March 27: Syndergaard underwent surgery yesterday at the Hospital for Special Surgery in West Palm Beach, Fla., tweets Anthony DiComo of MLB.com.
March 24, 2:58pm: The Mets have formally announced that Syndergaard will undergo Tommy John surgery on Thursday. He’ll be out until at least April of 2021. General manager Brodie Van Wagenen offered the following statement, via press release:
After experiencing discomfort in his elbow before Spring Training was suspended due to the pandemic, Noah and our health and performance department have been in constant contact. Based on the persistence of his symptoms, Noah underwent a physical examination and MRI that revealed the ligament tear. A second opinion from Dr. Neal ElAttrache confirmed the diagnosis and the recommendation for surgery. Noah is an incredibly hard worker and a tremendous talent. While this is unfortunate, we have no doubt that Noah will be able to return to full strength and continue to be an integral part of our Championship pursuits in the future.
2:41pm: Mets right-hander Noah Syndergaard has been diagnosed with a torn ulnar collateral ligament in his right elbow and is expected to undergo Tommy John surgery, ESPN’s Jeff Passan reports (via Twitter). It’s a rather stunning and out-of-the-blue development, as Syndergaard looked relatively sharp in Spring Training — three runs on five hits and no walks with 11 strikeouts in eight innings — and wasn’t known to be experiencing any notable discomfort.
The Syndergaard news is a devastating blow to a Mets rotation that looked to have the makings of a quality group. Jacob deGrom, of course, has won the past two National League Cy Young Awards and will return to front the staff, but Syndergaard had been slotted into the second spot in the rotation behind him. His injury makes last summer’s acquisition of Marcus Stroman all the more important but also serves to highlight the team’s inability to work out an extension with righty Zack Wheeler despite multiple attempts over the past couple of seasons. Wheeler signed a fjve-year deal with the division-rival Phillies this winter, though an extension prior to reaching the open market likely wouldn’t have proved as costly — particularly were it agreed upon prior to the 2019 campaign.
Beyond the combination of deGrom and Stroman, the Mets will turn to Steven Matz and rebound candidates Rick Porcello and Michael Wacha — both signed to one-year deals in the offseason. Porcello remained a durable workhorse for the Red Sox but was tattooed for a 5.52 ERA and better than 10 hits per nine innings in his 32 starts and 174 1/3 innings last year. Wacha, meanwhile, battled injuries for the third time in four seasons, spending time on the IL due to a knee problem and finishing out the year on the sideline due to shoulder troubles. Since emerging as a full-time member of the Cardinals’ rotation in 2014, Wacha averaged 24 starts and 134 innings per season.
The injury to Syndergaard will put to test general manager Brodie Van Wagenen’s offseason comments about having “probably the deepest rotation in baseball.” After all, if any of deGrom, Stroman, Matz, Porcello or Wacha struggles or lands on the injured list, the Mets’ slate of alternatives in the upper minors looks decidedly pedestrian. Walker Lockett, Stephen Gonsalves, Franklyn Kilome and Corey Oswalt — the latter three of whom were already optioned out of Major League camp — are the top names on the 40-man roster. Veteran righty Erasmo Ramirez was trying to win a job in camp on a non-roster deal after enduring a pair of miserable seasons.
With Syndergaard out for all of the 2020 season — assuming there is one — the Mets will be left with only one year of club control remaining over the powerhouse righty. Syndergaard is owed a $9.7MM salary after avoiding arbitration this winter, and he’ll surely command the exact same salary for the 2021 campaign; virtually all arbitration-eligible players who miss an entire season due to injury are brought back at the same rate they’d earned the previous season (with the exception of first-time eligible players). And given the timing of the surgery, Syndergaard can reasonably expect to pitch the bulk of next season, so there’s almost no chance he’ll be non-tendered, barring some notable setback(s) prior to December. Syndergaard is slated to become a free agent upon conclusion of the 2021 season.
This is really bad for the Mets. Get well soon Syndergaard.
Why is it bad? There isn’t going to be a 2020 season. He will be back for 2021.
On a typical 15-18 month time line for pitchers, that puts him at July-not at all next year. He’s realistically probably looking at Sept 2021 when rosters go to 28.
The estimate of April 2021 written in the article is a complete fantasy.
Thank you, Cosmo Kramer.
I’m a collegiate pitcher. Had TJ June 20 2019. Pitched in games in the beginning of February 2020. Not all players progress the same, tough to say when he will be back.
College pitchers also get abused and run down to extreme levels because they are short term assets that aren’t of any value to th establishment at a certain age.
There will be no rushing Noah.
The college pitcher overused thing is a tired mantra. It just really only happens when you get to tourney time, and MLB pitchers occasionally get the same treatment … or ask for it.
There is absolutely a timeline for Noah. For one, he is a free agent after 2021, and if you think he will not want to come back before then, both for his team to make a decision and for his potential first big contract .. you are not thinking realistically. From a realistic standpoint, about the only scenario where they would not rush him is if he were under control for many more years and the teams plans would not be otherwise impacted. For instance, if he had just signed a 8 year deal and the team was looking at 2022 before truly competing .. then sure, no rush, but that situation is rare as teams two years away typically aren’t bringing in big free agents.
I am not saying they will burn his arm up trying to get him back, but they will have no reason to ‘slow’ down the recovery timeline. It stands to reason they would actually try to accelerate it, both the player and the club.
There will be a 2020 season that he will miss even if it is a shorter season. Further he will not be back for the 2021 season. He may get back for half the 2021 season but even then how good will he be right away?
