchy stunk long before they ever met, and it’s not the hitting coach’s fault if the GM failed to build pitching depth or the manager will only pitch a closer in save situations.

    • Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

      I agree and I see your saying but you can’t fire 25 guys and we haven’t seem a gm get fired because his team wasn’t hitting. For example, the Phillies obviously have great talent, but we saw what happened to Milt Thompson. The Mets should make Von Joshua their hitting coach.

      • aap212 5 years ago

        They could fire the manager who let Perez blow a game when K-Rod was available.

        They could fire the GM who gave Perez his contract.

        They don’t need to fire 25 guys. They need smarter management.

        • Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

          A. you are a Mets fan who despises everything the Mets organization does.
          B. you are frustrated with the Mets performance lately.
          C. All of the above.

          Circle one.

          Seriously though, there are contracts all over Baseball that are given to underperforming players (hope that isn’t a complement for Perez) such as Gary Matthews Jr., Eric Byrnes, or even Bernard Gilkey. Perez is just another example. I will say that Omar Minaya isn’t the world’s best GM, but he has drafted better over the years, but not every bad GM gets fired right away. It’s also not easy to find good management. The Mets are not in as bad as a situation as people or you see them to be and to your first comment, I think blowing it out of perportion. Why would they bring in K-Rod, tie game, Perez was also available, and they could have eventually taken the lead and let K-Rod close it out. So what happens if they did use K-Rod and the Mets eventually take a 4-2 lead that gets blown by Perez? Come on man.

          • aap212 5 years ago

            1) He’s drafted better than whom over the years?

            2) Your philosophy on closer use is outdated and wrong. The game is tied in extra innings. You have a good pitcher and a bad pitcher available. You use the good pitcher.

            3) “Other people also signed bad contracts” isn’t a good defense, and at least the other two GMs ate the money and took back a wasted roster spot rather than going down with the ship.

            4) I don’t despise everything the Mets do or everything Minaya or Manuel does. But Manuel gets too much slack because he’s good with the media and the last managerial firing was such a disaster, and Minaya gets too much slack for a guy who’s made some of the same mistakes over and over again, and has seen the Mets fail to make the playoffs three going on four times in a row despite a premium core and one of the highest payrolls in baseball.

            5) Rebut my points well before you concern yourself with my vantage point.

          • Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

            I’m going to respond by yours by number.

            1) Kirk Nieuwenweis, Brandon Moore, Blake Forsythe, Ike Davis, Reese Havens are just a few examples of some of the guys he’s drafted.

            2) I’ll tip my cap to you on that one, but Perez was just brought up, and yes, maybe the best time to use him would be when the Mets find themself down 8-0 in the 3rd inning, but they had to loosen him up. And remember, Perez got of a bases loaded jam the previous inning.

            3) Minaya could DFA him, but you have to understand the tough situation he is in with Perez. Perez wont accept an outright assignment and he is completely hard-headed about the whole situation.

            4) The Mets aren’t doing as bad as people make it out to be. Minaya has earned the right to “currently” continue mantaining his job, but again the team has had a hard road trip, not a terrible season. I say first get rid of Ho-Jo, and if things don’t work out from there, get rid of Manuel.

            5) I still don’t get the joke you told yesterday. Please reiterate.

          • aap212 5 years ago

            1) That’s a *really* unimpressive list to hang one’s hat on.

            2) —-

            3) I understand that, but why waste money AND a roster spot? The guy is kryptonite.

            4) I don’t see how Minaya earned still having his job going into last offseason. Two epic collapses followed by a terrible season should get a GM fired.

            5) Really?

          • Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

            1) check out Brandon Moore’s stats. Seriously. And I can keep going, Cory Vaughn, Jon Niese, Chris Schwinden…Okay, teams have drafted better but he hasn’t drafted “terrible”.

            2) —-

            3) Someone should write a book, the long and mysterious journey of Oliver Perez’s Mets tenure.

            4) What I’m trying to say is, from the start of the season on, thats why I think Minaya deserves another shot…for example, we all criticized him for signing Mike Jacobs and Frank Catalanotto and not a better 1B…Well Ike Davis is what I would consider a bright spot right?

            5) Seriously, I want you to explain the Gibson joke. I’m still not getting it. Sorry man.

          • aap212 5 years ago

            1) If you went to college, you’d better put up good numbers in short season ball. Talk to me about Vaughn if he’s doing that in Double-A down the line. He has not drafted well enough to justify his job.

            3) Dante already wrote Inferno.

            4) Has Ike Davis been that much of a bright spot since April?

            5) REALLY?

          • Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

            1). I’m still in high school

            3). good one

            4) I think Ike has been great for the Mets. AVG down a bit though.

            5). REALLY! I know Baseball and thats it pretty much it. I’m no Harvard grad (although I’m not in college yet so there is still a chance I will go to Harvard. like a .00001% I’m just not ruling anything out)

          • aap212 5 years ago

            1) I don’t mean you. I mean it doesn’t matter how well a guy hits in short season ball if he’s 21 and just came from a D-1 school. Vaughn’s current stats really don’t tell us anything.

