Red Sox, Padres Agree On Adrian Gonzalez Trade

11:33am: Hayes tweets that the two sides have had the deal in place since Thursday night, which is what prompted the flight to Boston.

11:23am: Sean McAdam of CSNNE.com reports (via Twitter) that Gonzalez has already taken his physical and his surgically repaired shoulder "should be fine." Some minor tests still need to be completed.

11:13am: MLB.com's Peter Gammons tweets that the player to be named later is not a "prime guy." The two teams determine who exactly it will be later.

10:52am: Morosi tweets that Gonzalez is seeking a Ryan Howard-like contract. Howard signed a five-year contract extension worth $125MM earlier this year.

10:13am: Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports tweets that the Padres will also receive a player to be named, so it's a 4-for-1 swap. The 40-man roster freeze is in effect until next week's Rule 5 Draft, so it's possible the player is a minor leaguer not on the 40-man that's eligible for the Rule 5.

10:04am: Heyman tweets that there is still work to be done as far as a contract extension for Gonzalez, and that it could take a day or two. Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports confirms with a source that the trade is "not completely done." (Twitter link)

9:14am: Hayes tweets that the package includes Kelly, Rizzo, and Reymond Fuentes. ESPN Boston's Gordon Edes says (via Twitter) that Theo Epstein flew from San Diego to Boston with Gonzalez, and MLB.com's Corey Brock says that Jed Hoyer implored his scouts to scour the lower level of the minors in 2010 (Twitter link). The second and third player in the deal are key.

9:01am: SI.com's Jon Heyman tweets that negotiations about a contract extension will begin shortly, and that Kelly is in fact in the deal. WEEI.com's Alex Speier adds that multiple Red Sox prospects rumored to be in the deal have yet to hear anything from the team about a trade (Twitter link).

7:39am: Olney tweets that the Red Sox flew Gonzalez into Boston to help move the process along, and he is there now.

6:30am: Adrian Gonzalez is expected in Boston today for a physical, reports Nick Cafardo of the Globe.  Gonzalez had shoulder surgery to clean up his right labrum in October and has a four or five month recovery timeline.  Cafardo says talks have centered around Casey Kelly and Anthony Rizzo, and the deal "would likely involve three or four players from the Sox, including one who is major league-ready."  ESPN's Buster Olney says that all players have been agreed to and the Red Sox are now trying to work out an extension with Gonzalez.  MLB has approved a negotiating window.

SATURDAY, 12:01am: The Red Sox are very close to acquiring Adrian Gonzalez from the Padres, tweets Dan Hayes of the North County Times.  Hayes says the trade would just involve Gonzalez and not Heath Bell, whose name has come up in other rumorsHayes adds that the deal will only involve minor leaguers – not players such as Jacoby Ellsbury, Daniel Bard, or Jed Lowrie.  Top Red Sox prospect Casey Kelly would definitely be involved.

FRIDAY, 4:46pm: The Red Sox and Padres are discussing a potential trade that would send Adrian Gonzalez to Boston, according to Gordon Edes of ESPNBoston.com. Red Sox GM Theo Epstein appears to be making "some headway" in tempting Padres GM Jed Hoyer with a package of top prospects, Edes reports.

The proposed deal would include minor league players only. Hoyer, new assistant Josh Byrnes and Padres exec Jason McLeod are all former Red Sox executives, so they know the team's system well. Other clubs also have strong interest in the first baseman.

The Padres must address multiple needs on a limited budget this offseason and trading Gonzalez and his $6.2MM salary would give the team some flexibility. However, few hitters have Gonzalez's power and they would create a hole by dealing their first baseman.

The Red Sox, who have long had interest in Gonzalez, could move Kevin Youkilis to third base to make room. A trade for Gonzalez would effectively end Adrian Beltre's tenure in Boston.


1,321 Responses to Red Sox, Padres Agree On Adrian Gonzalez Trade Leave a Reply

  1. dickylarue 5 years ago

    Congrats to the Red Sox fans. You just robbed the Padres blind. You all owe Petey Gammons, Baseball American, Keith Law and ESPN fruitcakes for overhyping your prospects to the point they could be the centerpiece for a perennial MVP 1b.

    However, I don’t know how Boston is going to deal with the fact that Gonzalez is not homegrown! Gasp! You not only dumped your prospects for him, but you’re paying twice with a massive extension. That’s downright Evil Empire-ish, ain’t it?

    Bootstrap prospect baseball takes a hit in Boston. The Nation swaps it’s Lands End flannel for Gucci. News at 11.

  2. As a Jays fan I’m pretty upset. That package is pretty light for the Padres IMO.

    • ClimaClub 5 years ago

      its more or less equal to the package the jays got for 1 year of halladay, jays might have gotten a little more(maybe because they kicked in 6 million$)

      • I’d say they got a fair amount more value at the time. 2 Top 25 prospects and 1 Top 50. Show me some recent scouting reports that Kelly is still going to be a sure-fire ace. A 5.3 ERA, 1.6 WHIP in AA doesn’t impress me.

      • grownice 5 years ago

        considering the prospects, id take drabek, gose(from wallace) AND D’arnaud anyday instead of kelly, rizzo, fuentes.

        • 0bsessions 5 years ago

          And I’d take Halladay over Gonzalez, despite how much I covet Gonzalez. What’s your point?

          • grownice 5 years ago

            i was debating the fact that it wasnt equal to the halladay trade, considering jays got a much better return…for a better player thats my point… i was talking to D , not you.

          • 0bsessions 5 years ago

            Public forum. If you don’t want random people responding, well, I don’t know what to tell you.

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            Anything you want because it’s a public forum! :)

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            Anything you want because it’s a public forum! :)

    • Sd_brain 5 years ago

      from what it seems, the pads will get more if the red sox can sign Gonzo to an extension.

  3. As a Jays fan I’m pretty upset. That package is pretty light for the Padres IMO.

  4. jjs91 5 years ago

    He’s going to want ryan howard money, that’s rough though he’s closer to deserving it than howard is.

  5. And he ONLY wants a 5 year deal? Get it done Theo. 5 years at $21MM a year is much better than 7 or 8 at less.

    PLEASE THEO GET IT!

    • AGone is probably thinking… I might as well get a nice 5 year deal and sign another large deal after, rather than an 8 year contract now limiting his next contract.

      Smart if you ask me.

      • Hell if the Sox can make it 6 years/$140MM (~$23MM a year) get it done. Plus he will hit FA before the complete decline happens and we could get a Type A return for him them.

    • AGone is probably thinking… I might as well get a nice 5 year deal and sign another large deal after, rather than an 8 year contract now limiting his next contract.

      Smart if you ask me.

  6. zmoney10 5 years ago

    I am a Red Sox fan and am extremely happy with this haul. Seems like we got AGon relatively cheap (as far as prospects are concerned, he will seek 120-150 mill).

    My hypothetical question however is…What happens if Youk struggles at 3b? What happens if he becomes a sub par defensive 3bman?

    P.S. I know he has played third and was a 3bman in the minors. Just hypothetical question.

    • Trade.

    • Trade.

    • Mr. Pinches 5 years ago

      well then you only have to deal with it one year as Ortiz will be gone,he could just slide over to DH.

    • Ohhhplease 5 years ago

      A player like Adrian Gonzalez will make all of your infield better with his glove. He will pick throws that many other 1B would not, Sox fans will love him. Best of luck Adrian, thanks for the great memories in PETCO.

      • 0bsessions 5 years ago

        Youk’s arm is fine, it’s the range that concerns people. That said, with Iglesias apparently not in the deal, I’m not too worried about Youk’s range.

  7. 0bsessions 5 years ago

    “Morosi tweets that Gonzalez is seeking a Ryan Howard-like contract. Howard signed a five-year contract extension worth $125MM earlier this year.”

    You’re kidding me? SOLD.

  8. 0bsessions 5 years ago

    “Morosi tweets that Gonzalez is seeking a Ryan Howard-like contract. Howard signed a five-year contract extension worth $125MM earlier this year.”

    You’re kidding me? SOLD.

  9. You know what would make this much more balanced deal from a Padres POV?
    If Gonzalez does not return to his usual form in 2011 after the surgery and has a terrible season. If the extension was a given, the Padres should have gotten an MLB ready player at least. Or you know what would be even better? If the trade is completed and the sox fail to sign him to an extension and he signs elsewhere after 2011. That would really be hilarious.

    • zmoney10 5 years ago

      The Sox wont let him not sign an extension.

      They will give him what he wants and seems to be extremely reasonable so far.

    • zmoney10 5 years ago

      The Sox wont let him not sign an extension.

      They will give him what he wants and seems to be extremely reasonable so far.

    • Except they won’t complete the trade until an extension is all but in place (ex. see Halladay deal).

    • Do you need us to call the whambulance for you?

    • woadude 5 years ago

      It would be awesome if a massive earthquake shook petco to the ground and the Padres had to play in San Jose, what its not funny to wish terrible things? oh ok.

    • woadude 5 years ago

      It would be awesome if a massive earthquake shook petco to the ground and the Padres had to play in San Jose, what its not funny to wish terrible things? oh ok.

  10. You know what would make this much more balanced deal from a Padres POV?
    If Gonzalez does not return to his usual form in 2011 after the surgery and has a terrible season. If the extension was a given, the Padres should have gotten an MLB ready player at least. Or you know what would be even better? If the trade is completed and the sox fail to sign him to an extension and he signs elsewhere after 2011. That would really be hilarious.

  11. Per Peter Gammons:
    Player tbnl in Gonzalez deal is not prime guy. To be determined, unlike The Foundation to be Named Later

  12. Per Peter Gammons:
    Player tbnl in Gonzalez deal is not prime guy. To be determined, unlike The Foundation to be Named Later

  13. daveineg 5 years ago

    As a fan of a team with a similar player (Fielder), I’m sure hope the Brewers don’t settle for a deal like this.

    I feel sorry for the Padre fans. None of those guys they are getting back are any more sure things than the guys they could draft with the two high picks they would have gotten had the let Gonzalez leave as a FA. Another deal that causes me to boycott baseball’s postseason on television because the game is rigged.

    • So because you team sucks so much because they are too cheap to pay players to pay there, the MLB is rigged?

      Jesus, pay your players and quit whinning. Every owner in the MLB has the capability of having a $100MM a year payroll. They are just more worried about their own profits that they are too cheap to do it.

      • caseyB 5 years ago

        I disagree. Some smaller market teams just can’t afford those big payrolls — not even $100 million. It’s not rigged, but the current system isn’t exactly an even playing field.

        • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

          If the city can’t support the team, move the team to a new city. Easy peasy. The Red Sox and Yankees (etc.) have such large payrolls because of ravenous fan bases, smart marketing and good business models.

          • caseyB 5 years ago

            At least a third of the markets in MLB can’t support the huge payrolls of the big market teams. Do you really suggest all these small-mid market teams move their franchises? Really?

            And Boston and the Yankees have huge payrolls not just because of ravenous fan bases. Lots of smaller market clubs have that too. What they have that the smaller markets don’t is bigger populations which can drive media revenues.

            You think the fan bases in NY or Boston are anymore ravenous than St. Louis, for example?

          • woadude 5 years ago

            St Louis is not a small market, they have a budget, this point would only be valid if they were talking trades because of the 16 million they are paying Pujols is too much for them to pay. Hence they are a mid- to big market team, especially when they keep their guy at 1st for his whole career.

          • caseyB 5 years ago

            St. Louis’ market is much smaller than NY or Boston. Not even close. So while they may not be a “small” market, they are certainly NOT big market, and cannot afford a 100+ million payroll every year. You also fail to realize the cost of living in the Midwest and St. Louis is far lower than it is in the East.