All spells bad news for the Mets
Even if it is a shorter season?!?! There’s a slim chance there will be a season. This is a global pandemic. The mlb won’t consider starting a season until all mlb cities are completely clear.
Yea even if it is a shorter season
Really?? Who appointed you the new commissioner? There will be a season….just maybe an abbreviated one.
You should change your name to strike five- cuz there will be a shortened 2020 season. Money talks. The popularity of the sport is declining so much MLB is ‘turning the game upside down and looking for new ideas to fall out!’ MLB badly needs the revenue
The popularity of the sport doesn’t outweigh anyone’s safety.
If 1 million Americans have it and it’s September can you guarantee a shirt season?
He was not guaranteeing anything. He was just stating his opinion which obviously you do not agree with.
Strike Four, I’m not so sure about that. This virus could very well be contained by June. I know that owners and the Players Union will have the service time issue to sort out, but odds are, they’ll get it sorted out. Otherwise nobody makes any money.
He’ll be bak in mid 2021 approx. 18 months on ave. you don’t rush a pitcher like Noah who has a nasty fast ball.
There’s no good time for Tommy John surgery. However—because of the shut down— it’s better to have it now instead later.
The best time for TJ surgery is October, then you only miss one season, and you should be ready for ST.
With the entire season in jeopardy of being lost it’s hard to argue this isn’t the best time.
The best time for TJ surgery is to do it when you need it.
Who cares
Obviously you don’t care so why are you here?
Why does everyone think hes only out one year and magicaly hell be bck like nothing happened has anyone forgoten matt Harvy he went from one of the best pitchers in baseball to a joke in a blink of an eye. Not to mention this guy has never been healthy he cpuld be done for good.
Just what the Mets need. Seems like it came out of no where
Just because ST was canceled didn’t mean players stopped throwing and hitting.
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Ouch
Oh No-ah
Take the arm guards off the hitters. Make them back off the plate. Average pitches per batter will drop, innings pitched for starters will rise, TJ surgeries will see a sharp decline, average fastball will also drop slightly, and the average game length will decrease. Keep the padding on the arms and the TJS will continue to rise rapidly. This is ridiculous.
That’s an impressive amount of incorrectly drawn conclusions
It’s clearly anecdotal, but there is definitely something to banning body armor and seeing the inside and outside of the plate open up a bit more for the pitchers. If there is a reduction it will likely be shorter ABs which should reduce pitch count.
Sorry batters. We are “banning” items clearly engineered to prevent you becoming terribly injured by a deadly projectile. Sorry, but the pitchers don’t want to learn control or to adapt to a changing game. Hand in your “armor” [lol] and stock up on pain pills.
Stop crowding the plate. Answer solved. Watch games from the 80’s. See how hitters protected themselves.
Outside of the snarky “learn control” comment, please remember that the occasional HBP is the result of one that got away.
Bang a Gong. Awesome. How many people know it?
What does hitters having elbow pads have to do with pitchers getting injured
Yes, I would like to know that too.
Yoyo – batters crowd the plate and prolong at bats. Pitchers are forced to get an extra bit of zip on the fastball. Also tend to throw the power curve/slider rather than the get-me-over breaking ball to buckle the batter. You see hitters buckle on breaking pitches less and less. Without the padding you keep the hitter honest. The pitcher will benefit. If there wasn’t a benefit to the hitter you’d never see them wear one.
Yoyo – nevermind this cretin and his gutter level moron takes.
Ah yes, the major benefit of a batter of not taking a 96 MPH fastball off the joint.
No elbow guards aren’t going to stop guys who throw 95+ MPH regularly stop doing it. They’re still going to try and blow it by batters whether or not the elbow guard is on.
Pitchers gaining velocity has nothing to do with where the hitter stands. It is because a 96 mph fastball is harder to hit that a 95 mph fastball is harder than a 94 mph fastball and so on.
Using less pitches to get batters out in the process. Isn’t that why pitch counts are closely monitored? Going into the 7th inning at 85 pitches on-average instead of 95-100? The foul balls hit by batters with zero fear of crowding that plate thanks to the arm protection? The plate covered now compared to 30 years ago is evident just by going on YouTube.
Nebraska – a lot of pitchers throwing 96 get tattooed these days. Some don’t. Yes, many feel the hardest pitch to hit is a ball that is fast. The arm guard really benefits the hitters on the curve/slider when a righty hitter faces a RHP and vice versa.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/batters-are-getting-plunked-at-historic-rates-but-why/
More pitches are being thrown inside than ever before. That might have something to do with more hitters being plunked. Inside sliders and curveballs don’t typically have a lot of horizontal movement towards the hitter.
First off, this whole take is misleading. They did studies a few years back that stated pitchers careers are lasting longer than ever in current baseball. It’s insane how the spin keeps getting twisted back to ‘another pitcher has his arm fall off’ due to this that or the other. The study previously done talked about taking the top four starters for every team each year and finding the length of their careers as a viable starter. It was shocking how short most careers were in the early to middle part of the last century. So let’s keep that in mind. And yes, many of those pitchers would have had much longer careers with the advent of TJ surgery, but since not everyone comes back well from it, that was not factored in. I think they did reference some other study about number of TJ surgeries per starts on a year by year basis and found it was increasing. That study mentioned that the slight uptick was simply because it was the quickest and most reliable way to come back and pitch again without further trouble.
