Mariners, Yankees Swap Pineda For Montero

The Mariners needed hitting, the Yankees needed pitching.  The two teams addressed each other's needs in a blockbuster trade of young stars, as right-handers Michael Pineda and Jose Campos will go to the Bronx in exchange for catcher/DH Jesus Montero and righty Hector Noesi.  Both teams confirmed the trade this afternoon.

Pineda

The Yankees re-signed C.C. Sabathia and Freddy Garcia this winter, but those moves amounted to just standing pat with a rotation that (after Sabathia) contained several question marks.  In Pineda, however, the Yankees now have one of the top young arms in the game and one who has already showed he can perform at the Major League level.  Pineda (pictured) posted a 3.74 ERA, a 3.15 K/BB ratio and a 9.1 K/9 rate in 28 starts last season, earning an All-Star appearance and a fifth-place finish in the AL Rookie Of The Year vote.  Pineda recently turned 23 and is under club control through 2016.

Campos, 19, is another intriguing young arm.  John Sickels of Minor League Ball ranked Campos as the fifth-best prospect in Seattle's system going into 2012, noting that while Campos' secondary pitches need some polish, "his upside is very high, he throws hard, and already throws strikes."  Campos is coming off a dominant campaign in low Class-A ball in 2011, posting a 2.32 ERA and a whopping 6.54 K/BB in 14 starts.  Joel Sherman of the New York Post hears from an NL executive that if Campos was in this year's amateur draft, "he is [a] no-doubt top-10 pick" (Twitter link).

Montero was a top-four prospect in both 2010 and 2011 according to Baseball America and the 22-year-old showed why when he posted a .996 OPS in 69 September plate appearances.  Montero was drafted as a catcher but questions about his defensive capabilities had several pundits projecting his long-term future to be at designated hitter or first base.  In New York, these spots will be blocked by Mark Teixeira and Alex Rodriguez for the next several seasons, but the bat-starved Mariners have plenty of room in the lineup.  Montero immediately projects as Seattle's probable #3 hitter, splitting time between DH and catcher, and it's easy to see Montero hitting behind Dustin Ackley for years to come.

Montero was very nearly a Mariner in July 2010, as he headlined a prospect package the Yankees were ready to send to Seattle for Cliff Lee.  The M's, however, pulled out of that trade and ended up dealing Lee to the Rangers.  Yankees management was reportedly upset that the Mariners pulled out of the deal at the last minute, but whatever hard feelings existed between the two clubs clearly weren't enough to keep them from doing business 18 months later.

Noesi appeared in 30 games for New York last season (two of them starts), posting a 4.47 ERA and a 2.05 K/BB ratio.  Noesi turns 25 later this month and amassed impressive numbers over six seasons in the Yankee farm system.  Noesi should get a shot at filling Pineda's rotation spot in Seattle and could blossom at pitcher-friendly Safeco Field. 

Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com was the first to announce the trade as official, with MLB.com's Greg Johns adding Campos and Noesi's involvement.  ESPN's Jerry Crasnick first heard of a "significant trade" involving a "young impact hitter" coming to the Mariners earlier today, and Larry Stone of the Seattle Times was the first to cite Pineda and Montero in the deal, as he had heard "rumblings in that direction."

Photo courtesy of Icon SMI.


560 Responses to Mariners, Yankees Swap Pineda For Montero Leave a Reply

  1. YanksFanSince78 4 years ago

    I will say this…..

    Pineda, Nova, Hughes, Banuelos, Betances, possibly Joba and some long shots with Warren, Phelps and Mitchell at  AAA again means the Yanks might have a really good, young and cheap rotation in the next year or two.

    This is not it though. There has got to be another shoe yet to fall with CC, Pineda, Nova, Hughes, Garcia and Burnett in the rotation. I can’t see Cashman sticking Hughes in the bullpen since we already have Mo, Soriano, Robertson and Logan there. That would be a waste as he would basically be the long man.

  2. Wes Whitenack 4 years ago

    I really hope we could deal Olivo and at least give some innings for Jesus at catcher.  

  3. This is pretty huge. I like to see big deals. And there is now way in hell we can judge this deal right away. It could be 5 years before we know.

  4. flickadave 4 years ago

    I think the biggest winner in this is Hector Noesi. He gets out of the AL East and the Yankee launchpad and into the caverns of Safeco. Biggest losers are Montero and Pineda for the opposite reason. As for the teams… looks good for both.

    • radicalhenri 4 years ago

      pineda might lose some numbers, but he could gain a ring, not gonna get that on the m’s

  5. Stark2k 4 years ago

    The fact that anyone would call this a bad deal for the Yankees amuses me.  Tremendous deal for the Yankees.  Do you have any idea how much having no defensive value hurts a player?  Even if Montero hits like you think he will (no sure thing) hes just not that valuable.  Pineda is TORP.

    • Guest 4 years ago

      Yankees just got 5 years of cost controlled power in the rotation. Add to that Banuelos, Nova and potentially Betances, signing Cain 1 year from now. Ruh row. You can bet your chickens, AJ, Garcia, Hughes are all gone next year. 

      In fact, it wouldn’t surprise me if one is moved by the end of the weekend. You can’t send any of them down to the minors and none (other than Hughes) is bullpen material. Mark it, one is gone in the next 3 days.

    • YanksFanSince78 4 years ago

      If Montero can provide you with 30 hrs and a .350 OBP then that has tons of value, even if he’s a DH. People are acting as if being a DH somehow mitigates his offensive productions. I’m sure the M’s won’t care where their offense comes from.

      All the same, could be a good deal for both. On paper, I like the logic the Yanks used. We’ll see.

      • $3513744 4 years ago

        It’s not that he has no value, it’s that it’s just not as much as it should be.  Pineda still can be an ace, and those guys aren’t easy to come by.  I just think they could’ve gotten more for him.  So on paper, appears the Yankees got the better hand here.  So much for the Yankees never dealing with the Mariner’s huh?  I still see it as a huge risk for both sides though, but it’s a risk worth taking for both of them.

