The Athletics will trade Gio Gonzalez to the Nationals in a deal that further depletes Oakland's pitching staff and adds to Washington's potentially dominant rotation. The deal sends Gonzalez and minor league right-hander Robert Gilliam to Washington in exchange for four highly-regarded young players, including three of the Nationals' top ten prospects: right-handers A.J. Cole and Brad Peacock, left-hander Tom Milone and catcher Derek Norris. ESPN.com's Keith Law broke the news on Twitter, with Scott Miller of CBSSports.com reporting Gilliam's inclusion in the deal.
Gonzalez (pictured) will join Stephen Strasburg and Jordan Zimmermann atop an impressive-looking Nationals' rotation that also figures to include Chien-Ming Wang and John Lannan. Gonzalez, 26, is under team control through 2015. He has reached the 200-inning plateau in each of the past two seasons without posting an ERA above 3.23.
However, no MLB pitcher has walked more opponents than Gonzalez in the past two seasons and he's about to get expensive through arbitration (projected 2012 salary of $4.2MM). While most teams –the Nationals included — can stomach a $4.2MM salary for an established, young left-handed starter, the A's haven't resolved their stadium situation and operate under a more limited payroll.
Without Gonzalez and Trevor Cahill, two of the 40 MLB pitchers to throw 200 innings this past season, Oakland's rotation will look considerably different in 2012. Brandon McCarthy, Guillermo Moscoso, Brett Anderson, Dallas Braden, Tyson Ross and Josh Outman are possible starters for the A's, who entered the offseason with a deeper rotation than most.
Gilliam, 24, was an eighth-round draft pick for the A's in the 2009 draft. The right-hander has a 4.55 ERA, a 3.07 K/BB ratio and has 270 strikeouts in 287 innings of pro ball, with his highest level of advancement being Class A Stockton last season.
Peacock (#3), Cole (#4) and Norris (#9) all rank among the Nationals' top ten prospects, according to Baseball America's latest rankings. Peacock emerged as "one of the most exciting power arms in the high minors" this year, BA reports. The 23-year-old posted a 2.39 ERA with 10.9 K/9 and 2.9 BB/9 in the upper minors before getting called up to the Nationals and appearing in three games.
Cole posted a 4.04 ERA with 10.9 K/9 and 2.4 BB/9 in 89 innings at Class A this past season. The 2010 fourth rounder is just 19 years old and stands 6'4". Milone, 24, made his MLB debut this past season, posting a 3.81 ERA with 5.2 K/9 and 1.4 BB/9 in five starts with the Nationals. He spent most of the season at Triple-A, where he had a 3.22 ERA with 9.4 K/9 and 1.0 BB/9 in 148 1/3 innings.
Norris, 22, entered the 2011 season as the 72nd best prospect in the game, according to Baseball America. He responded by posting a .210/.367/.446 line in his first stint at Double-A, adding 20 homers and 77 walks.
Though Nationals GM Mike Rizzo would no doubt have preferred to acquire Gonzalez for lesser prospects, it was clear from the beginning of the offseason that Gonzalez would require a substantial return. The Red Sox, Rangers, Marlins, Yankees, Blue Jays, Tigers and Mariners were also linked to Gonzalez this winter. Earlier in the offseason, A's GM Billy Beane obtained minor leaguers Jarrod Parker, Collin Cowgill and Ryan Cook for Cahill and Craig Breslow.
Photo courtesy Icon SMI.
And Red Sox fans everywhere can now un-pee their pants.
Man, it is far too late for that. The relief just washed over me and I couldn’t help it.
If only the system down there worked that way.
I was hoping for the BoSox to get him, but glad we didn’t trade Lavarnway or any of the rest of our depleted farm since the AGon trade.
Would have given any of the ‘plateau-ed’ guys – Anderson, Reddick, Doubront, Weiland, Miller, Iglesias etc… in a package though
Oh, okay, in a package then. I’m taking it Weiland would be the centerpiece of your deal?
I know. So happy we didnt empty out half of our top 10 for Gio.
I personally would rather pay cash for Roy Oswalt and Madson Gio is not that good of a pitcher if the Soxs land Bailey thats will be nice
Yeah most definitely. Gio would be nice to have but honestly watching guys who walk people like he does gets annoying the example here being Dice-K…omg what an annoying start to watch. Gio could def improve that though but even still the package they got for him was a huge overpay, and one year of Oswalt is ideal seeing as we could get in on any top FA pitcher next season, hopefully Hamels hits the market.
They have Gio, who threw 200+ with >3.50 ERA both ages 24 and 25, for four years on the cheap. That is MUCH better than paying for an expensive one year stopgap that could get hurt at any time.
For one we will have depth behind him im sure. Two as good as Gio is pitching at Fenway walking 100 people is only gonna make his stat line come back to reality. Then your stuck with a three starter with a twos ceiling for what? Four of your top ten prospects. No thanks pay the money sign someone else next year or trade for someone a bit better than Gio for the same package.
just letting you know oswalt was better in his prime but gio is better now hes 25 and oswalt is 34
You obviously did not excel in Math. Three of ten is not half, more like less than 1/3 of their top ten and only one was top five.
I am obviously speaking in generalities obviously the point was it was an overpay.
And yeah all four are widely considered to be in their top 10 prospects.
Hey, remember that time the Red Sox didn’t trade for Gio? Good times, good times.
this is way better than the melancon trade
Yeah I remember
I shudder to think what we’d have to resort to in response to an injury had we traded for Gonzalez. We might as well have just sold one of our minor league affiliates because we barely have enough talent to fill them as-is >_>
Harry: “I got… I gotta stop and got to the bathroom”
Lloyd: “Just go man… Oh… that’s really warm.”
Fun Fact: Gio Gonzalez 09-11 8.8 fWAR Jason Hammels 09-11 8.8 fWAR
Cool. I’m sure Tim Lincecum and Dillon Gee have a stat in common also.
is it three years worth of MLB wins above replacement?
Gio actually only had a 7.8 fWAR during that time period.
Worst offseason ever for the Sox….
I love it!
Well when they have seemingly great offseasons, they have….2011. So let’s try something new.
Because they have to go into next year again with that horrid rotation? A slew of arms destined to and will once against cost Red Sox nation from another title. You think Beckett has any chance of repeating last season? There is nothing coming off that farm to help either… Lester and Buccholz are nice, Beckett should be back and solid also…but there is nothing after that…at all…and the first three have all had their share of issues.
And boom goes the dynamite…
Typed it wrong, my bad 😀
fail
smh
I’m happy the Jays didn’t get Gio. I wouldn’t want to give up half of that.
Liked. I’d rather we try our luck at one of five players breaking out than to put all eggs in the Gio basket.
I would have thought a package like that would get Garza
I would think it would be enough to get Garza. It’s more than the Cubs gave up for him last year when he had one more year of control. The funny part was most people thought that was too much for Garza last year.
We wanted Gio…he is a far better product, read:
link to fangraphs.com
Garza is basically the same pitcher, more expensive, and under control a shorter period.
Not to mention Gio’s endeavors versus the AL East. With his walk rate and those batters seeing him 3-4 times per year? Game over.
happy for the athletics because that is an awesome haul for gio
happier for boston though. bullet dodged
edit: and to be fair to the nationals, gio shouldn’t regress much if at all in the NL. here’s hoping he continues to improve and everyone wins. strasburg-zimmerman-gonzalez could turn out to be an excellent top 3 when the time comes
Think the Mets and Braves just crapped themselves a little bit more?
Phillies were already the favorites. The Marlins and the Nats have done a very good job of improving themselves. The Braves and Mets…..not much at all.
What a haul, lmao. Maybe I’m second guessing myself. I wanted to see Boston grab him just cause I wanted to see them make a move, but nevermind, I’m good.
Great deal for the A’s.
2015!
really great deal. cole and norris are fantastic and peacock is no scrub either
and milone may not be a strikeout machine, but 16 walks in 140+ innings…not too shabby
I hadn’t even heard of Milone until today, but his peripherals look great.
His walk rate has dropped and his K-rate has increased in each of the past three seasons.