Now, as to why so many power pitchers seem to get hurt each year. This problem is not about arm guards, but about players just getting stronger in general. They are physically stronger and can still get power and distance on hits without swinging the monstrous bats of the 40’s-60’s. Pitchers used to get those big hitting guys out by pitching to induce weaker contact. Today’s pitchers are just not as good at it for one, but for another, when you can generate the same exit velocity with a smaller bat that helps to allow for a longer delay in decision making .. it means velocity has to go up to compensate.
Pitchers are getting stronger as well, but quite simply, the muscles and joints they have to increase to do this simply cannot take as much. At some point, if they want to save arms from this ‘human nature’ they may have to raise the mound again, or possibly change field dimensions or tell the umps to actually call the ENTIRE STRIKE ZONE. Meaning mid-chest/armpits to bottom of knee caps, black to black. Not mid-thigh to belt, dead center of plate. Side problem .. changes to help pitching will likely result in diminished offensive output .. and sadly, most current fans are bored senseless by non-playoff pitching duels.
Who cares
Is it possible that careers were shortened in the early part of the 20th Century due to lack of pay? Is it possible many players just walked away to earn better money elsewhere? Alternatively, if baseball pay was comparable to pay elsewhere, might some players opt out of baseball to get married and start a family instead? I don’t know enough about salaries back then to know. Just asking.
stop writing a novel keep it short and to the point
I was thinking the same thing
Yes, it’s all th fault of the elbow guards.
An elbow guard killed my fourth cousin. I will have my vengeance.
It’s the helmet, really. They should go back to standard caps. No pitchers will ever get hurt again.
nymetsking don’t forget cups and jock straps.
let’s play it safe. No clothes. Completely nude. Can’t be too careful.
None of that has anything to do with tommy John precursers.
It goes all the way back to when these guys were kids. When their coaches were teaching them how to throw a curveball at the age of 13. When their high school coaches wanted wins so bad they would throw the same pitcher for 2 complete games in a double header.
Taking away stuff that makes baseball baseball is not going to stop the tommy John epidemic.
Devans – then why have bigger, stronger pitchers over the last 20 years broken down much faster than every before?
Why aren’t they able to throw 200 innings consistently anymore?
Why are TJS up more than they were before? And, why did we see a sudden spike beginning in 1995 when Tommy John surgery was around for nearly 20 years at that point. It was 1995 where we saw more hitters wear arm guards.
There is a correlation and it’s not a coincidence.
You would not know a correlation if it reached out and shattered your arm..
Then I’d get up and walk to first base with a better OBP. I guess you’re ok with hitters being hit in the face, Ducey. Congrats.
TJS is up more because before the 90’s we didn’t have tommy john surgery. So if a pitcher tore his UCL, his career was over or he pitched through it. If he pitched through it, he sucked and his career was over either way,
They keep getting hurt for a variety of reasons in my opinion:
Improper mechanics
Too many sliders
Infatuation with speed guns
Not enough lower body work
(Ask 2 nobodies like Ryan and Seaver about running and conditioning of the lower body sometime)
Too much 100% effort
Too many pitches per inning
Too many deep counts
Not enough change ups
Never being taught to finish their own games
Too much weight training and not enough stretching
Too much muscle mass
Too much emphasis on swing and miss numbers
Too much emphasis on the strikeout
Improper work between starts (not enough throwing)
Throwing too many breaking pitches at too young an age
Never being taught proper mechanics
…that’s my starting list.
Some of these are repetitive, but yeah, way more mechanics and conditioning than elbow guards.
Ryan and Seaver didn’t have to face hitters with elbow guards. They allow hitters to crowd with less fear on the big breaking ball, the big fastball and can cover more of the plate with the barrel. That is why the average number of pitches per batter has risen. Not just because of Ks but because of fouling pitches as well.
Guys are bigger and stronger, and I’d argue technology, mechanics (yes, we have learned more over the years) and other advancements should DECREASE the number of TJS. It hasn’t because of one difference over the last 25 years – the arm guard.
Nebraska, the surgery has steadily increased since the mid-90’s. So have the arm guards for hitters. More guys 1-9 are wearing them these days than the 90s.
I must agree with Nebraska. The widespread success of Tommy John surgery has made it far more common. If you hurt your arm in the 30’s or the 50’s, your career was over. Now, if your arm can always be repaired there is no need to show restraint.
Yes, except back then there were more 9-inning complete games by pitchers. Today’s pitchers are, presumably, bigger, faster and stronger. So what gives? Mechanics has been studied for decades and we should know more than we did back then, right?
Suddenly the TJS surges starting from the very point the arm guard becomes prevalent in baseball. More and more arms are going down, guys can’t complete games or go 7-innings anymore. It’s not just because of strikeouts. That can be explained by the hitters’ approach and being asked to take early in counts. Suddenly they’re down 0-1 in the count.
It starts long before they get to the MLB. Either they’re throwing the curve at a much younger age or something else is going on. How can pitchers fron the 60’s and 70’s throw tons of innings with very few TJ’S. Too guys on Pitch Counts having TJ surgery every other day?
Diet? I know Nolan Ryan is a freak of nature
But he. threw 245 pitches in a extra inning game. 100+ mph fast ball. It has to be mechanics. Ryan got his strength throwing the fastball from his powerful legs. Less stress on his arm.
We didn’t have TJS before the 90’s????? It was developed in the 70’s. Its named after pitcher Tommy John who was the first one to have the procedure in 1974 SMH
Uh, Steve, Google Tommy John surgery. It’s named after the pitcher from the 70s, not the underwear.
I strongly disagree that removing arm guards will make hitters back off, let alone that it would lead to all of those effects on the game.