  6. Johnny Damon isn’t good anymore.

  7. Based on what exactly?

  8. AndySTL 4 years ago

    what an awful trade by the Mariners…Yankees not only got a #2 starter in Michaael Pineda…but also a very good prospect in Jose Campos- RHP who throws gas

  9. The closest thing the Yankees had to a DH last year was Jorge Posada.  I don’t know what you’re talking about.

  10. Victor Kipp 4 years ago

    Yankees had to trade Montero at some point. ARod is breaking down and will be the DH very soon and they cannot move Texeria and his ciontract not to mention Montero does not seem to be a MLB catcher.  He had no where to play so the Yankees did very well by him and themselves.  He’ll get a chance to play everyday and the Yanks get a very cheap young pitcher with huge upside.  Like any trade only time will tell.

  11. Wes Whitenack 4 years ago

    The real part that will hurt for us is giving up Campos. He’s great, young and extremely raw that could be a great starter in the future. Sickles rated him the # 5 prospect in Seattle’s system.

  12. The Yankees did.  Noesi doesn’t have the ceiling, but he’s much closer and safer.  Campos is extremely raw and odds are he will flame out.  He has top of the rotation ability, but the volatility in pitching is what it is.

  13. NYYANKEES 4 years ago

    supposedly Yanks signed Kuroda as well according to Jack Curry

  14. I can see this trade being good for Jesus Montero and Hector Noesi—each gets to be a starter for a Mariners club now, while Russell Martin is firmly entrenched as the catcher for the Yankees, even if they are sacrificing offense at that position.

  15. MetsMagic 4 years ago

    I say the Yankees won this trade big time. Pineda is a very, very awesome pitcher with a super nasty slider and a huge K rate, but he doesn’t get many groundballs and that might translate to more home runs in the smaller confines of Yankee Stadium, but he’s young and can adjust. 

    Montero is a great young power prospect and the bat might play well in the spacious Safeco Field, but he likely won’t stay behind the plate and I don’t see a DH providing the same value as a pitcher as talented as Pineda unless he hits like Frank Thomas, and he’s no Frank Thomas.

    Additionally, Campos > Noesi, so advantage Yankees. BUT, if any or all of James Paxton, Taijuan Walker and Danny Hultzen pan out in some way or another, I can see this trade working out for Seattle. Even then, for a team that plays in a pitchers park in a top heavy division, I wouldn’t be so swift to trade from such an appreciable position of strength to maybe be a third place team behind Anaheim.  

    • toprock 4 years ago

      How do you know he is no Frank Thomas explain please.

      • MetsMagic 4 years ago

        I need to explain to you why he isn’t going to be Frank Thomas? No one is going to be Frank Thomas. 

      • $3513744 4 years ago

        They were born on different days, have different names, different parents, different DNA, and are completely different people.  Oh, and one of them has proven they are Frank Thomas and one hasn’t done squat yet.  Besides that, he’s Frank Thomas.

  16. HHHDMS 4 years ago

    The only way we will truly ever know if this trade was fair or not is how the players traded perform on the field. This certainly opens up the DH role for the Yanks if they want Fielder and we know they can afford him. Im sure Chavez and AROD could also split time DHing if they dont sign Fielder but Fielder and Mark *Tex* could also share time at first…who knows. Interesting trade if nothing else…something to talk about , something new at least besides the daily Theo Epstein discussing the Cubs, the LA Dodgers ownership and the Red Sox need for pitching news..Nothing like fresh news , a trade ! :)

  17. The fact that NYY got a potential-ace of the future in Pineda, paid less than Latos, and didn’t trade Betances or Banuelos is a win. I wonder what SDG and WSH think about this deal…

  18. You should acquaint yourself with Gary Sanchez, since ‘Gaby’ Sanchez played for the Marlins.  Also, Sanchez will very likely move off the position.  Romine isn’t a real catcher imo, but Montero wasn’t either.

    • radicalhenri 4 years ago

      sanchez is supposedly a good defensive catcher

  19. Mike1L 4 years ago

    It’s the other two players, Noesi and Campos, that make the trade more interesting.  On the whole, it makes sense for both teams.  If Montero goes .280, 25 and 90 and Pineda matches his qualitative numbers from last year, both teams will make out well.  Noesi puts an upside for Seattle.  Campos is very young.  It fits with the rest of the Yankee narrative-which is that they don’t want to spring for 10Million+for an established starter (or whatever Boras is holding out for Jackson) I guess we will see.   

    Well, my bad, they are apparently signing Kuroda as well, which makes this a little odd.

  20. Notin J. Notin 4 years ago

    Incredible deal for the Yankees.

    Makes me a little sad, but all the credit to Cashman here…

    • Yes trading a future DH for a young starter is a steal.  M’s fans must be ticked off knowing all they goit is a DH and a relief pitcher for one of the better young starters in the AL.

  21. BaronOfBacon 4 years ago

    I am a Yankees fan, and I still can’t believe this trade is happening (or could happen). Guess that’s this Friday the 13th’s strange happening.

    I like Montero, but he really is a DH. If Pineda is as good as advertised, then I say the Yankees won out this deal.

  22. How does this sound, 4-6 with a 4.40 ERA away from Safeco, 2-1 with a 4.67 ERA against AL East opponents (minus the Yankees), 1-4 with a 5.12 ERA after the All-Star Break, and has never pitched in Yankee Stadium yet.

    How effective does Pineda look now? Yankees fans getting nervous now?

    • slider32 4 years ago

      Cashman is a genius, this is the best move the Yanks have made in 5 years. How do you like me now?

      • Go look at his runners on/RISP numbers. If he is front line and oh so amazing he would not have a .250 opponent batting average with runners on! If he is as “dominant” as people say he is he would have it down around maybe .220 at the minimum.

        • how can u start throwing in stats after just 28 starts? when players are 22, they usually look more into minor league stats and scouting reports than just those 1st year stats. just shut up uve got no idea what ure saying

        • yanksallday 4 years ago

          The kid was a 22 year old rookie. Sounds like somebody is upset.

      • toprock 4 years ago

        I don’t

    • NYPOTENCE 4 years ago

      Then again he is a 22 year old power pitcher who has already proven he can be dominant. Feel kind of sad Montero is leaving with that monster bat , however, I think both teams did solid in this trade to satisfy their needs.

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      Uhhh… no.  