            This point is always valid, and it may factor in their ability to keep Pujols going forward.

          • erock1111 5 years ago

            According to the comment that what larger markets have that smaller markets don’t is “bigger populations which can drive media revenues” is incorrect. In the case of New York, yes they are the biggest city in the United States. However, Boston is only ranked 21st. One spot ahead of a small market team such as the Brewers and below other teams that spend less such as Baltimore (18), San Fransisco (14), Detroit (10), Dallas (9), San Diego the team that Gonzalez is being traded from (7), Phoenix (6), Philadelphia (5), Chicago (3) and Los Angeles (2).

            Saying that is simply the size of the city is not true. It is in part due to the fan base, media and ownership group. In most cases to spend money means to put a winning team on the field and butts in the seat (except for Seattle).

          • caseyB 5 years ago

            First, you at least have to look at metropolitan areas, NOT cities. Because teams normally derive revenues and fan bases from areas adjacent to the actual city they reside in. So if you look at metropolitan areas, Boston is 10th in the U.S.

            Second, Boston is in a unique position in that they have little competition within their geographical area and can draw from a fan base as large as all of New England.

            And, as I pointed out to woadude, you have to consider that the cost of living on the East Coast is generally higher than it is in the Midwest. Therefore, what a team can demand in terms of parking, tickets, food, etc, and even cable subscriber fees (as a regional sports network) can be much larger.

            So, while it is not simply a matter of demographics and population, revenues are largely driven by them. They are enormous factors in baseball today in terms of the “haves” and the “have nots.”

          • erock1111 5 years ago

            If we are taking about metropolitan areas, not just cities then you also have to consider that the Boston area has more in the way of competition from surrounding teams. New York is about a four hour drive, so they compete with the Yanks and Mets, not to mention that Philly is only 6 hours away. In Colorado the closest team around is probably either the Diamondbacks or the Cardinals, same goes for Seattle and other small market teams.

            The east coast is also not inherently more expensive then the midwest. The Red Sox do not actually provide any parking for most fans, most have to take the T to the park. Whereas Milwaukee owns it’s parking lot. The Sox and Yankees are lucky in that they have basically there own networks, yes, but what is stopping other teams from doing that?

            Revenues are largely driven by fan base, brand recognition, owners ability to shell out cash and to a minor degree stadium. Also, if you look at the list of metropolitan areas, teams that are small market are within at least 500,000 of the Boston metropolitan area, so I find this logic pretty flawed.

          • caseyB 5 years ago

            Huh? No, I’m talking about “Metropolitan” areas as defined by the U.S. Census. Do a google search. They are areas that contain a densely packed city proper plus areas within close proximity related by commerce and employment. And Boston is the 10th largest metropolitan area in the country.

            As for its unique status, Boston has virtually no competition in the upper New England area. This is as opposed to Metropolitan areas such as NY, Philadelphia, and Washington DC which infringe upon each other. And in the NY area, of course, you have two major league teams.

            For Colorado, St. Louis, and AZ, they are situated in less densely packed and populated metropolitan areas. And, again, the cost of living in those areas is a lot less than it is in NY or Boston.

            What is stopping other teams from owning their own networks? For the small-mid market teams, demographics and population. You need revenue to run a station. Where does the majority of that revenue come from? Ad fees and cable subscriber fees. Which are inherently based on NUMBERS. You need large populations to run a large successful regional sports network. YES, SNY and NESN can draw from extremely large population areas which are densely packed.

            Revenues are based on multiple things — but it’s a fact that the advent of paid TV tipped the scales in favor of large metropolitan areas. It a huge differentiating factor between markets of different sizes.

            As for Boston, again, it’s in a unique position in being able to draw easily from neighboring NE states. BUT, even if you leave those areas out, and JUST include the official “metropolitan” areas, Boston is SIGNIFICANTLY LARGER in population than many of the small-mid market teams.

            Here are the teams/cities whose populations in their metropolitan areas are MORE than 500,000 less than Boston:

            Seattle
            Minnesota
            San Diego
            St. Louis
            Tampa
            Baltimore
            Denver
            Pittsburgh
            Cincinnati
            Cleveland
            Kansas City
            Milwaukee

            Put the Red Sox or the Yankees in Milwaukee and their payrolls would have to shrink enormously in order for them to survive. That area simply does not have the population and demographics to support a baseball team with an annual 160+ million payroll.

        • woadude 5 years ago

          yeah thats why they did an investigation on what teams were doing with the luxury tax money right? it does come back to what the owner wants to make, they sell jerseys and have tv rights and and everything to hot dogs to paying 30 dollars to park your car, when you add it up, they make near a billion dollars plus, the Padres owner turned gray when he had to pay 6 million to an elite player, thats how far behind he is on the times.

          • caseyB 5 years ago

            LOL, who did an investigation? Actually, the finances of only a few teams leaked out, and it showed there was no way in hell a team like the Pirates could ever afford a payroll of 100+ million every year. So thanks for proving my point. The population and demographics just aren’t there. Revenue sharing or no revenue sharing.

            Also, it was not the Luxury Tax money which was detailed in those reports, it was revenue sharing money. They are two different things.

            And, no, it doesn’t all come back to what an owner wants to make. With the economics of baseball today, small-mid market franchises will always be at a disadvantage.

        • woadude 5 years ago

          yeah thats why they did an investigation on what teams were doing with the luxury tax money right? it does come back to what the owner wants to make, they sell jerseys and have tv rights and and everything to hot dogs to paying 30 dollars to park your car, when you add it up, they make near a billion dollars plus, the Padres owner turned gray when he had to pay 6 million to an elite player, thats how far behind he is on the times.

      • Ohhhplease 5 years ago

        Myopia has entered the building! Never a more untrue statement has been spoken. Revenues for any team fluctuate as the fan-base and revenue stream does. All of a teams revenue cannot go into payroll.

        Did you forget about little things called stadiums, operating costs thereof, staff, scouting, the salaries of minor league players and coaches etc etc etc.

        Your attempt at a slam on small market teams and the socialist economic rant has failed…..

    • 0bsessions 5 years ago

      No, they’re not sure things, but the quantity in terms of real value exceeds it.

      As I pointed out earlier, let’s say the Padres let him walk. Now, most people assume the Sox would’ve signed him. If that happens, the Padres get the Red Sox’ first round pick and a sandwich pick. Presumably a mid to high twenties pick and a fifty to sixty something pick.

      Fuentes and Kelly were both first rounders, mid-twenties picks, which is, by nature, better than what the Padres would’ve gotten from the supplemental picks since two mid to late twenties picks trumps a mid to late twenties and a fifty or so. On top of that, they’re getting a sixth rounder who has high power potential and a PTBNL.

      Whether you like the deal or not, it has more tangible value than letting him walk at the end of next year would have.

      • Dylan Ramirez 5 years ago

        You are ignoring the fact that Adrian on the Padres for one more year is worth an awful lot especially after last season when we took the world series champs to the very last game to see who won the division. Trading Adrian and not getting any major league ready talent in return is throwing away a season in which the Padres could have competed. A possible trip to the playoffs in which anything is possible (see SF Giants) and two first round picks is worth more to me than 3 prospects and a player to be named later.

        • 0bsessions 5 years ago

          While I agree that now was not the time for the Padres to trade him, now was also not the time to ask for MLB ready talent. Without Gonzalez, the Padres have absolutely no shot at the playoffs, so they might as well blow it up. If you get someone already MLB ready, you run the risk of them being expensive before the rest of their pieces are ready to compete.

    • woadude 5 years ago

      Wow, seriously, it is a great trade, and the draft pick you are referring to would only be worth it if someone like the Royals signed Agon, what would you draft with the 25-27th overall pick? and the sandwich round between, would you get a guy that can hit 25 home runs? Because thats what they have in Rizzo, would you get a guy that has explosive secondary pitches and just needs to work on a faster fastball to get it to around 95 mph? because thats what they got in Kelly, and how about the cousin to Beltran who has incredible upside? this deal is awesome for San Diego and awesome for Boston.

      • bustersposey 5 years ago

        wow, seriously… what would you draft w/ the 25- 27th pick? how about fuentes, or kelly, or ranaudo, or buchholz, or westmoreland, or reddick, or kalish, or anderson, or bowden, or rizzo who were all drafted lower than that. mcleod runs the padres drafts and he made all those picks for the sox (except ranaudo)… i’d rather have the picks + agon for next year if i’m sd.. bad trade for sd.

    • woadude 5 years ago

      Wow, seriously, it is a great trade, and the draft pick you are referring to would only be worth it if someone like the Royals signed Agon, what would you draft with the 25-27th overall pick? and the sandwich round between, would you get a guy that can hit 25 home runs? Because thats what they have in Rizzo, would you get a guy that has explosive secondary pitches and just needs to work on a faster fastball to get it to around 95 mph? because thats what they got in Kelly, and how about the cousin to Beltran who has incredible upside? this deal is awesome for San Diego and awesome for Boston.

  14. daveineg 5 years ago

    As a fan of a team with a similar player (Fielder), I’m sure hope the Brewers don’t settle for a deal like this.

    I feel sorry for the Padre fans. None of those guys they are getting back are any more sure things than the guys they could draft with the two high picks they would have gotten had the let Gonzalez leave as a FA. Another deal that causes me to boycott baseball’s postseason on television because the game is rigged.

  15. dc21892 5 years ago

    Of course he’s going to get Ryan Howard money. He’s a top first baseman and to his defense he hits for power AND average as opposed to Howard who has a hard time keeping his average up due to all his K’s. And… Gonzo plays much better defense than Howard. I expect that kind of money with another year or two.

    • jjs91 5 years ago

      His avg and obp are fine his slg dropping is the real concern.

      • 0bsessions 5 years ago

        His 2010 slugging percentage was the second highest of his career…

        • jjs91 5 years ago

          No it wasn’t what or who are you talking about?

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            2004: .381
            2005: .407
            2006: .500
            2007: .502
            2008: .510
            2009: .551
            2010: .511

            Would you like me to put it in order, greatest to least too?

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            Umm did u not see what i was replying to someone mention howards avg was down last year and he was struggling to keep it up so i responded that his avg was fine it was his slugging that went down. You can act like a smartass if you want but it helps if you’re actually smart.

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            Sorry. You had me lost at Howards BA average being down. I didn’t realise that his .276 BA from his career .279 was dropping off. Thanks for clarifying that for me.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            good thing i never said that, i said his slugging was down which it was

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            good thing i never said that, i said his slugging was down which it was

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            show me were i said he’s average was down.

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            And there’s my horrible reading comprehention, as you noted.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            If my edit bottom was working properly this conversation would have been over a long time ago, i understood the confusion after obsession didnt let up. Which is why i asked him who he was referring to.

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            To be fair though, Howard’s .850 OPS is still good. He’ll never live up to that contract.

            Now before I state something “over the edge of the world” again, I must get my Tim Hortons coffee so my brain may start functioning.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            haha it’s really ok it happens. It is a good OPS.

          • MaineSox 5 years ago

            You said that his SLG% last year wasn’t the second highest of his career and he showed you the actual number proving that it really was, how can you argue that?

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            because im talking about ryan howard that’s what i was replying to.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            These are ryan howards slg % numbers from the last 5 years .564, .567, .659, .584, .543, .571, and this years .505. The person i intially replied to said howard was struggling to keep his avg up i disagreed with him and said it was slg% that slowed him down this year.

          • MaineSox 5 years ago

            Gotcha, I mistakenly assumed you were talking about Gonzalez. My bad.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            Based on how Manny people had the same assumption i have to admit it’s somewhat my fault for not copying his quote and not making it clearer.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            These are ryan howards slg % numbers from the last 5 years .564, .567, .659, .584, .543, .571, and this years .505. The person i intially replied to said howard was struggling to keep his avg up i disagreed with him and said it was slg% that slowed him down this year.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            Umm did u not see what i was replying to someone mention howards avg was down last year and he was struggling to keep it up so i responded that his avg was fine it was his slugging that went down. You can act like a smartass if you want but it helps if you’re actually smart.