Players care more about performing well than their safety, so all that would do is cause more injuries to hitters
Enter the batter’s box at your own risk. Protect the head, protect the face. Crowding the plate with padding and no fear has hurt pitchers. Again, no coincidence the spike in TJS has coincided with the arm guards becoming prevalent in the mid-90’s.
Arm guards are a performance enhancer for the hitter.
The increase of players under going TJS is due to science and data getting better. When performed correctly which the doctors have been excellent at, the rate of full recovery with a planned rehab program is very high. It has zero to do with batter protective gear.
Science and data getting better? Well in that case, the science would come in-effect for pitchers to remain healthier, no? There is no such science and data. What we do know is in 1995, TJS took off. Around 1995, more hitters opted to use arm padding.
Average pitches per at bat has been on the rise over the last few decades also. That’s data that matters when starting pitchers are facing hitters the 3rd time through the order.
Watch games from the 1980’s. See how far hitters were from the plate. See what pitchers could get away with.
It’s less of “Now that we have elbow guards, we can crowd the plate” and more of “crowding the plate makes us better”.
Many will not crowd without the arm guard. And hitters these days rarely buckle on the curve/slider. They will be more likely to without the arm guard, especially sitting fastball.
Well I guess that there isn’t much left to say. And the earth is flat.
Highest pitch count in a game since 2005 is Edwin Jackson with 149. In 1989, Nolan Ryan threw 164 pitches in a start. In 1920, Leon Cadore and Joe Oeschger threw 345 and 319 innings respectively in a single game. Pitch counts have been going down. WAY down. Arm guards do not equal more pitches.
Javla – average number of pitches per batter, per inning and per game has increased over the last 30+ years. One start out of 30+.
Over 50 years ago the mound was higher than it is today. Is THAT the change that is needed to decrease TJS? Seems nobody really cares about the health of pitchers and the current solution(s) aren’t working. Considering the best pitchers in the game bring (usually) the highest level of interest, one would think protecting pitchers would be a priority rather than codding hitters to help them perform.
One start out of 30? Last year a total of 15 pitchers pitched at least 200 innings, led by Verlander at 223. From 1971-1979, Bert Blyleven AVERAGED 273 innings and 16 complete games per year. He threw as many as 325 innings! Jim Palmer 1969-1978 averaged 272 innings and 18 complete games per year. He threw over 296 innings 3 times during that period. Has any recent pitcher come anywhere near that? Pitchers today aren’t throwing near as many pitches as they used to.
“345 and 319 innings respectively in a single game.” you say? Now that is an extra inning game!
Pitches, sorry. I would give mad credit for that many innings!
Pitchers l can still throw complete games. Just because a pitcher can throw a complete game doesn’t make it a good idea. Why would I let my starter pitch in the eighth inning when I can bring in a left-handed fireball or who throws 99 miles an hour? And then bring in another reliever you can throw 102 miles an hour for an inning or two? Managers use the bullpen because it works. Earned run average is the third and fourth time through the lineup consistently go up. It’s not as enjoyable to watch, I will give you that, but it is more effective when you were trying to win games
The robo ups will do more the anything, cuz the high fastball will get everyone. The zone is actually much higher then the umpires give them now.
Could be offset by the fact that the called strike zone is wider than the plate in today’s game. 10-15 pitches off the plate outside and inside (mostly outside) are called strikes per game. That’s significant to the outcome of AB’s, innings, and sometimes the final result of the game. Umps can decide the winner by calling balls strikes. And they do. It’s a power trip.
It’s catchers wearing face masks that are the problem!!
I know right? They wear the facemask because pitchers are throwing so hard, so if we take away the face masks and helmets in general, pitchers will throw less hard.
I guess foul tips never registered in the Pittsburgh area? I presume this was your attempt at a joke?
I never said take off the helmets. In fact I’d hope they’d wear the face cover with the helmet.
Some people have waaay too much free time.
The current state of affairs will do that.
IF THE BATTERS COME TO THE PLATE NAKED THERE WOULD BE ALOT LESS TOMMY JOHN SURGERIES!?!?!?
There would be a lot less bats needed.
Your basis for this whole thing is pitching velocity has risen since the 1990’s, and so have elbow guards. That’s correlation, not causation. There’s zero proof to back it up other than a trend where many other factors affect the increase if velocity. If you can find somewhere, anywhere, where a pitcher has said in some form they throw inside more because batters have more protection, then come back to me.
This. The sole basis of the argument is to prove some random causation that has little to do with it, or is a very minor attribute. Velocity is harder to hit being on one the many factors. One of main arguments here is that guys rarely flinch on a get me over breaking ball. We’ve gotten to a point in the game where guys attack to do damage so with technology and approach there’s a reason the get me over breaking balls are rarely ever effective, unless there a multi control facet to the arsenal. Pitchers have ditched East/West to go North/South. I get that there is some validity to taking away the inner half, but at the same time it’d hold more relevance if have an honest discussion about how the game has changed, in terms of pitching philosophies and approaches. If we want a proper discussion about TJs are more prevalent in the game then we have to get real and understand the major complexities. Guys throwing more often then ever without a break, specialization, which goes hand in hand with velocity, the workloads at such a young age and extended showcase circuits into high school years, technology and proper diagnosis/better medical treatments etc…. If we want to discuss causation of UCL injuries the problem generally starts with overuse at a youth to teenage years through professional years and has very little to do with arm protection. There are no overwhelming guidelines to UCL injuries, and the sad state of affairs, is throwing overhand is not a natural motion so UCLs are going to go eventually it’s just a matter of time and personal genetics. We can pretend to speculate and be disingenuous to try to prove a point no matter what or we can be honest to the fact that there are more primary reasons than elbow guards.
