In his latest notes column, FanRag’s Jon Heyman reports that while teams such as the Astros, Pirates, Rangers and Yankees were all linked to Jose Quintana in trade rumors this offseason, the best offer the White Sox received came from an unnamed club that is currently perceived as more of a rebuilding team. That could mean any number of teams — the Braves, Phillies, Twins, Reds, Brewers and Padres are all in the midst of retooling their organizations — and further context is seemingly unknown at this time. A trade of Quintana, at this point, seems far likelier to occur this summer than during the final days of Spring Training, though Heyman’s note is a reminder that Quintana would appeal to virtually any club in baseball. With four years and $36.85MM remaining on his contract, Quintana’s affordable level of excellence can help clubs looking to win now or those looking to contend more in 2018-19.
A few more highlights…
- The Braves have made “multiple” attempts to sign free-agent outfielder Angel Pagan, but the veteran has been holding out for a big league deal worth around $5MM. Heyman notes that Pagan has received some guaranteed offers, but they’ve come with very low base salaries. Atlanta has also been tied to another reunion with infielder Kelly Johnson, but Heyman notes that Johnson, too, is seeking a Major League contract.
- Zack Cozart is still available in trade talks, but the Reds haven’t gotten much in the way of appealing offers due to the fact that few clubs are looking for a shortstop right now. The Padres have talked to Cincinnati about Cozart, but Heyman notes that they’re not keen on giving up top-tier talent for a player with only one year of club control remaining before free agency. Heyman notes that San Diego is still on the lookout for a shortstop upgrade.
- The Rangers would want a Major League ready starting pitcher in any trade involving Jurickson Profar, Heyman notes. The Padres like Profar but wouldn’t be willing to surrender right-hander Luis Perdomo in order to obtain him, he adds. That may raise an eyebrow for some fans, but I’d point out that Perdomo has five years of control remaining (to Profar’s three) and posted a 4.47 ERA with 6.0 K/9, 2.2 BB/9 and a 61.4 percent ground-ball rate across his final 110 2/3 innings in 2016 after a dismal start in the bullpen. In that time, he posted a 3.84 xFIP and 3.88 SIERA. Profar hit .239/.321/.338 in 307 plate appearances last season.
- Right-hander Jered Weaver tells Heyman that he considered retirement this offseason following a career-worst year in 2016. However, Weaver began to feel stronger after a month of rest, ultimately landing with the Padres on a one-year, $3MM deal. Weaver says that he’s “10 steps above last year” in terms of how he feels physically at this point.
- The Indians made an offer to Jose Bautista that was for roughly the same $18.5MM guarantee he received with the Blue Jays, Heyman reports, and they weren’t entirely closed off to a multi-year deal. However, Bautista’s preference was to head back to Toronto.
- The Pirates sought right-hander Derek Law (among other pieces) in trade talks centering around Mark Melancon with the Giants at last year’s trade deadline, per Heyman. It seems that the Pirates were focused on adding an MLB-ready replacement arm for the bullpen in Melancon talks, which they received in the form of left-hander Felipe Rivero. San Francisco, of course, signed Melancon to a four-year deal this winter.
An interesting point concerning Jose Quintana is that manager Rick Renteria has still not officially named him as the White Sox opening day starter, stating just yesterday that it may still be a week or so before he makes his choice public. It’s a no-brainer that “Q” will be on the mound opening day barring a trade. One has to wonder if there are serious trade talks taking place right now with some club that is delaying such an obvious decision.
Reasonable point, but nowadays coaches often care less about starting the best pitcher on OD
Few teams in MLB have as remarkable a discrepancy between their #1 pitcher and the remainder of their rotation as the White Sox. Jose Quintana is clearly #1 after the trade of Chris Sale. The White Sox next best pitcher would be Carlos Rodon who has yet to throw a single inning of Cactus League ball as I post, just 18 days away from opening day. The remaining veteran starters all lag significantly behind “Q”, namely Derek Holland, Miguel Gonzalez and James Shields.
True, but just because he’s the logical choice for #1 on the sox, doesn’t mean that any other team would look at him the same say.
He’s durable, consistent, but has not established himself as the #1 in the Sox rotation as yet based on performance although he’s certainly the heir apparent.
You never know, somebody else can step forward as a surprise.
I think that you could easily argue there’s only 1 person in the league that would’ve clearly established themselves as the #1 in the Sox rotation based on performance the past 5 or so years… There aren’t many pitchers that would’ve jumped Chris Sale…
rocky7: Your reply is irrelevant in regards to my original comment or it’s followup. It’s solely based on Jose Quintana being the opening day pitcher for the White Sox this season.