          • 0bsessions 5 years ago

            I’m assuming you’re talking about Gonzalez as he’s the subject of the thread:

            2004-.381
            2005-.407
            2006-.500
            2007-.502
            2008-.510
            2009-.551
            2010-.511

            Per baseball-reference, yes, it was his second highest slugging percentage. He had a significant drop from 2009, but it’s right in line with his career numbers. If you’re talking about Howard, well, carry on.

          • jjs91 5 years ago

            I was replying to someone who mentioned howard i didnt bring it up out of the blue.

          • 0bsessions 5 years ago

            Got it, I misunderstood then. It was a bit ambiguous which one you were referring to as both were addressed in the previous entry.

  16. dc21892 5 years ago

    Of course he’s going to get Ryan Howard money. He’s a top first baseman and to his defense he hits for power AND average as opposed to Howard who has a hard time keeping his average up due to all his K’s. And… Gonzo plays much better defense than Howard. I expect that kind of money with another year or two.

  17. Lars Chunks 5 years ago

    Pretty good trade for the Red Sox. It’s important to remember that there really wasn’t much competition for Gonzalez because of the need to sign him to a huge extension. The Padres also waited until he had only a year left on his current contract, so they weren’t going to get a full deal anyway.

  18. penpaper 5 years ago

    1000th comment?!

  19. xXdiggletreeXx 5 years ago

    glad agon will not be the giants killer anymore

  20. John LeClair 5 years ago

    Hey Theo if I Could Kiss you right now I think I would.

  21. theharsh 5 years ago

    is it weird that I just busted my pants?

    • Ferrariman 5 years ago

      well since you asked, yes.

      • theharsh 5 years ago

        it’s hard to control myself when my favorite player is finally put in the spotlight and is given the chance to shine (which he’ll easily do) 😀

  22. NomarGarciaparra 5 years ago

    Sounds like a good deal…a great loss of young talents, yes. But also getting the long needed big power bat.

    With this signing and with Ellsbury still around, wouldn’t it make more sense to go after Werth rather than Crawford now? Because:
    1. With Crawford, the Sox would be an overload of lefties. And given the number of dominant lefties in the AL East, wouldn’t we want some additional good bats from the right?
    2. Crawford would most likely require more years & more money. What if Crawford speed decline a bit? Then his value drops. Werth is more for power…and power is more sustainable.
    3. With Ellsbury still around for this year, having Crawford would be like having two Ellsburys. And when Ellsbury reaches FA, then we can talk about locking him down (although that will be tough given that Boras is his agent). But for now, we need more power from the right side (only Youkilis right now…and Pedroia & power? not really).

    • jjs91 5 years ago

      Are all redsox fans delusional enough to think that Ellsbury is even close to Crawford?

      • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

        if we’re talking speed? Ellsbury is better at stealing bases. But I think what Nomah was saying is that Crawford doesn’t fit the Sox as good as Werth does.

      • Dustroia15 5 years ago

        If it was 2009, players were nearly identical.

        If it was 2010, Ellsbury played, was hurt, tried to come back, still hurt, tried to come back and the Sox shut him down. He had broken ribs and he will be fine now that they were left to heal. Crawford had a career year.

        When both players are healthy their numbers are very close. Ellsbury also plays CF, Crawford LF.

        I’ll take Ellsbury for a few mil over Crawford for $20M

        • ellsbury will never be a crawford. you sox fans need to get that straight.

          • RedSoxDynasty 5 years ago

            wow! can you forward your number from the psychic hotline Allmighty Baseball Guru KB! U so smart!

    • jjs91 5 years ago

      Are all redsox fans delusional enough to think that Ellsbury is even close to Crawford?

  23. Dwan 5 years ago

    I can’t believe Hoyer couldn’t get Iglesias and the padres need a SS in the worst way.

    • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

      Yea I was sure Lowrie, Iglesias, or at the very least Navarro were going to be included in this.

      • start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

        Navarro could be the ptbnl

        • MaineSox 5 years ago

          I thought the same thing but Navarro is on the 40-man roster and could be named now.

          Off topic a little but when I was looking I noticed Rizzo doesn’t seem to be on the 40-man, at least what is posted on Redsox . com. Or am I missing something??

      • MaineSox 5 years ago

        PTBNL could still be a guy like Jose Vinicio who is only 17 and looks to have potential, and is a SS.

      • MaineSox 5 years ago

        PTBNL could still be a guy like Jose Vinicio who is only 17 and looks to have potential, and is a SS.

    • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

      Yea I was sure Lowrie, Iglesias, or at the very least Navarro were going to be included in this.

  24. Time to make your move cashman

    • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

      He did. He resigned Jeter.

      • True. However, some experts, actually, bloggers, say the Yankees fans should be rejoicing because, Cashman will not allow Boston to have the “final say”. I, on the other hand, don’t think the Yankees will make any big trades.

        • Guest 5 years ago

          If the Yankees sign Crawford (you never know, this could be like the whole Tex, CC & AJ show) they will probably trade Swisher. For what? maybe another arm or another arm in the pen.

          • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

            I heard this on the radio today. If that were to happen what return would NY get for him?

          • Guest 5 years ago

            Swisher is not a game changer like Crawford or even Werth. He is basically possesses solid plate discipline and below average defense. Based on that maybe a low end #3 Sper probably more like a #4. Maybe they would try to add a bullpen arm & a low level prospect instead.

    • He already did. Didn’t you see? He ran down the side of a building as an elf.

    • He already did. Didn’t you see? He ran down the side of a building as an elf.

    • MaineSox 5 years ago

      Personally I think he is too smart to be reactionary like that. I think he probably already has a plan for this offseason and will only deviate from that if it is in the best interest of the Yankees and not just because the Red Sox did something.

  25. Time to make your move cashman

  26. So the Sox lineup right now stands likeEllsburyDroiaYoukGonzoOrtizNancy DrewScutaroSal/TekCameronNot a bad lineup for the Sox.Congrats on the big trade, from your yankees fan.

    • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

      Red Sox should have a higher team OBP and about the same team SLG with Beltre out and Gonzo in. It may only be a marginal upgrade, but if Beckett and Lackey can rebound, and severely upgrade their bullpen, they should have no problems making the playoffs again.

      • True, very true, I can see the Sox going to the ALCS if Beckett and Lackey live up to their AJ Burnout type contracts. I have a couple of questions though, two in general.

        1. How do you think Gonzo will do, in terms of the “learning curve” of switching leagues.
        2. Why would the Padres trade away their stars and contention pieces, when they were just one game out of the playoffs, and not get a shortstop in return?
        3. What will the rotation look like for the Sox?

        • Sox Rotation
          Lester
          Beckett
          Buchholz
          Lackey
          Dice-K

        • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

          Gonzo will either:

          A: be the player he was in the NL, or
          B: be the next Pat Burrell

          As for the Paddies trading their stars, it’s all money. As embarrassing as it may be, his $5mil 2011 contract was just too much for them, and wanted to cash in on his high value now. They also missed the playoffs by 1 game because of their insanely good pitching, something that’s very difficult to repeat.

          • Ouch, does Gonzo have a high strikeout rate? If so the Sox are in trouble, how is he in the clutch?

          • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

            .400+ AVG w/RISP and two outs. So i’d say yes to the clutch question. He has excellent plate discipline. Usually averages high .300 OBP with low 100 SO’s.

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            Career 20.9% K rate, 19.3% in 2010. As for clutch, there really is no such thing. Let’s use Ichiro as an example. He’s good for 200 hits a year. If one year he got 120 of his 200 hits when men on base, it’s just happenstance. His RBI’s would go up, but not because of clutch, but the fact that his teammates were actually doing what they’re supposed to do – not create an out. [I hate using counting stats as a reference, but it seemed easier].

        • MaineluvstheSox 5 years ago

          Answer to question 2;
          The Paders will get 2/3 top prospects now. If they waited until the trading deadline they would get a lot less for him as a 2 month rent-a-player. The Pads are trying to make the best of a bad situation, they are not going to have Agon in 2012. Get the most from him while they can.

    • Lowrie will be starting at SS.

  27. As a fan of the World Champion San Francisco Giants, I salute you, Red Sox nation. This was a great trade for Boston, and, well, just about erases any possibility that the Padres even sniff the playoffs again in the near future (especially with Bell likely on the move as well).

    Well done Epstein!

    • jjs91 5 years ago

      well they werent supposed to sniff it this year either so who really knows what will happen.

  28. As a fan of the World Champion San Francisco Giants, I salute you, Red Sox nation. This was a great trade for Boston, and, well, just about erases any possibility that the Padres even sniff the playoffs again in the near future (especially with Bell likely on the move as well).

    Well done Epstein!

  29. TheReturnOfMrBlanks 5 years ago

    How does this trade help the 2011 Padres in anyway? Are they relying on Kyle Blanks to be the everyday 1b? Really? Might as well trade Bell now he will no longer be getting any save attempts! lol If we do trade bell can we get a guy that can start for us next year?

    I cant believe we had a great season like that and now we are reducing our payroll and trading our #1 reason fans come to games. Petco was empty all year with a good team,
    the seats are going to be cold all season in 2011.

    • jjs91 5 years ago

      no Rizzo can be their everyday first baseman (eventually).

    • 3ball 5 years ago

      Get ready for Jesus “the Butcher” Guzman. Guy can hit, but he was made for the DH.

      I’m glad to see Adrian was moved (Giants fan), but Blanks still worries me a little. Saw him in the minors (Vegas) and he hit two of the longest HRs i’ve ever seen (seen post-balco Bonds hit a few). If he could figure things out, he could easily be an Adam Dunn type power guy (maybe a less Ks).

  30. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    I know this is going to sound like a typical sour grapes statement, but I’m kinda glad the Red Sox sold Rizzo now instead of waiting. His left/right splits are a little disconcerting. But hey, regardless he’s still a good prospect who can smash righties and maybe with the right coaching will do the same to lefties.

    • YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

      Wow…that was really a fast about face on Rizzo. Careful. Whiplash is a mother. Only Hillary Clinton’s acceptance as a staff member for Obama was quicker. “He will suck. He knows nothing. But I will be glad to work for him”.

      • start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

        Dude, I’ve been saying trade Rizzo for 2 years and been citing his left/right splits the whole time. Also I know English isn’t my first language but I’m not sure when I said “he will suck.” Wait… English is my first language and I said “he’s still a good prospect” and “can smash righties.”

        I normally respect your comments but you never before put words in my mouth.

        • YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

          Ummmm…i didn’t say you said “he will suck”. Maybe I should leave humor out of future posts. Read it again.

          • Ferrariman 5 years ago

            actually you did lol

          • padresfuture 5 years ago

            Looks like he was putting words into Hillary Clintons mouth, not the poster.

          • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

            Hey if Bill can’t put anything in her mouth, YanksFanSince78 shouldn’t be allowed to either!

          • YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

            I heard she bites. But yeah, the quote was meant for Hillary. Sorry for any confusion. I thought the “But I would be glad to work for him” was obvious.

    • Sawksfan 5 years ago

      I agree it’s a good move. Gonzo is a know commodity, Rizzo has potential, but with any prospect, he may not pan out. I would have liked to see what he would bring to Fenway.

  31. slider32 5 years ago

    This was a good trade for both teams. The Padres got three top 10 prospects in Kelly, Rizzo, and Fuentes. The Sox got their man, let’s see how much he will cost, I’m guessing more than the Howard contract.