WAJGH isn’t very adept at looking at data! Correlation=Causation in his mind! You might as well talk to your corner office plant!
Swiiiing batter, batter, batter.
What?
F
O O F
Oh god we can never have nice things
wow…but not surprising. he’ll make a great closer though.
Wish him the best. Ad a Padres fan probably a trade in hindsight that Im glad both teams didnt make. Still perfect time for this procedure.
I understand the sentiment of timing considering no baseball currently but I am confused as to how these procedures are getting approved. I’ve said it on here before but the supplies and requirements needed for surgery could most definitely be better allocated.
Money. It’s the same old story. The ban on elective procedures only applies to those who don’t have it. I’m putting off back surgery until the fall or next winter.
Makes sense, baseball has a chance to create some serious good will by restricting these procedures. It’s highly unlikely all of these arms go down during a typical spring. Market efficiency plays supreme though
i wasnt even aware there was such a ban.
I probably chose the wrong word. I think it is highly discouraged since the equipment used is supposed to go to people fighting the virus. I know that any hoarding of certain things is illegal because of some presidential emergency decree.
No there very much is a ban on elective procedures currently
@stps2019
I heard in the radio this morning that Chris sales surgery was postponed for the reason you are referencing, but if it does get approved it is the same reason a bunch of NBA players got tested within 24 hours and the rest of us couldn’t. Money equals access
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.masslive.com/redsox/2020/03/chris-sale-surgery-boston-red-sox-ace-could-return-in-12-15-months-tommy-john-procedure-not-yet-scheduled-with-coronavirus-straining-healthcare-system.html%3foutputType=amp
Welp. Glad they got Porcello and Wacha after all.
Lucky if those two win as many games combined as Thor would by himself.
Pretty sure those two guys can combine to win 11 games.
Should have extended Wheeler a year ago
Until he needs surgery, because you know that’s only the inevitable.
Yeah and the Red Sox should have extended Betts. And the Orioles should have extended Machado. And… And….
Coming off the half-season of dominance he was? I imagine the price would’ve been too high for my liking even then.
of course Syndergaard happened to be a person i drafted for fantasy this year
Well, I drafted Severino, another guy out for the season and needed Tommy John Surgery, so I then replaced him with Stroman.
Thank goodness they have an extra starter with Wacha and Porcello. Get well soon Thor.
Ouch! Thor is a pending FA in a year and a half giving him little if any time to pitch ahead of his entry into the marketplace as a TOR starter. More unfortunate news for the Mets and MLB in 2020.
That is harsh. ouch…
If fellow Met fans thought things couldn’t get any worse at this time in the NYC metro area, here’s our answer. SMH.
Couldn’t have realized he needed this um maybe months ago
No. Tommy John and other arm issues spike in February/March. It isn’t surprising to see this many TJ diagnosis during spring training.
@king beas has never heard the phrase “ramped up” before and thinks pitchers throw the exact same intensity all year round, great good really smart
I do know severino should’ve gotten the surgery at the end of last year I wouldn’t be shocked if Noah felt pain and should’ve gotten it done last year as well
Luckily they have plenty of depth. This injury could cripple other teams, but I think the Mets will be fine. Wishing him a speedy recovery. Who knows? The way things are going maybe he won’t miss any regular season games.
Your a good dude Von, rare and refreshing in here
Crushing, absolutely crushing.
If nothing else, this vindicates the Mets bringing in both Porcello and Wacha for depth. This is exactly the situation they were prepared for.
Very smart of BVW to hold onto that pitching depth.
Mlb players still going out with injuries even when they aren’t playing. This sport is becoming a joke
Or he just got it checked out and there was damage. There’s been damage for a long time, it probably went unnoticed. It’s not noticeable like a broken leg, where you know right away
Then you won’t miss it then. See ya around.
So, does this mean that Thor will get depressed, put on lots of weight, and binge online gaming?
Wonder if the Mets expect the season to be postponed so they can get this surgery done now rather than wait until it’s absolutely necessary. Noah was pitching great in spring
Good thing there’s no baseball in 2020 he will only miss a few months in reality
And insurance will pick up his salary. Maybe the Wilpons talked him into this.
Half of TJ players never come back sad reality
I guess with the season up in the air this isn’t as bad. it would kill me if the season was starting on Thursday
**Tore Syndergaard
This sucks
So what? The season has a giant * asterisk anyways and the winner is going to be forgotten. Besides, who says the season will even start this year.
I am not even sure we will have a season. Never a good injury but this isn’t the worst year to get it done. Just this morning I was hearing a 50 game season with extended playoffs is being discussed.
Thor was pitching effectively and regularly in spring training after having some injury issues the past couple of seasons. I heard nothing of any arm issues up until the lockdown last week. I have to wonder if he tore his UCL while throwing in the aftermath of the cancellation? Regardless, his elbow was likely on borrowed time anyway.
TJ comes from cumulative damage dating all the way back to a pitchers teenage years, not a throwing a singular pitch on its own.
We Mets fans are used to disappointment. This ain’t no thang.
He immediately has 2 months.of recovery still bas for the Mets.
Instead of a 2021 june return its April 2021. Right now is a perfect time to do it if needed.