  23. My initial reaction as a Yankee fan was anger at this deal, and i always go with my gut reaction.  With that said the deal at second, third, and fourth glance does seem to be in favor of the Yanks (if there is a winner)……I forget which analyst it was that said “A good trade is when neither side is fully satisfied”.  That seems to be what we have here…

  24. Jack Z is a terrible GM. He had the opportunity already to obtain Montero and he blew it. He would’ve had both Pineda and Montero this year instead of a lame duck Smoak. He got fleeced in this deal. Noesi is a worse prospect that Campos, for christ sakes! How is Montero, who will probably be a career DH and hasn’t proven himself at the ML level, worth Pineda who has already proven he’s at least a solid #2 in any rotation?

    Jack Z has some questions to answer. He is being proven as a fraud.

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      If Z was smart he would have Pineda, Morrow, Fister, and Banuelos headlining the rotation next year and also have Montero on the team.  Instead he still has King Felix (who is certainly awesome), but they are not going to win with him on this team.

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        They could have had Banuelos and Montero for Felix.  I should have clarified.  

        • Banuelos and Montero alone aren’t worth Felix, especially when it was reported that we could have had at least 3 of Montero, Banuelos & Betances.

      • They just improved their chances considerably. Admittedly, at a pretty big cost giving up Pineda and Campos, who I was very excited about. However, needs were addressed for both teams and that’s the big picture.

        • Bret Wask 4 years ago

          If improved means they go from a 76 win team to a 77 win team, then yes they did.  I have trouble seeing Montero being that much better than Pineda and I there is no doubt that Noesi is worse.  

          • Apparently you’re not aware of how desperately the Mariners needed offense to be saying something like that.

          • Bret Wask 4 years ago

            Apparently, you are not aware of how wins are accumulated in baseball.  Also to project Montero as some sort of offensive superstar in 2012 is a bit silly.  The Pujols type breakouts are pretty rare.  I think you should be tempering your projections.  Hosmer’s 2011 is probably the best case scenario for 2012.  He was worth 1.6 Wins (link to fangraphs.com).

          • That would be a good situation, but “best case scenario?” LOL, no. Many people seem to think otherwise if you look at his projections on fangraphs.

    • Hutch84 4 years ago

      Smoak was playing hurt half the year, but looked solid as hell before the injury and after he came off the DL.  I’m not worried about him at all.

      • ayrbhoy 4 years ago

        Not to mention the death of his Father in April or May? Personally, I think Montero’s arrival will take the pressure off of Smoak. I know a lot of M’s fans want wins right now and even more want Jack Z’s head but this ball team is shaping up nicely. 

  25.  “Blockbuster?”  Hardly.

  26. As a Jays fan this is a significant blow. What kind of dimwitted GM trades an elite pitching prospect who’s 6’7 and 22 for a DH in today’s baseball? I’m not suggesting Montero isn’t a big time bat but that’s never a good trade.

  27. FacelessGeneralManager 4 years ago

    Wow, Dumb trade. Pineda will be very good and worth more than montero in my opinion. Plus, i liked Pineda!!!!!!!! WTH YANKEES. always do that to me.

    • Pineda’s ERA will consistently be in the 4’s/high 3’s range with the Yankees. Don’t forget how much of a pitchers park Safeco is.

      • MB923 4 years ago

        And Montero’s numbers may drop a bit too. He went from a possible 30/100 guy to a 20/80 guy.

  28. I am an Angels fan and I know as of now the Rangers are the team to beat as they won last year. But as far as pitching staffs go I think the Angels are better even if they get Darvish cause he is yet to be proven in the mlb.

  29. NYBravosFan10 4 years ago

    Mariners…got…HOSED!!!!!!!! They could have easily gotten Betances or Banuelos along with Montero

    • That’s interesting, I didn’t know you were one of the integral decision makers of this transaction.

      • NYBravosFan10 4 years ago

        lighten up francis I was just voicing my opinion

  30. East Coast Bias 4 years ago

    I have an emotional attachment to this batch of prospects, but the more I think about it, the more I like it for the Yankees. 

    That being said, I’ll still follow Montero’s career and wish him the best. He’s going to be an awesome bat, no doubt in my mind. 

    Justin Smoak and Jesus Montero’s careers were already linked together thanks to the Cliff Lee trade, or almost trade… wonder how this will impact that. 

  31. Not feeling this deal for the Yankees . I don’t think Pineda was worth giving up Montero AND Noesi. I don’t know much about the other Mariners prospect in the deal which tells me he must not be anything special which furthers my feelings of displeasure with this trade .

    • sdsny 4 years ago

      Let me cheer you up then.  The other Mariners prospect, Jose Campos, is apparently a fireballer.  He throws absolute gas.  He’s only in A ball, but the M’s were very high on him.

    • Honestly, I was more irritated with Jose Campos being traded than I was with Pineda. That’s not to say Pineda isn’t a decent pitcher; I just felt Pineda/Montero straight up was a more fair deal. I think the deal will prove great for both sides in the long run.

  32. FacelessGeneralManager 4 years ago

    I feel the Nats could have gotten Pineda for less than Gio. and Pineda may be better option.

    Any opinion?

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      agree.   Pineda is probably better and controlled for longer.  Montero is VERY good, but the package that the Nats gave up is better.

      • slider32 4 years ago

        Pineda’s K/9 9.11 and bb/9 2.89 is better than Gio and Latos, and he is under control for 5 years at a low salary.

  33. I used to defend Z but after this trade he needs to be fired along with Chuck Armstrong and Howard Lincoln. Felix should have been the one traded were in a rebuild and you trade away a young pitcher you control for the next 5 seasons? ROFL such a Mariner thing to do.

  34. nyy4life4 4 years ago

    Yanks will sign Damon now.

  35. coreif 4 years ago

    Swisher DHs with a Gardner-Cespedes-Granderson Outfield.

