Odds and Ends: Colon, Clark, Gagne

Forget the FA pitching market.

Maybe the Mets should trade Carlos Gomez to the Nats for John Patterson. Or maybe Fernando Martinez for Mike Mussina. Better yet, how about Mulvey for Padilla?

After the Milledge trade, Omar's capable of anything.

Colon would be a perfect fit for the Mets. Remember, he won the Cy a few years ago. He can revive his career in the friendly confines of Shea and Citi Field. Also, the National League should help him out a bit. Maybe a 3 year deal with a team option for the second year and mutual option for a third, with each year being worth 4MM plus up to 5 million more in incentives for innings pitched each year.

Colon wouldn't be a bad short-term gamble for the back end of the rotation, but I wouldn't sign him for more than one or two years, and do so as cheaply as possible, and only do so after securing a more solid bet elsewhere for the rotation.

One thing the Mets DON'T need to hitch their wagons too for next year is another aging medical-risk type of starter. Too many of those around already, and really, the breakdown of the pitching staff as the season wore on last year was one of the most significant factors in their inability to close out the season on top.

Tolo, any GM is capable of anything. If omar was willing to sell that low on milledge, and nobody would give him anything better, Do you think there might be a reason? Lastings is a nice talent, but very raw. Much like willy mo. If they develop, washington has a few nice outfielders, but their defense and baserunning leave too much to be desired at this point to warrant regular duty on a contender. Church and Schnieder have little upside, but would be nice pieces for a contender since they are more polished. If milledge pans out to be better than church, which isn't a guarantee at this point, he has the upside to be great. I don't think NY was the right place to develop for him.

@SkiBolton

So you think giving Milledge away for a catcher who can't hit (which is why they let LoDuca go, wasn't it?) and a reserve OF was a good move? Wouldn't it make more sense to keep him and take your chances on a 22 year old with potential?

“He can revive his career in the friendly confines of Shea and Citi Field”

…hehehe, that’s what the Angels figured he could do in Anaheim after he first got hurt because he had “won the Cy a few years ago.”…

Keep dreaming though. I say 1yr/7M with tons of incentives ~ but even that might be too high…

hahaha,

So this "verify you are not a robot" crap is almost as bad as the randomly logging you out after every post ~ but thought this one was classic!!!

"vd2pus"

...hehehe...

If I were the Mets, I would sign Colon to be a setup guy. These broken down starters can find new life in the bullpen where they don't have to throw as many innings, and can focus on one or two pitches. I wouldn't give him much money, though, until he proves he can still pitch.

@bbgodsproductions

And Colon would take a deal like that why?

I'll take that Carlos Gomez for J Patterson offer. J Patterson turns 30 in January - highly unlikely he can ever be a solid 25 game 150 IP starter again with the TJ surgery and other chronic elbow and forearm nerve issues.

Hey did anyone catch Jim Bowden on WFAN? Its still up on their site. His diplomatic spin was Milledge - Church/Schnieder is a better deal short term for the Mets since they get two starters...

The Rangers need to leave Eric Gagne alone...Let CJ Wilson or Joaquin Benoit take over the closer role, and really commit to the youth movement. If you're taking Gagne on a one-year deal, you'll have to find another closer next year anyways, and it'd likely be Benoit/Wilson, so why not just get them started a year early?

"Better yet, how about Mulvey for Padilla?"

Done deal. LOL

Colon is going to have enough suitors to probably get what he wants in terms or years/money. There won't be a reason to accept a low ball offer from the Mets. That's how desperate teams are for pitching.

"So you think giving Milledge away for a catcher who can't hit (which is why they let LoDuca go, wasn't it?) and a reserve OF was a good move? "

Schneider cant hit, but so what, he doesnt have to. He is the nuber 8 hitter and catcher. Yeah, and youre statement for letting Loduca go because he couldnt hit speaks for your credibility. They let him go because he had an awful relationship with the media, couldnt hit, couldnt field, couldnt run, had no power, got suspendeded and ejected on more then one occasion for arguing balls and strikes. Schneider on the other hand, is a defensive stud, and can draw a walk. 56 walks to 56 strikeouts in 2007. Call Church a reserve all you want, but I am okay with a solid fielding 800 OPS especially batting 8th. You look foolish when you call him a reserve, just because you dont know him. He has better numbers then the whole philly outfield besides Burrell. It definitely improves the Mets this year. Millegde is just not ready at this point to slug .500 in a year vs righties. Church and Schneider are good players to make a run with, they are solid and in their primes. Milledge wont be a key contributor I dont think until 2010.

"Wouldn't it make more sense to keep him and take your chances on a 22 year old with potential?"

