Phillies Notes: Fire Sale, Amaro, Hamels

Earlier tonight the Phillies traded Jim Thome to the Orioles for a pair of Single-A prospects. Here's the latest from the City of Brotherly Love…

  • The Phillies are not yet ready to start a full-scale fire sale according to ESPN's Buster Olney (on Twitter). The Thome deal figures to be the first in a series of moves, however.
  • GM Ruben Amaro Jr. told reporters (including MLB.com's Todd Zolecki) that they'll get both Roy Halladay and Ryan Howard back in the coming weeks, and the duo will be "pretty big factors" in the club's trade deadline plans.
  • When asked if the team's losing would impact his upcoming free agent decision, Cole Hamels told Jim Salisbury of CSNPhilly.com that he's not thinking about it (Twitter link). The Phillies went 9-19 in June.
  • Earlier tonight we heard that the Rangers are scouting Hamels, but that the Phillies trading Shane Victorino may be more likely.


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35 Comments on "Phillies Notes: Fire Sale, Amaro, Hamels"


Blue387
3 years 2 months ago

If the Phillies are forced to call up Pat Misch from AAA, you know the season is kaput.

dylanp5030
3 years 2 months ago

Well played. Made me laugh

3 years 2 months ago

 At this point anyone is better than KK.

3 years 2 months ago

It is what it is at this point.  Amaro has committed big money to aged players for a long time.  He took the helm of a World Champion, with affordable young talent all over the place, and through managerial hubris, proceeded to clean out the farm in a mad dash to get his name on a winner.
Now we have a team with a core age in the mid-30’s, with no prospects of merit anywhere close to contributing, unless you still think Dom Brown has a chance, which I no longer do.

3 years 2 months ago

 really about the farm system, I bet you were not complaining when Halladay pitched a perfect game and no hitter in the playoffs. What about riding Lee to the world series in 09. What about Pence last year. There are only two real mistakes he made. 1. Not keeping Lee when he traded for Halladay 2. Howard’s contract. I am died hard Phillies fan but to blame him for trading for the best players available when they needed the peices is just hindsight 20/20 about the farm but this is a good ride. Plus they only have two players on contract past 2014 I believe.

3 years 2 months ago

Mike Olt and Jurkison Profar and they got a deal.

3 years 2 months ago

lol, not a chance.

MadmanTX
3 years 2 months ago

Give us Hamels and Halliday for Feldman and Lowe and you’ve got a deal.

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 2 months ago

And Jon Daniels would be out of a job.

baseball52
3 years 2 months ago

Is this for Halladay?!

3 years 2 months ago

Halladay and Victorino, and we’ll throw in Feldman

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 2 months ago

It’s a shame. If Lee, Bastardo, and Victorino/Pence have the years they had last year, we’re not even close to having this discussion right now.

This season’s been a nightmare ever since Halladay left the field in St. Louis.

frank_costanza
3 years 2 months ago

I have not been a fan of RAJ’s tenure as GM at all. If he misses this chance to really get a player like Olt (if he is available) for Hamels then he is running this team into the ground. A potential perennial All-Star third basemen for a pitcher that even if you could re-sign, would further financially handcuff you? It’s a no-brainer. 

The Phillies have no infield prospects in their system and need to filter in some youth. The pitching, on the other hand, is plentiful in their system with May, Biddle, Pettibone and Colvin (not to mention Worley, as well). 

Trading Hamels is not the end of the world, the Phillies have too much money not to remain contenders year in and year out. 

dylanp5030
3 years 2 months ago

Cesar Hernendez is a very nice. 2B prospect. I believe Mayo had him as the 5th best 2nd base prospect going into the year.

3 years 2 months ago

if only the Phils had a decent bullpen then they would at least be at the .500 mark. 

Runtime
3 years 2 months ago

AA is probably caressing the contracts of Drabek, D’Arnaud, and Gose right now.