  36. Here is how it went down (my guess)
    1.Yankees call asking about Felix
    2.Mariners say they would have to be blown away.
    3.Yankees offer package similar to package offered for lee, agaian montero headlines it.
    4.Mariners decline
    4a.Mariners say they are still interested in aquiring Montero
    5.Yankees offer Montero for Pineda
    6.Yankees/Mariners agree in principle to deal
    7.a prospect is added to each side
    8.Comm. Office aproves
    9.Story published

    safe to assume right?
    (only thing i would change is which team was interested in aquiring who)

    • ayrbhoy 4 years ago

      More like:
      1. Mariners talk to Fielder
      2. Fielder says no to Seattle
      3. Seattle goes to plan B
      4. Jack Z calls NY dangling Pineda for Montero and back end starter
      5. NY only OK’s the move if they receive a top 10 prospect for said starter
      6. Seattle throws in a prospect from one of their strengths- young starting pitching
      7. Michael Pineda’s Dad is so excited about his son going to the Bronx he tells his entire neighborhood
      8. One of Pineda’s neighbors phones a columnist in Boca Raton, FL telling them Pineda’s Dad’s information
      9. Columnist in Boca Raton verifies the information then tweets 
      10. Story published

  37. Bret Wask 4 years ago

    Noesi is a luxury they Yankees don’t need now that they are likely moving Hughes and Nova to the pen.  It will be interesting to see if they try to move Burnett for pennies (like REAL pennies) on the dollar.  

    • MB923 4 years ago

      Absolutely 0 chance Nova goes to the pen at the start of the year at least.

    • I can’t see Ivan Nova moving to the bullpen.

      This is the rotation I see next season:

      Sabathia
      Nova
      Garcia
      Hughes or Pineda
      Pineda or Kuroda

      A.J. Burnett’s time in pinstripes is probably finished; it’s really a question of how much salary the Yankees will eat as I see it.

      • slider32 4 years ago

        CC, Kuroda, Pineda, Nova, and Hughes, with Garcia long man.

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        I agree with all of you that Nova is better than Garcia and Burnett, but I just think that you let them work out in April and May.  Garcia probably doesnt last (injury or ineffectiveness) and Burnett probably also doesnt (ineffectiveness).  Nova will definitely have a spot by the end and depending on Hughes stuff, he might too (or we will be read to move to Banuelos or Betances).

    • slider32 4 years ago

      I would think Burnett is worth 5 million a year. The Yanks might be able to move him, he still has great stuff.

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        His stuff has diminished (Velo, movement, etc.). I hope you are right though that we could get something.  $5M doesnt seem unreasonable.

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        His stuff has diminished (Velo, movement, etc.). I hope you are right though that we could get something.  $5M doesnt seem unreasonable.

  38. Ackley and Montero are gonna be fun to watch down the road. I’m excited.

    • ayrbhoy 4 years ago

      Don’t forget Smoak- he is going to thrive now that there’s less pressure on him. 

  39. Bret Wask 4 years ago

    oh and one more thing….  As good as Felix is (awesome is the word), Pineda is more VALUABLE as a trade chip.  I dont understand Z.  He is clearly lost.

    • Pineda is NOT more valuable as a trade chip than Felix Hernandez. That’s crazy talk. It was stated that the Yankees were willing to give up Montero, Betances, Banuelos and more for Felix, but the Mariners wouldn’t budge and opted instead to trade Pineda. Felix is a proven ace who has the ability to pitch great in any stadium against any team. Pineda is a two-pitch pitcher who will only ever be in that discussion if his changeup ever develops.

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        Your wrong.  Felix isnt cheap anymore.  Now the Yankees can go sign Cain, Hamels, or Greinke next offseason for $18M per (cost of Felix) AND have Pineda.  Felix is awesome, but replaceable by a team like the Yankees.

        • You’re crazy if you think Felix’s cost makes him less valuable than Pineda. Every team knew what his current cost would be when they were (unsuccessfully) attempting to trade for him last year. You can’t honestly think some team intended to flip him at the deadline or the offseason if they ever acquired him. If Felix was traded right now, the Mariners wouldn’t eat any of his salary and would land considerably more than what they got for Pineda.

          • Bret Wask 4 years ago

            What are you talking about flipping Felix?  I agree that was never going to happen.  Also, just because Seattle wouldn’t need to eat his salary doesnt mean that he is more valuable than Pineda.  Felix is still below value, but 6 years of Pineda on the current contract can save a team $40M by the time it is done (that could be spend on other players).  Felix is going to save teams maybe $9M over the remainder of his contract.

          • The first two years of Felix’s contract were extremely team-friendly. Any team that would have potentially traded for him would have had it in mind that his contract increases considerably, and you made it sound as though Pineda was more valuable than Felix because of Felix’s contract when the Yankees were dangling Montero, Betances, Banuelos + more at the Mariners for Felix, and the Mariners still wouldn’t do it. On the contrary to your theory, the Mariners acquired Montero for Pineda, which obviously makes Pineda a less valuable trade chip than Felix would have potentially been, because Felix is a true ace and a proven commodity despite his contract. Pineda isn’t anything more than a 3 without a good changeup, yet you make it sound like he is by saying he’s more valuable than Felix, which is absolutely ridiculous.

          • Bret Wask 4 years ago

            I am lost as to what you are talking about.  You seem to think that teams dont have budgets.  In a vaccum Felix is CLEARLY better than Pineda.  But when taking into consideration that teams cannot accumulate a roster of 25 guys worth $20M a piece, Pineda is more valuable than Felix.  It is not a debate it is a fact.  I dont understand why you cannot comprehend the concept of value. 

          • I’m not saying that. I’m saying that Felix, as a trade chip, is much more valuable than Pineda as a trade chip, as evidenced by Cashman’s willingness to deal Montero, Banuelos & Betances + more for him. I always said it would be more likely that Pineda was traded than Felix.

          • The first two years of Felix’s contract were extremely team-friendly. Any team that would have potentially traded for him would have had it in mind that his contract increases considerably, and you made it sound as though Pineda was more valuable than Felix because of Felix’s contract when the Yankees were dangling Montero, Betances, Banuelos + more at the Mariners for Felix, and the Mariners still wouldn’t do it. On the contrary to your theory, the Mariners acquired Montero for Pineda, which obviously makes Pineda a less valuable trade chip than Felix would have potentially been, because Felix is a true ace and a proven commodity despite his contract. Pineda isn’t anything more than a 3 without a good changeup, yet you make it sound like he is by saying he’s more valuable than Felix, which is absolutely ridiculous.

  40. TheHitman23 4 years ago

    Awesome deal. I’d love to see a Hideki Matsui/Johnny Damon return for the DH.

  41. MB923 4 years ago

    Wonder if I should be worried about Pineda struggling in the 2nd half last year. Not to mention his sub par road stats.

    • sdsny 4 years ago

      At 22, no.  That seems normal to me for a 1st year starting pitcher.

