As ESPN.com's Jayson Stark points out in this week's Rumblings & Grumblings, there's not much starting pitching available after Cliff Lee and Carl Pavano. Stark examines alternatives for pitching-starved teams and provides some rumors along the way. Here they are:
- Though it appeared to some baseball people as though the Angels were trying to sign Rafael Soriano before the Winter Meetings, it now appears that their search for relief pitching is secondary to their pursuit of Carl Crawford.
- Stark sees indications that the Angels are showing "very little" interest in Jayson Werth so far this offseason.
- The White Sox still say they're not shopping Carlos Quentin, but rival teams say Chicago will listen to offers.
- The Phillies don't plan on pursuing a trade for Quentin, according to Stark.
- Arthur Rhodes appears to be one of Philadelphia's top left-handed relief targets, followed by Pedro Feliciano. Neither reliever would cost the Phillies a draft pick, which is their preference.
- The Astros have quietly been shopping for an affordable outfielder who bats from the left side.
As an Angel fan this Jason Werth story is delightful.
why is that delightful? As a Phillies fan, I have watched Werth develop in quite a player, though I wonder how he’ll do without the line up around him.
Its not that he is bad. Its that he is old and has an athletic based skill set that seems prime to decline quickly. His contract has a better chance of becoming an albatross than Crawfords. So I hope his contract strangles the Red Sox or something. I am sure he is a very nice guy.
Are we missing something? Did Werth sign?
No, but I am hoping the Sox react if they lose the CC bidding by going after Werth
Crawford is almost just as old as Werth and his main skill is speed…which declines quicker than anything.
More than a 2 year difference. That is significant.
Yeah, but Crawford has been playing full time since mid-2002 on a rough turf at Tropicana Field. Werth has only been playing full time since 2008.
It definitely takes more out of your legs playing on turf for 8 years as opposed to playing on grass for 3.
The White Sox also said they weren’t shopping OZZIE, and JR finally admitted they had, so yeah, I’m certain they would take offers for CQ.
Quentin will be traded in a package next week.
Quentin to TOR for Travis Snider Josh Roenicke will be announced at the meetings.
So, another apples for oranges trade, huh? How sure are you on this?
He is on a comment board with the name ChiSox. My guess is you should bet your house deed.
Heh. Sassy. That’s the thing with KW, though, you never know what the man is up to. Anything is possible.
The Phillies would never part with Brown for Quintin, so that’s a no brainer by Stark. But I’m sure they would for Upton…
That’s an interesting idea I hadn’t thought of yet. Upton would be a fantastic fit in the Phillies lineup. They’d probably have to serve up the farm to get him, but I think they have the pieces to do it if they included Brown. His salary isn’t too bad next year I don’t think, and they have Ibanez coming off the books the following year to help balance out the payroll (Oswalt too).
I could definitely see the Phils being an interesting darkhorse team for Upton…
Other than Brown, non of Philly’s prospects are near the “major league ready” status that Ken Towers wants in return. That would be the biggest obstacle in acquiring Upton. The Cosarts and Singletons of the system are a few years away.
True, but Brown is probably one of, if not the best major league ready prospect he could get for Upton. I would think getting him, along with a couple of lower level guys to restock the farm would get talks rolling. They’re may be better packages out there from someone, but an offer including Brown, Singleton and Cosart would be hard to initially dismiss I’d think
Not that I would care a whole lot if they don’t; I’m Rangers fan. But I think it’s an interesting possibility at least. And one that I hadn’t heard mentioned yet
I’m pretty sure Towers turned a package like that down. Unless they part with Hamels it’s not happening.
No one is getting both Brown and Singleton, I don’t care for what player….and then Cosart on top of that. NO WAY! That is their top 3 prospects and all will most likely be in the top 50 at some point in 2011. Yeah, Ruben hangs up on that deal.
I think the Mets should sign Rhodes, the Reds should sign Feliciano, and the Phillies should sign Takahashi.
Lol, I like that. But, I’d rather have the mets sign Romero so that he can walk Howard and Utley every time.
This reminds me of the Uribe, Garland, and Tejada deals out West
The Mets aren’t going to sign anybody! They are going to have Alderson and company pull their players out of a hat, or should I say out of their —.
Can see the Phils going after Takahashi but why would the Mets want Rhodes over Feliciano when he’s 8 years younger and won’t cost too much more than Rhodes?