Could be a dark horse for the starting rotation.
yeah milone looks pretty good, only knock is that he doesn’t throw 90 mph, or at least tops out at it
BA had him as the best control and changeup in the organization.
i’m definitely going to see some rivercats games next year, jesus, a possible opening day rotation of (2 of) parker, gray, peacock, and milone. that’s naaaasty, plus green, miller, parker, ka’aiahue (however you spell it) on offense, should be an awesome group to watch
Probably because he only throws like 86-88. But he can pitch definitely, I like him better than peacock
You know who else has relatively low velocity and doesn’t know how to issue a walk?
Cliff Lee says velocity is overrated when you have pinpoint control.
Seriously, I’m new to the Milone train myself, but looking at his peripherals, if the A’s want Middlebrooks all that bad and think this mid-eighties throwing scrub is such a waste, I’ve got a trade proposal for them…
I haven’t heard of him till today also. Guess by how everyone talks about him he is kind of like a Shawn Marcum type pitcher. That’s not a bad thing either.
While I don’t think the return is as good as the Padres got for Latos, I have to agree that this was a fantastic return for the A’s – certainly more than I expected.
Its a lot but If there was one area in the system we could afford to lose it is pitching.
Predictable-_-, I think its a good trade, but i did kind of wish for the mystery team!
god damnit now the braves have to face Gio!? he’s K rate will only go up now…
Cole, Peacock, Norris, and Milone.. I’m actually happy Hood isn’t included
Good job Rizzo
never heard of Norris but wow does that guy look good on paper. Granted the BA was very low this year but extremely high walk rate, has power and fantastic at throwing runners out.
However he was useless to the Nats, who have a glut of catchers anyway.
too bad no destin hood, but i like the deal
Wow, what a deal. Could be a solid 1-2-3 combo if Gio adjusts properly to the NL and Stras stays healthy. I like the Nats chances for a 2nd place finish or even a wild card if they can get Prince. With the phillies getting older this team may be a force in the next few years. I’ll be rooting for em.
P.S. When the heck are the Yanks going to get some pitching help. I’ve been very patient with, “Plan B”
Why didn’t they just keep these guys?
Because they suck. Millone throws 85 with nothing but a
changeup. Peacock is a 2-pitch pitcher with bad command. Norris can’t
hit the broad side of a barn. The only one with any iota of talent is
Cole and he hasn’t even pitched above low-A ball. Billy Beane is a
disgrace. What a terrible haul. RIzzo wins big.
Sickles reports:
3) A.J. Cole, RHP, Grade B+. I really believe in his upside. Needs to build stamina and refine his changeup, but if it comes together he could be a Top 20 pitching prospect next year, perhaps more.
4) Brad Peacock, RHP, Grade B: Borderline B+. Still has some command issues, but his ERAs finally caught up with his components and his overall potential in 2011. Will be ready before Cole but his upside is not quite as high. Future 2/3 starter if all works out.
6) Derek Norris, C, Grade B: Loads of power, walks, and scouting reports on his defense are getting more positive each year. Ranking may seem high for such a low batting average, but I see him as a Mike Napoli/Mickey Tettleton type who can be productive even with a low average.
9) Tom Milone, LHP, Grade B-: At some point, the radar guns stop mattering. The guy can simply pitch. He has little margin for error, but he will probably have a better career than hundreds of guys who throw 10 MPH harder.
Sickles reports > your mindless, thoughtless sh!t-talking.
Brilliant right up, thanks Pete!
because they were surplus and they think they are ready to compete and build a fanbase now
It’s expensive but you won’t get any special surprises, you should stick with it-
Oh, wait, never mind.
When I read this I thought of a different “plan B”
Yeah, I’ve gotta admit, if the Nationals get Fielder, I like their
chances in the division almost as much as your chances of winning the
WWE or World Heavyweight Championship. Or both. Raw’s bringing Smackdown
guys on the show, you could take their title too.
Good.
Whatever. Bailey will be going to Boston any second now, if they had any actual interest, it was only to raise Boston’s price.
Your pessimism is strangely reminiscent of Randy Quaid in Major League 2.
The Rays could give up like 1% of their MiLB talent pool and get Bailey.
Overpaid. While he’s a decent guy in the rotation to contend in the next few years, a guy like Edwin Jackson is still available and could had done 90% of the task. I know the NL East is filled with power LH hitters but that is too much given up.
Should gone after Garza, they could have kept Cole.
i think the reason for this is the money and control.
Yes, and Espinosa and Storen stay put!!!!!!!!!!! Plus Destin Hood!!!!
If I were the Nats I would have rather taken out two of those guys and plugged in Espinosa. Those K’s are gonna catch up to him
The Nats gave up a metric ton, but they will have a very nasty top of the rotation. Granted their starters stay healthy, next year could be a wry exciting year for them, especially if Harper makes his debut.
This could make the nationals very good for quite some time. Their starting staff is well beyond solid.
WOW! That’s a nice haul!
Brad Peacock, A.J. Cole AND Derek Norris, plus Tom Milone?!?
I think I might I like this package even more than the ones they got for Mulder, Haren and Swisher.
Not even that…I think this is the best haul for any player, ever. I seriously can’t remember anyone getting back 3 top starting pitching prospects + another player for 1. This one will go down in the record books.
Lmao slow down there…
Pedro Martinez was a pretty good haul for Delino DeShields.
Trading Mark Teixeira to Atlanta pretty much turned Texas from a joke to the best team in baseball. That trade destroys any trade I’ve ever seen, including this one.
Atlanta made 2 horrible trades with Teixiera. The one they traded when they got him, and then Teixeira for Casey Kotchman lmao.
As an A’s fan, that trade still makes me sad. WHY did that happen.
Also, the Angels trade. The draft pick from Tex turned into Mike Trout.
The Braves hurt us a little bit during those Teixeira trades also. They could have taken Kendrys Morales out of the AL West for us. He was who Anaheim wanted to give them for Teixeira, but the Braves held out for Casey Kotchman!
The Padres got 2 top 100 prospects, may be top 50 when this years rankings come out… for Mike Adams.
Beane murdered on this one. The Massacre.
Pretty fair deal for both sides. Not mad.
So you actually like this deal? even without rendon.
I can’t help but agree, i wish we could have gone with a lesser pitcher than milone tho.
The Nats just won the Wild Card. The Braves can’t top this rotation even with Kimbrel & Friends in the back of that bullpen…
that division is really getting tough
Poor Mets
They still exist?
What an overpayment. Awful deal for the Nationals IMO.
Love the haul for the A’s though.
Glad someone finally pointed out his control issues. Until he cuts down on those walks I’m not a believer.
But i thought Yagottabelive!!!
iGottaBelieve in my Mets, not Gio haha
Finally?
Where have you been? Literally everyone writing about Gio has pointed out his league leading walks and his 4+ BB/9 rate every single time his name has come up.
Well then I guess I wasn’t reading up on it as much as I thought. With all the hype around a potential Gio trade people at least to me seemed like they forgot all about his walk issues and his second half last year.
Unless he improves Billy robbed Washington
lol
After this trade the Nationals still have Harper, Rendon, Goodwin, Meyer, Purke, Solis, Hood, and Taylor in their system
The future is bright in D.C.
The thing IMO that made this possible for us is our draft list. We can replace these guys, with purke and meyer.
It really hurts tho that we gave up all three, especially two that are major league ready. Im pretty excited for this one but can’t help but be nervous.
Lot of risk involved with this kind of trade, prospects are no guarantee to pan out however, I think it will help out Washington more in the long run then the Athletics.. I just can’t see them competing any time soon.
I think that was too much for the Nats to give up but at least they got their man I guess. I thought it would be two stud prospects and two average guys. Nats should ask for something else in return because even though I don’t consider myself a prospect guru, those are four or their top prospects.
wow why not any bats we have a ton of pitching im not happy with this trade did not mind peacock,cole and norris but should have got another hitter
Norris is a Mike Napoli clone. But I see where you’re coming from, Hood would have been nice
red sox fans bailey deal soon, beware
If Beane gets Middlebrooks for Bailey can we all agree he’s still got it?
Considering the haul he just got for Gio, I think it’s safe to say that he’s still got it.
Getting Parker in the Cahill deal wasn’t bad either.
if that happens, i will say those words myself
at his funeral
No, because Middlebrooks has the same hit tool issues that Norris has, and as a result, will most likely not pan out. And yes, I’m a Red Sox fan. Kalish or Reddick would be much better for Oakland.
