Jays Quietly Discussing Halladay?

Now HERES the guy yankess trade Cano, and any other prospects the jays want. Theres no way the jays will deal him to an al east team, if at all, but if they would listen to offers, Im giving up cano, and any other prospect they want!

Cubs couldnt get Halladay for that...

Looking at Arizona and LA would make sense.

Kershaw, Kemp + propsect?

uww1, I hate to break it to you, but I don't think the Jays want to bring Mr. Lilly back. He left for a reason.

uww1, I hate to break it to you, but I don't think the Jays want to bring Mr. Lilly back. He left for a reason.

Sorry about the double post, the interwebs spazzed out on me.

I think we can safely say that every team will at least have interest. But, not all of them have the ability to pull this off.

Arizona - No prospects left in the system aside from Scherzer and Parker. They won't trade both to get Halladay. I doubt they'd part with either Webb or Haren either.

LA Dodgers - Kershaw probably will be off limits here. With an aging rotation (Penny, Lowe, Schmidt (if he ever comes back), Kuroda) they will need Billingsley and Kershaw to keep them competitive. I'm sure they'd love Halladay and would part with Kemp, Loney, and others but I don't see them trading pitching to get pitching.

Cubs - Would have to deal Vitters, probably Samardzija, and others. With the ownership questions, I doubt it happens.

Aaron -

Cubs ownership has nothing to do with trades. A $136 million contract, maybe. But whoever they are, they are still in the bidding process with 5 other bidders. A nice way to be eliminated from bidding would be to try to pass judgement on trades or signings when you don't even own the team and are just one of five or six bidders. Halladay's contract is peanuts to the Cubs.

I think people need to realize that it's going to take basically all of the high level talent the Cubs have to make this work. The Jays won't want crap contracts like Marquis, and won't be willing to take them.

How about Vitters, Ceda, Samardzija, Colvin, Hill, and Cedeno?

See this is why even as a Cubs fan I don't want to this kind of trade. It scares the hell out of me to give up the type of players that it'd take.

I don't think the Cubs would be in on this even if Halladay actually became available.

"Kershaw, Kemp + propsect?"

You are joking, right? Doc is a great pitcher, but look at what the Dodgers were locked in for with the Indians for Sabathia, Blake and Carroll. Andy LaRoche was the biggest name involved in that one. Now, if they wanted a package of, say, Halladay and Eckstein, a package similar to that minus one of the prospects would seem appropriate. But dealing two talents like that makes no sense at all.

Sabathia was a 3 month rental, Halladay is under contract for 2+ years, well under market value.

Only way a deal would get done is if there is a blue chip involved. I don't want a bunch of unproven Cubs prospects.

jacklaf:

The Rangers' system makes them the most capable to make a trade happen. They just have to weigh their options. Halladay's contract is up in 2010, right around when the reinforcements should arrive. I think this time next year a move like this would be perfect, but now is too soon to spend some of your trade chips. I'd offer Salty,Andrus,Kiker + 1-2 lower tier prospects. If they shoot it down oh well, if that's close to a package they'd be interested in I'd keep talking.

Wow, the Rangers would definitely be an interesting destination for Doc. They certainly have the prospects to get him if they want and he would be the perfect anchor to a rotation.

If Sabathia brings back 1 "can't miss" prospect for a few monthes of service, you have to assume that the asking price starts at 2 top prospects and lower tier prospect or two for 2+ years of Halladay at reasonable money.

why would the braves trade francouer? not only would it be selling low, but then they would be sorry when he regains form in toronto. regardless, you are saying one of those OFs plus a pitching prospect? not gonna cut it. it would have to be heyward or perhaps gorkys and then one of the better pitchers in the system and even then i don't think that does it. and i wouldn't trade gorkys anyways. his name is ridiculous.

Posted by: schellis
Everyone will stop reading your idea as soon as they see Arroyo. If they do continue reading, they will stop reading once they see you can't spell Halladay correctly.

"The only minor leaguer I wouldn't trade is Elvis. A package of Neftali Feliz, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Joaquin Arias, Nelson Cruz, and John Mayberry Jr."

Honestly I don't think the Rangers would give up Neftali Feliz either. The guy has electric stuff and has been dominating minor leaguers and shooting up prospect charts. He's not going to be ready for a little while but he seems pretty special. I wouldn't be shocked if he was the best player the Rangers got for Tex.