Yes, but not if you feel as if you are ready to compete and the 22 year old with potential is still going to hav a lot of growing pains and you can net 2 solid starting players for him, and you have 2 more top OF prospects in your system, it is a deal you can make. It stinks to lose Milledge, but for all the people who talk about this like it is Kazmir/ Zambrano, youre a bunch of idiots. This trade puts the Mets in better position in 08 and 09, and after that we will see the true winner when Milledge starts to realize some of his potential. This difference is, the Mets THOUGHT they could win the year they traded Kazmir. Bad mistake. This year, that are definitely ready to compete for a world series, so I dont mind it as much.

I have to agree with the move from minaya's standpoint. He gets 2 known commodities for his team, but loses a raw talented player. If milledge develops to his potential, it's a great deal for the nats, but that is far from a guarantee.

the mets dont neeed a nother starting right handed pitcher they need a left handed one they need to get santana or kazmir but i wopould prefer kazmir they will trade kazmir sooner or later because the have david price who will out to be like kazmir

I cant help but feel sorry for these Mets fans. It truly was a terrible deal, because Milledge has tremendous upside. He posted an OPS just 25 points worse than Church last year and is liable to make that number jump with full playing time and experience while being 7 years younger. Schneider is a good catcher, no longer a defensive stud but at this point he is pretty good defensively and quite bad offensively. Add in the fact that Milledge is going to play center field for a long time probably and you have quite a loss of a deal. Everyone knows how bad it is...I usually like to look at positives of a deal from both sides but this one is just a clear bust on Omar's part...

You say he will have growing pains? I don't think he will. Look for lots of power from the Nationals outfield next year...and for the record, I'd take any of the Phillies outfielders over Church, at least if you are including Rowand.

The problem with this trade, and why so many here and the media are calling out Omar - at best it is break even for the Mets if Milledge is a bust and Church and Schneider continue to play at the same level over the next 2-3 years. No chance Church or Schneider improve. Mets fans need to know Church is not a 150+ gamer, he frequently takes himself out of the lineup with minor injuries. He is a headcase who flaked out at times under Frank Robinson on a non-contending team. No way he improves under the NY pressure, 2007 was his ceiling, I guarantee it. At worst, Church and Schneider disappoint and Milledge blossoms, then this is a complete embarassment for Omar.

really good defensive catchers are hard to find.

OF can always be gotten when you are a big market team like the mets.

not every trade can be a slam dunk "win." Omar did well to improve a team that has to win now.

“really good defensive catchers are hard to find.

OF can always be gotten when you are a big market team like the mets.“

Agree 100% with the second (meaning Church was pointless to acquire) and the first couldnt be further from the truth in my eyes ~ the D guys are the ones who become vets bouncing from team to team as each club tries to find a hitter with fair D for the Catcher position (making Schneider almost pointless as well).

I think the team would have been much, much better off keeping Lastings (who should be just as good as Church in 08) and signing a guy like Doug Mirabelli off the FA market for a D-minded catcher if they really, really wanted one… As it stands now, Schneider is one of 3 catchers they have brought to the club within as many weeks and Church could see very little playing time if they go after a RF with upside. Since RF is the only spot they have available on their roster to update, I personally see them atleast trying with someone like maybe Guillen. Shoot, bringing Shawn Green back could have provided just as good of results as Church though even if ya didn’t want to use Lastings. Still think he should have been kept and Gomez/Martinez traded instead if he really held that little interest around the league. Both Church and Schneider are replaced so easily, neither holds any upside and the guy you sent away is already better. But that’s just my thoughts…

He's not a really good defensive catcher. He's certainly capable but he was really good a couple of years ago but is definitely on the decline and isn't getting any better.

I have a feeling this will be a slam dunk "loss", so no he didn't do well.

And Omar Minaya is paying back the Nationals by giving them Lastings Milledge. He just feels so bad for stripping the Nats of Grady Sizemore, Brandon Phillips and Cliff Lee and then turning around and giving Colon for nothing.

I'm starting to realize how bad a GM he is.

Heyman update on Miggy:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/baseball/mlb/12/02/angels.cabrera/index.html

Angels back to the table with Kendrick + Mathis + Adenhart OR Santana + mid-level player.

iknowtomuch-
The Mets are not getting Kazmir. Why would the Rays trade the AL leader in Ks BACK to the Mets when all they could really offer is OF prospects?

I hope the Rays don't make the mistake of bringing Norton back, I'd much rather Erstad. World Series winner, former All-Star, former Silver Slugger, and played under Maddon already. Seems much more desirable for this team than Tony Clark IMO.

"The Mets are not getting Kazmir. Why would the Rays trade the AL leader in Ks BACK to the Mets when all they could really offer is OF prospects?"