“And yes, I’m a Red Sox fan.”
I’m shocked. No really.
You do realize that Middlebrooks is the Sox number 1 ranked prospect this year….and that he killed in Portland last year right?
if beane can get middlebrooks out of bailey…i will kiss him on the mouth haha that’s be a stroke of jenius (spelled on purpose)
Wow that’s a lot of the National’s farm system depth. A lot.
It may be 4 prospects but we paid much less than the Reds paid for Latos.
And you got a far worse pitcher.
Yeah OK.
You did get a worse pitcher, I wouldn’t say far though.
MLBTR commentators wildly, massively, going overboard with how much they think Gio Gonzalez is not very good at pitching while ignoring such key factors as facts and stats and not believing in progressing? Yup, par for the course.
Gio is good, this deal is not a whitewash but they are getting a good pitcher, walks arent everything, I wonder what all these nerds thought of Randy Johnson back in the day….
the days before his K-rate went from 8 to 10 to 12 and his walk rate went from 5 to 3 to 2?
they probably said “his k-rate will not go from 8 to 12 and his walk rate will not go from 5 to 2, because that never happens”
because it never does. good comp though
lol did you just compare Gio to Randy Johnson lolololol
it may be less than the reds paid, but they also got a lesser and more inconsistent pitcher at a much steeper price. Hopefully, for Nats fans, he doesnt turn into oliver perez, very similar pitchers
Not really. I’d rather have this prospect package than the one the Pads got. And I’d MUCH rather have Latos than Gio.
Latos > Gio
Yes, but Latos goes to hitting-friendly park, while Gonzalez doesn’t as much. And Gonzalez is LH in a division with quite a few LH bats (mostly on PHI).
Holy cow, that’s a HUGE haul for the A’s. The Nats will be great with Gio, but they gave up a ton.
The Nationals now have very little pitching depth. I wouldn’t have done it with both Peacock and Cole.
*and Milone
you guys still have solis, meyer, purke, and ray…you’re still in good shape for the future
The Reds gave up a ton to get Latos, but I saw the value and reason in that trade. This is just bonkers. Nats, what were you thinking?
That they will have a big 3 of Stras-Gio-Zimm controlled for the next 4 years?
Its pretty on paper, but I don’t think a pitcher with control problems and an almost 4 era outside of Oakland was worth what was given up.
Would I want him on my team? Hells yes, but right player for the right price. Nats keep going all in on flashy players.
Thank Jesus.
Hopefully now the Sox are back in on Oswalt.
Looks like the best fit for both the Sox and Os.
How is that a HUGE haul? Millone throws 85 with nothing but a
changeup. Peacock is a 2-pitch pitcher with bad command. Norris can’t
hit the broad side of a barn. The only one with any iota of talent is
Cole and he hasn’t even pitched above low-A ball. Billy Beane is a
disgrace. What a terrible haul.
I hope you’re right
You should post this again in case somebody missed it.
Saying it repeatedly isn’t going to make it true.
That makes three times you’ve posted this exact same comment.
We get it.
Quit spewing the same garbage over and over.
Peacock’s 2.9 BB/9 in the minors last year suggests that he has at least average command. Peacock’s development of a third pitch will likely determine whether he is a good starter or good reliever. Norris had his worst year in the minors last year, and still had an .813 OPS in AA as a 22 year-old. Next year will be a big year for Norris, but the ceiling is high. Cole is a pretty decent pitching prospect. And Milone had a 9.69 K/BB ratio in AAA last year. They may have ignored the scouts a little bit too much on this one, but it’s a pretty decent risk for Oakland when all they gave up was Gio Gonzalez, a guy who will never have good enough control to be an elite starter.
Jamie Moyer made a career out of throwing 85 with elite control.
Is the Nats farm system that deep to give up that much for a mid of the rotation starter???
Nope.
The Nats farm system had a really impressive top 6 or 7. Not anymore.
You gotta think when Brett Anderson comes back from TJ if he stays healthy he will be next to go.
A very nice haul for the A’s. It makes up a little for the Cahill deal.
More than a little, this trade is criminal.
I think he’s a little better than mid-rotation, but still think the Nationals went off the deep end a bit.
I’m just glad I’m not an A’s fan. Even as an outsider this is tough to watch.
I am glad for Gio’s sake he ended up in the NL and not the AL East. Let’s be honest, he would have been wrecked here. Glad he’s not on the Jays and Sox and that he won’t be (nearly as) shellshocked.
And the NL East gets even stronger…definitely the 2nd toughest division behind the AL East.
Can’t argue that.
Great deal for both sides!! How did Rizzo weasel his way out of losing Espinosa or Desmond?
I was honestly surprised neither of those two were included as well..
I don’t think anyone would want Desmond.
As a Red Sox fan I love it!! Thank you Nationals! That was almost a disaster for the Sox. But yea Nationals got raped in that trade. I don’t understand the Nationals at all, why does it seem like they are rushing to improve?? Last year they signed Werth to a terrible deal and now this trade. They have a nice young core already, just wait a few more years and let everyone develop. The players they traded could be in the major leagues in a few years.
Gio’s 26…. It’s not like they traded a bunch of guys for a pitcher in his mid 30s…
26 but hes not great by any means.
Excellent trade for the Nats- each one of those prospect(s) ceilings traded away are w/o question one draft away from replacing in the system! The Nats are contenders for a Div Banner, IMO.
Maybe in a year or two. Certainly not with the loaded Phils still there.
as a marlins fan I love the trade
Why? The Nats now have a better rotation than Miami does..
But they probably weakened their organization as a whole.
Anderson has to stay healthy first – He has his lowest value right now. He’ll be in OAK through mid-season, at least.
Mainly because he’ll still be injured until mid-season, at least.
You’ve got to be kidding me Nationals.
Edwin Jackson Combined WAR last two years, 7.6.
Gio Gonzalez? 6.7.
Don’t be surprised if Peacock matches Gonzalez’ production very soon. Not to mention, he’s only the third best prospect in this deal.
What an offseason for the AL West. Billy Beane does it again.
i agree, way to much, I’m ok with peacock going. But only if milone and cole don’t.
Hey Nicholas. On behalf of everyone ever.
SHUT UP ALREADY!
Bollocks. That was in response to someone saying Anderson was next to go.
And the saddest part about all this is that the Mariners will still come in behind the A’s.
Even if the A’s get a few great prospects, they’re still prospects and it’s depressing to see that they completely failed the one year that they really went for it.
Jair Jurrjens’ stock just went up. Thanks, Nats.
(He’s healthy and has been clocked in the mid-90’s recently in instructional league throwing).
oh jurrjens, the one pitcher the nats rocked with regularity. i really hope he stays on the braves for the nats sake
If he’s so great and healthy then you would want to keep him, right?
No, you want to trade him because you have the best pitching depth in the mayors and need help in offense.
I’m just saying why him? Because the most likely to underperform going forward, but when since he’s on the block (some) Braves fan continue to claim he’s an ace and prop him up with nonsense (mid 90s fastball in instructional league). (some) Braves fans continue to identify him as the most likely to be traded and then want the moon for him. Can’t have it both ways. The fact that he’s brought up in a discussion of Gonzalez is absurd b/c it seems to indicate the packages should be even remotely similar.
Gotta love the delusional Braves fans. So when does the Braves “Decade of Dominance” begin anyway?
Very true!! The Braves should be able to get a nice package of prospects for Jurrjens since teams seem to be willing to overpay for starting pitchers.
If they throw Rendon on that pile they probably get Latos
If they threw that pile to San Diego they probably would’ve gotten Latos
Happy that the Nats made such a poor move. Marlins and Nats will never beat the Braves, let alone the Phillies.
Bold words from a Mets fan.
I have seen this before.
-Mark Mulder
Bah.. its not like that Dan Haren kid the Cards traded for Mulder ever amounted to anything.
I am a nats
I am a nats fan and am now quite ill. This is a terrible deal.
It’s not a terrible deal at all, relax. I’m bummed about Peacock but honestly nobody else in that deal worries me.