    • I disagree. They aren’t proven players. Agon is. Awful trade for the Padres, especially since they were so close last year. Who is their leader now?

      • Sawksfan 5 years ago

        Considering the clock is ticking on the Padres and they wouldn’t resign Gonzo, it is a good deal. Kelly will pitch in 2011, and Rizzo/Fuentes have great potential. If SD waited to the deadline, it would have been Kelly and a couple lower prospects. Bold move for both sides IMO.

  32. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Am I missing something or is Rizzo really not on the Red Sox 40-man Roster?

  33. missyae 5 years ago

    Thank you Theo!! Now work out the deal for Upton or go for Werth because you don’t want to overload with another lefty like Crawford. Martin for a reserve might be good too unless you have someone else up your sleeve. Don’t forget the pen!!! Nice job Theo!!!!

    • start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

      Considering the asking price on Upton was the Moon, the Sox probably don’t have the pieces to get Upton. Kelly would have been a big piece.

      • GoAwayNow 5 years ago

        If they start with ML pieces (i.e. Ellsbury and Bard) then add say Doubrant, Briton, Pimental, and Lavarnaway (or something to that extent) they could at least pique interest.

      • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

        Agreed. If they were to now try to obtain Upton, they’d have to start taking pieces off their 40-man such as Kalish and Lowrie.

        Red Sox really need to focus on their bullpen after this trade is done.

        • Sniderlover 5 years ago

          Sign Downs and not anymore Type A FA so we can get a first. You’ll have 2 extra first to work with anyways.

          • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

            I like it when you talk dirty haha. They can trade for Frasor too while they’re at it.

  34. rsn1511 5 years ago

    this is a great trade for the red sox. no iglesias/lowrie/bard/ellsbury. i thought hoyer would want one of our shortstops.

  35. The People saying the Padres didn’t get enough don’t get it. You people are head in the sand, narrow-minded types without any scope or ability to view the bigger picture. The Friars got two highly touted former 1st round picks who cost over FOUR million dollars in signing bonuses. If I’m not mistaken, these two guys step right in as #1 & #3 on San Diego’s depth chart (arguably interchangeable with Tate). For a financially challenged team like the Padres they need the high upside cost controlled players they received, and they needed another team to have already covered those bonuses. If San Diego just waited to recoup the draft picks you can certainly bet Hoyer wouldn’t have had clearance to drop 4 mil on the compensation picks, on top of SD’s own 1st in that 2012 draft. Also take into consideration that Hoyer has #10 & #26 and three other supplemental 1sts in this 2011 draft so the 6+mil savings on A-Gon should give Towers the financial flexibility to spend on some serious talent in this deep draft. Hoyer will have completely turned around San Diego’s farm system in less than two years. Kudos to him.

    • No one is saying they shouldnt have traded and AGon and just took the picks. They are saying a AA pitcher with an ERA over 5, a AA 1B with a OBP under .340, and a A OFer with a BA of .270 was not enough in the way of prospects. This #1, #3, and #6 ranking business was before these poor seasons last year. No way they keep those rankings. The fact they didnt get Kalish or Lowrie is criminal.

    • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

      ..former 1st round picks who cost over FOUR million dollars in signing bonuses.

      Where a player is drafted, or how much their bonus was doesn’t mean anything. All that matters is ceiling and numbers.

      Kelly had a horrible 2010 year considering his hype. At this point, I’d say Rizzo is the better prospect with them both in AA and he still OPSing over .800.

      • dc21892 5 years ago

        Well, to Kellys defense, it was his first full season as a pitcher in pro ball. He has much room for improvement and I’m sure he will be something more than a bust. As for Rizzo, he looks good. Best of luck to these guys. Took a hit out of our deep farm.

    • thebigdog 5 years ago

      Three years from now we will know — and I don’t think the Padres fans will be happy.

  36. Dmarkos 5 years ago

    For all the people saying that the Padres got ripped off in this deal, let me ask you, if this was the best deal they were offered (which I am assuming it was, because Hoyer taking a lesser deal because he is Theo’s buddy is just laughable) then does it matter that it is below value for A-Gon? They knew they had to trade him, they had other holes to fill and his 6 mil will be spent elsewhere. I am not trying to make the argument that trading A-Gon is good for the Padres, it clearly is not, but if they had to move him, which they did, because they would have gotten much less at the deadline for only two months of him (he also would have been less likely to sign an extension because he was so close to FA) and this was the only deal out there, didn’t they have to take it?

  37. I love seeing Yanks fans complaining how the Sox always get good players for garbage

    • Guest 5 years ago

      No, Yankee fans are just taking a page out of the Red Sox play book. Like the Yanks buy all of the best players or trade with teams that cannot afford to keep their best players. The Yankees over hype their farm prospects to fleece the best talent from other teams. The Yankees buy the best players…oh wait I already said that. I guess the playbook of rants for Pink Cap nation is pretty small….

  38. tripperdimauro 5 years ago

    if the sox did sign werth and downs, would they lose their pick at 19 for det signing victor and whatever pick they net for beltre?

    or would the sox lose the 24th or whatever they finished with for signing one and then their second rder for signing the other

    • Dmarkos 5 years ago

      They would lose their first rounder to the Phillies for Werth, not the number 19 that they picked up for V-MArt, then they would surrender their own second rounder to the Blue Jays for Downs. They would end up with 19 overall, and whatever pick the team signing Beltre has (of course providing that the signing team did not also sign a higher ranked Type A FA).

      • tripperdimauro 5 years ago

        thanks, that question had been bothering me. this works out great for the sox that det signed victor as long as they dont sign anyone higher on the type A list.

        his offense and beltres offense will be missed.

        i would think they should still pursue beltre as an expensive insurance policy in the cases that youks thumb and gonzos shoulder are not ready for the start of the season

        • Dmarkos 5 years ago

          I’m not opposed to bringing back Beltre either, but it wouldn’t be as an insurance policy, he would be their 3rd baseman. This would likely move Youk out to LF, which would be a real adventure on the road as we saw last year when he was out there because of injuries. I gotta say I still have mixed thoughts on letting V-Mart walk, the pick is nice, but then again I salivate at the thought of having him in the same lineup as A-Gon, Youk, and Papi, that would have been 4 ridiculous hitters in a row the Sox could have trotted out there. I think I would have signed him for the 12.5 mil a year and then let him DH after next season when Papi is no longer with us. I am ok if the Sox let Beltre walk and take the picks, don’t get me wrong he was spectacular, but anyone who gives him 60 million and expects the same production when he is out of Fenway Park needs to have their head examined.

        • Dmarkos 5 years ago

          I’m not opposed to bringing back Beltre either, but it wouldn’t be as an insurance policy, he would be their 3rd baseman. This would likely move Youk out to LF, which would be a real adventure on the road as we saw last year when he was out there because of injuries. I gotta say I still have mixed thoughts on letting V-Mart walk, the pick is nice, but then again I salivate at the thought of having him in the same lineup as A-Gon, Youk, and Papi, that would have been 4 ridiculous hitters in a row the Sox could have trotted out there. I think I would have signed him for the 12.5 mil a year and then let him DH after next season when Papi is no longer with us. I am ok if the Sox let Beltre walk and take the picks, don’t get me wrong he was spectacular, but anyone who gives him 60 million and expects the same production when he is out of Fenway Park needs to have their head examined.

    • MaineSox 5 years ago

      Delete

  39. Gurvir Nijjar 5 years ago

    wts the deal ?

  40. Really surprised by this trade. Not that it happened, but how little the Padres got. Kelly is a good start but they needed an elite position prospect. Is Rizzo really that player? A 1b? They needed at least Iglesias or Kalish. Funetes looks like nothing special despite his age. Really this will have to be judged by the development of Kelly and whomever the player to be named is. Really disappointing day for Padres fans. Great day though to be a Sox fan.

    • jwredsox 5 years ago

      Fuentes is actually a little safer. His speed will be a big factor in the immense Padre’s outfield and fangraphs puts him at #4 on the Padre’s top 10 prospects ahead of Tate. Actually fangraphs updated their top 10 prospects for San Diego and has Kelly at #1, Rizzo at #3, and Fuentes at #4. Not a bad haul to add 3 top 10 prospects to your farm.

      • MaineSox 5 years ago

        Hard to say at such an early stage of his career but Fuentes looks like he has the potential to be Ellsbury with better defense.

        • tripperdimauro 5 years ago

          i like fuentes potential, i hope he thrives in SD

  41. padresfuture 5 years ago

    This trade does nothing now for the Padres this year except create another hole and reduce payroll. The return the Padres got, although devoid of ready now players, is OK. Boston should be happy with this trade. As for the Padres, only time will tell. As for all the posters on here upset about the minor league numbers of kelly/rizzo/fuentes… all are fairly young for the level they were playing at…. if they were in the padres system last year they would be in lower levels and likely produced better numbers. Fair trade but not great for the Padres.

  42. Giorgi Almonte 5 years ago

    hmm, this guy coul hit around 55 homers in fenway!!!!!, i guess……

  43. tripperdimauro 5 years ago

    If the Sox do sign Carl Crawford, i would envision a trade of Jacoby Ellsbury forthcoming. maybe for relief help if they cant land a quality reliever on the market.

    but i would think that an oufield of Jacoby and Crawford and eventually Kalish, no matter how LEFTHANDED they would be, would be very fun to watch and not many singles would turn to doubles, doubles to triples and tweeners would turn into outs.

    they have the balance in the infield and DH after this season, 2b, SS and 3b and C are all RH if you count salty/varitek switch hitting, and they can purse a DH or 3b next season if/when ortiz leaves and youk could shift there.

    • Dustroia15 5 years ago

      Who plays OF next year?2011Crawford/Werth, Ellsbury, Drew – back ups Cameron and Kalish/McDonald 2012Crawford/Werth, Ellsbury, Kalish – back ups McDonald and ReddickSox could actually sign both Crawford and Werth and not be in bad shape. If everyone stays healthy each of Crawford, Werth, Ellsbury, Drew and Ortiz could get 130 starts. Most likely someone will get hurt. I’m not saying this is what the Sox should do, just pointing out signing an OF doesn’t make Ellsbury expendable.

      • tripperdimauro 5 years ago

        i wasnt referring to just any of but crawford being a lefty i felt it may have. i agree that it doesnt need to happen

        i agree that someone will get hurt, drews knee/shoulder/back/neck/vagina… ellsburys ribs? youk and his thumb

        its really wouldnt hurt to bring beltre back if they somehow managed to miss out on crawford and werth and beltre was still out there… YOUK did play some OF in a pinch for them over the years. not the best scenario but still would be a nice lineup

        just a pipe dream

        if they miss out on both FA OFs then they will most certainly acquire one via trade.

        BRIDGE YEAR MY A$$

    • Dustroia15 5 years ago

      Who plays OF next year?2011Crawford/Werth, Ellsbury, Drew – back ups Cameron and Kalish/McDonald 2012Crawford/Werth, Ellsbury, Kalish – back ups McDonald and ReddickSox could actually sign both Crawford and Werth and not be in bad shape. If everyone stays healthy each of Crawford, Werth, Ellsbury, Drew and Ortiz could get 130 starts. Most likely someone will get hurt. I’m not saying this is what the Sox should do, just pointing out signing an OF doesn’t make Ellsbury expendable.

  44. tripperdimauro 5 years ago

    If the Sox do sign Carl Crawford, i would envision a trade of Jacoby Ellsbury forthcoming. maybe for relief help if they cant land a quality reliever on the market.

    but i would think that an oufield of Jacoby and Crawford and eventually Kalish, no matter how LEFTHANDED they would be, would be very fun to watch and not many singles would turn to doubles, doubles to triples and tweeners would turn into outs.

    they have the balance in the infield and DH after this season, 2b, SS and 3b and C are all RH if you count salty/varitek switch hitting, and they can purse a DH or 3b next season if/when ortiz leaves and youk could shift there.