Q would be the number 1 starter on more than just the White Sox. You can’t fault him for being the number 2 on a team fronted by Sale. He would be a clear number 1 quite of few teams.
I highly doubt Cleveland offered up that kind of money for Bautista. After EE signed they had no payroll flexibility to sign him nor the need.
It doesn’t say it was after EE signed.
Good point.
True, but go back and read the links here and it was definitely after EE when the Indians went after Bautista to re-unite the two.
You may be right. I never saw that.
Six better not trade Q to Minny!!!
I doubt it was Minnesota. They don’t have the pieces in the minor leagues to pull off a deal. They’d have to include at least 1 player like Buxton or Berrios, which would seem counterproductive in a trade for Quintana.
Not too mention that the White Sox and Twins are divisional foes who are each currently in a rebuild mode, albeit at different stages. The White Sox would like to be competitive by 2019 and Jose Quintana would still have two years of team control remaining if he was dealt to Minnesota.
No on Cozart and Profar. Any shortstop the Padres trade for has to come with at least 4 years of control.
Ok Branch Rickey
I missed the part where AJ Prellar ran things by common sense or logic. He’ll trade for who he wants when he wants it, with no short or long term concerns. The more moves he makes the happier his supporters are, without any regard for how good or bad said deals are.
I would say he is clearly in the long term concerns road at this point as evidenced by the international signings , our cheap pitching staff, rule 5 draft and young MLB team.
It seems foolish to trade Quintana now.The White Sox are a legitimate dark horse contender for the division.Why tank the team now? They probably could get a better deal closer to the trading deadline,if they they are out of contention by then.
There is no chance the White Sox beat out Cleveland for the central. The Tigers, Twins, and Royals are all significantly better than the Sox as well.
You are correct in claiming the White Sox have no chance in beating out the Indians for the A.L. Central Division title.
You are right to state that the Tigers and Royals are “significantly” better than the White Sox.
Your claim that the Twins are also “significantly” better is ludicrous, especially comparing their likely opening day rosters. However, come the trade deadline, that could also change “significantly”. lol
Agreed. Not sure how the Twins fit in with the rest of the teams that are “significantly better.” They’ll be fighting with the Sox for last place.
The Twins are better than their record last year, .500 isn’t far fetched for them with that roster. They’re more likely to battle for third than last.
I mean, they lost 9 more games than the second worst team(s) in baseball. They won a whopping 59. I think it’d be nearly impossible to not be “better” than that…
Their pitching is pretty bad (starters and bullpen), and they only have a few guys that are good hitters. Maybe Buxton and Berrios can start turning into what they’re hoping for, but outside of that, I don’t see any significant improvements over last year. Hector Santiago doesn’t make THAT big of a difference… They’re going to need a TON to go right for them if they want to reach .500.
Their pitching was riddled with injuries last year and the addition of Castro behind the dish is also a vast improved in terms of game calling. The team that lost those 59 games last year also won 81 the year before, and they’ve upgraded on the field and ousted an antiquated front office who insisted on tinkering around with prospects mechanics that didnt mesh with their developmental strategy in the minors. Outside of Cleveland no one else in that division improved themselves for the immediate future more than the Twins and with Kansas City probably looking at selling off assets this summer, and Detroit not far behind them, Minnesota winning 75-80 games is far more likely than them competing with Chicago for last place.
Their pitching may have been riddled with injuries last year, but it’s not like they’re a very talented bunch to begin with… Assuming Berrios doesn’t make a MASSIVE leap, their best pitcher is Ervin Santana. That’s not good… At best, they’re a middle of the road team in regards to starting pitching. Their relievers are bad.
I’m also not seeing where they made big improvements in the field… Castro may be better in terms of game calling, but he’s also a pretty garbage offensive player (not that Suzuki wasn’t). Mauer isn’t getting any younger. Dozier had BY FAR the best year of his career last year. He’s going to be hard pressed to improve on that (or even repeat it). Polanco is at least interesting at SS if he starts, although he’s far from someone they can count on. Sano can rip the cover off the ball when he makes contact, which isn’t frequently. Grossman was a solid hitter last year, but can he repeat that? The OF is pretty bad, assuming Buxton doesn’t make a massive leap (I’m hoping he does – I like watching him).
