Rosenthal's Latest: Blanton, Furcal, Penny, Burnett, Greinke

Really? The Royals really might deal Grienke? For some reason that would shock me. Teams try for years and years to get guys who look like they'll be top of the rotation guy for years, and Grienke seems to be exactly that. He's young and supremely talented, he's the kind of pitcher that you build your staff around. I realize that he had some mental issues and probably isn't the kind of guy you wanna make the face of your franchise, but Alex Gordon is pretty much that already, and I think moving Grienke would be a bad move. Unless they got back like three top prospects, at least one of which is an ace potential kind of guy, I think Grinke is an unmovable asset at this point.

Sounds like pure speculation on Rosenthal's part. I doubt KC would trade Greinke unless they were blown away by an offer, and a Pie/Cedeno package doesn't fit the bill.

Well that's no suprise that the Braves didn't even come close for Blanton. Beane was likely asking for Brent Lillibridge and Jordan Schaffer. Lillibridge shouldn't be to hard to part with, he's not hitting very well in AAA, and he's blocked by Yunel Escobar and Kelly Johnson, while Schaffer is considered to be the next Andrew Jones. For Blanton, and as an A's fan it's true, he is a #2 starter. But I'm more in favor of a deal to the Cubs, sending Rich Harden for Theriot/Cedeno and Vitters. Laugh in my face, but I think that would be Beane's asking price for Harden.

Cubbies won't move Vitters for Harden. He's been in extended Spring Training for most of this year, and so they really don't know quite what they have with him yet. At this point I think they won't deal him until maybe this offseason if ever.

I could see a Felix Pie for Rich Harden trade though. Harden's value really isnt all that high, and neither is Pie. It'd be like trading low on two guys with huge potential, filling needs for both teams. The Cubs, with a rotation of Zambrano, Harden, Lilly, Dempster, Marquis/Hill, are probably the favorites in the NL. The A's get a long term CF who can take some PT immediately, and a future outfield of Gonzalez, Pie, Sweeney and/or Buck would look pretty good. Maybe the A's would target a middle infielder like Cedeno, but I doubt the Cubs want to give up both of them for Harden. If the difference between getting Harden and not getting Harden is Cedeno though, then I'd lean towards moving him.

I dont know about Pie for Harden, but I can almost bet that Oakland would take Cedeno for Harden. Harden's value is as low as can be and it doesnt sound like the A's are going to bring back Ellis. As for Greinke, I would rather see him in Cubbie blue, but he would take an aweful lot to get. Something like Pie/Gallagher/E Patterson/ + another prosepect would be what the Royals would want.
Either way for the Cubs a roataion like that would be plenty good.
Zambrano
Greinke/Harden
Lilly
Dempster
Hill (forget Marquis)

"Beane was likely asking for Brent Lillibridge and Jordan Schaffer."

I can see Lillibridge, organizational need and all, but Schaffer ?

Is Schaffer's stock back as high as it once was ? I though being loaded up on HGH for the past year had taken some of the trade value out of him and we all know Beane isn't dumb, so why would he ask for such a dubious character?

I'd think he is more then happy to have Gonzalez playing center, or even Sweeney, as he seems a more natural CF, then having to trade one of his best chips for one.

One thing i don't think he's sold on is Buck in RF, so i'd believe he would ask the Braves for Jason Heyward, not Schaffer, since Beane can afford to wait a little longer for Heyward and he needs a good RF.

If he did ask for Schaffer, it probably was as a supplemental part of the trade, trying to buy low on the guy.

I applaud the efforts of Wren to check in on Blanton, and applaud even further that he does not consider giving up a king's ransom for Blanton. Lillibridge of course should be part of the deal, but the braves should do their best to hold on to schafer, heyward, and hernandez, as they should only be traded for a pitcher with more potential than Blanton, and perhaps should just be held as off limits. Again, we do need another pitcher, but Campillo and JoJo have allowed for us to buy more time in our search for the right deal. Again, I would inquire about Daniel Cabrera, as he would cost less and could put up similar numbers to Blanton in the NL.

It wouldn't make any sense at all for Beane to trade Harden for Pie. Oakland has a glut out outfielders similar to Pie, most are better. Harden is a guy who you really can't trade because he's a good player when healthy, and no one will give enough for him. People need to think before they throw out these wacky proposals.

Hell if I am Melvin I would trade... Gwynn and Hall to the Pads for Maddux...he likes Yost from his days in Atlanta and would love to pitch for his brother in Milwaukee

Then Trade Laporta, Salome and Escobar to the A's for Harden and Chavez

I'm just curious but when did the A's create a massive surplus of outfielders? Outside of Carlos Gonzalez I don't think they have a single guy that you can pen into that outfield for the next 5-10 years.

And as far as scouting reports and other things I've read and seen, Gonzalez is going to be a right fielder. He's been playing that spot in the minors for years, and with his arm that seems ideal for him. He'll probably get some time in center this year and would probably be adequate there for a couple years but he really isn't a center fielder. Meanwhile Emil Brown will be gone next year and Jack Cust belongs in the DH spot. Ryan Sweeney and Travis Buck have potential to be a solid players, but Buck is a corner outfielder as well and Sweeney isn't much better than adequate in center.