    • blueandwhite89 4 years ago

      2nd half shouldn’t be an issue. Dont think he pitched 171 innings in the minors. He’ll recover from that.

      Road splits may be an issue. The M’s play in a pitchers ball park, and at Yankee stadium almost everything goes over the fence.

  42. Felix, Taijuan Walker, Hultzen, Paxton, Ackley, Montero, Smoak, Nick Franklin, Carp…  In GMZ We Trust!  

  43. coreif 4 years ago

    Mariners have 4 catchers now: Jaso, Montero, Gimenez, Olivo

  44. coolstorybro222 4 years ago

    Oh lord, when Felix leaves, their rotation won’t be good. What the hell, Jack?

    • FrankTheFunkasaurusRex 4 years ago

      why are we assuming that Felix won’t be signing an extension

      • Exactly. Felix has stated his desire to stay with the Seattle Mariners well beyond the end of his current contract, at least “5 years more.” There’s really not a lot of basis to automatically assume he won’t sign an extension.

    • harmony55 4 years ago

      When the Felix Hernandez contract expires at the end of the 2014 season, the Mariners could still have Danny Hultzen, James Paxton, Taijuan Walker, Blake Beaven and Esrasmo Ramirez (plus any pitcher the M’s addd in the interim).

      The Mariners traded from a position of organizational depth.

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        But why not also keep Pineda in that rotation???  They should have traded Felix so that by 2015 they actually had a team that can compete.

  45. coreif 4 years ago

    Keep in mind, Pineda, like Nova is coming off just one good year, and Kuroda has only pitched in the NL West. But a big improvement nonetheless.

    • Either way, it means that A.J. Burnett’s time in pinstripes is over unless he has an excellent spring training.

      • coreif 4 years ago

        Yes, the demotion of Burnett from 3rd starter to potentially no longer on the team is the big +

  46. Ok guys, don’t forget the second piece of the trade, the pitcher the yankees are sending over. We have seen plenty of average pitchers pitch pretty well in Safeco ie: Jason Vargas, Jarrod Washburn, Doug Fister.

    He could fill in for Pineda nicely, if he can manage a 4.20 ERA (OR LOWER!)

    • levendis 4 years ago

      Noesi is a solid pitcher, you wont be disappointed by him. Hes no ace, but i can see him as a definite 3-5 starter. He can definitely manage a 4.20 ERA in Safeco. You guys got yourself a nice pitcher, the kids been tearing it up in the Dominican. T

  47. powertech84 4 years ago

    If i were an m’s fan this would be the point were i realized the next ten years is gonna suck.

    • Irrational and completely baseless.

      • powertech84 4 years ago

        No not really. Your team bias seems to be blurring your common sense. You simply cant expect to contend in that division if you trade away young cheap, high end pitching for a slightly above average position player prospects with no real position. Jack z clearly doesn’t get it, despite having a clear example with tampa that the only way you can build a team to contend within high payrolls, is to draft and develop “high end, cost controllable pitching”

        • When you have young, cheap & high end pitching coming in on the way in Danny Hultzen, James Paxton & Taijuan Walker and any potential talent we could acquire in the draft/free agency, it is okay to deal from a surplus in order to address a need, and that’s what this trade did. I don’t love the deal, nor do I hate. Pineda is nothing more than a 3 if he never develops a changeup, and in bandbox Yankee stadium, he’ll get hammered. Montero, on the other hand, has opposite field power and could drastically improve the Mariners’ anemic offense. It’s not the end of the world. Plus, I seriously question why you compared the Mariners to the Rays. Rays 2011 payroll: 44,969,740, Mariners: 98,067,684.

          • powertech84 4 years ago

            So you justify trading a young stud pitcher for a prospect because you figure you can surely just aquire more talent in the draft? Or that your unproven pitching prospects who’ve never thrown a pitch in the bigs have potential? You got a lot to learn about baseball kid. Oh, and the mariners may have a higher payroll than the rays, but they aren’t yet in the same zip code as what L.A. and texas can spend. Remove your bias and you can start to see this team is on a long term goal of mediocrity

          • “So you justify trading a young stud pitcher for a prospect because you figure you can surely just acquire more talent in the draft?”

            No, that was just one of the many reasons I listed. Funny how you focus solely on that and ignore the rest of what I said. The Mariners dealt from a surplus to continue to build towards a serviceable offense, something they have been lacking for years. Jesus Montero, a hitter with monster upside and power potential, compliments the hitters we’ve already got in place in Ackley, Smoak & Carp.

            “Or that your unproven pitching prospects who’ve never thrown a pitch in the bigs have potential?”

            Before knocking my baseball knowledge, you probably should have done your research; Pineda is far from “established.” He’s a two-pitch pitcher, albeit both of those pitches are nasty and could solidify him as a 3 for years to come, the fact of the matter is that he’s not going to turn into a true 1 or 2 starter unless he ever develops a decent changeup. Admittedly, he’s further along than Montero, but if you’ve seen the Mariners’ anemic offense, you’d realize that he’s well worth gambling on. Additionally, you have to take into account that Pineda will go from pitching half of his starts in one of the most pitching-friendly environments to bandbox Yankee Stadium, where popups sail out of.

            I can’t refute your claim that none of Danny Hultzen, James Paxton or Taijuan Walker have thrown a pitch in the bigs, but I think it’s equally unfair that you assume they become busts/fail in the majors. In any case, pitching in Safeco isn’t going to hurt.

          • powertech84 4 years ago

            I question your knowledge because you flat out dismissed my opinion that seattle is heading in the wrong direction, which is based on not only this lopsided trade, but many of the transactions since jack took over as gm. As a brewer fan i would have loved to see jack succeed, but its just not gonna happen. The mans got two years, tops, maybe less.
            I also find it amusing how you use the safeco card as your main stud, but completly ignore the fact that last year pineda’s fip was lower and he gave up fewer hr per flyball AWAY from safeco!

          • All I’m saying is his 44.8% flyball % is definitely not going to help him in Yankee Stadium.

          • powertech84 4 years ago

            I question your knowledge because you flat out dismissed my opinion that seattle is heading in the wrong direction, which is based on not only this lopsided trade, but many of the transactions since jack took over as gm. As a brewer fan i would have loved to see jack succeed, but its just not gonna happen. The mans got two years, tops, maybe less.
            I also find it amusing how you use the safeco card as your main stud, but completly ignore the fact that last year pineda’s fip was lower and he gave up fewer hr per flyball AWAY from safeco!