I think the Rangers would probably offer something like Eric Hurley, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Kasey Kiker, Joaquin Arias, Julio Borbon and Neil Ramirez.

They'd probably consider moving anyone but Elvis Andrus and Neftali Feliz, and the crazy thing is that their system is so good that they could get it done anyways.

BrianTX:
what reinforcements are you referring to? if you're talking about the youngsters (andrus, hurley, teagarden, etc.), at least some portion of that group would be included in the proposal to ricciardi. also, this would be more of a win now move for the rangers with the offense they already have in place and some of the pitching they are developing.

"Sabathia was a 3 month rental, Halladay is under contract for 2+ years, well under market value."

Not necessarily true with the Dodgers. Sabathia would likely be resigned, perhaps even during the season, if traded to the Dodgers. He may be a Dodger after the season anyway. Further, Sabathia would have also included a very good player in Blake and a rather serviceable backup in Carroll. Halladay + Eckstein for the same package or a tiny bit less would make sense, though it would require McCourt taking on more salary.

"I don't see Jays doing a package of 4+ prospects. They will need someone who will be a stud, not a bunch of slightly above average players. They also have no need for a catcher."

They would probably move Salty or Ramirez if they got one of them to first base. If they could get Michael Main he's got a really good arm as well. Julio Borbon and/or Engel Beltre and both good outfield prospects with huge ceilings, and Kiker, Beaven and Hurley are all good pitching prospects.

Even without Andrus or Feliz you would still be landing some really good young players.

scribble,

You read my mind on Feliz. He's as close to as untouchable as it comes in the Rangers' system. The guy was hitting 101 on the gun in his first AA start. Not to mention, he's 20 years old.

However, I don't think JD would offer your package. Considering the lack of innings this staff pitches each game, we can't afford to trade a starter who has role both now and in the future. If Hurley was included in the deal you'd have to bump off some of the lower guys, because outside of Arias, I think all of those guys have a lot of potential.

Posted by: txrangers22
Yay common sense of knowing to receive, you have to give lol.
Too many people think, 'oh we don't have to give up our top prospects, we can just give up our, 5th, 8th, 12th, 15th, 16th, 19th and 23rd best prospect.

jaklaf,

Naturally, I expect some of the reinforcements to be included in the deal. I was speaking more along of the young pitchers, since the lineup is more or less set. Kiker/Beaven/Maine/Feliz are all arms, that in a year or two (or three) should be part of our rotation. Like I said above, Halladay would be a tremendous addition to the rotation. I just think it's a year too early to pull the trigger on this trade. Some of those arms could not arrive until the 2011 season, when Halladay would likely leave as a FA.

And CC is younger and left-handed. I adjusted my estimate to make the trade equal to the deal that would have brought Sabathia to the Dodgers.

Posted by: AA | July 24, 2008 at 12:49 PM

rofl
okay

juiced - If you are referring to the deal I created, I was matching up with their needs. Why would they want another outfielder when they are going to have holes in the rotation, 3B, catcher, and SS after the season? My deal takes care of 3 of those 4.

If I were JD, I'd be all over this, for sure. Make anyone available except Chris Davis and Neftali Feliz. Even without them, you've got plenty of guys who can get it done.

Andrus, Hurley, Saltalamacchia, and a lower guy or two.

chris davis, elvis andrus, jarrod saltalamacchia

for

halladay, overbay

Just want to chime in. Halladay is my favourite player and is beloved in Toronto. He's under contract for 2 more years, is perhaps the best pitcher in baseball when you factor in how many innings he can work and his division, and the Jays CAN afford him and he likes it here.

The only way he gets dealt is if the Jays are blown away. There must be several top prospects. Not a group of mediocre crap. If Bedard can bring in Jones and Sabathia can bring in Laporta, it will take something like a Rasmus or Kershaw plus more.

This would be the Rasmus deal, other than the fact Rasmus is now out a month with a bum knee.
Halladay would be worth a package with Rasmus included. Like "Guitar Hero" said if Bedard got Jones and Sabathia got Laporta, someone like Rasmus would have to go. Maybe Rasmus and Anderson and Todd? ......But I am not good at putting together Minor league packages.