  45. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    The Red Sox payroll current sits around $135M. They would probably be willing to spend another $40M for the right people.

    Starting Pitching = $50.5M
    Lester, Buchholz, Beckett, Lackey, Matsuzaka, Wakefield

    Relief Pitching = $14M
    Papelbon, Bard, Doubront, Atchison, Bowden, Pimental

    Starting Lineup = $66.5M
    Saltalamachia, Gonzalez, Pedroia, Scutaro, Youkilis, Cameron, Ellsbury, Drew, Ortiz

    Bench = $4M
    Varitek, Lowrie, Kalish, McDonald, Anderson

    I think the Sox should sign Werth (16), Downs (6), Wiggington (6), Rauch (4), Wheeler (3).

    This puts Sox around $170M.

    Wouldn’t mind seeing Sox unload Papelbon and Scutaro and replacing them with Iglesias and Soriano.

    This would get the Sox around $168 because they would have to also give up $4-5M with Papelbon.

    There are still a lot of moves to be made by the Sox just to fill out the roster, should continue to be an exciting winter.

    • jwredsox 5 years ago

      Iglesius isn’t near ready for the bigs. I have trouble seeing him hit even just .200 in the majors at this point.

      • ‘Iglesias’ is pretty damn close to being ready, I don’t know what you are talking about. I have trouble figuring out where you are drawing your conclusions aside from the ever popular “gut feeling”.

        • jwredsox 5 years ago

          1. He hasn’t batted above AA
          2. He has little present power (.072 ISO in AA) to go with no patience (3.4% BB% in AA)
          3. His average was held up by a high BABIP in AA (.360)

          That’s why.

          • MaineSox 5 years ago

            True, however he is more than ready to come up and be one of the top defenders at SS right now.

    • jwredsox 5 years ago

      Iglesius isn’t near ready for the bigs. I have trouble seeing him hit even just .200 in the majors at this point.

    • tripperdimauro 5 years ago

      kalish wont rot on the bench.

      he’ll start in AAA, as will lars and stolmy

      • Dustroia15 5 years ago

        I agree. We just dont have 4th and 5th OFers right now. Above is our roster as it stands right now. McDonald will get the 5th spot if we sign Werth.

        • BoSoxSam 5 years ago

          Nava and McDonald might be the 4th/5th outfielders. Both guys who don’t have starting roles in their future, and who can contribute. Not the best group, but Kalish needs to be in AAA. He’s gotta get ready for next year, when Drew leaves. :)

        • BoSoxSam 5 years ago

          Nava and McDonald might be the 4th/5th outfielders. Both guys who don’t have starting roles in their future, and who can contribute. Not the best group, but Kalish needs to be in AAA. He’s gotta get ready for next year, when Drew leaves. :)

      • Dustroia15 5 years ago

        I agree. We just dont have 4th and 5th OFers right now. Above is our roster as it stands right now. McDonald will get the 5th spot if we sign Werth.

    • BoSoxSam 5 years ago

      Not a huge fan of Rauch or Wheeler, although I think one of them would be okay. For the bullpen, I just want to see Downs signed plus one of the guys ala Rauch or Wheeler, and then do Epstein’s thing with mini-trades and low-risk/moderate-upside guys. Too hard to really know what to expect from every free-agent reliever, so I don’t want them to spend a lot there past Downs, and just accumulate a lot of options. Risky, sure, but its the bullpen. It’s always really risky, because relievers can be so volatile.

      And the Sox really need Werth. Great addition to this lineup now, with Gonzalez in there.

      I agree, this winter is going to extremely fun to follow. Boston finally got its ball rolling with Gonzalez, which is already making the next steps (Werth, Downs) clearer. And as their shroud of mystery begins to disappear, I expect moves to start flying fast and furious as Epstein tries to minimize any sort of bidding wars.

  46. RedSox2219 5 years ago

    Still not a fan of Werth. His defense has dropped for two years in a row and that reminds me too much of Jason Bay.

    • Dustroia15 5 years ago

      Not a huge fan wither but the Sox need to sign Werth or Crawford or make a trade fr a starting OFer.

      Wouldn’t mind trading for Bay. Are the Mets regretting the deal yet, willing to give him away, maybe throw in some $?

    • slider32 5 years ago

      He’s much faster than Bay, and his swing is made for Fenway. Plus the Sox need another right hand hitter to face Lee, Sabathia,and Pettite; not to mention Price and Romero.

    • slider32 5 years ago

      He’s much faster than Bay, and his swing is made for Fenway. Plus the Sox need another right hand hitter to face Lee, Sabathia,and Pettite; not to mention Price and Romero.

  47. The_Silver_Stacker 5 years ago

    This now signals the AL East back to the two-headed monster that is the Yankees and Red Sox. Rays now have no chance at the division crown

    • BoSoxSam 5 years ago

      Yanks haven’t done anything yet this year. Wait until you -actually- get Lee before making these claims.

    • BoSoxSam 5 years ago

      Yanks haven’t done anything yet this year. Wait until you -actually- get Lee before making these claims.

    • Call me crazy but I dont think the Yankees will make the playoffs next year unless they sign lee. The Blue Jays are getting better and could give either team a run for their money and the rays are going to be good as well. The blue jays had a winning record against every team in the east last year except the red sox, watch out for them

      • Tyler Sekula 5 years ago

        Okay…you’re crazy.. The Rays are losing Pena and Crawford and Soriano and Beniot along with other key players to their team. They wont be nearly as good as last year. The blue jays are a couple players away…they will lose a lot of their bullpen and are in desperate need of another bat in their line up. The Red Sox win the divison (expecially if they go out and sign CC/Werth) and they you also have to take into account the fact that the Angels are going to be better next year with Morales coming back, texas will be good again (although will struggle with pitching if they lose Lee)..the A’s will be good next year if they sign Beltre.. The tigers/whitesox/twins…all good teams in the central… Right now..If I had to call it..

        Red Sox – East
        White Sox – Central
        Angels – West
        Yankees -Wild Card

        The Yankees will be extremely competitive next year if they sign Lee. I still think the Jays are a few players away..It’s a two horse race in the AL East.

        • jjs91 5 years ago

          The redsox have to fix their bullpen and it’s not like their rotation dominated last year.

          • jwredsox 5 years ago

            Their pitching staff’s FIP was better then both the Ray’s and Yankee’s last year. They just had 2 extremely unlucky years from Beckett and Lackey.

          • YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

            Yeah…unlucky in the sense that it was unlucky they didn’t push the Fenway OF walls back about 20 feet.

          • jwredsox 5 years ago

            I’d say a .349 BABIP for Beckett and .323 for Lackey is unlucky. But it is really unlucky in Beckett’s case.

          • rsn1511 5 years ago

            i expect them both to be a lot better next year. yankees fans should take a look at their own pitching staff before ridiculing ours. burnett? HA

          • YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

            Hey schmuch nobody is ridiculing, it’s just a discussion. We each have issues.

          • rsn1511 5 years ago

            nobody cares about what biased yankees fans think

          • jwredsox 5 years ago

            Lay off. YFS78 is one of the least bias Yankees fan on this site.

          • rsn1511 5 years ago

            nobody cares about what biased yankees fans think

          • YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

            BaBIP factors in batted balls in play or how well the defense turned “fieldable” balls into outs. A HR isn’t fieldable and the equations subtracts Hits – HR. The problem w/ Beckett wasn’t his “luck” on singles, dbls and triples. It was a much higher BB/9 rate (2.33 to 3.17), a lowered KO/BB rate (3.62 to 2.58) and a ridiculously high HR/9 rate of 1.41 up from 1.06.

            In addition, his FB velocity drooped for the 4th straight year (2007 @ 94.7 to 93.5 in 2010). He’s also using a lot of his offspeed stuff more often. He threw the cutter 15% of the time compared to 5% in 2009. He also threw the CH moreand FB and Curve less.

          • jwredsox 5 years ago

            I realize this. But you’d figure Beckett whose FB% only went up a bit (3.6%) from ’09 was also getting unlucky on homeruns. It could be similar to in ’06 when he had the same average speed on his FB as ’10 and a higher HR/9. That coupled with the fact there were a ton of base runners because of all the singles, doubles, triples, and (most importantly) walks and you can see why he had an inflated ERA. The walks could certainly just be the fact he was never really settled into the season or sample size or maybe a change in mentality as you pointed out by him throwing more offspeed stuff. But his overall peripherals remained constant and I’m leaning more towards 2010 being a statistical fluke for Beckett.

            I mean even the plate discipline stats make no sense for a guy with a terrible season. His O-Swing% actually went up (which would make you assume more strikeouts), his Z-Swing% remained in pretty constant as did his overall swing%. So it isn’t like hitters were laying off his stuff better and working walks. What was off with contact was the fact hitters had a higher O-Contact% (7.2% higher) yet the rest of his contact rates remained constant as did his swinging strike%. The jump in O-Contact% seems like another flukish thing to me that points towards a better 2011. I’m not predicting another 2007 season but he can match his 09 season and that’s all the Red Sox need.

          • jwredsox 5 years ago

            I’d say a .349 BABIP for Beckett and .323 for Lackey is unlucky. But it is really unlucky in Beckett’s case.

    • Call me crazy but I dont think the Yankees will make the playoffs next year unless they sign lee. The Blue Jays are getting better and could give either team a run for their money and the rays are going to be good as well. The blue jays had a winning record against every team in the east last year except the red sox, watch out for them

    • slider32 5 years ago

      Rays will still be in the race with their pitching; they do need to make some key moves with their bull pen and 1b-DH.

      • jwredsox 5 years ago

        Their bullpen lost 270 something innings with an ERA under 3. They’re going to need a lot of bullpen moves.

      • jwredsox 5 years ago

        Their bullpen lost 270 something innings with an ERA under 3. They’re going to need a lot of bullpen moves.

  48. The_Silver_Stacker 5 years ago

    This now signals the AL East back to the two-headed monster that is the Yankees and Red Sox. Rays now have no chance at the division crown

  49. JackParkman 5 years ago

    this has to be the most comments ever? 1214 and couting

    • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

      The Roy Halladay trade forum had nearly double.

    • Encarnacion's Parrot 5 years ago

      The Roy Halladay trade forum had nearly double.

  50. Letsgofathers 5 years ago

    this sucks b@lls.

  51. Hoosierdaddy92 5 years ago

    I don’t think the Red Sox go out an sign a big name OF now that they acquired A-Gonz and are likely to be paying him 25MM a season. I think they are fine with Ellsbury, Cameron, and JD Drew for this year, and then once JD and Big Papi’s contracts expire, they spend some money next offseason. Their offense was amazing this year, despite a ton of injuries. A-Gonz could outperform Beltre next year after all, now that he is in a hitter’s park with a great lineup around him. The Sox should wait it out before signing anybody else, and see where they are at the trade deadline next season. If JD or Big Papi gets hurt midseason, perhaps they make a splash then. But as for now, they should sit tight. This already is a pretty amazing acquisition

  52. take two shots of johnny walker and call me in the morning

  53. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    Sentiment and a couple of bucks will buy you a cup of coffee at Dunkin’ Donuts. He’s cheap and can produce, that’s AGon’s value.

    “The Negative: All it says is the Red Sox called San Diego”

    Yes, but without the continually announcements about the Red Sox calling up the Padres we wouldn’t have all the fun arguments between the state of the farms of the Sox and yanks.

  54. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    Sentiment and a couple of bucks will buy you a cup of coffee at Dunkin’ Donuts. He’s cheap and can produce, that’s AGon’s value.