As an A’s fan, I don’t care who stays or goes, I just want us to sign Brandon McCarthy to a 10 year deal. Via his twitter:
“Day 1 of Spring Training is going to be a meet and greet party with all of us in name tags it seems.”
hahaha so true
To me this trade means that theyre going for it in 2012…and wouldn’t be surprised if Prince is a nationals soon. As a nationals fan I think they gave up too much much for gio (if they wanted to sell the farm they should have called the seattle up and gave them those four plus 3 more more felix)
I think that this is a good deal for both sides. Washington traded from a position of depth. They have a whole bunch of young arms in their system. While it may hurt, they can absorb the loss of pitchers that werent going to be in the majors until next year as regulars. Gio is the top of the rotation that they need. It is a major haul but from the Nationals perspective, it was a bold but good move. Norris was about 4th on the depth chart and would only have gotten to the majors if he switched to 1st. This trade makes sense from both sides
And what a shock, he is much worse away from Oakland
Check out his career lines
Seems to me the Reds and the Nats gave up a similar match of prospects to acquire a young cost controlled starter. But I think the Reds got the better pitcher.
Reds got a better pitcher, an extra year of control, and a year of Latos at the minimum salary. Curious as to who got the better package between the Padres and A’s.
i’d say the padres did. potentian #1 starter (volquez), 1b capable of hitting .300-30-100 (alonso), potential closer (boxberger) potential above average starting C (grandal). a’s got #2 starter (peacock) back of the rotation guy (milone) potential #1 (cole), and a low ba high power catcher who could either be an all star for the next 20 years or do terribly and never be seen in the majors again (norris) actually i’d say its about equal
They don’t seem too far off by your assessment, although I’m suspicious of Alonso hitting thirty home runs playing half his games in Petco.
And if Volquez was ever going to reach his potential, he would have done so by now.
Black, Balsley and Petco would have something to say about that. I’m not saying Cy Young year or anything, but I could see Volquez having his best years in the next couple before he prices himself out of San Diego.
Other than Volquez, the Padres got 3 prospects with high ceilings and are less risky than Cole and Peacock. I give the Padres the edge, but not by a big margin.
Which is fair considering Latos is better than Gio, but not by a big margin.
I’d say both the Padres and A’s got what they needed. Alonso and Grandal have that line drive stroke needed for position players at Petco and the A’s added pitching to their farm system. As we all know the last time the A’s were god they had a pretty good rotation with 3 #1’s.
Haha, I see Disqus is posting messages all over the place like when I was trying to respond to you in the Mat Latos trade thread. Not at all down on the Padres’ haul by the way, just was curious who the consensus “winner” might be between Oakland and San Diego.
So are they going to call their TV Network NatGio?
The Nationals have quite a nice young core when you look at the big picture: Strasburg, Gio, Zimmmermann, Clippard, Storen, Ramos, Espinosa, Zimmerman to go along with a farm system that has Harper, Rendon, Goodwin, Meyer, Purke, Taylor, and Hood..
The Nationals draft well, take a look at the players that were sent over:
Peacock-41st round
Cole- 4th round
Norris- 4th round
Milone-10th round…
It won’t take the Nationals long to get it up to the level it was at prior to this trade.
With the new CBA it will be.
Eh, I wouldnt put much stock into what round of the draft they were obtained in, Cole went late because he wanted too large a bonus, Peacock was too young and not a sure thing to sign etc
Who’s to say Meyer and Purke aren’t the equivalent of Peacock and Cole, if not better?
time for the andrew bailey bidding to start! hopefully it becomes a high priced bidding war.
BRING ME MIDDLEBROOKS OR BRING ME DEATH*
*Death can be brought in the form of a cheeseburger.
noooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! nats made a HUGE mistake
What a job done by Billy Beane, great haul my man
The Nationals are now officially contenders. They have to be because they have a 126 million dollar player out in right field who hits .229 with 14 homeruns.
*232 with 20 home runs
Pretty excited and nervous about this one. Could go either way. Milone, peacock and cole is ALOT. Hopefully only Cole pans out, and only cuz i like him. I view norris as just the throw in piece since he has been all but gone for two years if the nats made any trade.
Only thing i can’t understand is why no outfielder instead of milone. And why the Nats give up two MLB ready pitchers.
Hopefully this doesn’t end up being the Bartolo Colon deal, which in my opinion is the worst ever!!!. Cliff Lee, Grady Sizemore, and Brandon Phillips. Wow that was bad.
The A’s have a lot of young MLB-ready pitching. Spring training should be very interesting.
Go to hell, Rizzo. This is terrible. Those prospects are liable to produce more WAR in a season by 2013 than Gio will. He’s a slightly above-average pitcher. You basically traded all that talent for four years’ worth of the 2011 version of Jason Marquis. As a Nats and an M’s fan (I know…I’m a masochist) Rizzo has managed to hurt both my favorite teams in one fell swoop.
A Nats and M’s fan??? Really? That’s a very interesting combination.
You’re dumb. Great trade for your team today.
You gotta hand it to Rizzo, he doesn’t fool around. They wanted Gio Gonzalez and they got him. Now, they might have overpaid for him, just like they did for Jayson Werth (obviously overpaid in a different way) still he went out and made a bold statement today and they didn’t give up Storen! Hey if they decide to go out and sign Prince Fielder that team could become legit contenders!
Now the Orioles on the other hand seem to be standing around and talking by the coffee maching and not much else!
Duquette is full of “Hot Air” and that’s about it. At least it appears to me that way so far. Come on Duquette do something!
They are already legit contenders in the East. The Phillies are getting old, the Braves have some rotation issues, the Marlins will be very good if they can stay healthy, and the Mets are just terrible. I’m guessing that if all goes well for all the potential contenders (Phils, Braves, Marlins, and Nats,) we’re looking at 4/5 teams being over .500.
On your Duquette statement, maybe he will sign Manny to another 8-year deal…
On your Duquette statement, maybe he will sign Manny to another 8-year deal… Thanks for cheering me up, LOL.
While you got me to laugh, I am the one who is supposed to dispensing the sarcasm around here….
Seriously though, as for your Mets will compete, but they have a lot of issues, the rotation and the newly minted bullpen. Oy Ve.
The Braves don’t have rotation issues. Beachy, Minor, Teheran, Delgado, Hanson, Hudson, Vizcaino, and Jurrjens if they don’t trade him. Where they have issues is at shortstop, another outfielder, and getting Heyward to hit.
They are only Prospects and “could” potentially work out. But, giving 4 players for Gio is ridiculous!!
Sign Fielder and the Nationals could compete for the division
Great, he is a solid upside cheap lefty that can rack up innings… BUT SERIOUSLY, Cole, Milone, Norris, AND Peacock… Milone could possibly end up being exactly what Gio is next year… Milone’s minors are sick and his first call up went fine. Peacock is #34 in BA America’s newish rankings. Norris was #72 coming into the year. Cole is rapidly climbing up the top 100. Giving up two top 100 and a package makes sense, but four!!! This is not a surefire superstar by any stretch of the imagination.
His ceiling is a superstar though, if he gets his BB/9 under 3 there will be literally nothing to knock him about, and he’s way young enough to figure that out and improve his game.
Cole is the most likely to reach his potential imo, unless Peacock develops a 3rd pitch he won’t be more than a solid 3 or even a back of the bullpen closer/setup, Milone is just Lannan-lite, and Norris is definitely not a Top 100 prospect anymore
Two notes:
1. The NL East, outside of the Mets will have 4 playoff contenders and be very competitive.
2. Jarrod Parker and Brad Peacock will be a nice future duo.
AJ Cole & Sonny Gray have ceilings as aces too. Damn Billy.
also dan straily could end up being a solid #2 or #3 pitcher in bigs, he’s legit
Its wild to think that the A’s have McCarthy, Anderson, Braden, Moscoso, Ross & Outman plus whatever FA they take a flier on….all of those guys could get traded too.
I’m totally down with getting rid of everyone except Weeks and shooting for 2014/15. This is a fantastic base to start from.
If the A’s were to trade all of them (except anderson) they’d still have a rotation of Anderson, Peacock, Parker, Gray, and Milone, with Banwart, Straily, and AJ Griffin waiting in the wings, definitely something to look forward to
A’s top 10 prospect list looks like this now:
1. Jarod Parker
2. A.J. Cole
3. Michael Choice
4. Brad Peacock
5. Sony Gray
6. Grant Green
7. Derek Norris
8. Tom Milone
9. Chris Carter
10. Yordy Cabrera
If you saw the top 10 from last year, this is a MONUMENTAL turnaround. Praise Jah–I mean Beane.