            4) He flat out hasn’t hit well since his first few weeks in the majors. I like him well enough as a player long term, but people got overexcited about him because of his hot start. He’s not going to be some kind of star, and he really hasn’t been good in a while. That happens with rookies, but I wouldn’t call him a bright spot.

            5) You’re familiar with the “Guy walks into a bar” jokes? There are a million of them. And you’re familiar with Mel Gibson turning out to be a really terrible person? The joke is that in a normal bar joke, the racist, the misogynist, the homophobe, and the anti-semite would be four different people, but Mel Gibson is all of those lousy people wrapped into one.

            I can’t believe I just explained that.

          • Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

            you’re the man.

          • NL_East_Rivalry 5 years ago

            I have to be honest, I used that joke yesterday and got a laugh. I wouldn’t say the audience was a tough crowd, but it’s definitely a joke I will use every now and then. – I even for some reason still like the guy.

  2. bulldurham08 5 years ago

    As a phils fan, I’d be upset to see J.A. Happ go. He’s got tremendous upside, despite alot of people saying he only projects to be a 4th-5th guy in the rotation. I don’t want Oswalt in a Phillies jersey. From what I understand he would rather play for St. Louis. It seems like he isn’t looking forward to being put under the microscope by the media. The guy is getting paid like a top 10 pitcher in the league and obviously is past his prime. The fact that he is only willing to re-negotiate his 2012 salary with St. Louis shows he’s a diva. Ruben would be crazy to guarantee a 35 year old man, not named Roy Halladay $16M. I’d rather him make a run at Ted Lilly than Oswalt…

  3. Dylan 5 years ago

    I don’t think the Phillies get Oswalt due to financial reasons. You’re giving up a guy who is making 470,000 this year and doesn’t hit arbitration years until 2012 (and is a solid number 3 or 4, which is what Oswalt might be by 2012) for a guy that is making 16m, 15m, and 12m…

    Yes, it would be an upgrade (HUGE upgrade) but are the Phillies going to raise their payroll to $160 next year? They already have 134m committed, so with Oswalt that is closer to 150m already….thats not including Dobbs, Fransisco, and Kendrick due for raises…

  4. bevothephenom 5 years ago

    i dont like happ and others for oswalt…just trade werth for prospects to flip to houston

    • Dylan 5 years ago

      If it were that easy, it would have been done, but you are saying Werth (1/2 year) and Oswalt (2.5 years) are equivalent in value which just isn’t true.

  5. Abraham Zapruder 5 years ago

    Oswalt is too big of a financial risk. I hope Ruben passes on this one, even if it’s something like Happ and JC Ramirez.

  6. HoJo will be fired because the Mets have to blame someone however its only a matter of time before Manuel and Minaya are both fired and replaced by someone within the organization however I’d love to see Bobby Valentine get the job..

    The thing with Omar is that he really is just the face and holds title of GM. The Mets have gone with a GM by committee the entire season. Omar has no power and can’t make any moves without several approvals.

    BTW Bernard Gilkey was awesome in NY..No Manager can make your players hit when their slumping. This isn’t high school baseball. All Jerry does is make in game decisions . What manager isn’t gonna go with their long relief in a 13 -14 inning game?? Jerry has to use Ollie in that spot..No Ollie shouldn’t be available because he shouldnt be on the team. Bad bad bad contract but at the time it was signed ,it was looked at as a decent deal..Just imagine he could have gotten 4 maybe 5 years

    In Philly news,you guys have to go get Oswalt but how bad does it feel to need a pitcher of that quality when you already had Cliff Lee and gave him away for crap

  7. philsWSchamps 5 years ago

    agree with most of the sentiment on here. The Phils are not the yanks. We have a budget and at some point we need to start bringing the kids up and letting them develop.

    Imagine a rotation if we had some patience of Halladay, Hamels, Floyd, Gio Gonzalez, Happ.

    I’m tired of trading the future for overpriced older talent now. Sure Oswalt is a good upgrade but then it’ll tie us up from doing other things.

    In 3-4 years I want a rotation that includes Cosart, Shreve, May in it and includes Singleton, Gose in the lineup.

    • You want Singleton to play over Howard in 3-4 years?

      • Singleton has the athleticism to switch to LF for 1 year in the minors and be ready to play.

        • aap212 5 years ago

          Not according to what I’ve heard from anyone who’s seen him, and besides, he’s a lot more than one year away from the majors.

          • Muggi 5 years ago

            That’s not what I’ve read from columnists and scouting sites, and he looked fairly athletic when I watched him at Lakewood. Only one game but…if his bat ends up being what some think it will be, the Phils will be happy with whatever he can do in LF.

            Hey, they won a WS with Burrell out there!

          • aap212 5 years ago

            And Ibanez isn’t exactly a young Barry Bonds in left. But you also have to remember that Singleton isn’t even 19 yet, and he’s already 6’2, 215. He hasn’t totally filled out yet and he’s already Mark Teixeira’s size. It’s not a knock on the guy. He’s just a big dude who’s going to get bigger.

          • Muggi 5 years ago

            Yeah I understand, just noting I had read different.