And all those comments are just about their offense. If you want to factor in defense, it only gets worse. The only player I’d actually be happy about having on my defense is Buxton.
The funny part is that 2015 seems like a massive outlier. They won 70 the year before and were in the low-to-mid 60’s the 3 years before that. Somehow they won 83 despite having a negative run differential in 2015, and the only teams in the AL that had lower overall bWAR than them in 2015 were the Tigers and White Sox. Doesn’t seem very sustainable, at least not to me.
I stand by my statement that they need a TON to go right to reach .500 next year.
Dozier did not have the BY FAR had the best year of his career last year, I’m in no way on the “Dozier is amazing train” but he’s a very good 2B. You’re also adding by subtracting on offense, full seasons of Keplar, Grossman, Vargas, Grossman, Polanco, and Sano full entrenched at a position thats right for him are all upgrades. Defensively Sano, Castro, Escobar, Santana, Rosario Mauer, & Dozier are all average or better on defense. I’ll take a defense full of guys that can make all the routine plays all day every day.
A starting 5 of Santana, Santiago, Gibson, a healthy Hughes, and Berrios is nothing to scoff at and their bullpen will have a returning Perkins, Kintzler, Pressey, Belise, and has plenty of depth, which is what you want with the volatile nature of a bullpen.
No. The White Sox are not “a legitimate dark horse contender for the division”.
Yes. “They probably could get a better deal closer to the trading deadline”.
The Sox aren’t a “dark horse contender” for anything. There’s no depth in the starting rotation, not enough offensive power, and one of the worst outfields in the majors with Garcia leading the way towards ineptitude in RF.
No depth in the White Sox starting rotation? It can be argued that the elite prospects that will occupy the top 3 spots to begin the season at AAA Charlotte, Lucas Giolito, Reynaldo Lopez and Carson Fulmer are the equal or better than the veterans who will comprise the bottom of the White Sox rotation in the early going of 2017, namely Derek Holland, Miguel Gonzalez and James Shields.
That being said, it’s hard to argue with your other points. The White Sox won’t likely contend for anything but a higher selection in the 2018 Rule 4 June Draft.
Elite prospects, huh?
All three are currently in MLB.com’s top-100 prospect ratings with Giolito #11, Lopez #46 and Fulmer #71, so yes. They have similar rankings with Baseball America and Baseball Prospectus as well.
Top 100 doesn’t mean elite. Giolito is really the only one that fits that mold. All of them lost a good amount of the prospect shine last year, especially Fulmer.
At the same time there is often a team that has everything break right and a few breakout/fluke seasons from a few players that also get hot at the right time. Next thing you know the Royals are world champions.
jakem59: Semantics.
Btw-Reynaldo Lopez hardly lost any “shine” last year. He had the best, albeit brief, MLB debut of the three and actually moved up in the latest prospect rankings.
It is not “Semantics”, that’s like saying someone like Khris Davis is elite because he’s one of the best 100 players in the league. It’s just incorrect.
Lopez shot up the boards after a great start to the season, with projections of him becoming a top 10-15 prospect. They were arguing wether he or Giolito was the better prospect. Instead he hit a wall when called up and the story turned from TOR type potential to a 3-4 guy who might be better suited for the bullpen. That’s loosing a shine.
Dark horse? That horse is jet black on a cloudy night with no moon and with octopus ink all over it. Oh, and dead. I’m a huge White Sox fan, but this season is over for them before it begins. I believe in the rebuild, though, so I’m good with that.
Sox
John Heyman’s article also brings up White Sox closer David Robertson’s name and his link to the Washington Nationals in trade discussions. His report seems to downplay previous speculation that a deal between the two clubs was ever imminent this offseason, even offering that some Nationals representatives suggested “the White Sox didn’t seem all that interested in trading Robertson” and that “ChiSox people don’t think the Nats have been very aggressive on this front”. Heyman opined “that’s silly”, suggesting that “it would be best if the two teams worked something out.”
Have to agree with Heyman here. It sounds to me like a load of crap coming from both clubs, each of whom seem to be using the media to their advantage in on-going trade discussions.
The Nats are just gun shy after the Eaton trade. For a club so heavily invested in high-end players, they seem to have a small-market mentality when it comes to prospects.
They’re a dominant closer away from a WS appearance, and they’re complaining about giving up a solid prospect for Robertson.
I say screw it, hold on to Robertson until the trade deadline. Someone will give the Sox a reasonable offer by then.
A dominant closer guarantees they’ll beat the Dodgers and/or Cubs?