  48. BoSoXaddict 4 years ago

    Wow. I thought it would have taken a lot more to get Pineda. Yank’s rotay just got pretty good.

  49. Maybe the bat will be worth it but in my mind the Yankees once again pulled the wool over the eyes of another club that shot itself in the foot.  I would like to think that Pineda isn’t as good as he looked last year but he was just dominant in the games I watched. 

  50. Stephen Ficek 4 years ago

    I would have been fine with a Pineda, Montero swap; but i don’t know why the Mariners had to add in Campos. I think the Mariners got screwed there. A 19 year old pitcher for a 24 year old pitcher that posted a 4.47 era and a 1.51 whip. That’s pretty bad. Does anyone know anything about Noesi to change my opinion, because from there he seems like trash.

  51. Franl Edwardo 4 years ago

    what a terrible deal for the Mariners.  The A’s pull a haul for Cahil, the Pads do the same for Latos, and the M’s can only get a DH for Pineda.  Horrid deal.  Well Montero had an OPS of blah blah blah.  Look at the lineup he hit in and the ball park.  there are exactly no hitters in seattle that will give protection to a young hitter learning.  Those Opposite field homers will be can-o-corns in seattle.  

    Who was the last Yankee prospect that did anything?  Robinson Cano, and oh yeah, he is flourishing, he is one hell of a player, and guess who he plays for?  The Yankees.  Trading for a position player from the Yanks is like trading for a pitcher from the Braves.  you have to question why the guy is available.  

    Prince Fielder could be residing in New York very soon.  Him in that ball park, you could see an average season of 50 homers and 125 rbi.  milwaukee is a great hitters park, but pop ups leave in NYC.

    • sdsny 4 years ago

      The main reason Montero was dealt is, as you said, he’s a DH.  Perhaps he can be moved to 1st base, but either way, he didn’t have a spot on the Yankees.  And Prince Fielder isn’t coming to the Yankees.  I know the reputation precedes the organization, but the Yanks aren’t gonna commit $150 mil for a DH, a spot they need to be free occasionally for A-Rod and Jeter.

    • the reason he is available is because he doesnt have a postition, thus is a great trade chip. 
      ever think why Pineda was available. look at Hultzens fall league stats. look at Paxtons pitching stats. Montero will be more valuable to the Ms then Pineda would 

      • Franl Edwardo 4 years ago

        a position the yankees have readily available.  what team in their right mind (seattle clearly was not) would trade a kid with that stuff for, at most, a high end DH. 

        Seattle already has a history of making bad deals with their good pitching….hello doug fister.  hultzens fall league stats huh…last time i checked MLB is not played in the Fall League.

        Montero may in deed turn out to be a good hitter, but in no way will he bring what Pineda will brind to the Yanks, or M’s.  The minimal return makes it a horrible trade, not the piece the recieved in return.

    • Dustin Ackley, Justin Smoak and Mike Carp have all showed promise, and Montero will probably be slotted somewhere between. Stating he’ll do terrible because of a lack of protection in the M’s lineup is misleading.

  52. FrankTheFunkasaurusRex 4 years ago

    compared to the Gio, Latos deal, this trade is way too fair. Think the Mariners should have tried to get more in the deal, considering the market for young SP is way overblown right now. Still, I think both teams did well.

  53. CardsEagles1489 4 years ago

    Damn, I wouldn’t wanna be the rest of AL. Yankees are now the favorites in my opinion..

    • Because of Pineda? Doubtful

      • Bret Wask 4 years ago

        Yes.  Because of Pineda and Kuroda.  

        And Seattle will still finish around 80 wins.  

      • blueandwhite89 4 years ago

        Kuroda also. But they are easy favs because the rest of the team is very VERY good.

  54. Potential swap for Garza? 

    • gocubs418 4 years ago

      Brilliant point!  That could very well be for Garza.  Hopefully so.

    • Franl Edwardo 4 years ago

      why in the world would you ever do that.  Pineda has a much higher upside than Garza, and is much more controlable and cheaper.  Pineda may be unproven, but his upside is phenomenal.  This is a huge win for the Yankees.  They will certainly give the kid rest when it is needed.  Seattle really mismanaged his rookie campaign in the second half.  They will have enough of a cushion to ensure he is rested and ready to go for the playoffs.    

      • Why? Because Garza is battle tested and has proven he can handle the AL east. I like Pineda’s upside, but he is still raw. Garza gives the yanks a formidable 1-2 and makes them WS contenders not just playoff contenders.  

        • Bret Wask 4 years ago

          that doesnt make any sense.  Pineda (all things considered) is greater than Garza.  They Yankees (rightfully) refused to part with Montero for Garza.

          • No. At this point in time Garza> Pineda. Pineda has the potential to be a better pitcher than Garza, but right now he isn’t better. Pineda is a two pitch pitcher right now, who gets hammered by good lineups. And no again. The Yanks didn’t want to give up Montero+Banuelos+Bentances for Garza. 

          • Bret Wask 4 years ago

            you are totally ignoring that players come with contracts.  in 2012 Garza is probably a better pitcher than Pineda, but he is NOT a better value.  And he will be even less vs Pineda in 2013 and beyond.

  55. gocubs418 4 years ago

    Garza and Byrd for Pineda, Betances / Banuelos, and Campos.  

    :)

    Yankees need a #2 behind CC.  Not Pineda.

    • Disgustedfan 4 years ago

      Are you high

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      Pineda isn’t really that much behind Garza.  AND he is cheaper.  AND he is controlled for longer.  If the Yankees had something like that up their sleeves 1) they would be stupid, and 2) they would not have signed Kuroda.

    • Chris Barrows 4 years ago

      Pineda will be a solid #2 and could be a future ace. His numbers are solid and should develop well. Having him under control till 2017 is an additional added bonus. I love Montero – but the fact is, this is more of a long-term deal and Montero wasn’t a guarantee to work out long-term in light of the questions if he could be a full-time catcher or not. 

  56. I think the key is Olivo. Can he mentor Montero into a decent fielder?

    • Olivo can’t turn himself into a decent fielder, let alone anyone else. Still have hopes for Montero though.