Your dreamin its going to be July 2021 at the very earliest if he ever comes back
Every pitcher at any level with an IQ of over 100 who experiences any kind of pain in their elbow should have pre-emptive TJ right now. There will be no 2020 season to play for, it’s smart to get ready for 2021.
Tommy John is not some slap band aid fix. If your UCL is intact no competent doctor is going to tear it for you as a preemptive strike. Also there will absolutely be a season at some point. Sale and Thor had been putting TJS for a long time and they will both miss a postseason chance to play for this season.
Pre-emptive TJ surgery? Another poor idea from Strike Four
Pre-emptive TJ to prevent… wait for it…the possibility of TJ! Brilliant!
Very disappointing. Good luck Noah. Hang tough Metsies.
man what a bummer.. that’s the only bball team from ny I like
seems like you ought to have all pitchers have tommy john at this rate
Godspeed Thor!
I’m of the opinion that weight training creates an imbalance between the muscles and the tendons.
A properly periodized weight training routine is one of the best things these guys can do to prevent injury and elevate their game. Out of curiosity where did you read such a thing? A lot of pitchers work directly with prominent strength coaches and end up having statistically the best years of their lives (ex. Kluber, Scherzer).
Tendons are not muscles. They can gradually thicken over years of repetitive stress. TJ surgery is now a right of passage for all pitchers, even relievers who throw about 60 innings a year.
DeGrom, Matz, Stroman, Porcello, and Wacha is enough to make the playoffs IF the offense can hold up their end of the bargain.
Syndergaard seems overrated too. He will be missed but its not as big of a loss as people believe. At least this way he wont have to throw to Wilson Ramos…
Are you kidding THor overrated? one of the top five best SP in the NL
Don’t forget about the bullpen.
Nice job, Brodie. You should’ve traded Syndergaard when you had the chance. Let’s see if they can even get a whole season out of Wacha and Matz, that’s is if there even is a season.
Who is pitching for the Bluejays??
Hyun-Jin Ryu is really the only starter they have that they can consistently rely on, yet he has had only 3 seasons with more than 150 innings pitched, his rookie season, his sophomore season and 2019.
Sick of the little kids on this site who have no idea how to have a discussion. Very very immature
Corona causes UCL tears. He should of self isolated. Wonder if he can actually get the surgery in the next couple months.
It’s almost like max effort pitching is a bad thing…who knew?
Misery loves Company when it comes to TJ…
“Please Take A Number For Better Service”
-sign seen at the office of Dr. Andrews
At least there’s one person whose business is booming despite the epidemic.
Mets fans would like to reverse that Dickey trade now, wouldn’t you? Lol. Jays fan obviously. I’ve lost a lot of sleep watching that guy deliver for the Mets after Anthopoulos traded him away for a 38 yr old knuckleball pitcher coming off his career year. Dickey did okay but I curse AA for this move.
Some work out, some don’t. Evens out with the Donaldson trade.
Lift more weights, Buddy.
As a Mets fan, I can honestly say I’m not surprised. He was relying way too much on his slider last year and is hellbent on having the fastest average mph fastball of any starter. I was all for trading him at the deadline last year, too.
Score one for BVW with adding “too many starters”. DeGrom, Stroman, Matz, Porcello, Wacha with Lugo and Gsellman in long relief still looks better than most teams.
Probably ramping up efforts to deal Dom for another starter now. Royals? Orioles? Marlins? Pirates? Mariners? How about Gonzales and Dee Gordon? They still owe us for taking Cano in the Diaz deal!
It might be a good thing this will be a short year. At this rate, we’d have run out of starting pitchers by the All-Star break. Just a crazy amount of injuries to SP’s this year.
Judging by the comments the sites biggest troll must have finally went full galaxy brain. Abysmal
SOOOOOOOO glad Preller didn’t trade Tatis or Gore for this guy…
Pitchers should be lining up for this surgery right now.
Considering the current pandemic and ban on elective procedures, they actually are lining up… does anyone know if sale has gotten his surgery yet?
There’s a sale at Penneys! I think its curtains for now. I don’t think Dr. Andrews does his surgery at a hospital so it might be business as usual for him.
The surgery has to be done in a hospital because they need an OR and all the resources (anesthesia, nurses, blood bank access for if something goes wrong, PACU, ect). It’s not actually the surgeon or the surgeries themselves that are the problem; we aren’t at the point where we need orthopedists taking care of covid patients yet. It’s the use of these limited recourses we need available (we don’t have enough masks or intubation supplies, nurses that could be on the floor instead of the OR, beds going to covid patients instead of filling the hospital with post op patients). Not to mention it’s better not to be in a hospital where there is a high risk for covid exposure and then all the sudden your elective procedure turns into a critical care admission and 2 weeks of quarantine…
Ventilators. Lack of ventilators. Respiratory arrest is a leading cause of death with COVID-19. It’s going to take months, possibly a year to ramp up production of supplies. People will be turned away. People will die due to lack of ventilators. That’s what is happening in Italy. That’s why it’s critical to adopt the policies and get people to flatten the curve (eliminate the death rate).
Not sure. Syndergaard’s surgery is this Thursday.
Brodie feels like an idiot now for not training him to San Diego
I think the feeling like an idiot started well before that.
Syndergaard getting Tommy John surgery. Why can’t we have nice things? I feel so bad for Noah probably out until next Summer- Mets should have extended Wheeler a year ago.
Syndergaard getting Tommy John surgery. Why can’t we have nice things? I feel so bad for Noah probably out until next Summer- Mets should have extended Wheeler a year ago. Wacha won’t stay healthy for long and while I’m high on David Peterson it’s impossible to replace Noah.