    “The Negative: All it says is the Red Sox called San Diego”

    Yes, but without the continually announcements about the Red Sox calling up the Padres we wouldn’t have all the fun arguments between the state of the farms of the Sox and yanks.

  55. penpaper 5 years ago

    The reason I ask is because Adrian would cost money AND prospects. Plus with Youk shifting over, will it be worth it? Obviously Adrian is a superstar yet still has not met his ceiling as far as production goes but I just don’t see Youk shifting over.

    That’s why my question intrigues me.

  56. Hubbs2 5 years ago

    Not to mention Gonzalez is one of the best at first on D

  57. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Not that he has proven himself but he had a better year than (at least I) expected offensively.

  58. flickadave 5 years ago

    I agree that it probably is the Padres demanding the minors package. I wonder if this is their way of stocking their farm system with great prospects without having to pay signing bonuses. I kind of get the feeling that the Padres are trying to out-cheap the Marlins and Rays and still put a decent team on the field in a few years.

  59. EarlyMorningBoxscore 5 years ago

    I do agree with that. They need to have an extension in place first.

  60. padresfuture 5 years ago

    It is a risk, but at least they would get back 2 high draft picks if Adrian left. Besides, I think Adrian will enjoy mashing 50 Hrs and driving in 120 RBI’s in the AL east band boxes.

  61. Hubbs2 5 years ago

    I think Adrian has hit exactly what his ceiling is, a GG 1st baseman and a hitter that over the last 4 years has hit 30 or more homers in the toughest park to hit home runs. He has an excellent eye and should hit around .285 every year. If he gets any better he’ll be Albert Pujols
    If he goes to Boston I wouldn’t be surprised to see him hit a minimum of 40 every single year

  62. Beersy 5 years ago

    Gonzalez for Ackley and Pineda, although this is a deal offered up by a Padre fan, would be fine with me. Jack Z should be trying to save his a$$ and get a winner in Seattle before Ichiro is done.

  63. padresfuture 5 years ago

    An extension doesnt have to be stipulated. Low risk with 2 high draft picks as comp if he doesnt resign. Worst case scenario a team gets great value and 2 comp picks.

  64. Hubbs2 5 years ago

    A lot of the Padres staff, such as the G.m., asst gm, and an exec are former Sox staff. So he’s saying it makes the most sense because they know their system through and through

  65. Ferrariman 5 years ago

    how exactly can you assure us? are you aware of the inner workings of baseball?

  66. Hubbs2 5 years ago

    As a CF ellsbury has registered a 21.6 uzr in 07 in 107 innings, in 08 he was at 6.1 in 546.2, in 09 he registered a -9.7 in 1302.2 and in 2010 he put up a 1.4 in 104.2 innings for a total UZR of .1 not real great. Especially considering the most amount of time he saw in CF also was the season he experienced his worst season, and it was statistically right at the bottom in the entire league

  67. YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

    Other than Kelly what high end pitching prospects not drafted in 2010 (because they can’t be traded) do they have to offer? And by high end I mean guys who can be #1’s-#3’s regardless of what division.

  68. YODA777 5 years ago

    As it stands right now, the Padres have better pitching in the minors and more of it then the Red Sox do. No restocking needed. The Red Sox need Gonz more then the Padres need your overrated prospects [other then Kelly or Doubront]. The Padres could use some middle infielders and catching prospects. The Red Sox should trade Ellsbury and whoever to add a top level catching and SS prospect to the deal for the Padres. The Red Sox can then go out and sign either Werth or Crawford to replace Ellsbury and have a very competitive team in the A.L. East. Kelly, Doubront, catching prospect and SS prospect acquired via trade for Gonz.

  69. Dave_Gershman 5 years ago

    Well I was obviously refering to A-Gon signing an extension, in which case I think Ellsbury would be included.

  70. Quest2b1 5 years ago

    yes, not about what fair, but whats best

  71. jwsox 5 years ago

    sorry i was saying 4-5 of the teams top ten prospects assuming that A-gon was extended before the trade is complete….and even without your talking 4-5 top prospects is a texiera type deal and thats going to be exactly what the padres are looking or

  72. padresfuture 5 years ago

    Hey, it’s cool. Keep finishing second to the Yankees. Oh wait, were the Rays up there too this year?

  73. YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

    Yeah but 4 or 5 of the top 10 of Boston’s farm might equate to 1 in the top 50. It’s all relative and I have to imagine that they can better from others.

  74. YODA777 5 years ago

    LOL, what a laughable offer.

  75. padresfuture 5 years ago

    That depends on whether or not that team makes a serious title run. Agreed that it would be a mistake if the team fizzles and he leaves.

  76. padresfuture 5 years ago

    My point is, the RedSox want to win this year. Worry about a SS later, maybe they can get Hanley Ramirez away from the Fish when he is due another contract… the Red Sox, unlike the Padres, have the resources to get top talent without only internal development.

  77. Pimentel and Britton, but they aren’t as highly regarded as Kelly. They are definitely good arms though. Neither would headline the package, but they could be the very good #2 or #3 piece in the way that Anibal Sanchez was in the Beckett deal.

  78. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Micheal Bowden, I kid I kid… Doubront projects as a good 2-3 (or #1 in a weaker staff) Pimentel has great stuff and the potential to be a front end starter, and Drake Britton is only 21 and missed ’09 due to Tommy John surgery but throws a fastball that already tops out around 97 along with a ++ 12-6 curve and a good change up and an impressive ’10 has him ranked right behind Ranaudo for the #5 spot on baseball america’s organizational ranking.

  79. johnsilver 5 years ago

    Anything “can” happen of course. SD “can” resign him to a 7-8 year 140-160m dollar contract also, but everyone knows they can’t afford it and they won’t either.

    Boston has been looking at this guy for 2-3 seasons, the only team that has the finances to outbid them is the NYY and they are set at 1B and DH for years to come with 20M+ players Tex and Arod. There is nobody out there that will be able to touch Boston *IF* they pursue him like they have shown interest in the past.

    Why I have always been reluctant, or since mid way through last season to give up far too much for him since figured he was destined to play in Boston anyway and if in the end AGone asked for more than say Pujols if he is also on the market?? Boston could always go in that direction.

  80. Steve_in_MA 5 years ago

    But there is one position where we haven’t had a home grown guy for a long time, and must preserve. Its about pride in our SS. We won’t give up Iglesias. Anything else you want, you can have. Name it.

  81. MaineluvstheSox 5 years ago

    Nobody, whether it’s the Sox or even Yanks, are going to trade 3 or 4 top prospects for ANY player for 1 year. Nice dream.

  82. darkstorm97 5 years ago

    You know, Hanley was the BoSox SS of the future a few years ago. Funny how things come full circle. Six years from now we’ll be saying the same thing about Kelly.

  83. Hubbs2 5 years ago

    I quoted Fangraphs as well, he has nowhere near the offensive ability to stick in ANY COF spot so I quoted his CF UZR since being in LF and especially RF severely limit his offensive productivity.
    I never said he wouldnt improve, but being a part of an AGon trade, all he should be considered is as a throw in, they need a plus defender in center, why else do you think Gwynn Jr would ever see the starting line up

  84. Hubbs2 5 years ago

    And his TOTAL UZR being 21 in 08 really makes no difference, he would be awful as a weak hitting weak armed LF/RF, his only chance to have a positive impact would be playing in CF

  85. GoAwayNow 5 years ago

    “Theo clearly has his priorities in disarray. The Bullpen was the clear weakness and needs to be solved first. The Red Sox will finish last in the AL East with a 0-162 record. ”

    :p

  86. Mr. Pinches 5 years ago

    The idea of seeing that makes me happy in the pants

  87. Mr. Pinches 5 years ago

    I still think the sox are in on either Crawford or Werth.

    Which would also help free up some blocked OF prospects for a trade.

  88. doubtful on an outfielder it wont happen

  89. Mr. Pinches 5 years ago

    Really,since he’s fallen behind Rizzo on the depth chart. i REALY HOPE they want Lars!!!

  90. YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

    Yeah but cmon, the Pads are looking for better than a #2 or #3 starter under “special Petco and good defense” circumstances. I would think they want someone who could be a #1 even if they were pitching in Fenway, NYS or Citizens Park. I mean Ian Kennedy could possibly pitch well in Petco but it doesn’t make him a front of rotation prospect right? As for Rizzo, can anyone tell me more about him? I see his numbers and age/level but can’t get past the 132 ko’s, the .334 OBP and the 16 errors at 1B last year @ A+/AA. He just reminds me a lot of Brandon Laird who was drafted the same year as Rizzo but is 2 years older.

    Laird at AA/AAA w/ .281/.336/.482 line w/ 25 hrs and 42 bb vs 112 ko and 16 ER @ 1B
    Rizzo at A+/AA w/ .260/.334/.480 line w/ 25 hrs and 61 bb vs 132 ko and 22 ER @ 3B

    I’m not being smug, and I know numbers don’t tell it all, but do the majority of Sox fans see Doubront and Pimentel as bonafide #1’s or #2’s TALENT WISE?

    Is Rizzo a top 50 prospect?

    And yeah I know…Montero is overrated, Jeter sucks, Joba is fat and Hughes is overrated to. Now that that’s out the way.

  91. MaineSox 5 years ago

    The thing that has people really excited about Rizzo is his power potential. Most of his strikeouts came after the move to AA. Batting against more advanced pitching he had trouble adjusting to the better breaking pitches.

    He also seems to suffer from a bit of a J.D. Drew complex, and by that I mean that he has a good eye and knows the strike zone well but actually needs to protect the plate better late in counts and not be as picky with 2 strikes. Living in Maine I had the opportunity to watch him play several times and he seemed to strike out a lot on pitches that would be normal to let go with 0 or 1 strike but were too close to take with 2 strikes. He just seemed too passive with two strikes.

    With some time to adjust to more advanced breaking pitches and learning to protect the plate late in counts I think he could drop his strike out count quite a lot. I don’t think 130 strike outs is all that unreasonable for for a power hitter anyway, not at all trying to say “see your guy does it too” but just for comparison A-Rod has had 4 seasons with over 130 strike outs and 9 seasons over 120 and a lot of other sluggers flirt with 200.

    As far as his OBP he was consistently up around .375-.380 until this season and I think the drop is mostly due to his drop in average as his walks were near where they usually were, and I think his drop in average was also at least in part due to his trouble handling better breaking pitches this year. Also I don’t know that looking at his errors is completely fair. Errors are subjective and don’t tell the whole story, Beltre had 19 last year and I think is still considered one of the best defensive third baseman around.

    I don’t know that he is quite worth the hype yet that some people (particularly the Boston media) like to give him, but he is definitely a good young player and is an exciting prospect. He has a bright future IF he can live up to the potential, but that same “if” applies to any prospect. And no he is not ranked to 50 by anyone that I know of.

  92. why does everything have to be about boston vs nyy montero could be good i dont like joba but this isnt about nyy at least try to stay on topic its about boston and san diego

  93. YODA777 5 years ago

    Hey Youk is fat and fights like a girl too lol.

  94. treyraq 5 years ago

    Not to mention that Gonzalez WANTS to go to Boston.

  95. YODA777 5 years ago

    A lot of the Red Sox staff are former Padres staff as well.

  96. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Just curious, what do you mean doesn’t fit the Sox mold? As a player in some way or the trade/potential contract?

  97. rsn1511 5 years ago

    actually I will be fine with that. I love Lowrie’s offense.

  98. BoSoxSam 5 years ago

    Yes. Please! I keep refreshing the page, to no avail….it was exciting that one time it added the detail about no major leaguers, which we already knew and just had confirmed.