  57. The mariners have the biggest surplus
    of pitchers in baseball. And a  lack of bats. Pineda is only 1
    year in. He is as much of a risk if not more so then montero. Montero,
    smoak, carp and possibly dustin ackley
    are potential 25+hr 100+rbi guys. Even if two of those guys succeed,
    the mariners will be in a good place. Montero doesn’t have to play
    catcher. There is a spot in the al called the DESIGNATED HITTER! and
    even if you sign a prince fielder (meaning if they dont sign fielder they should still sign a proven vet that you know can still hit, they’re claiming they only have 3 or 4 mil left, but if you know about all the money that came off the books you know thats b.s.) you can still platoon him and get
    ANOTHER big bat. Anyone that says this is a stupid trade need to SHUT UP
    and let these guys’ careers unfold. Your acting as though pineda has
    been in the big leagues 5 years. He hasnt and it is very possible
    (although I hope not) that he ultimately fails. It was a risk the ms AND
    the yanks had to make for both teams. I have been a mariners season ticket holder for 6 years. and frequent minor league games. They are FINE in the pitching department. And I have a feeling that this trade will entice prince to at least carefully comin to seattle. This is a much bigger move then a lot of people think

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      That doesn’t mean making a bad trade with one is worth it.  This was a bad trade for Seattle.  They could have gotten more.  

      Frankly, they probably could have gotten more for Felix.  It isnt like they are going to make the playoffs in the next 3 years!

  58. Heliosphan 4 years ago

    Pineda struggled with lefties at times, and going to the AL East means he’ll regress slightly. That being said, Montero will be held back by Seattle’s ballpark. Campos has a live arm and a high ceiling. Noesi could turn into a Doug Fister type…. or, more likely, he will be minor league depth and an option if some of the young pitchers in the rotation falter.

  59. Heliosphan 4 years ago

    Pineda struggled with lefties at times, and going to the AL East means he’ll regress slightly. That being said, Montero will be held back by Seattle’s ballpark. Campos has a live arm and a high ceiling. Noesi could turn into a Doug Fister type…. or, more likely, he will be minor league depth and an option if some of the young pitchers in the rotation falter.

  60. philly_philanderer 4 years ago

    He

  61. philly_philanderer 4 years ago

    the move def makes sense for the Yankees…now they can trot out a five man rotation of dudes names ending in A—-sabathiA, pinedA, novA, kurodA, garciA…was purely an aesthetic move

  62. Grant 4 years ago

    Not as good as the Rays rotation, but it’s a big step forward. All us Ray fans will just have to hope that he will not be able to handle the pressure in NY. He’s a fastball pitcher and in a hitter’s park like New York, those can be pretty bad.

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      Right, but the lineup is night and day and the yankee bullpen is probably better too.  The Rays are going to be shooting it out with the Angels for the wildcard (only because they have a tougher schedule).  Also Cleveland could make a run at the wildcard (because of any easier schedule).  Of course there may be two “wildcards” this year so who knows!!!???

  63. umm pineda only added 8 wins to the season. montero can easily double that. so even if pineda does win 15-16 games (which he wont) its still equal

    • Somebody doesn’t understand how WAR works.

      • blueandwhite89 4 years ago

        I’m pretty sure he was talking about wins (you know, that normal pitchers stat that sabermetrics made you forget). Pineda had 9 wins last year. (in 171 innings). Thats mostly because of the team he played on.

  64. JacobyWanKenobi 4 years ago

    I didn’t know it was possible to feel sad, happy, terrified, excited, nauseated, and waffle all at one time.

  65. FrankTheFunkasaurusRex 4 years ago

    yeeeup. Lefty-heavy lineups will kill him at home.

    • Bret Wask 4 years ago

      Riiiiiight… because he held lefties to a 3.82 xFIP last year.  He is one of the best young pitchers in baseball.  At least as good as Latos (according to the numbers) and cheaper for longer.  

  66. blueandwhite89 4 years ago

    As a Jays fan I like this trade. Kuroda and Pineda are pitching against tougher teams in a HR happy ballpark. I think they will be ok, but expect some struggle there.

    The key is losing Montero. This is a guy who has lit it up at every league he’s played in. And with A-ron and jeter aging, I am very happy the Yanks wont have this guys bat in the middle of the order.

    Yanks take the AL East easy with or without this trade though.

  67. I think Yankees should talk to angels about swapping abreu for soriano. (angels could use bullpen help and really dont have a place to play abreu this year) meanwhile yankees could use a bat like abreu and I think soriano has all but proven he’s not ready for new york…..contracts are similar.

    • That would be bad soriano would be the closer after mo leaves and abreu is getting to old and he was not good under the new York presure soriano had a great year besides having a injury

  68. Pineda is going to win A LOT of games for the bombers. 

  69. Marinersforever71 4 years ago

    Unfortunately, Prince is now a Detroit Tigers. Mariners need to move Seager to first base and acquire Miguel Cabrea and reacquire David Pauley from the Tigers for pitchers James Paxton, Erasmus Ramirez, outfielder Franlyn Gutierrez, and a player to b named later so the M’s can also sign Johnny Damon, Magglio Ordonez, or Manny Ramirez to keep up w/ the Rangers and Angels, esp. this season.

  70. TophersReds 4 years ago

    And THAT payroll. Wow.

    (Sorry, it kind of agitates me.)

  71. slider32 4 years ago

    Pineda will win many more games for the Yanks than he did for the Mariners.

  72. Yea, why’s that?

  73. tiger313 4 years ago

    Saying montero is a clone of cabby is hilarious.

  74. Michael Pineda is far from a “frontline” pitcher; he has the potential to be one if he ever develops a good changeup. Otherwise, he’s a 3. Not all that bad, but not an ace.

  75. We’ll see, I don’t see any prototypical DHs on their team, unless there is someone in their farm system I’m unaware of.

  76. they still need an everyday bat for dhing, these are the yanks we’re talking about… they dont platoon players

  77. $3513744 4 years ago

    Because that package isn’t getting Felix no matter how many times someone proposes it.

  78. MetsMagic 4 years ago

    A-Rod. 