A.J. Cole has the potential to be a solid #1 or 2 in the future
Peacock, I’m not sold that he can be more than a solid 3 or a really good setup or closer
Norris hasn’t really been the same since his injury, it’ll be interesting to see what he can do this year
Milone reminds me of a John Lannan with a bit more accuracy, he’ll be a solid 4-5 at the end of the day
This from a Nationals fan who pays very close attention to their prospects, or in this case, former prospects
Grant Green at 6???…didnt he get moved to CF and now is having trouble hitting?…
AA is the hardest minor league to hit in, and a CF with 20+ HR potential are rare birds indeed. He’s still a top 10 guy even with just ok numbers at AA, easily. You have to figure some of his troubles stem from learning a new position too. Can’t wait to see what he will do at AAA this year.
not saying he isnt a stud…just that he has regressed somewhat
Yeah a lot of guys dont hit AA well, its usually their first taste of offspeed pitches, but he wasnt like, terrible. There’s a decent chance he will have a good year at AAA in 2012. He’s not top 5 anymore, but I think 6 is fair for him.
huge sleeper: vicmal de la cruz
also another sleeper: dan straily (154 k’s/40 bb’s, 3.10 FIP, low-mid 90’s fastball in hitter friendly Cal League)
Agreed but he’s 17, a gnats wing too early to put him in there.
agree, but a 17 y/o who walks more than he strikes out in his first pro season? swoon
Yup, Beane was not lying when he said his goal was to have a beastly 2015 team. He definitely is going to.
Just wish he’d buy some FAs to make the team watchable in the meantime :/
It doesn’t seem like he has much choice, as far as free agents go. As we all know, not many players (especially position players) like to play in the Coliseum. And ownership isn’t gonna let Beane spend any more than MLB makes them spend (per revenue sharing requirements). So they may have to just do something similar to what they did with Ben Sheets in 2010, and offer someone like Oswalt a ridiculous amount of money on a one-year deal.
I just hope its an outfielder next time.
I wonder if Carlos Beltran would take a 1 year $18MM deal? He was traded for Wheeler last year, if Beane was shrewd enough he’s try and pull the same move, sign him and then trade him at the deadline to a contender.
Beltran would be nice to have. But I seriously doubt he’d accept a one-year deal to play in a place like the Coliseum, even if he was offered an astronomical amount.
In my opinion, someone like Oswalt would work out better, anyway, since he could mentor all the new young arms. Plus Carter and Taylor could finally get extended auditions, along with Miller, Sweeney, Cowgill and Mitchell. Plus they’d still have plenty of room for Choice, just in case he decides to go atomic in early spring, and force his way onto the roster.
I think that’s something he’d definitely consider but one of the reasons why the Mets got Wheeler was because they ate Beltran’s salary.
The return for Oakland wouldn’t be nearly that. (obviously Beltran’s off the board now).
Good call. I’m impressed that you know that name. He turned 18 a month ago, so hopefully he’ll get to play in the Arizona Rookie League this year, or maybe even short-season Vermont.
just missing the cut: Josh Whitaker, AJ Griffin, Vicmal de la Cruz, Renato Nunez, and BA Vollmuth
What would Pineda fetch?
Felix?
I believe it was Dave Cameron that wrote an article a few months back discussing what felix would be worth and that it could be worthwhile to consider trading him to add hords of offensive talent. He was laughed at and now we see other teams doing similar type moves. Pineda should have a similar value to Latos and Felix I would assume would return a teams top several prospects and maybe more.
I’ll have to look at Cameron’s ideas. Z has stockpiled the Ms with tons of pitching – makes sense to move some of it for a 3B, SS, and possibly LF. I agree with you that Pineda has to be valued around Latos and Gio.
i was wishing he ended up with red sox – damn it! on that note: Thanks AA for not dolling out what would have been requested from our system. Now sign Beltran, Oswalt, and throw in a reliever.
where does the a’s system rank now? wow
Definitely moves from 20’s to top 10. Parker, Cole, Gray & Peacock are a formidable batch of SPs. If Beane can turn Bailey into Middlebrooks, the A’s will be in a heckuva lot better shape than they were a year ago.
This is a great upgrade for the Nats, they now have three good young starters, they needed to make this deal after falling short with a few other deals. This team is going in the right direction. The A’s also did well to restock their farm, Bailey will be next maybe to the Sox.
Good point. I think the Nationals gave up 3, maybe 4 guys with basically potential to be as valuable or more valuable than Gio Gonzalez, but give the Nationals credit for getting a solid pitcher from 2 4th round picks, a 10th rounder, and a 41st rounder.
The round players are drafted is irrelivent, John Sickels rates them as B prospects not bad.
exactly, a couple of the A’s good sleeper prospects for next year were 24th and 25th round selections: Josh Whitaker and Dan Straily
Well rotation is set I guess, SS, JZ, Gio, Lannan, Wang. Might as well overpay for Fielder on a short contract and bet it all on 2012.
Why do people keep saying “all in for 2012”? We have Gio, Strasburg and Zimmermann under control for years.
So you are just making crap up and trolling because you hate Beane because of the movie? Knew it.
Please just go away.
Okay, I don’t LOVE what we had to give up..but some of you sound like we gave up harper and strasburg for him…
We gave up Cole who i really like (19 year old with a 95, touching 97 mph fastball that he can command), peacock with a MAYBE #2 pitcher upside (def #3) Milone who is MAYBE a major league starter, and Norris really isn’t a problem to trade..
It is an overpay for sure. But Gio still can get a lot better if he lowers that walk rate as he continues to mature.
I am kinda worried about the walk rate. Anyways there will be crybabies no matter what Rizzo did. It is better to do it than not to do it and regret it later. We have Gio for four years, along with JZ and SS. I am looking forward to that.
Bold move for a team that has been bad for a while….love what there rotation looks like now…this could make them a dark horse for a wild card….and love gio been a mainstay on my fanasty team for a couple years…all that said the price was to much…three mlb future starters and as u said 2 will probably be top end starters….love how they have been building this team with quality young prospects think maybe they veered off course with what has been working…lil desperation to win something now maybe.But they are so deep in there minor league system that they probably figured they could afford to over pay to start getting some results…not a nationals fan but can relate being a cubs fan to wanting to win….so i hope this works for them love the underdog.
Peacock is not a top end starter. Baseball America is the highest on him and they say a #3 at best. Law sees him as a reliever or very back end guy. If Norris & Cole become all stars then the A’s won the deal. That’s a huge if as Norris’ stock has gone down the past two years and Cole turns 20 next week and still has a long way to go.
The same Keith Law who called Gio a fringe starter and possible reliever when assessing his trade to the A’s?
I just read the article and Law never said that. He referred to Peacock as a reliever or potential back end starter. Nice try though.
Speaking of trying, perhaps you should try reading what I wrote again. I said Law called Gio a fringe starter and possible reliever after being traded “to the A’s.”
The point being that Law is prone to mistakes and has never been a Gio proponent. In 2008, Law called Gio “at best” a No. 3 and a likely No. 4, and possible reliever when the A’s got him. He liked De Los Santos much better and saw him as a top of the rotation possibility.
How has that analysis worked out?
LOL. Where did I say Law can’t make mistakes? Does that mean you invalidate anything he says and that he’s always wrong? The guy has a pretty good track record.
Have a nice life.
Wow. This is what happens when you nap during reading comprehension. You’ve made this much more difficult than it needed to be. I’ll slow it down. You: Pointed out Law called Peacock a backend rotation/reliever type. Me: Saw the irony that Law used the same basic terms in his flawed 2008 trade eval on Gio, and chose to use that as a cautionary tale.
Cheers!