Although Felix Pie isn't exactly a slam dunk in terms of filling a team need, the A's other real team needs are at SS, 2B and possibly third. Unless they want Cedeno or maybe Tony Thomas, then the Cubs don't have those players to offer. Felix Pie is a fully legitimate center fielder who is already pretty much capable of playing brilliant defense, and has the potential to be a very good with the bat as well. I'm not quite sure what A's fans are expecting to get in exchange for Harden then if its not a stud CF prospect like Pie, because Harden is so injury prone that his value is damn near ruined.

I agree completely... Beane will probably be looking for a good middle infield prospect and a true centerfielder in return for Harden and/or Blanton.... that is why the package of Lillibridge and Schafer makes so much sense for beane..... Now, if the braves could perhaps also work Street into that deal, then there might be a possiblity of that package being reasonable... However, the braves probably want to keep their top tier position prospects in tact, since kotsay is questionable to be extended, and the high amount of doubt that Teixera resigns with the braves...

I wouldn't call Pie a "stud" CF prospect. He might turn into a decent everyday CF'r, but I don't think he's ever going to become a stud and most probably know that. Maybe that is one of the reason's Cubs fans wanna jump all over including him in most trade scenario's??

As far as the A's OF depth, they have all the young guys that are there now including Buck, Gonzalez, and Sweeney. I agree that Cust should only be in the OF if there is a major emergency, otherwise he is strictly a DH. The A's have some guys down on the farm that have question marks, but have been highly touted and still have a chance to break through such as Herrera, Sulentic, and Robnett. Also, don't forget about Aaron Cunningham. The guy has done nothing but hit so far in his proffessional career and is supposed to be a good OF'r as well. Gets comp's to Aaron Rowand, and i've heard some say he could be better. The A's are not completely "loaded" with OF guys, but are more then comfortable and will likely focus on other positional needs if a trade occurs unless the OF prospect they get back is a very, very good one.

Lastly, Beane is in no rush to trade Harden and if he strings together another 6-8 starts I think somebody will pay what he wants. Harden is arguably the best pitcher in the AL, if not the majors when healthy and Beane absolutely should hold out to get 2-3 good prospects before trading him. He's still pretty young, and beyond productive when healthy. There may very well come a time when Harden no longer has any solid trade value, but I think its fairly obvious that time is not now.

And btw, jpshark, thank you very much for bringing up Aaron Cunningham. I completely forget about him. He's got good potential to be along term player in their future as well.

The only guys on that list that I'd feel good about being good players long term are Buck, Gonzalez, Sweeney and Cunningha,. The rest of those guys are bench guys at best. Outfield may not be a need, but its not a huge surplus.

…Uhhh, what the heck does this thread have to do with the Cubs anyway? And how would that lead to long pointless conversations on Pie for Harden? The likelihood of Greinke ending up in Chicago is next to nil, probably similar to the odds of Harden ending up there. The Fans are the only ones who seem to think the Cubs should be targeting high-profile pitchers, and using the same guys the team wouldn’t give up for Roberts in their proposals to get it… It just makes no sense, none of it…

baseballz, although your point about the haren deal is legitimate regarding scherzer, i would say that beane often asks for too much in return for his players and indeed has a reputation for doing so, one that is not necessarily inaccurate. that's not to say that he overvalues his players (i think he knows their value well and is just doing his job as a gm to get the best possible deals done) but his demands can border on ludicrous sometimes. recall when the reds attempted to acquire blanton and beane asked for at least two of johnny cueto, homer bailey, and joey votto? unrealistic. compare that to offers the twins fielded for santana. apparently the yankees had some interest in harden a few months ago and beane wanted at least kennedy, horne, and marquez. consider the fact that that was before kennedy's rather disastrous 30-some odd inning sampling this year and before his current placement on the DL, when a cloud of mystery and excitement to be honest still surrounded the yanks' trio of young studs. beane's demands frequently border on the absurd for players who have serious question marks (harden).

Why is the Cubs talk here centered about Harden? I would love to have him, but we just got word that Penny may be made available. I think he is a great option to stick in the #2 spot for the playoff run. A rotation of

1. Zambrano
2. Penny
3. Dempster
4. Lilly
5. Marquis/Hill

That would be more than fine, and probably as good as Arizona's, especially when you factor in the Cubs far superior offense. If Beane is going to be unreasonable about Harden, Penny would be more than fine with me.

I havent read all the posts but I dont like the idea of Harden coming to the Cubs? We dont need anything injury prone pitcher. We have gone through this before a few times.

I like the Penny idea or maybe just the idea of any high profile pitcher.

You know what this is going to mean for Marquis? He is going to be left off the rotation again in the playoffs. HAHAHA

Sorry, just saw the post where you addressed Penny. If the Dodgers fall out of it, I think thats a real possibility.

I think the Cubs have finally come to the conclusion that they could trade Pie OR Colvin but I doubt they would trade both. I know you said or but I just wanted to type it out I guess. Pie, Hill, Veal, Cedeno would be a great package to offer and I think would be worth it.