It certainly helps!
Nothing is “guaranteed” for any MLB team no matter how good they seem to be in spring training or on paper.
Except for the last couple months of last season, after they acquired Mark Melancon just ahead of the non-waiver trade deadline, the lack of a reliably “dominant” closer has been one of the Nationals Achilles’ heels the past few seasons. Before Melancon, the Nats had three different primary closers since the beginning of 2014, Rafael Soriano, Drew Storen and Jonathan Papelbon, none of whom fit the label as “dominant”. Not that David Robertson would necessarily fit that definition either. lol
Of course they are gun shy after getting eaton they made their big move. And while Robertson is solid at closer he doesnt move the needle enough imo to make a deal.
If the Nats “have a small-market mentality when it comes to prospects” what prompted them to make the Adam Eaton trade in the first place?
As I recall, reports suggested that the Nationals were also trying to include David Robertson in that original Eaton trade and it was the White Sox who said nay to that at the time.
I still maintain that a deal for Robertson this past offseason was closer than what Heyman is now reporting, at least according to remarks made to him by “some” people associated with each club. There were just too many other reports out their contradicting this latest assertion.
GM Rick Hahn himself stated publicly that two trades involving two separate White Sox players this offseason were agreed upon by him and his front office counterpart and that they were rejected at the ownership level by the other clubs. Jose Quintana and David Robertson were the two names most frequently mentioned as White Sox trade pieces after the deals for Chris Sale and Eaton at the winter meeting in early December. Todd Frazier was the only other name even offered as a possibility but his market as a third baseman was limited to a scarce number of contenders in need of one, especially once FA Justin Turner re-signed with the Dodgers.
I do agree that the White Sox will probably do better holding on to both Robertson and Quintana until the summer trade deadline approaches. Of course, potential suitors also realize this so it’s not unreasonable to think that a trade can’t come together before opening day that might also satisfy the White Sox lofty demands, particularly regarding “Q”… and especially by teams needing to get off to a fast start in 2017.
I agree with one exception: what is lofty about the Sox trade demands? And what trades are you referencing to justify your assertion? Frankly, guys like Q and Sale don’t get traded very often (if ever).
I don’t think it will happen, but I’d like to see the Dbacks sign Pagan to a low guarantee with incentives.
OK,maybe the White Sox aren’t better than Cleveland,but I think they will be in contention for a wild card playoff spot longer than most people think.Almost every year some lightly regarded team makes the playoffs.The WS are as good of a sleeper pick in the AL as anyone else.
“… the best offer the White Sox received came from an unnamed club that is currently perceived as more of a rebuilding team. That could mean any number of teams — the Braves,”
Let me stop you right there. It was the Braves.
Rumor was the Braves offered Albies, Newcomb, Riley and Lottery arm.
IF true, it’s Interesting that the Sox would see that as the best offer. The Yankees were rumored to have offered Frazier, Mateo, Tate + and the Pirates offered Glasnow, Newman, Keller and Diaz. Again, none of this 100% verified..
No way the Braves give up three prospects for JQ. But I could see Matt Wisler or Mike Foltynewicz for Jurickson Profar. Or both plus Austin Riley for Profar and Joey Gallo.
C’mon bruh. You just gotta bring Profar and Gallo into a rumor like it’s 2015. Let them drift into obscurity in peace.
lol don’t trade prospects for a top 15 pitcher …….. But trade one of your best looking young arms for Profar …………
I thought (and think) ATL would be the front-runner, but was thrown off by Coppy’s Dec comments: “It comes down to needs and wants,” Braves general manager John Coppolella said. “We don’t have needs in starting pitching. Do we want a No. 1 starter, is Chris Sale a No. 1 starter? Yes. Do we want Jose Quintana? I don’t think Jose Quintana is Chris Sale. Is he an extra year of control (under contract four more years instead of Sale’s three)? Yes. Who’s to say one of our young kids can’t turn into Jose Quintana? Or Chris Sale.”
This is Coppy give the good ole spin.
Seems like a pretty nice deal that gives them quantity and quality, though Newcomb is a wild-card still. A good spring training from him would go far for his trade value.
No way the Yanks offered that for one pitcher when they are much more then one pitcher away! Silly!
Depends on if they think they can get an equal return on Tanaka. Mateo and Tate aren’t exactly stud prospects (Tate’s fastball disappeared and Mateo is a prospect seemingly no one agrees on and was suspended for insobordination last year), and if they think they can get another Frazier-type prospect back in return for Tanaka at the deadline, it would make some sense. Than again, the Chapman move didnt make much sense either for similar reasons.