I understand that the Nationals gave up a lot but you have to consider what they have left in there system and where Gio fits. He will slot in as the #2 behind Strasburg to fill a rotation that already has Jordan Zimmerman who was dominant last year, John Lannan who is an above average 4 starter and Chien Ming Wang who started regaining his dominant form last year. They also have Matt Purke, Alex Meyer and Sammy Solis waiting in the wings as pitching prospects. I’m sure many remember Purke as the 1st rounder from Texas and the potential #1 overall pick for next year. Similarly, Solis is moving up as well showing he is a capable LHP. Meyer the other 1st rounder this year has a better fastball than Peacock and a plus slider. The Nationals are getting proven value for the next 4 years, a 3.12 ERA and 197 SO’s in the American League will definitely translate to the NL, just ask Roy Halladay how the transition has been. As for the prospects, Norris is blocked by Wilson Ramos, a future all-star, and we still have Jesus Flores lurking, a player who showed he could play before getting shoulder surgery. Peacock is a solid pitcher, but Milone looked incredibly average in his few ML starts. He has limited fastball velocity and when he misses the ball gets smacked. Cole has big time upside but how any prospects have that written about them? I remember the Pirates traded for Tim Alderson from the SFG a few years ago who was a similar age, size but had better statistics than Cole. He is currently at AA as a reliever with an ERA over 4. Many don’t pan out, that is why you get 4 prospects for 1 proven player. I think Washington wins this deal, a starter that can be an ace and a LHP, a difficult commodity to find in the MLB.
nats homer much?
John Lannan is an above average #4 starter? He’s a fifth starter at best.
3.70 ERA as there #2/3 last year, I think that would make you an above average 4th starter.
Wow you actually read all that?
I cant talk smack about the Nats.You guys got an ace so congrats on that.It is official my Mets will be finishing in last place
Gio is no Ace
It’s interesting that everyone says this. You watch him pitch or are you just one of those stat guys? He walks a few guys yes, but usually gets through the innings no problem. His stuff is great. One of the best curves in the game.
Now do not get me wrong I do not think Gio is a bad pitcher or he will not do good with the Nats, I am just saying he is not an Ace pitcher. He has good stuff but you cannot discount the stats. Baseball is after all a numbers game. He walked roughly 4 batters per 9, his h/a splits vary greatly and his FIP is close to 4. Those numbers indicate he is more like a good 2/3 than a top of the rotation guy
Also for most teams he isn’t an ace, but he was the A’s ace so he kinda was.
I hate stats so much. Just watch the guy pitch.
The Nats don’t need an ace, they have Strasburg.
That was official before the nats got Gio.
Well now you can compete for the wildcard.I think this is a good trade for both teams.No more smack of the Nats from me
Nah, the Nats got better, but Gio is no ace. I’m not saying he can’t be one, but aces don’t have that ridiculous walk rate.
Wow, talk about an overpay!
Norris sucks; Cole is overrated; Minlone might be total garbage in the majors. The Nats won. Stupid Beane gets praised but would have helped his team more by acquiring Rendon and Cole/Peacock.
Nat’s will get Fielder now. Why sell the farm. If your not ready to win now. And who better than Fielder’s 40 plus homers to help your offense now that your pitching is good to go!!!
Unless Fielder goes to NY, he isn’t hitting 40 bombs.
Dude could hit 50 in Baltimore with that short porch in right. Especially since they’re lowering the wall a couple of feet.
And, considering the fact that his top three homer seasons in Milwaukee were 38, 46 and 50, I’m pretty sure there are plenty of other parks where he could hit 40 fairly easily.
He alternates between good and mediocre seasons. He’s due for a mediocre season next year, after that he’ll start his rapid decline.
Robert Gilliam as a throw in? not bad, a little old for his level but put up good numbers
23 is more than just “a little old” for A-ball.
he’s probably the guy who has to buy all the other guys booze
just curious, what’s the normal age for a prospect to be at for A+ and AA?
oh great, he’s homophobic to boot.
MLBTR mods….still waiting for you to drop the ban hammer on this troll. he’s really bringing down the quality here.
Nicholas, my friend, the simple fact that you think your OPINION is EVIDENCE/FACTS paints a telling picture of your “analysis”. That you refute anyone who speaks to you, without utilizing any sort of intellectual honesty (ability to admit your OPINION is not FACT and that others’ OPINION’S are also based upon stats and scouting, much like you keep saying yours is) speaks volumes. You are, in essence, a troll. You may or may not realize this, but your actions make it so. Your over-redundant “copy-paste” jobs, your insistence that ONLY YOUR OPINION IS FACT, etc. You are clearly NOT here for an actual discussion or even debate on the topic, merely to cram your opinion down everone’s throat, parade it around as stone-cold FACT, and belittle every other opinion that isn’t yours. Pathetic. If you were TRULY up for debate/discussion, you’d have a more open mind. THAT is what being a “sheep” is about, friend. Wake up, participate honestly, or simply f&* off. Have a nice day.
P.S. In the majority of philosophical circles, a contradiction in one’s argument provides evidence that one’s argument is false/wrong. You insist your opinion is fact, no other opinion though is fact. That is a contradiction. You, through your own words and without any assistance, contradicted yourself, defeating your own argument. Better luck next time, kid.
Ahhhhhhh. I’m not going to lie, I’m relieved..
but this is actually a really nice haul for the A’s .. Not as much star power as the Padres got, but more depth than the padres got. 4 B prospects is really nice, good haul for the A’s.
Cole and Peacock borderline B+
Cole is a B+, Peacock, Norris are B’s and Milone is a B-
thats a legit B average, good haul
are the A’s mad??? Millone throws 85 with nothing but a changeup. Peacock is a 2-pitch pitcher with bad command. Norris can’t hit the broad side of a…..
I kid I kid
Bailey next to go
Id shop around a mccarthy + balfour deal, that coiuld result in 2-3 solid prospects
Fuentez- he a left w/ experience, throw in some cash to find a taker.
Suzuki- i doubt they sell low. But with donaldson, recker, norris there it catching depth
i could easily see balfour going before the start of spring training, and suzuki going during spring training if there were to be a major injury to a catcher. Suzuki is a really crappy hitter but with all his years under team control, i can see him bringing in a good haul
As a Nats’ STH, I have mixed feeling about the deal. IMO, it comes down to what you think about Peacock. Milone has a chance to become a nice back-of-the-rotation starter but there’s no room for him in DC. Norris is blocked by Ramos and the team has several catching prospects just below him. Both were expendable.
Cole is a potential ace and was obviously the center piece of the trade. I hate to see him go. That leaves Peacock. Is he really a #2/3 starter or is he, as Keith Law and others think, a reliever? If it’s the former, then Rizzo probably paid too much. If you have your doubts then Rizzo “sold high” and avoided giving up someone like Destin Hood, never mind an Espinosa.
I suspect that people in the Nationals’ front office were divided on Peacock.
Quality post!
Giving up Cole hurts a lot! I mean he’s 19!!!!
But Peacock sure looked like a 2/3 last year when i saw him. He was just nasty all year, minors and majors. The years before tho, not so good. Its a mixed bag, you never know.
People are always talking about how constrained the A’s are financially, so maybe somebody can explain to me why the A’s are pulling down $20M in profits (EBITDA) on average over the past 5 seasons, based on Forbes research on MLB’s finances. They could have easily afforded to sign a $10-15M player over the past 5 seasons but chose to bring the money down to the bottom line instead.
Lew Wolfe is pleading poverty and deliberately tanking the team so MLB will let him move to San Jose. Anyone who says differently hasn’t been paying attention to Bay Area baseball.
The A’s *have* offered that much money to players before. In fact, just last year — after finally being free of Eric Chavez’s 6-year, $66M albatross — they offered Adrian Beltre 6-years, $76.8M. And they also offered Lance Berkman 2-years, $16M.
The year prior to that, Adrian Beltre turned down the A’s guarantee of 3-years, $24M to play with Boston for 1-year, $10M (not that I blame him, but the fact remains that the A’s *did* make him a competitive offer). And Marco Scutaro — who was the best SS on the market — took $4M less than what the A’s guaranteed him, to also sign with Boston that winter. Missing out on those two players is why they went out and spent $10M on Ben Sheets. He was arguably the best free agent left on the market, and they knew they would have to overpay to make sure they got him.
And the year prior to *that*, Rafael Furcal turned the A’s down for the Dodgers, even though LA’s guarantee was for $8M less than what the A’s offered him.
These are just a *few* examples of Beane trying to spend what he can to improve the team in recent years. The fact that he’s limited to such a small budget, and that his team is stuck in an antiquated stadium that most players try to avoid is something he has no control over.