(Yes, I am aware that Gose wasn’t part of the Halladay trade)

notsureifsrs
3 years 2 months ago

not necessarily. gose and d’arnaud are great,  but the blue jays might be a roy halladay away from the playoffs right now

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

Who would you rather have? Roy Halladay, an aging ace with a monster of a contract 20+ million, or one MLB ready top catcher prospect who’s a legit five player tool (Arnaud) and one soon to be ready top prospect (Gose), both who are under club control for 4+ years.

I’d pick the latter without any hesitation, and then I am a Doc fan too.

Toronto are building a long term contender. Phillies have been buying high and selling low for years, so to speak. Which is killing their farm system, and ultimately their franchise.

notsureifsrs
3 years 2 months ago

phillies have been winning for years now, too, so that’s a seriously incomplete picture you’re drawing. likewise, the for all the bluejays stockpiling and positioning, they haven’t contended in forever

halladay is a known commodity and the others aren’t. he’s also the most valuable commodity type in the game. i’m not saying i’d undo it in their shoes, but it seems like a mistake to suggest that AA is thrilled to death that he has them instead of halladay. he’d be the first to tell you he hasn’t won anything yet

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

Look, the comparison between AA and RAJ isn’t even funny.

AA signs Bautista to a multiyear contract worth around 11 million a year. He also somehow manages to ship off Vernon Wells. And what does RAJ do? Well, he signs an already declining Ryan Howard to a contract that’s worth more than double the Bautista deal.

You can claim all you want that Toronto aren’t going anywhere, but the fact of the matter is that they have a very healthy organisation, with a great skipper in Farrell, and has been getting steadily better the last few years.

They should be competing for that wild card this year, and are probably gonna be legit WS contenders in 1-2 years, with a little better starting pitching, that they BTW have in their farm system.

notsureifsrs
3 years 2 months ago

“the comparison between AA and RAJ”

“You can claim all you want that Toronto aren’t going anywhere”

seriously though, who are you talking to

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

I’m replying to you. You claimed that Toronto haven’t contended in forever, like that would be some indication on the future.
But history in baseball, just like the stock market, isn’t indicative of the future.

The current Toronto team, and their organisation, has a healthy blend of young and old.

When they dealt Roy Halladay a couple of years ago, they had no shot at contending, so dealing him was the right move.

Buying expensive free agents who are past 28 years old have probably more drawbacks than pros.

Better to tie up your own franchise players to long term extensions.

notsureifsrs
3 years 2 months ago

“You claimed that Toronto haven’t contended in forever”

yes

“like that would be some indication on the future”

no. this is where you made something up in your head, attributed it to me, and then argued against it as if it were my position

the rest of your latest comment is similar shadowboxing

back on topic:

it was the best choice at the time, but the blue jays didn’t want to give up halladay. they did so begrudgingly because they were not good enough for his talents to lead them to the postseason

thanks in no part whatsoever to gose, d’arnaud, and drabek, they now are good enough for his talents to lead them to the postseason

so is AA happy to have those kids? certainly. anyone would be. but travis snider (if not kyle drabek himself) can tell you how certain the future of a top prospect is. meanwhile if halladay were in toronto, they’d be at the top of the division

to repeat myself: i’m not saying i’d undo the trade or that AA would, but it’s a mistake to suggest that he’s thrilled to death that he has them right now instead of halladay

Lunchbox45
3 years 2 months ago

I have to agree with this

reality is if it were up to the Jays they’d never get rid of halladay, what team would? But he asked for a trade and would have walked at the end of the season. it is what it is unfortunately

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

I disagree. Whether Toronto is going or not going to the post season isn’t depending on if they have one guy like Roy Halladay, who’s BTW is injured and have been plagued this season with lost velocity in case you haven’t noticed.

The biggest misconception in baseball is that one ace on a staff is gonna somehow get you into the playoffs. That’s just not true.

For playoff success, the overall quality of the rotation have to be decent enough so your no 3 and 4 starters routinely gives you quality starts.