  99. Good to know I’m not the only one protesting sleep on account of this. How late before the MLBTR guys go to bed and wait to update until tomorrow?

    I keep perusing the soxprospects website thinking about who might be headed out… I just hope it’s not Iglesias or Britton. Though I doubt Theo would be willing to part with Iglesias, especially if Kelly is already included.

  100. mbonzo 5 years ago

    Congratulations on your 89 games. Just to let you know the Yankees hardly played in Sept in Oct thanks to that nice lead the Red Sox gave them. They were projected to at least be a 100 win team then but decided to rest played because… oh wait they had injuries too. I’m sure the Red Sox will be better, but the Yankees will be better too, and they were already better so that means the Red Sox have to double improve. They’ll get Crawford or Werth but Yankees have one of the all time best offensive lineups.

  101. It would take more than Just Ackley and Pineda. More like Ackley, Smoak and Pineda.

  102. MB923 5 years ago

    Back in March when Baseball Prospectus ranked farm systems, the Padres had the worst in all of baseball. Of course this gets adjusted all the time so I don’t know where they rank now, but if they are ranked towards the bottom, it should come at no surprise that they are asking for all minor leaguers.

  103. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    Hopefully Sox don’t go more than the Dunn contract on Werth.

    I actually like Drew, think Werth will put up similar numbers with better defense. I would do the Drew deal again but wouldn’t do it for more money.

  104. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    You can’t bring us down. We got AGonz baby!

    We already expect you to get Lee. If you do not a big deal, if you don’t, wooo another party!

  105. BoomDizzle 5 years ago

    That would be hilarious

  106. BoomDizzle 5 years ago

    That would be hilarious

  107. NL_East_Rivalry 5 years ago

    I know A-Gon is a great defensive 1st Baseman, but I hear his defense is even better at DH! He never drops those sunflower seeds.

  108. bostiguy 5 years ago

    Once you get out of high school, you will learn that is a stupid thing to even joke about. Love or hate players you don’t wish injury on anyone.

  109. Guest 5 years ago

    While I don’t wish that, I bet you are right. My buddy just had a similar surgery and he is absolutely useless at work and thats not his style. Granted this happened just 6 weeks ago and needs more healing time, this is not an injury to take lightly. I bet Gonzales sees only about 120-130 total games, max next season. You’d think the Sox would protect this massive investment.

  110. FriedCalamari 5 years ago

    Yea, for real. It kinda makes it harder to kinda sneak into a competitive spot next year. I’m realistically expecting a bit of a digression in terms of wins next years for the Jays, but maybe a bit more now than expected. I love the Jays. I do not like the Sox or NYY and rarely ever cheer for them. It’s more like I’m just happy that when the Jays win the division sometime in the near future they will have done so beating some really stacked teams^^ and that would make it all the more gratifying. Seriously facing Boston’s lineup will be real tough now, especially if they add another high tier hitter

  111. FriedCalamari 5 years ago

    Yea, for real. It kinda makes it harder to kinda sneak into a competitive spot next year. I’m realistically expecting a bit of a digression in terms of wins next years for the Jays, but maybe a bit more now than expected. I love the Jays. I do not like the Sox or NYY and rarely ever cheer for them. It’s more like I’m just happy that when the Jays win the division sometime in the near future they will have done so beating some really stacked teams^^ and that would make it all the more gratifying. Seriously facing Boston’s lineup will be real tough now, especially if they add another high tier hitter

  112. NL_East_Rivalry 5 years ago

    Then send letters to Selig to get them moved into the Central or West. I think Jays would become a West team to get out of the AL East. Braves were in the West for a couple of years and still won 90-100 games.

  113. Guest 5 years ago

    Sad thing is the Jays could have blown the Sox package away.

  114. dc21892 5 years ago

    I was thinking the same thing. Where this stands right now, that seems like a hell of a deal for Boston. These prospects all have high upside but this is Adrian Gonzalez we’re talking about!

  115. dc21892 5 years ago

    I was thinking the same thing. Where this stands right now, that seems like a hell of a deal for Boston. These prospects all have high upside but this is Adrian Gonzalez we’re talking about!

  116. caseyB 5 years ago

    But, didn’t you just say Hoyer knows what he is doing???

  117. BoomDizzle 5 years ago

    This better be a joke. Kalish or Iglesias better be in this deal. Fuentes doesn’t do it. The Sox don’t care if they lose him.

  118. 0bsessions 5 years ago

    Look at it this way:

    If Gonzalez walks, the Padres get a pair of supplemental picks in the 2012 draft, a draft most experts expect will get hard slotting.

    If the Padres let him walk for picks, most people figure he was a lock to sign with Boston anyway, so the Padres would be getting the Sox’ first rounder and a sandwich pick in 2012 which would likely be somewhere in the high twenties and sixties respectively. Kelly and Fuentes were first rounders and Rizzo was a sixth. This is basically more than you’d get for him if you let him walk, so I wouldn’t expect too much more.

  119. caseyB 5 years ago

    But that was exactly my point in the post to which you replied with that comment.

  120. dc21892 5 years ago

    That’s why this is so much sweeter being a Sox fan :]

  121. leachim2 5 years ago

    what are you talking about.

  122. sometimes I wish there was a dislike button.

  123. caseyB 5 years ago

    Nope. At that point I had accepted DunkinDonut’s statement that Kelly was a top prospect (and I made no other comment about the rest). I was merely questioning whether it was enough to go on a projection which by it’s very nature is just an educated guess. You saying these prospects are “at least 2 years away” are essentially doing the same thing. You can’t have it both ways.,

  124. I think the redsox now look to move Marco Scutaro, Mike Cameron, Jonathan Papelbon to save money then use the prospects acquired and money saved to go after Jose Reyes i think redsox will keep Cameron though.

    Lowrie will be a super utility player, playing 3B, 2B and SS every other game

  125. penpaper 5 years ago

    Boston moved their top prospect, did they not?

    I was certain that qualifies to making a deal “fair”. Now I see why Boston and NYY fans are always sensitive–other fans bash their team’s every move.

  126. Guest 5 years ago

    Have to agree with you. Have no idea what the Padres are thinking. They are not getting a solid return. Shoot the Royals and Diamondbacks were asking for more for Greinke and Upton, respectively. Good for the Sox and for the first in um…ever, I can say Epstein may earn his stripes, but it ain’t done yet..so…

  127. 0bsessions 5 years ago

    Another team could easily top the picks, but how many would be willing to top that offer AND either offer Gonzalez and the kind of extension he seeks or accept him leaving at the end of the season?

  128. caseyB 5 years ago

    “…padres fans can take comfort in hoyer et al’s familiarity with kelly.”

    That’s what you said. Then you say he is at least two years away. Well, how can Padres fans take comfort with that, regardless of Hoyer’s familiarity with him? That’s the point about projections I was trying to make. It is just an educated guess. Nothing is proven. The projection could turn out to be right or totally wrong. So, in essence, trading Gonzalez for a projection (or a few of them) is not that great.

  129. woadude 5 years ago

    and Lars Anderson

  130. redsox927 5 years ago

    thats not always true, there are those with class…

  131. How are guys who hit 270 at AA and A ball and a guy with an ERA of 5 in AA top prospects?

  132. I think some Sox fans are little worried they may have not gotten a steal after all if they lose Lowrie.

  133. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    The statement that Hoyer had his scouts scour the lower levels has me intrigued. Good news for the Sox means it’s probably not Drake Britton or someone might have leaked it by now. I really wouldn’t even be able to guess.

  134. he’s not on the 40man roster – that means its not Iglesias or Lowrie – doesn’t change anything

  135. penpaper 5 years ago

    That’s because those players are signed beyond 2011. It will take a Teixeira type deal to extend Gonzalez.

  136. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    Yeah because building 2 world series winners, 2 other teams that made it to game 7 of the ALCS, 2 other teams that made it to the play offs, signing batting champ Billy Mueller for pennies, picking up a Dominican slugger who no one wanted off the waiver wire (you know him as Big Papi), trading for Schilling, continually drafting all stars (including an MVP), and continually making little moves to keep the Red Sox competitive didn’t already earn Theo his stripes.

    Can you you go ahead and directly say that even your compliments towards anything about the Red Sox will be backhanded so it can be official?

  137. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    Jays fans have been saying that for years. Not trying to start a flame war, I like the Jays farm and think AA has made some very wise long term moves. But ultimate any end result in building a baseball team needs to be seen.

  138. guest_54 5 years ago

    I love lamp . . .

  139. woadude 5 years ago

    yeah your right, it appears they want a small prospect that is in rule 5 jeopardy and if selected they will have to give another guy up, yeah real arm twister that appears to be.

  140. The stats dont always matter for prospects. Its their mechanics and the way they play that makes prospects “top-notch.”

  141. not Bard. He is the future closer.

  142. ugotrpk3113 5 years ago

    No thanks. At this point, there is no reason to trade more prospects for Upton. The best choice, at least for me, is to sign two bullpen arms and fill out the roster. Add a couple of low risk, high reward injury comebacks on 1 year minor league deals.

  143. ugotrpk3113 5 years ago

    No thanks. At this point, there is no reason to trade more prospects for Upton. The best choice, at least for me, is to sign two bullpen arms and fill out the roster. Add a couple of low risk, high reward injury comebacks on 1 year minor league deals.

  144. Uhhh no. It could be a high impact guy from the Red Sox 2010 draft class. I would think Vitek, Coyle, Cecchini, and Ranaudo wouldn’t be included, but if one of those guys was the PTBNL it would change things big time.

  145. Uhhh no. It could be a high impact guy from the Red Sox 2010 draft class. I would think Vitek, Coyle, Cecchini, and Ranaudo wouldn’t be included, but if one of those guys was the PTBNL it would change things big time.

  146. caseyB 5 years ago

    We not only disagree about the value of projectability, but also on whether or not SD fans should be happy with a trade that just includes prospects, and whether or not they should take comfort in Hoyer having worked in Boston.

    While it’s true Hoyer will know Kelly as well as anyone, it is also true that some GMs get stuck on going back to what they know best (raiding their old systems) instead of what might be best.

    All I know is if I were a SD fan, I wouldn’t be happy with a package of prospects who are all like Kelly — far away from the majors.

  147. grownice 5 years ago

    Actually with ricciardi it was more about signing quick fixes , not so much about development… AA is all about development. Jays will be on top soon enough!

  148. How are these guys top prospects? Guys with those numbers only project to weekend beer leagues

  149. Muggi 5 years ago

    1, 3, and 6 are arbitrary numbers. If the guys aren’t that good, their ranking is meaningless.

    Let’s not forget Masterson was a top-10, highly-touted Sox prospect during the Halladay fiasco…that’s turned out well.

    Also, given the extension that’s coming with the trade, the Sox are getting a heck of a lot more than one year of A-Gon. It’s the same reason the haul for Halladay was greater than some assumed; no extension, no trade.

  150. Vitek is no good anyway. Anyone could put up his numbers in the MAC

  151. jwredsox 5 years ago

    I think those guys will be safe depending on the time the deal goes through. I think you can only be traded a year after you were signed/drafted and PTBNL must be named within 6 months of the deal. the 6 month mark for the past draft I /think/ is the 7-9th of this month so they would fall just short of that cutoff.

  152. YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

    Thanks I know what date it is. WHy don’t you point that out to the guy who said Yanks fans are scared if this deal goes down? My point is that exactly. The Yanks haven’t done anything yet and even w/o doing aything were still a good year and chances are that even if Cano doesn’t have a MVP caliber year the likes of Jeter, Arod, Grandy, Tex and Posada DH’ing vs C should net a postive gain next year. Even w/ all those guys having down years the Yanks still led the #2 team in all of baseball by +41 runs scored.