And for the record, MLB makes certain that the A’s spend at least x-amount amount of dollars every year because they’re recipients of revenue sharing.
At this point, there’s *no point* in the A’s trying to sign a bunch of players to long-term deals like they did with Eric Chavez, Kurt Suzuki, Brett Anderson, Trevor Cahill, et al, and like they tried their *best* to do with Jason Giambi, Rafael Furcal, Adrian Beltre, Marco Scutaro, Hisashi Iwakuma, et al. Because until they’re at least close to having a new ballpark — and having a better idea of what their budget will look like once they’re in it — there’s no way they can possibly come up with a clear strategy for building a team that will be strong contenders.
The best thing they can do right now is what they *are* doing. And that’s rebuilding with an eye on 2014/2015, when they will *hopefully* have their new ballpark at least halfway through construction.
Who do you guys think got a better haul A’s for Gio or Padres for Latos
Padres…as they should have. Latos is the better pitcher.
not really…. gonzalez had better numbers last year in a better division and latos has one of the best divisions for hitter friendly parks.
The Padres-Alonso is MLB ready, Grandal is a top prospect .
The Reds picks cost the Reds more to draft and develop (two first rounders). The prospects the A’s received were 4th round, 4th round, 41st round, and 10th round so it cost the Nationals system less to draft and develop these players.
Good Job Oakland
Gotta give up talent to get talent. Go NATS. and Congrats A’s on a great haul.
I like this trade for the A’s.
A bit of a surprise that the Nationals made this move…I wonder if they really believe that Josh Outman has found his form again. I like this for the Nationals because Gio Gonzalez is still under team control for 4 more seasons (he’s a Super 2 this year).
Gio was my favorite Oakland A’…it’s such a sad day for me…Just wish we got more offense in the deal…too much pitching for a team in desperate need of offensive talent….Nats fans, you will love Gio…and yes, he is an ace.
not the ace when they will have strasburg coming back
is BJ Upton on the Nationals radar??? seems like that’s their next move, instead of going after Prince
I’m sure they’d love to make a run at him. But it seems pretty unlikely they could put together a good enough package for him now that this trade has happened.
Nice Christmas present for A’s fans… Can’t believe what Washington gave up in this deal…
and 100+ walks
9-15, maybe. Nationals will score some runs, but yeah, Gio will get figured out here soon.
I’ll take the under on that. Facing the pitcher and a division of middling offenses.
I actually broke down and tebowed it wouldn’t happen
Mike Stanton will tee off on him
you might be the worst talent evaluator alive
Anyone who who’s anyone knows you can’t pick on Milone because of his velo. He flat out just gets everyone out and he’s like never walked a batter before. And same goes for Norris and his batting average. Both of those guys are ridiculously good at other things that completely drown out their faults. Very good haul
Why do you keep posting the same comment to everyone? once is enough.
If Milone (with one “l”) only throws 85 with a changeup, then how do you explain a 9.7 K/BB ratio and 9.4 K/9 in AAA in 148 IP? Add the Nats’ #3, #4 and #9 prospects and this looks pretty good for Billy Beane.
Ok I’ll bite:
Milone: Elite control, 85-87 mph fastball, plus cutter, solid change, above average curve. Being left-handed doesn’t hurt either. Gets better as he moves up the chain.
Peacock: B+ prospect per Sickels. #2/#3 (probably the latter) starter potential. Nice ratios.
Cole: Very good prospect with 104:28 K:BB in 89 IP in first taste of full-season ball.
Norris: Avg is a concern, but lots of power and walks. Should be an above avg offensive catcher at least.
Getting guys everyone else thinks are awfully….classic billy beane
No one ever overpays Oakland. Trades with Beane are always fair for both sides.
will be walked by him*
Mike Stanton tees off on everyone.
THE END IS NEAR
I guess you’ve never heard of Harper, Rendon, Goodwin, or Meyer
Randy Johnson and Brian Holman traded for Mark Langston?
Nats have a very large farm…just sold off a little of it
strong rebuttal
i laughed
Talent evaluation aside, he’s right. No matter how good the haul is, Beane will inevitably flip these guys after their first good season and a half in the majors and be back at square one. Sucks for A’s fans to continuously have this giant revolving door in their lineup.
strong rebuttal as well
I don’t know that he even hopes it sounds smart.
You’re annoying. I shall ignore the things you say.
Are you gonna copy/paste the same thing over and over again every time someone gives props to Beane?? Everyone got what they need.
A’s got pieces to build around through 2014 and the Nats got a legitimate starting pitcher who adds up with power arms already on the rotation to contend for the next 2-3 years. I think Rizzo overpaid but it’s a win-win
Copy-pasted.
*facepalm
Jolly saint Nicolas !
are you a scout?…are you even a coach?…didnt think so…
Now you are getting annoying. How many times can you post the same thing? You are starting to prove previous comments by others for them.
Never? You NEVER thought your GM would do a good job?
No one knows what that is from? I though it was rather straight forward given the massive flood of comments this is going to generate due to the build-up. Guess not as many people watch Family Guy as I hoped.
It’s funny how you guys insult me but fail to provide evidence as to how it’s a good haul.
u mad?
“Boom goes the dynamite” isn’t from Family Guy…
Dude first of all you didn’t even say it correctly and secondly it didn’t originate from Family Guy.
i don’t post stats when someone claims stephen strasburg is a scrub either. maybe someone else will help you out, but sometimes the right thing to do is just point and laugh
you may be the worst talent evaluator alive or dead?
We tend to have some real pessimists up here. They come out in force when it starts getting dark at 3:30.
OH STRONG REBUTTAL
I like the line on Family Guy that Cleveland said? This is extremely off-topic. But that was the most recent I heard that phrased used. Didn’t realize that people online were so anal.
There is a Family Guy episode where Cleveland says it several times so I get what John is saying.
Yeah it is and the Cleveland show as well.
-dude who watches too many adult themed cartoons.
This has me laughing harder than it should.
Thought I was the only one who saw that episode :).
Welcome to the internet. You new around here?
Milone is easily the most ironic prospect Beane could’ve gotten in this deal.
3:30? Are you sure you’re not in Worcester or something? That seems pretty late.
I usually post on forums and people are much nicer :(.
well that doesn’t really matter does it! I think the Nats love the new playoff system.
You shouldn’t expect anyone else to provide evidence if you don’t. Your post sounds simply like your opinion. And opinion are like…well you get my point.
laughing is the opposite of being mad, homeslice
To be perfectly honest the only one that seems mad is you.
“hating like a schoolgirl” he says while insisting that other people are mad. this guy’s good
you didn’t mention norris’ 20% walk-rate between high-A and AA while posting an ISO over .230. you are a cherry picker who looked at batting average without looking at BABIP
you do not deserve these explanations, but i had to defend norris’ honor
Iota slap you.
that is not what a breakdown is
Aaahhh ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.
Aaaahh ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
*wheeze*
ha ha ha ha ha ha
saying one guy throws 85 mph and the other has 2 pitches is a “breakdown”?
you my friend are a debbie downer and my man here has every right to defend his stance against you… now back to the loony bin with you
No.. just, no.
get a grip
I hate when people like you give baseball fans a bad name.
That comment was a travesty.
he is in fact both. that’s why everyone calls him “slouch”
I don’t know, but the last time it was talked about the As supposedly wanted Middlebrooks.
Prospects of some kind.
He’s saying you said boom goes TO the dynamite. That’s the fail. Geez.
Welcome to Worcester. $1.25
Ah, didn’t catch that. Could have just said that instead of trying to be a smartass.
To be fair, BABIP shouldn’t be used for anything. It is a highly flawed stat.
Bailey is a stud. When healthy.
Peacock is not guaranteed to be at Gio’s level. You are overrating these prospects. After all, they’re just prospects. Most will not work out.
You are entirely clueless about baseball-related matters. Go back to class and figure out that your opinions are as wrong as wrong can be and every single thing you say is written to badmouth Billy Beane and literally nothing else. I feel dumber for reading your posts.
Mad? No. Laughing? Yes.
This is America! We don’t like forumers around here!
MLBTR mods, can you ban this cut-and-pasting clown?