They don’t have to be 20 game winners with sub 3.00 ERA, but if you have pitchers like Colby Lewis, solid workhorses, in the back of your rotation, you will be just fine. He will be lit up from time to time. But he works through games.

3 years 2 months ago

Dubee and Manuel should be the first to go.  Then get what you can for Hamels and maybe Vic…then go from there.

dylanp5030
3 years 2 months ago

Why should Dubee go? Because Lee isn’t pitching well and he is forced to have Kendrick in the rotation instead of Halladay? I do think Manuel is the hot seat however.

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

I think you’re right.

The organisation needs a major overhaul.

Consider how the Phillies haven’t been able to develop their major league players, like eg Tampa or even Boston or New York.

Boston was the target of heavy critisism for bad bullpen, but they straightened their guys out, got the mechanics sorted out.

Rich Dubee and particularly Charlie Manuel are clueless.

RAJ is also on the hot seat, and may have to be fired unless he can present a long term plan that will get the organisation in order again.

It’s time to face it as a Phillies phan, that the priority #1 for our club right now should be to replenish the system, and any player should be put out there in order to do that.

We should even be prepared to eat some salary on a couple of players contracts if we can trade away them in return for good prospects.

Phillies should seriously consider eating a big portion of Ryan Howards contract, and offer him to a team with a rich farm system that are interested in contending the next couple of years. Like Toronto.

Phillies should offer to eat 10-12 million off Ryans contract, in return should get perhaps one of Toronto’s top 5 offensive prospects, 1 of Toronto’s top 15 offensive prospects and 2 of Toronto’s top 40 prospects. All in all 4 prospects of various pedigree.

A type of trade that IMO would be pretty fair.

Phillies need quite simply to move guys like Cliff Lee too. With Cliff Lee, you would perhaps not have to take on as much on his contract in order to get quality in return.

3 years 2 months ago

 I will sit back and enjoy the show…I called the Phillies declining before the season started, but I never dreamt of this.

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 2 months ago

I’m hoping more like the 1979 Phillies (wasn’t around to see it but I’ve heard some people making comparisons to them).

3 years 2 months ago

I wasn’t around either, I was 6 months old when they won in 1980.  My childhood memories of the Phillies were nothing but pain.  Sadly I think that is where we are heading again.

johnsilver
3 years 2 months ago

 You 2 are some of the biggest Philly fans here and never got to see the wickedly good teams of the late 70’s! Missed when they and the Bucco’s would go at it tooth and nail every year…

Those were the good days of the NL Eastern Division.. Luzinski, Schmidty, Carlton, Garber, Maddox, Bowa.. Oh man were those teams good and only Tommy Hutton do I get to enjoy now and recalls those years.. As one of the voices for the Marlins..

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 2 months ago

The Players have bailed out Charlie’s mistakes for years… this year, he’s looked awful.

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

Realistically, the Phillies aren’t winning anything this year. Or the next year.

Thus, dealing the 30 something players and trying to get at least something for them makes sense.

Look, even aged players who leave the Phillies are better off, look att Ibanez. He’s one of the better players on the Yankees now, shows no sign of aging.

burnboll
3 years 2 months ago

Your GM is one of the best in the majors. Look at what the Cards have been pulling off the last few years, and it just blows your mind.

They got Lance Berkman when his value was way down after that horrible stint with the Yankees and totally revamped him into an all star player again.

And now they’re doing it again with Carlos Beltran, who was horrible with both Mets and the Giants. Still Cards knew he had game, and brought him in and made him good, great again.

Also the way the own players are being brought up is great, David Freese is maximising his potential.

I also love how the Cards weren’t afraid to let Pujols leave, realizing that his best production is behind him, and that he is in a slight decline.

Colby Rasmus was allowed to leave too, a great prospect that didn’t fit into the organisation, and needed a change of scenery. Good move.

You just gotta love how the Cards work