  153. YanksFanSince78 5 years ago

    Thanks I know what date it is. WHy don’t you point that out to the guy who said Yanks fans are scared if this deal goes down? My point is that exactly. The Yanks haven’t done anything yet and even w/o doing aything were still a good year and chances are that even if Cano doesn’t have a MVP caliber year the likes of Jeter, Arod, Grandy, Tex and Posada DH’ing vs C should net a postive gain next year. Even w/ all those guys having down years the Yanks still led the #2 team in all of baseball by +41 runs scored.

  154. Closers are replaceable.

  155. start_wearing_purple 5 years ago

    I’m shamed by your wisdom sir.

  156. ahhh, minor league numbers are not indicative a player’s future success. Players in the minors are trying to figure all kinds of things out (ex. learning new pitches like a change-up, etc.). Geez people.

  157. YouDontKnowDude 5 years ago

    Weekend Beer League, better known as the NL West, or ML champs….you decide.

  158. sojuboi 5 years ago

    They are the Red Sox top prospects.

  159. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Sure, but why would they have for a one year rental?

  160. jwredsox 5 years ago

    Vitek is actually pretty legit. I like him more then any other hitters in the Red Sox draft class.

  161. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Right, the guy was drafted this year and he already sucks. Give him at least a full season before you throw him under the bus.

  162. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Right, the guy was drafted this year and he already sucks. Give him at least a full season before you throw him under the bus.

  163. MaineSox 5 years ago

    I would take Werth on a Drew-like contract, but nothing more.

  164. Muggi 5 years ago

    They’re eligible to be PTBNL….trading guys that currently are not eligible is the entire reason teams started the PTBNL craze.

    2010 draft guys can be on the list, they just can technically be traded until the 1yr moratorium is up.

  165. picked_u_off 5 years ago

    me likey breadsticks…me likey breadsticks!

  166. You want other numbers? Kelly had a whip of 1.6 – he can’t get AA guys out.
    Rizzo had an OBP of .330 – can’t get on against AA pitchers
    Fuentes has an OBP of .330 in A ball – I don’t care how fast he is, you can’t steal first
    And someone’s ceiling shouldn’t be projected when they can’t hit AA pitching or can’t get AA hitters out

  167. Have you seen Vitek play? I have and he struggled against the mediocre Big East team he was playing against.

  168. Shikikazu 5 years ago

    Your freaking crazy Ackley and Smoak are top 10/former top 10 prospects and Pineda is almost equal to Kelly in value. If the Red Sox get the deal done with Rizzo, Kelly, Esteban, and PTBNL then this is massive overpay

  169. MaineSox 5 years ago

    I thought the same exact thing.

  170. NomarGarciaparra 5 years ago

    They definitely will have an extension in place before completing the trade.

    But that’s something that’s confused me before…I remember reading somewhere that a club is not allowed to discuss a contract with a player if the player is still under contract with another team…can someone enlighten me here?

  171. MaineSox 5 years ago

    They can’t be trade for one calendar year after signing and have to be named within 6 months of the trade, putting them eligible to be a PTBNL in January-February depending on when they signed. It’s too early to use them as a PTBNL.

  172. MaineSox 5 years ago

    They can’t be trade for one calendar year after signing and have to be named within 6 months of the trade, putting them eligible to be a PTBNL in January-February depending on when they signed. It’s too early to use them as a PTBNL.

  173. I’m not sure how to help you. Apparently any player in the Red Sox system is a future all-star, even when they are flailing around in the minors. The Padres already have a player like Fuentes (named Luis Durango) who is fairly useless, a guy like Rizzo (named Kyle Blanks) who couldn’t even hit 200 last season, and plenty of pitching depth. I’m sure your deep scouting background has led you to believe that every “top prospect” produced by the all-knowing Red Sox brass is an all-star (cough Justin Masterson). These three players are possible decent big league starters at best, and none of them measures up to the haul Texas got from Atlanta for Teixiera, which would have been a good place to start the discussions.

  174. Baseball America ranked Kyle Blanks as the best prospect in the Padres system several years ago. Look where that got him

  175. bustersposey 5 years ago

    “learning new pitches like a change-up, etc.” would be a reason to expect a top prospect’s numbers to suffer a bit, not completely suck. minor league numbers ARE indicative of future success; esp. AA and AAA numbers. they are not the be all end all, but to disregard them completely is foolish. if casey kelly puts up a 5.5 era and 1.6 whip in AA next year with the same ‘stuff’ he’s reported to have this year his stock as a prospect will take a huge tumble and it will be based on his numbers. think of any star player in MLB and look at his minor league numbers. you’d be hard pressed to find one who didn’t put up strong AA and/or AAA numbers. great minor league numbers don’t guarantee major league success, but you won’t even get to the major’s if you can’t put up numbers in AA.

  176. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    It was a mistake because he is getting $9M this year when the Sox knew they were going to be going after Crawford or Werth.

    Werth and Crawford would be more attractive if you could remove $9M from the final contract.

    He should have got a 1 year deal.

  177. Here’s what’s important when evaluating players
    For pitchers: Can he get people out? Kelly – Nope, not at the AA level
    For hitters: Can he get on base? Fuentes and Rizzo – Nope, neither one of them can.
    I haven’t seen too many guys struggle as mightily as these three and turn it around to become MVP-caliber player. (You should check Kelly’s AFL numbers. they’re even worse, indicating regression, not progression)
    Fuentes is young enough to turn it around, but the other two have a long way to go to help the big league club.
    Trading Gonzalez was necessary, but we should have got more in return.
    None of these guys scream Neftali Feliz or Elvis Andrus to me

  178. But he won’t put up the same numbers.

  179. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Not that I know of.

  180. MaineSox 5 years ago

    Yeah, maybe I’m the only one though. Kelly is said to have the potential of a #1 and would be ready right at the right time (Dice-K leaves after 2 years), Rizzo has high potential with his bat and even being blocked at 1st could potentially be a good DH, and Fuentes could be Ells with better defense. Granted all of these guys are maybes at this point.

    Edit: It would depend on who the “one prospect” was too I suppose.

  181. The Cubs were never even real players. This was the Sox and the Sox alone in on this one. Hoyer told the media that others were involved to get the price higher. Hoyer was a part of the Sox system and knows and loves the prospects that is why it was a Sox and a Sox only thing.

  182. BWOzar 5 years ago

    As a Yankee fan I’m saying this, Casey Kelly is a significantly better prospect than any of the Cubs top prospects (Jackson, McNutt, Archer). There’s a solid case to be made that Rizzo and Fuentes are comparable to either of those three. So I have no idea why you’re so convinced they do have the pieces to make a deal unless the top piece in the trade is Castro.

  183. bustersposey 5 years ago

    not the point. but thanks for the prediction.

  184. redsox927 5 years ago

    ya but i think it’s safe to say the guys at baseball america and the guys in both the sox and padres front offices know more about scouting, player development and potential than either your or I do.

    Phil Hughes had a season where he struggled in AAA in 2008 and he turned out ok??

    Evan Longoria hit .266 for a portion of the season when he made the jump from low ball to AA.. he turned out pretty good too…

    Adam Jones (the pretty good center fielder for the O’s, you may have heard of him) had a season when he was Fuentes’s age where he hit only .267 with a .314 OBP at class single A.

    You think if all of these things happened in the same year the Padres wouldn’t take this package for one season of AGON?

    Dont get me wrong, in no way am i saying that the 3 guys the sox are giving up are going to be as good as the examples i have come up with, but don’t come on here and act like a elitist know-it-all bc of a few minor league stats for players who made significant level jumps prior to this year. It is very normal for a player going from low A to AA to struggle a bit (especially considering this is Kelly’s first season as a full time pitcher), and it’s also normal for a 19 year old kid with a ton of raw talent to struggle a bit when he makes a move up the ladder. And as for Rizzo, he lost a season or so to cancer and is now reaching his potential.

  185. Sawksfan 5 years ago

    Wow, nice stat.

  186. Sawksfan 5 years ago

    Wow, nice stat.

  187. additionally no one knows how those 4 prospects will do down the road, all 4 could be all stars.

  188. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    He is only signed for two more years I thought. If Lowrie was starting, Iglesias would be a serviceable defensive replacement.

  189. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    I don’t think Lowrie starts over Scutaro because they are pretty even and it will just cost the Sox more in arbitration going forward. If Scutaro is moved, it’s obviously a different story.

  190. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    I don’t think Lowrie starts over Scutaro because they are pretty even and it will just cost the Sox more in arbitration going forward. If Scutaro is moved, it’s obviously a different story.

  191. bustersposey 5 years ago

    hughes as a 20yo in AA= .905whip 5.7h/9 .4hr/9 2.5bb/9 10.7k/9 4.31k/bb
    kelly as a 20yo in AA= 1.61whip 11.2h/9 .9hr/9 3.3bb/9 7.7k/9 2.31k/bb.
    i love BA, i’m sure i’m not as smart as them, but as a long time subscriber to the website and mag i can think of many many players that they have vastly overhyped, and i think kelly is the latest. i think in 4 yrs sd will look back on this trade like the pirates look at the jason bay trade.

  192. Dustroia15 5 years ago

    If the Mets were willing to pay a portion of Bays salary and he would be cheaper than Werth, I wouldn’t have a problem.

    Unless he comes here and gets hit in the head witha baseball.

  193. Sawksfan 5 years ago

    Depends how extensive. From what I’ve read, it’s just a debridement, meaning just a cleanup of a small tear. It’s not his throwing shoulder thankfully. And David Altchek (NYM team Doc) is one of the best at labrum/rotator cuff repairs. The good thing is he goes to the Sox who have a couple shoulder pro’s there (Mike Reinold for one). Your buddy may have had more of a SLAP repair or working with a lesser skilled PT. You really can’t compare because every shoulder repair is different. Gonzo will be fine.

  194. stevieb3535 5 years ago

    One year of Agon is all the Pads have left to offer. An extension by the Padres BEFORE the trade certainly makes for more value and secures more/better prospects and/or MLB players. If the RS can’t make a deal on an extension, then the deal is off and SD is back at square one, that is, one more year of AGon before he hits FA. Why would Theo give more prospects if he makes a deal with AG after SD is out of the extension game?

  195. jjs91 5 years ago

    in extremely limited plate appearances

  196. jwredsox 5 years ago

    ^ This

  197. RedSoxDynasty 5 years ago

    Difference is Agonz has 1 yr left and Tex had 2 yrs remaining thus the larger haul by Texas!

  198. RedSoxDynasty 5 years ago

    Difference is Agonz has 1 yr left and Tex had 2 yrs remaining thus the larger haul by Texas!

  199. Muggi 5 years ago

    We’re saying the same thing, just different ways I think. There’s no way the Pads would sign him then immediately trade him…that just doesn’t happen in the MLB, and it wouldn’t surprise me if there would be an MLBPA grievance if someone tried that.

    What I was trying to say is the Sox aren’t buying one year of A-Gon, they’re buying an exclusive negotiating window with him. That’s added value over, say, what the Phils paid for Cliff Lee, because everyone knew Lee was gonna go FA. It’s the same reason the Phils paid close to the 1.5yr asking price for Halladay in the offseason, when he only had one yr left…they were paying for the extension, not the time left on the existing contract.

  200. redsox927 5 years ago

    That’s actually a fantastic idea if it worked out the way your thinking.

    we all know that the mets are under new leadership and that leadership, not having signed or developed any of the current players, will have less to no ties to them.

    If they are willing to dump Bay for a couple low level prospects and pay 4 or so million per year i think i would be ok with it.

    We all know Bay can handle the “pressure of Boston”. If they can get him for half or even less than half the money Werth is looking for I think it’s worth a shot in the dark.

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