Can White Sox fans please let me know what they see as their team needs? I know some of their farm prospects but not sure how far away some are.
Urgent White Sox needs – left handed bat, 1st base, catcher. We could also use, IMHO, another starting pitcher and maybe another arm in the bullpen. I’m not counting on Peavy being healthy this year, although that would be great, and I think Sale should be developed as a closer, but looks like that isn’t happening this year. We could also use a more athletic RF than Quentin and a solid DH. Most of our needs can be addressed internally – resign AJ for 2 years and try to find another catcher during that time period, give Viciedo a shot at first, move Quentin to DH.
Strike all of that. Our most urgent need is a functioning farm system. 😀
Im not a white sox fan but they do need an upgrade at first they have a huge hole their.Possibly players for Berkman, and Dunn.Maybe even a Fielder trade. They do need an upgrade as far as pitching goes aswell.They can make a run if they acquire these players but still unlikley because you have a hard to beat tiger team who im sure are players for greinke and for decent staring pitching maybe garza amd they will also acquire an outfielder maybe Werth.They have already done a lot already.The tigers should be big competitiors and also look for the Twins aswell
I’m a big Sox fan, here’s their needs:Need #1 – First base. If a power bat, good, if left handed, better. I’ve got a notion that the Sox could pass on Konerko if they can get a younger guy for the same/less salary.Need #2 – Bullpen. Jenks will be cut loose this week, and they prefer Thornton to set up. Santos could close, but they’re looking for a RHP who can setup or close. Doubt they’d pay big bucks to Soriano, maybe Putz could come backNeed #3 – DH, or RF to move Quentin to DH. They could go with Viciedo there if needed, but they prefer an experienced younger bat who can also play a position over an aging star looking for one more contract.Need #4 – Starter insurance – Peavy probably won’t be ready for opening day and Sale (who they see as a potential ace) needs a half season in AAA. They could bring back Garcia, but want someone better and/or younger, but still around $1-2M.Need# 5 – Catcher – They have Ramon Castro and possibly Tyler Flowers (who’s not ready) but I’d think they’d being Pierzynski or Olivo back, but are waiting until the price goes down and/or until after other more pressing needs are taken care of. They could stopgap catcher and wait until next trade deadline to upgrade.Ursiform: Good luck on that farm system while Kenny Williams is the GM, but I’d rather have a GM that goes for it than someone building towards a contending team that may never arrive.
Out of curiosity, what are your thoughts on Pappelbon to the White Sox? Just a thought I’ve had, haven’t really considered it too much, but Boston wants to dump him and his numbers might get better with another team, I think the romance w/Boston is over. Of course, I’m obsessed with getting Choo for RF, so take it for what it’s worth, I’m a dreamer.
I agree with everything you’ve said here, and am fervently hoping Hahn gets the nod before he gets snatched up by another team.
Papelbon is a FA next year, and will get a huge contract. Boston won’t give him away, so we’d need to deal a few prospects.
I’d say doubtful, unless we get cash in the deal or send them a salary.
Thanks to all.
Don’t right handers bat from the left side?
Wise-guy. 😀
Not as seen by the pitcher.
Not as seen by the pitcher.
Arthur Rhodes should be on the bottom of any list of teams looking for a late inning lefty specialist, not because he’s bad, but because there should be major concerns about his health for an entire year. Takahashi and Feliciano should be the Phils’ main targets.
Here’s the way I see it, Downs-Sox, Feliciano-Yanks, Takahashi-Phills.
I would love to see Quentin packaged with Viciedo for Ellsbury.
That would take care of Bostons outfield Power problem, they can still sign Werth since Quentin can play LF as he did in 09 and 08, and Boston gets an affordable power 1B with tons of potential who hit .308 with 5 HR in 105 PA with his first trip to the Majors.
White Sox get speed, another LH bat, and upgraded D. Then they can replace Quentin’s production in a DH signing in maybe Damon or Berkman.
Here is what the White Sox should do:
Create some package with C. Quentin/B. Morel/Viciedo and shop them for a two or three starting pitcher…my target would be Jonathan Sanchez. It gives the Giants some power they’re looking for and gives them a replacement for Kung Fu (Hopefully, Tejada can play SS).