Maybe they saw all the comments that Braves fans on this site made in every article about a Chris Sale trade.
Agreed. I thought Braves before reading any teams listed.
I agree but I also believe that discrepancy occurs with Tanaka and the Yankees. I have a bad feeling about their rotation. Pinieda looked pretty impressive yesterday, though.
Effin’ Quintana. That creep can throw, man. Not much news if they keep trotting out Quintana non-stories. Revisit this at the deadline. Yawn.
“San Diego is still on the lookout for a shortstop upgrade.”
Hasn’t this been this case for the past decade?
Sure seems that way.
Have to agree that Perdomo is too much to give for perpetually injured Profar.
Not perpetually injured–he is recovered from a major injury, not a series of injuries.
Hate to nitpick. It was two separate injuries to the same shoulder. One he played through most of spring ball in 2014 before getting an MRI in March and was supposed to be out 10-12 weeks. Then in May he reinjured it. Hurt his finger in the WBC, but that doesn’t seem bad.
It’s impressive Perdomo is considered too much. Padres basically turned him from trash to treasure.
I think it says a heck of a lot more about Profar’s value… Calling Perdomo a “treasure” is a HUGE stretch…
Currently, neither Profar or Gallo have much trade value. Until they actually perform, Profar is just a light hitting utility player, and Gallo is a K waiting to happen. Texas can value them as they see fit, but obviously, as they are still there, no other team agrees with their asking price. If the Rangers aren’t willing to play either of them full time, why would any other team trade them a starting pitcher?
Braves want a fourth outfielder, who can hit RH with versatility. Profar fits that bill and is probably worth a AAA starting pitcher.
Totally. All 18 games he has played in the OF throughout his career (majors and minors combined – all in LF) would make him a great addition for the Braves as a fourth outfielder.
If the Padres or other teams don’t see Profar’s value, nobody has to deal for him then, right?
They do see Profar’s value. It’s just nowhere near as high as Texas thinks it is… unless they mean a backend #4 or #5 when they say they want a major league ready starter. Then they’d be a lot closer in value.
How about trade Jose Quintana to the cubs for Happ, Underwood, Candelario and Alberto and give cubs Nate Jones in the deal
Not even close, especially with Nate Jones added. That’s less than they’ve been asking other clubs for on Quintana alone. If Quintana ends up going to the Cubs, which I don’t see happening, it’ll be because they REALLY want him and are willing to overpay – Jerry would never approve otherwise. Start with Eloy and Cease, and then add in at least one more high end position player (like Happ) plus another arm.
And before anyone says it, I’m not arguing that it’d be fair value for a deal like that to happen (unless you want to add Nate Jones, then I don’t think the value is that far off, if at all). That’s just the kind of deal I’d imagine it having to be for a trade to get done, assuming the Cubs don’t want to subtract from the major league roster (someone like Contreras/Schwarber/Baez). No way Jerry would approve a deal with the Cubs without feeling like it was a clear win/overpay.
Well said, although I believe that Jerry Reinsdorf would not stand in the way of such a deal if Rick Hahn was amenable to it. The “Chairman” is probably the most knowledgeable owner in MLB when it comes knowing the game and it’s players.
Having finally convinced JR and Executive VP Kenny Williams into the full rebuild, GM Hahn will be orchestrating the White Sox new direction. The only thing Reinsdorf will have to sign off on are financial matters such as eating salaries in deals that might involve other veteran players like David Robertson and James Shields, certainly not Jose Quintana.
Hahn has already gone on record as saying that the White Sox are open for business with any club including division rivals and the crosstown Cubs. If Hahn’s best offer comes from the North Side, the deal will be made and with Reinsdorf’s blessing.
Q to the brewers. bring corey ray home.
Along with….?
Lewis Brinson
it’s gotta fall between the eaton and sale returns. so let’s go ray, Hader, erceg, and a lottery ticket
My first thought was the Braves. Any deal would have to start with Albies. After that it’s tough. The Braves prospects are all so young.
I still say the the Astros and Pirates make the most sense right now with the Yankees and Braves coming in after that.
I tell you what though, a 2B/SS/3B of Albies, Anderson, Moncada is awesome to think about. With Abreu at 1B. But still need some OF.
That’s hilarious! Got love the Sox! Spoken like a true White Sox fan.