Penny would be great and I have always thought he was a good pitcher and would love to see him in Cubbie blue. His value is low and I think even if the Dodgers are in the race he could be available. What would it take?

I think its too much too...but I think that is the kind of offer it would take to get him. Like I said, I'd rather go after Penny, who I think you could snag much, much cheaper.

Anybody want to weigh in on what it would take to get Penny, assuming the dodgers are 8 or more back at the break?

Just cuz I have been drinking and speculating which is never a good thing. Here is what I think.

Cubs trade Hill, Wuertz, Cendeno

Royals trade Greinke

Cubs Trade Veal, Pie, Donaldson, Ceda

Rockies Trade Holliday

Rotation:
Zambrano
Lilly
Dempster
Greinke
Gallagher

Lineup:
Soriano
Fukudome
Lee
Ramirez
Holliday
Soto
Theriot
DeRosa

Just my fantasy :)

I for one, can't wait for the Cubs to trade all of those bums. Hmmm, let's offer Hill, Gallagher, Veal, and frickin Cedeno in every MLBTR Comment section for whoever. Man I'm sick of hearing those names

You've got to love Cubs fans trying to trade their spare parts for a young, top of the rotation starter!

In fact, Kansas City won't move Grienke unless they get back at least two good players who can help them: Marmol and Theriot. Without those names in the deal, there's no deal!

Young,top of the rotation starting pitchers are hugely valuable.

"1. Pie or Colvin
2. Gallagher or Hill
3. Cedeno or Murton
4. Veal or Ceda"

That was my proposed deal for him...and I don't think I'm all that far off or one of those just trying to trade "spare parts".

Bucs,
I know what you are saying, I was just making the point that those names are going to be around all summer.

By the way, what do you mean by this?

"BTW, everytime I see a post from Aduncaroo, I really feel like a Reds fan is making all those posts."

HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA...

Oh man! So many Cubs fans are idiots! The Grinch is my new favorite. He wouldn't give...Rich Hill...for Zach Grienke.

(long pause)

Sorry, had to step away while I busted a gut. What a dumba$$! One guys a likely All Star; the other got demoted to AAA. Seriously?! Are you brain damaged? Cause if you are, at least you have an excuse. No? Hmmm.

Whoever said that Veal, Cedeno, and Gallagher have upped their respective values is right...to an extent. Still, Veal's control numbers are still quite poor, suggesting, more and more, that he's a future reliever; Gallagher's awesome AAA numbers have been tempered by the reality of his MLB numbers, and Cedeno...c'mon does ANYONE really think Cedeno's for real?!

Add to that the rapidly declining value of Felix Pie, Tyler Colvin (props for the walks, though; lol), Jose Ceda, and Hill, and...you're base of trade-worthy talent isn't in nearly as healthy a shape as you seem to think. Whatever. It's still a kick to hear some of these trade proposals. Holliday...Penny...Harden. Go Cubs!

Final note: KC is stupid if they deal Grienke. Makes absolutely NO sense unless they're fitting him for a straight jacket again.

"I guess because I think of Adam Dunn everytime I see your nick."

Ahh..ok. maybe I'm slow today. My name is actually Adam Duncan, so I do a double take whenever I hear his name...

Mile,
You don't think the Cubs could snag Penny? he has an ERA in the 5s right now...and certainly could give a pretty decent package for where his stock is at right now, no? The others, I agree, pretty tough, but I really think Penny could be a near perfect fit.

1. We don't want to give up the farm for a few month rental of CC, if he even ever is available.
2. What other top of the rotation guys are available?
3. We saw the playoffs last year, and know that with Arizona adding Haren to their rotation, we need to upgrade as well.

The fans are thinking playoffs, not regular season.

jaklaf, you a dumba$$ I wasn't talking to you! I was talking to baseballz. You're an idiot. You're alomost as bad as "guru" you reply to something you didn't read. I never once mentioned something you said. I mentioned baseballz and scribz, the only difference between you and guru is that you don't make up random trades that would help you're team. Maybe you do because I've never seen any of you're posts.

"Anybody want to weigh in on what it would take to get Penny, assuming the dodgers are 8 or more back at the break?"

That is assuming a lot. The rest of the Dodger staff has come around and the bats are waking up as well. They are only 3.5 back and should only be 1.5 back.

"There is a growing sentiment among baseball that Penny might need surgery; his game is beyond messed up right now..."

Where did you get such an insane idea? Guys who need surgery don't throw 95 consistently and touch 97. Penny is doing just that. Penny looks to have a bit of Steve Blass syndrome these days, which is to say command problems. He is leaving 95 mph cookies over the plate and is getting hammered for single after single after single, on top of walking way too many. He is overthrowing his pitches and I think the main issue may be his noticeable weight gain.

The more I think about it, Penny seems to be going through something typical of groundball pitchers. They have off years. Look at Lowe back in 2004. He was absolutely terrible. Then he had 4 years of excellent numbers that would have been even better had he gotten any run support.