Extension takes two to tango. Zack wanted out.
I almost feel like at this point in baseball, if you have a stud pitcher, or a perceived to be stud, once you are at the two years of control left mark, trade them away for whatever is the best offer back. They lose value after they are one year left, and in the case you lose this year and the showcase for next years deadline and you are left licking your wounds and getting at most a second round draft pick. Terrible. Next year trade matz. Hopefully some young arms impress and come out of nowhere like Degrom did a few years back.
It’s karma from hitting Alcides Escobar in the ‘15 World Series.
I was kind of happy you guys won that year. Bc I knew you wouldn’t be relevant after that. You were the one team didn’t mind losing too lol
And the Mets have been relevant since?
Even when we don’t make the playoffs (last year) we were talked about more than the royals the last 5 years combined
Let it go brother.
I don’t see him getting 9.7 again next year! With the economy in the toilet, some of these salaries are going to have to give. Anything not under contract will be fair game.
What did Wheeler get?
5 years/$118 million, or $23.6 million per year.
That’s too bad. He’s fun to watch. I wish him a speedy recovery.
Hey, the Mets got Wacha. That’s awesome. Wacha’s good, then bad. He’ll be Shelby Miller soon enough. Don’t worry Mets fans, as a Cards fan I’ve watched a lot of Wacha’s pitching, and I can say he’s got electric stuff, he just gets in trouble if guys get on base. Oh, and the playoffs, he’s terrible when he pitches in those games.
If we even make it… I think Degrom stroman matz and Porcello would pitch before.
Jeff Todd, worst comments to start this thread I have ever seen. Delete that garbage, as I will not continue to visit a site that has so much despicable garbage being printed.
bye bye
Well, if todd actually did his job and got rid of that bully their wouldn’t be an issue but he won’t. A dude comes on here and bullies people and they do nothing as always. They will ban the people trying to get those pos outta here. hmm, Convenient
Not surprised at all that he needed Tommy John surgery. Basically many many many pitchers need Tommy John surgery but do not mention that their elbow is bothering them and pitch through it. We as fans don’t realize that these players are competitors and the last thing they want is to be on the shelf so keep in mind when a pitcher complains of discomfort in their elbow it is actually a lot worse. What I see often is the top pitchers are the ones that are at the highest risk because they overthrow everything. They overthrow fastballs and sliders and the curve ball is spin and snap extea and this is the problem in itself. I know firsthand because when I pitched if I didn’t overthrow my pitxges I was less effective so it was only natural to overthrow Edwin I did I definitely felt it on my elbow twice as much. right now a lot of pictures are coming out to have their Tommy John surgery because they could take advantage of the time off because the coronavirus. Expect more pictures to come forward
They should have unloaded him last year… the Mets are always behind. All we need to do is trade Stanton for him and we’re all good
I would do the opposite. Extend him now you might get him cheaper. Why would a team unload him if they are trying to win. What’s the point of rebuilding with the young controllable players we have??
well said
Doesn’t matter. Will be no baseball in 2020 anyway.
Rumor has it that he injured his elbow in the offseason while swinging a hammer.
Nice.
Elective surgery is suppose to be put off for the next 30-60 days due to the Virus! I guess that doesn’t apply to MLB?
Doesn’t apply to millionaires
Many of the highly regarded Orthopedic surgeons like ElAttrache and Andrews work in or are affiliated with full service Orthopedic Surgery Clinics likes the Andrews Sports Medicine and Orthopedic Center. They are not a full service hospital and would not be treating anyone that does not need Orthopedic care or surgeries. That is the difference.
They could go to a hospital along with their nurses and staff to help with the overload.
Look out NL East , ITS WACHA TIME!!!!
Glass half full, if you’re going to have surgery, this is the year to do it
The comments on this story are unreadable because of two idiots crying back and forth.
Hopefully he comes back strong
Why is Marlinsfanbase the biggest Mets hater? Who hurt him?
Mr. Met.
I kid, but true story about Mr. Met. A friend of mine was hit with a foul ball at Shea stadium. Mr. Met visited her in the hospital. It seems like a nice gesture, but if you were just hit in the head with a baseball wouldn’t the last thing in the world you want to see be a man with a giant baseball head?
Sorry for the tangent. I think I’m losing my mind a bit during this quarantine.
Von, funny stuff. Well, not your friend getting hit, but the rest.
Maybe he gets mad that we have more fans at marlins stadium than them??
He hates the Phillies too. Not as much, but he does. I think as a kid, he ran downstairs expecting to see Santa and instead saw Mr. Met and the Phillie Phanatic double teaming his mom. Putting the pieces together, I’m guessing Mr. Met was doing some freaky $#.
Lol
He hates the Marlins’ NL East opponents. Kinda natural actually.
Dislike for opponents and vile hatred for anyone and everyone who watches the teams are completely different things. The fans of the other 4 teams get along rather civilly, comparatively.
Tommy John for Cy Young Award 2020! Geez! That’s a lot of arms he’s claiming.
Everyone bout to get some TJ done, it’s good social distancing
Non-essential surgery for multi-millionare, sounds very NBAish.
Go ahead and get that TJ out of way now while you’re on the Mets dime, Noah.
The Braves will be more than happy to allot you their annual 1 year make good contract to you in 2022, once the Mets rebuild begins.
You’ll slot in nicely behind Soroka, Fried, and Anderson by then.