There is almost no way in hell the Rays would trade Kazmir, especially to a team without anything really that special to offer like the Mets. The Rays rotation appears to be stacked for years with Scott Kazmir, James Shields, Matt Garza, David Price, Jacob McGee, Wade Davis and Jeff Niemann. Not only that but also Andy Sonnastine, Edwin Jackson and Jason Hammel. The best pitchers the Mets have to offer are Pelfrey, Mulvey, Joe Smith, Guerra and Humber, and the Rays already have guys that are better than any of those guys. The other guys the Mets have to offer, Fernando Martinez and Carlos Gomez, are both young outfielders, something the Rays also already have in Crawford, Upton, Baldelli, Dukes and maybe Gomes.

"I hope the Rays don't make the mistake of bringing Norton back, I'd much rather Erstad. World Series winner, former All-Star, former Silver Slugger, and played under Maddon already. Seems much more desirable for this team than Tony Clark IMO."

Secondly, I think it would be fantastic move by the Rays to bring in Tony Clark instead of Erstad. I live in Chicago and I watched Erstad play last season for the White Sox, and to be honest he really no longer brings anything to the table. Listing all of those previous accomplishments by him is pointless when he isn't even close to that type of player now. And he can't even stay healthy either. Tony Clark is still a decent quality power bat, a good veteran who can help mature young guys (like with Arizona last year), and would be a decent option to give Pena some rest and to play some DH.

"The Mets are not getting Kazmir. Why would the Rays trade the AL leader in Ks BACK to the Mets when all they could really offer is OF prospects?"

There is almost no way in hell the Rays would trade Kazmir, especially to a team without anything really that special to offer like the Mets. The Rays rotation appears to be stacked for years with Scott Kazmir, James Shields, Matt Garza, David Price, Jacob McGee, Wade Davis and Jeff Niemann. Not only that but also Andy Sonnastine, Edwin Jackson and Jason Hammel. The best pitchers the Mets have to offer are Pelfrey, Mulvey, Joe Smith, Guerra and Humber, and the Rays already have guys that are better than any of those guys. The other guys the Mets have to offer, Fernando Martinez and Carlos Gomez, are both young outfielders, something the Rays also already have in Crawford, Upton, Baldelli, Dukes and maybe Gomes.

"I hope the Rays don't make the mistake of bringing Norton back, I'd much rather Erstad. World Series winner, former All-Star, former Silver Slugger, and played under Maddon already. Seems much more desirable for this team than Tony Clark IMO."

Secondly, I think it would be fantastic move by the Rays to bring in Tony Clark instead of Erstad. I live in Chicago and I watched Erstad play last season for the White Sox, and to be honest he really no longer brings anything to the table. Listing all of those previous accomplishments by him is pointless when he isn't even close to that type of player now. And he can't even stay healthy either. Tony Clark is still a decent quality power bat, a good veteran who can help mature young guys (like with Arizona last year), and would be a decent option to give Pena some rest and to play some DH.

sorry for postin that twice

"the mets dont neeed a nother starting right handed pitcher they need a left handed one they need to get santana or kazmir but i wopould prefer kazmir they will trade kazmir sooner or later because the have david price who will out to be like kazmir "

Your probably the new most annoying poster here. Its a good competition between you, angels fans and some others. Stop posting your Kazmir crap proposals everyyyyyyyyyyyy singleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee dayyyyyyyyyyyyyy please.

And also please use some periods periods are good they help you read the post easier not like a big run on sentence when you use some punctuation it is easier on the eyes and doesnt like like a 7 year old wrote it please it just makes things easier thanks

And when i said angel fan i dont mean all of them just the one nicknamed angel fan. Brewcrew is also pretty awesome

"You say he will have growing pains? I don't think he will. Look for lots of power from the Nationals outfield next year...and for the record, I'd take any of the Phillies outfielders over Church, at least if you are including Rowand."

Oh okay, he wont have growing pains because gopalehose says he wont. Why? Do you think that he will overcome his problem of not getting out of the batters box or being able to get a quick jump off any base this year? That is a minor problem, but an annoying one. He also cannot hit good slider from a righty yet. Thats his one main obstacle, but it is a big one and once he overcomes that he will be ready to shine. Usually though this takes a couple of years atleast to do, and he will indeed have growing pains. Again, I think its funny that all the Milledge naysayers are joining his fan club ever since the Mets dealt him so they can say what a bad deal it was. Milledge will not out produce Church NEXT year. This is a win NOW move. It will probably suck in 2 or 3 years. Right now, it improves the team. Its really that simple.

"I cant help but feel sorry for these Mets fans."

Wow, a fan of one of the 5 worst franchises the MLB feels bad for my team? Too funny. The Mets are better then the whitesox at basically every position on the baseball field. All the way up from Manager to GM. Feel a little sorry for your own joke of an organization.