  79. MaineSox 4 years ago

     The move from SafeCo to Yankee Stadium is a legitimate concern, Pineda is a flyball pitcher (or was last year) and still had a below average HR/FB, moving to Yankee stadium is going to make that worse.  That’s not to say that he can’t and wont still be a very good pitcher, but it would be foolish just to dismiss the concern.

  80. Rangersfan32 4 years ago

    Pineda will play in a tiny ballpark, against much tougher competition, under insane pressure. It’s not that far fetched to say a guy going into his second year could blow up.

  81. “hugest”, really?  I know this is sports, but still. 

  82. kurtits 4 years ago

    Sorry man, but the yanks are trying to shed costs so they can get below $189MM by 2014. I think adding another 20+ mill contract doesn’t fit in that…

  83. sdsny 4 years ago

    I don’t see that at all.  We don’t need a full-time DH.  That spot needs to be open for some of our aging bats to get partial days off.  That’s the only thing that bothers me about this deal.  Aging bats.  Montero probably had no defensive position in the lineup, but man can he rake.  I like the players coming back, but I hope it doesn’t come back to bite us.

  84. The Yankees obviously want a free open DH spot, to reduce the payroll before 2014, and get younger. I understand Prince is only 28 but why pay Pujols money for someone thats just gonna clog the basepaths and the DH spot unless you trade Teixeira and lose a gold glove and someone who can hit 30+ with 100 RBI’s and get on base at a decent rate. Yeah, he doesn’t hit like Prince does but he is also a switch hitter which makes things tough late in games on managers.

  85. YanksFanSince78 4 years ago

    yeah….don’t see that happening, especially with all the talk of them trying to reduce the salary. The Yanks trading for Pineda vs signing a pitcher makes me think along those lines.

    That’s not to say that Jackson, Oswalt or Kuroda > Pineda. We have to see.

  86. Add Kuroda

  87. Yankees fans desire to add payroll for no reason baffles me. Prince Fielder isn’t coming to NY, and it would be a bad move if he did. Cashman is smart, too bad Yankee fans couldn’t grasp how important it is to get under the lux tax by 2014. The new CBA makes the luxury tax actually important, signing Fielder would be an albatross.

  88. Then you don’t get plan B, you get the guy you really want. Also, they just signed Kuroda for 10 million, so how does that not fill their need.

  89. Rangersfan32 4 years ago

    Pineda is just as unproven as Montero. Pineda also pitched in a pressure free place with a huge park and relatively easy division for pitchers compare to the East. This could be a lose-lose deal.

  90. Guest 4 years ago

    You sir, are correct. 

    One of AJ, Hughes, or Garcia will be moved in the next three days. My guess, AJ and $14mm-$16mm is traded to an NL team. 

  91. And in all of it—the Yankees get younger in the rotation. CC Sabathia is the unquestioned ace, but I see 3 of the Yankees’ projected 5 starters as 25 or younger on Opening Day.

    As for the other end, Jack Z had better be right or else this could cost him his job.

    I think that Pineda could be a 14-15 game winner on a team with a good offense.

  92. WhiteOwl1972 4 years ago

    Hugest jealous he said it first.

  93. hardcoreforhardcore 4 years ago

    *Gary Sanchez

  94. michael hughes 4 years ago

    Your punery is second to nonery.

  95. He is also forgetting Nova.

  96. If they liked Montero so much how come they didn’t give up the rental Cliff Lee for him? Pineda has so much more value with age and team control.

  97. yeahh ure right. that damn luxury tax!

  98. yeah no doubt it was a great trade an no doubt the yanks have an excellent lineup but whos going to dh now? u could say arod will play in the dh sometimes along with jeter but how many games 50-70? how about the rest? nuñez? chavez? jones? cmon, the yanks dont settle for bench players to become everyday players. 

  99. $3513744 4 years ago

    It’s not really plan B when getting Felix isn’t an option and never was.  

  100. $3513744 4 years ago

    At least Pineda has a season under his belt.  Can’t say the same for Montero.  He hasn’t done squat yet, but I do agree it’s a huge gamble for both teams, which is why it’s a fair trade.

  101. Nonchalanto 4 years ago

    “clog the basepaths”
    Joe, is that you?

  102. Yeah that CASHMAN has an eye for pitching talent.  So talented.  Is Kei still on the payroll?

  103. jjs91 4 years ago

    Nope his deal expered did carlos silvas?

  104. Tvators 4 years ago

     sanchez regressed severely last yr both on and off the field, serious questions about his D, as he has problems catching a baseball which is a huge problem for a catcher

  105. westcoastwhitesox 4 years ago

    Great point.  Someone in charge of the Mariners is dumb for that.

  106. jigokusabre 4 years ago

    Because they also liked Justin Smoak.

  107. harmony55 4 years ago

    Because the Mariners thought they had a better offer in Justin Smoak, Blake Beaven, Josh Lueke and Matt Larson.

  108. Montero is younger and has 6 years of control vs 5 for Pineda. 

    Are you sure you’re thinking about Jesus Montero and not a different Montero. 

  109. Sam Watanabe 4 years ago

    The Mariners actually had a pretty good bullpen last year

  110. sonofsnake 4 years ago

    Yes

  111. Not only did it expire but so did Bavasi.  Good to see CASHMAN sign Silva to a minor league deal. 

  112. East Coast Bias 4 years ago

    I thought Adams was the reason the trade didn’t happen…? Pineda will do all right, have some faith, man!

  113. Sorry – BoSox signed him.  Same thing up here in South Alaska.  

  114. ayrbhoy 4 years ago

    I Agree- the M’s badly need offense, they have plenty of young stud starting pitchers (Paxton, Walker, Hultzen etc.) and Pineda has injury history: he had to be shut down in 2009 due to an elbow injury.  

  115. MaineSox 4 years ago

     Right now he throws a fastball and a slider (and he actually threw a change up about 6% of the time last year too, so he actually already has a 3rd pitch).

  116. michael hughes 4 years ago

    Team wins and pitcher wins are different stats my friend.

  117. blueandwhite89 4 years ago

    Well of course anything can happen, but its hard to fathom the yanks blowing it this year. They had the most wins in the AL with an increadibly shaky starting rotation. This year its stable. Only way I can see them losing it is if the Rays get some of their young bats cooking.

  118. Still using wins like they’re a meaningful stat, I see.

  119. Thinking he’ll suffer from Ed Whitson syndrome?

Leave a Reply