What rebuild???? Sure we would need to work on some pitching but far from a rebuild. Our young hitters will still be in the Mets with Degrom and one of if not two of stroman and Syndergaard… people who think Mets will rebuild soon are clueless
Eso era algo que se veia venir.
Deberieron cambiarlo y conseguir algunos prospectos buenos.
Well he led the league in runs allowed last year, so it may be addition by subtraction!
While I am seeing comments here that are increasingly contentious in this mega stressful time, I personally am trying to remind myself that baseball fans are a truly unique and special group who stand apart from the general rabble that seem to exist only to throw gasoline onto the fires of division, contention and anger. We baseballers as a group are better. I would hope that we can continue to show the world that we are indeed citizens of Americas Game and the world. We carry that responsibility with dignity and understanding of our collective humanity. Tomorrow will be a new day. We will hear those words, “Play Ball” again. Please, I implore you, let us all try to remember that.
With all the new tech, training, pitch count limitations, etc., why can’t trainers and coaches figure out how to AVOID these types of injuries?
All the talk of utilizing bullpens and relying on the 10th and 11th best pitchers on the roster to determine outputs of games is ridiculous. It wasn’t long ago when teams only needed 15 pitchers ALL SEASON because starters knew how to pitch deeper into games and were conditioned to throw into the 8th and 9th every time out. Today, teams might go through 15 pitchers in 2 weeks! So what really is the benefit of limiting pitchers to 75-100 pitches every time out if you need 300+ just to get through one game every day and warm guys up 6 times a game, 6 days a week? I have yet to be convinced that pitch counts prolong careers. All one has to do is look at the hall of Fame and innings pitched totals. Those guys didn’t live in the weight rooms like today’s players. Even marginal pitchers tossed 200 innings each year with relievers throwing 100 innings! Many teams relied on the same 12 or so pitchers all season long even into 1990’s, not players who had no business being in the majors.
Pitch counts destroy pitching staffs, not injuries. These pitchers are limited all through the minors and never learn to pitch, only throw max effort. Hell, Randy Johnson had better mechanics than almost every pitcher out there today. How many weights do you think he lifted with his arms? Or Glavine? Or Colon, Pedro, Dennis Martinez, Eck, or any other Hall if Fame pitcher? How many Hall worthy pitchers are in the game today?
Just following up, in 1993, teams needed 3,000 fewer pitches to get through 162 games than 2019. Yes, I looked it up – took about 5 minutes. They relied on 30-35 different pitchers, typically 5+ per game, throughout the season instead of their best 15.
Why would anyone with medical issues wait anymore?? Get it done now while it won’t cost games.
I have long felt the use of significant weights by pitchers (see Syndergard’s history) is what is causing the massive increase in TJSs. Back in the days of 300 inning/20 complete game pitchers, they focused on flexibility and light weight training. You can only strengthen muscles; you can’t strengthen tendons and ligaments. Pitchers muscles are overpowering their ligaments, so the tear.
Being real muscular time and has proven time and again that it doesn’t work for baseball longterm. It’s such a grind and pulling tight muscles and tendons is only natural when someone is ripped and they push themselves in baseball. Cough cough Stanton and Judge constantly banged up.
Same gut punch feeling as when Harvey and Wheeler needed their TJ surgery.
People actually thought the Mets could win that division lol have they not been paying attention??
Yes, Syndergaard has a 4+ era last year. If your bullpen is better we still have a chance
Amid a national health crisis, New York has a ventilator shortage and he gets non emergency surgery? Not a good look.
& this is all after “non-emergency” surgeries have been cancelled to help save resources
Somehow this qualifies, but I completely agree. This is a very bad look.
It’s amazing what money can do in a broken system.
Assuming a 15/16 month recovery time he’s looking at returning in July 2021, if there are no setbacks or issues with his rehab. Syndergaard is a FA at the end of the 2021 season
“Elective” surgeries at its finest. Just a bad/selfish look for MLB.
These surgeons have a niche practice and it does not impact services for COVID-19 patients. TJ surgery only takes 60-90 minutes to complete and patients go home the same day, so this is not impacting the public health crisis whatsoever.
What I want to know is what is Chris Sale waiting for? He needs to get his procedure done ASAP. Every day he waits is another delay for his 2022 comeback.
Yeah,,,no hospital gowns, masks or sanitizers are used in TJ surgery
Pretty sure you’re sedated and placed on a ventilator. The things that were so short on right now.
No ventilators are used during TJS. I’ve had 3 rotator cuff surgeries (which are much more complex) but never put on a ventilator for any of them. Yes you are sedated but you still breath on your own.
Do they have ventilators?
Is that really an “essential” surgery right now? Contradictions and non-adherence to guidelines, recommendations, rules and even temporary mandates, all across the country. The vast majority are of sound mind and being reasonable, but still tons of people who think the rules don’t apply to them. Some things never change.
The number one reason pitchers keep getting hurt is the side step . To counter the running game that took off in the 70s and early 80s pitchers started the side step as a quicker way to pitch with men on base. It slowed down the running game but pitchers arm problems started. Before then pitchers had long wind ups with high leg kicks. Since they have gone away from that the injuries just keep coming
You actually believe it’s that? Not that he throws 100mph sinkers & a 90+ mph slider?
I guess he didn’t get the memo about not having elective surgery.
Interesting. My wife just fractured and dislocated a toe but can’t get it fixed because it’s “elective” surgery. Another example of different rules for the rich and connected.
Get well, get well soon, we want you to get well!
this thread is effing hilarious. mets fans stand alone as the most sarcastic, snarkiest, and realistic. thanks all for making me smile…