Re-sign AJ for two year deal $4,500,000 per (give Flowers/Lucy another year to develop and then see if its time to cut your losses and 1B/DH them).
Sign Adam Dunn to DH/1B (3yrs $50,000,000 – $60,000,000).
Shop Mark Buehrle — Find something or someone that would give you something to get James Loney from the Dodgers (All the Dodger fans I know hate him).
Sign a couple decent bullpen arms. Target Jesse Crain, Jon Rauch, Scott Downs, and re-sign JJ Putz.
Lineup:
LF Pierre (L)
2B Beckham (R)
CF Rios (R)
DH Dunn (L)
1B Loney (L)
SS Ramirez (R)
C Pierzynski (L)
3B Viciedo (R)
RF Low-priced FA/Danks/Mitchell/
Pitching:
Danks (L)
Jackson (R)
Sanchez (L)
Floyd (R)
Rauch (R)/Sale (L)/Garcia (R)/Leftover FA
Bullpen:
LRP/6th SP Loser of Rauch/Sale/Leftover FA
LRP/SP Pena (R)
RP Santos (R)
SU Thornton (L)
SU Downs (L)
CP Putz (R)
*And I’m not sure if its possible or not but to explore trading bad contracts for bad contracts — Linebrink/Teahen for Overbay???
this post is why you will never be a GM.
Here is what the White Sox should do:
Create some package with C. Quentin/B. Morel/Viciedo and shop them for a two or three starting pitcher…my target would be Jonathan Sanchez. It gives the Giants some power they’re looking for and gives them a replacement for Kung Fu (Hopefully, Tejada can play SS).
Re-sign AJ for two year deal $4,500,000 per (give Flowers/Lucy another year to develop and then see if its time to cut your losses and 1B/DH them).
Sign Adam Dunn to DH/1B (3yrs $50,000,000 – $60,000,000).
Shop Mark Buehrle — Find something or someone that would give you something to get James Loney from the Dodgers (All the Dodger fans I know hate him).
Sign a couple decent bullpen arms. Target Jesse Crain, Jon Rauch, Scott Downs, and re-sign JJ Putz.
Lineup:
LF Pierre (L)
2B Beckham (R)
CF Rios (R)
DH Dunn (L)
1B Loney (L)
SS Ramirez (R)
C Pierzynski (L)
3B Viciedo (R)
RF Low-priced FA/Danks/Mitchell/
Pitching:
Danks (L)
Jackson (R)
Sanchez (L)
Floyd (R)
Rauch (R)/Sale (L)/Garcia (R)/Leftover FA
Bullpen:
LRP/6th SP Loser of Rauch/Sale/Leftover FA
LRP/SP Pena (R)
RP Santos (R)
SU Thornton (L)
SU Downs (L)
CP Putz (R)
*And I’m not sure if its possible or not but to explore trading bad contracts for bad contracts — Linebrink/Teahen for Overbay???
Hey Astros the Phils have a lefty bat you can have for a low level prospect….Raul Ibanez. The Phils would make that deal in a heartbeat and then they could resign Werth.
No No my friend the astros would want Fukodome for his defence they they would have a strong Out field Defence.
It might be all about the money. If Crawford likes the Angels more he might go with them.
Angels gave a 32 year-old Torri Hunter 5/90, so to me they’d certainly go 6/100+ for a three-years-younger Carl Crawford.
In a bubble yeah Hamels probably is right now, but when you consider the contracts and Upton’s age (not that Hamels is OLD, but four years is four years), it would take Hamels+ to get Upton.
I didn’t say it did, I was commenting on your statement that Hamels is more valuable.
I agree it makes no sense. Hamels isn’t getting traded any time soon (if ever).
They couldn’t afford Hamels after 2012 anyway…the Phillies are going to have a tough time lox king him up to deal, they will have to break their own rules to get him. By that I mean they will have to offer at least 5 years and options because of his age and he is a lefty.
That’s not exactly true…they drop a ton of payroll over the next two seasons (Lidge, Ibanez, Blanton, Victorino, Oswalt). The 2012 offseason is the year they can actually SPEND if they want. They’ll have plenty of holes to fill, but if they wanted to throw $15m+ at Hamels, they could.
You’re right that they’d have to break their own 3-year rule regarding pitchers, but IMO if they’re going to do it for anybody, it’s going to be the homegrown guy.