So what do you think of the deal?
by itself, agree. you need batted ball data to make anything useful of it
but if you’re going to look at batting average, you’ve got to acknowledge BABIP
a .302 batting average isn’t making enough contact? a .520 slugging and .865 ops isn’t good enough for you?
i hear you’re the best with directions
I suppose you’re right. Beginning to think the Yankees symbol in my profile is like a huge target on my back. No love for the Yankee fans lol.
Let’s just call you the idiot-fanaticBoss88.
I think it’s a fun homage to old tyme baseball. Like, the M’s would be the Seattle Americans because they play in the American League. At least, that ‘s my take on it.
i really might give you middlebrooks for bailey if you take this guy with you
he is both?…so that means “nicholas” is an associate scout…which means he reports to an actual scout…keep bird dogging nicholas
Who cares about Sickles? One look at these guys K9 and BB9 tells you all you need to know. These guys are legit
Haha, when MLBTR users reply to your analysis with insults, you belittle them, but when they take the time to refute your points, you respond with poop jokes?
gb2 4chan
I put my foot down!
It all makes perfect sense now…
Please do. At least stay away from MLBTR, where you have lost all credibility at this point.
Sorry AA and AAA
I’m still not a fan of it in that aspect either. It suggests that pitchers don’t pitch to contact and batters are just unlucky if they put the ball in play and get out. If you make solid contact more often then not, then you’ll have a higher avg., if you don’t then you’ll have a lower avg.
Throw in Bogaerts and its a fair deal. He’s like a mixture of Milton Bradley, Carlos Zambrano and Vernon Wells.
Uhh, Gio’s from Florida, homeboy. Thus, an American, regardless of the color of his skin or last name. If you knew a thing or two about your country, you would realize that diversity is one of the things that makes it such an incredible place to live. In fact, it is racist pricks like you that give America a bad name. In other words, Gio is a better representative of America (family that came from another country, which in turn has allow him to make a name for himself) than you are.
What he say?
Latos is not a product of a pitchers park.
type boom goes the dynamite into youtube and educate yourself
right, that’s what batted balls profiles tell you: how solid was the contact
“tebowed”?
wow
I had, I was just referencing it from Family guy. No big deal…
No, it’s referenced in those shows, but it’s not from them.
I declare shenanigans! And Shipoopi while were at it!
His road splits seen it.
.400 OBP + .230 ISO = …
…rape, if i read his comment correctly
Dude the only reason why you are bagging on the deal is that you hate Beane because of some movie loosely based on him. Your analysis/trolling has nothing to back it up. Its hilarious but you cant cut and paste the same post over and over, thats against the rules of the site. Read them.
Luckily the A’s will have a new park by the time he’s ready or soon after he debuts.
You give your evaluation as if you are an expert and then bash everyone else for thinking otherwise for not seeing it the same way as you do. Here’s what John Sickels sees him.
3) A.J. Cole, RHP, Grade B+. I really believe in his upside. Needs to build stamina and refine his changeup, but if it comes together he could be a Top 20 pitching prospect next year, perhaps more.
4) Brad Peacock, RHP, Grade B: Borderline B+. Still has some command issues, but his ERAs finally caught up with his components and his overall potential in 2011. Will be ready before Cole but his upside is not quite as high. Future 2/3 starter if all works out.
6) Derek Norris, C, Grade B: Loads of power, walks, and scouting reports on his defense are getting more positive each year. Ranking may seem high for such a low batting average, but I see him as a Mike Napoli/Mickey Tettleton type who can be productive even with a low average.
9) Tom Milone, LHP, Grade B-: At some point, the radar guns stop mattering. The guy can simply pitch. He has little margin for error, but he will probably have a better career than hundreds of guys who throw 10 MPH harder.
I would LOVE to see what Milone can do in a HUGE ballpark with a good defense behind him. He doesn’t get himself into trouble with walks and his mistakes can get swallowed in a big ballpark.
Dear moderators, can we get the ability to vote people off the website?
Can you please define “potate” ?
i think you mean the Seattle ‘Murricans
Responding to trolls isnt a good look, and I don’t need to have “original thoughts” on prospects, as I am not under the delusion that I am a talent evaluator, unlike you. John Sickles however, is a very good talent evaluator, he has this to say:
3) A.J. Cole, RHP, Grade B+. I really believe in his upside. Needs to build stamina and refine his changeup, but if it comes together he could be a Top 20 pitching prospect next year, perhaps more.
4) Brad Peacock, RHP, Grade B: Borderline B+. Still has some command issues, but his ERAs finally caught up with his components and his overall potential in 2011. Will be ready before Cole but his upside is not quite as high. Future 2/3 starter if all works out.
6) Derek Norris, C, Grade B: Loads of power, walks, and scouting reports on his defense are getting more positive each year. Ranking may seem high for such a low batting average, but I see him as a Mike Napoli/Mickey Tettleton type who can be productive even with a low average.
9) Tom Milone, LHP, Grade B-: At some point, the radar guns stop mattering. The guy can simply pitch. He has little margin for error, but he will probably have a better career than hundreds of guys who throw 10 MPH harder.
Better, more in depth analysis than your outright lies based on nothing but a hatred of Beane. Beane could have gotten Harper and Strasburg for him and you would have posted the same crap. Go away.
you arent doing anything close to posting statistical or scouting evidence though. if you did you wouldnt be saying the A’s got fleeced. simple.
At first I thought you were a troll, when I read your comments on how bad you think this trade was. Then I realized you are just a cross between the drunk guy in the bar that thinks the louder he states an argument the more right he will be and that obnoxious kid that just won’t shut up.
THEY TOOK OUR JOBS
What is this nonsense you are preaching about guys that can get on base and mash the ball having a place in the big leagues? I demand a recount!
and he thinks a photo of me autographing a fine young ladies breast is a homosexual act…which doesnt even begin to approach anything logical.
Norris’ K-rate last year: 27.7%.
u mad?
Peacock’s BB-rate in AAA last year (age-appropriate level): 4.5/9
More evidence.
u mad?
To be fair, I am not sure Sickels is a “very good” talent evaluator. He is good at aquiring information though, and is far more reliable than this no talent — clown.
hey everyone, touching boobs is a homosexual pursuit now.
Replies that are this skinny are fun.
Would you rather pay 12 million for Madson.
god damn it
His carreer splits at hitters parks says otherwise:
Chase field: 1.42 ERA
Citizens bank: 4.91
Coors: 3.51
Great American: 1.93
Miller: 6.35
Minute Maid: 3.14
Wrigley: 2.57
He has actually pitcher better at Coors and Chase than at Dodger stadium. I only posted ERA, but if you want to look at other stats you will see similar results. A closer examination of stats shows there is little to no distinction between hitters parks and pitchers parks for Latos. Having seen him pitch dozens of times on TV and at games, he is very unlikely to have significant regression because of the Ballpark he pitches in.
whos worse, boss88 or nicholas?
Why not neither?
It’s probably more like $10 million.
It’s not my money but I’d rather just spend the money if I’m the Red Sox. They’re going to have to potentially give up a future franchise third baseman.
cool story troll
Beane’s not a joke. The fact that the A’s are stuck in that awful stadium is a joke.
Beane’s just doing the best he can to keep them as a viable franchise.
Beane has no control over the stadium situation.
DEY TUK UR JOBS
You have. Stating that one opinion is fact and that any other is not is indeed a contradiction. You simply cannot use one as evidence, yet dismiss another. They are both opinions, regardless of their origin. A fact is something you can prove infallibly. You cannot do this with your opinions of 4 minor league baseball players, regardless of who you may be. Understand? You have contradicted yourself. Along those lines, implying I’ll be mad about something as placing an emotion to my text which is not there. Very defensive of you. Perhaps you could simply take this exchange as an opportunity to learn and grow a little. A chance to be better prepared when attempting to form an argument or discuss something. There are hard and fast rules to an actual argument. You have falied to meet the standards of a well-formed argument. Sorry, but that IS fact, based upon the formal rules in regards to argumentation. Better luck next time. 😉
Good grief man, I hope you were wearing gloves!
I have absolutely no idea what that says, but it made me laugh and you got a like from me, haha.
Bryce was 19.
So the two teams with good offenses (Brewers, Phillies) are the two teams that destroyed him. All that means is he cant beat good teams
imgonnareplytothisjustbecausetheresnoroomleft
his road splits aren’t what one would call ‘elite’ or ‘ace’ quality