          • I didnt say he would be ready in 1 year. He’ll stay at 1b but can be converted quickly. Who have you heard from? Because ive seen the kid play multiple times and he is capable of anything.

          • aap212 5 years ago

            A few different people. Also note what I say above. He’s not even 19 yet and he’s already pretty huge. It’s not a knock on the guy. Playing outfield for very long if at all just isn’t going to be feasible.

    • aap212 5 years ago

      You don’t want Gio Gonzalez in that ballpark.

  8. eponine 5 years ago

    ok, giving up happ for oswalt makes no sense. happ is a starter. oswalt is really good, i get that but he’s in his 30s and is v expensive. happ just got back today from an injury in april–good comeback today btw (i was there). if you give up a starter for a starter you’re not filling holes. you’re just making an upgrade but given the cost and age, i’m not sure it’s worth it. i think our starters and team itself needs to get younger. moyer is 47–halladay is 33. now you want oswalt?

  9. Potrzeba 5 years ago

    Papelbon for happ and a prbnl?

  10. Bozo31215 5 years ago

    Personally I was hoping for Haren(and keeping Happ) but now I think I’ll hope we just go for some bullpen help and keep Happ and Werth. I agree with the comments of Oswalt being a “diva” and for all I care if he doesn’t want to come play for Philly he can go find another team to play for.

    I thought Vance Worley looked really good despite it being a non-pressure situation with an 8 run lead but it’s probably not hard to be an upgrade over Danys Baez.

  11. phillies08 5 years ago

    Does anyone think Werth will be moved by the deadline? For some reason I don’t think he will.

    • mrsjohnmiltonrocks 5 years ago

      I don’t think Werth will be moved. But if the Phillies were going to move him, I’d look to the west, specifically the Padres and Giants, especially the Padres. They have some young arms, plenty of young arms, they don’t want to move but you might convince them to for Werth.

      • I know this Sounds Crazy. But what if the Phils traded Werth and prospects to SF for Burrell (used to be in Philly) and some prospects for Cain or J Sanchez?

        That would take care of our need with bringing back a power bat. Burrell can platoon with Ibanez and you bring up Dom Brown to play RF.

        And you bring in a pretty decent pitcher as well. What does everyone think about that move?

  12. dc21892 5 years ago

    Damn. Wish the Sox could have grabbed DeJesus before he went down for the year.

    • moonraker45 5 years ago

      so that the red sox get the record for most players on the DL?

  13. phillies08 5 years ago

    I wish we could do something with Blanton and Baez…

  14. aap212 5 years ago

    Ben Davis spent years hitting like a pitcher. He might as well try to pitch like one.

    • Sadly, I have began to think that Saltalamachhia is Ben Davis 2.0.

      • aap212 5 years ago

        Sadly, it’s just what happens to a lot of catchers. Catchers are riskier than teenage pitchers. Look how many highly touted guys have performed well in the high minors, then done nothing, or have been drafted high but never got it going in pro ball.

  15. sportsnut969 5 years ago

    The Problem with Westbrook is that the Indians are willing to pay all the bonus’s and monies left on the contract but only if they are getting a couple of quality top prospects in return with the cash totally 7 mil you would think that would have to include prospects totally a top 10 and a top 20 with maybe a unranked lower level guy.

    Plus what is making it even harder is the Indians are not interested in any prospect who may end up block their own prospects that they haven’t taken a look at yet.

    And they are looking for lower level A ball Hi A ball Shortstops / 3rd Baseman / Centerfielder or corner outfielder with power and mostly guys who a right handed or switch hitters who have somewhat of a balanced splits.

    That best rumor we have had confirmed was the Padres offer Simon Castro even up but the Indians we heard asked for Simon Castro and Drew Cumberland so we still may see something happen with the Padres.

    Xm Radio rumors saying the Padres feel that if they can add Westbrook and Werth they feel they would be able to make a real run this year. They have also be in on the Fausto Carmona rumors also but the Indians are wanting a boat load for Carmona who is sign through 2014 very team friendly contract with 2 additional option years also in place.

    • Jason Klinger 5 years ago

      The Phillies want a decent starting pitcher to slot in behind Hamels. But the Padres (rightly so) aren’t going to hand over Richard, Garland or Latos for two months of a slumping Werth. There would have to be a third team involved for the Padres to get Werth.

      • sportsnut969 5 years ago

        Maybe the Indians could be that 3rd team

        Phillies get Westbrook + prospect from Padres
        Padres get Werth
        Indians get JA Happ plus the Padres and Phillies split the 7 mil owed Westbrook

        • NorCalTribeFan 5 years ago

          From an Indians fan perspective, I am fairly excited about the possibility of getting Castro and Cumberland from SD, but if we could get Happ for Westbrook, I would go for it. I don’t think the Phillies are getting enough in this deal, though.

  16. I know this Sounds Crazy. But what if the Phils traded Werth and prospects to SF for Burrell (used to be in Philly) and some prospects for Cain or J Sanchez?

    That would take care of our need with bringing back a power bat. Burrell can platoon with Ibanez and you bring up Dom Brown to play RF.

    And you bring in a pretty decent pitcher as well. What does everyone think about that move?

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