I really wanted to read this thread, but I saw two idiotic cubs proposals (of course) in the first 10 comments and now I can't.

Come on guys, can't you think a little bit before you start mashing the keys?

If Rasmus is on the DL...doesn't that pretty much put an end to that talk, because players on the DL can't be traded?

The Cards just flat out don't have what it takes without including him. The Cubs don't either unless Toronto wants a ton of quantity and not a top 25 prospect.

The brewers are the team that absolutely scares the hell out of me. Does anyone else realize that Gallardo could be back before the end of the seaon? Thats what I heard...not sure if its true. lets just say he did, and the Brewers made this trade happen.

1. CC
2. Sheets
3. Halladay
4. Gallardo
5. Parra

Throw Suppan in there...and as a Cubs fan...i would most likely cry.

There is probably like a .1% chance of all that...but even the thought is nuts.

"Come on guys, can't you think a little bit before you start mashing the keys?"

Can you not make generalizations about a fan base? Take a look at the Cards proposal without Rasmus even involved. That is no better than the dumb Cubs proposals. Generalizations are real stupid.

I totally agree with Guitar Hero on this one. In my opinion if Texas wants Halladay they are going to have to give up Neftali Feliz.

I don't think Rasmus will be traded now that he's hurt his knee. Granted, initial reports look good, but this will lower his value at least. I don't blame a Cardinal fan for giving this a shot otherwise. Say you offer Todd, Anderson, Garcia, Perez and Salas... That's five Futures Game participants right there. Bryan Anderson is one of the elite catching prospects out there and is ready to start on a major league team in '09. Jess Todd has advanced to Double-A in a year since being drafted and is dominating. Salas and Perez both have Lidgeish stuff. I think if you're the Blue Jays you have to consider this deal, and maybe the Cardinals throw in Daryl Jones or Jon Jay as well(Jones more likely). Sure, that's burning down the farm system completely, but I think they at least have the pieces to make an attempt.

Nobody considers Colorado bringing Roy home to play in Denver? Colorado has a few guys that could/should be traded.

Holliday, Fuentes, one of Barmes/Jeff Baker, and Franklin Morales could do it.

Felix Pie, Sean Marshall, and Ronny Cedeno easily gets it done. No chance any team will be willing to part with more talent then that. He is as good as a Cub.

"Felix Pie, Sean Marshall, and Ronny Cedeno easily gets it done."

Praying that's sarcastic or you've had your body invaded by Guru.

IF Halladay is really on the market (which is a gigantic IF), I would obviously want him to go to my team, the Rockies. Maybe a package of Holliday/Torrealba/Jhoulys Chacin (top prospect - pitcher)/Ian Stewart gets it done.

Actually, screw it - go all in, Rox:

Matt Holliday
Dexter Fowler
Casey Weathers
Yorvit Torrealba (only because you need something that resembles a productive catcher)

Would that get it done?

""Fine - I'm happy keep Victorino on my team."

If only they played the Mets 100 times.

And for all the talk about the Jays not needing an OF, if they could get a stud like Rasmus, Kemp, or Heyward as a part of a package they found sufficient in terms of talent, I think they pull the trigger and don't worry about the needs. Top prospects like this will find a place to play. Plus in the AL there is the DH, so that is an option. You also can use them as trade chips to fill other holes. I think when trading, like when drafting, you get the best group of talent you can and worry about where they will fit later.

"Matt Holliday
Dexter Fowler
Casey Weathers
Yorvit Torrealba (only because you need something that resembles a productive catcher)

Would that get it done?"

I'm sorry, but I don't believe that it will. We already have an amazing future in LF with Lind and Snider. Torrealba will be unneeded because Barajas has held up pretty well for us. I doubt the Rox will give up Casey Weathers for Halladay, and Halladay's pitch-to-contact philosophy won't be helpful at Coors anyway. I don't know much about Fowler, but once again, we don't need outfielders.

And do you honestly think that the Rox would give up two of their top prospects, plus their franchise player for Halladay? Despite how good he is, it is unreasonable.

You have to look at it from an outsider's view. The Rockies' offense can hold up - they've always lacked pitching. Halladay is a monster and is one of the top 5 pitchers in all of baseball. I'd do it without thinking twice (other than maybe instead of Weathers, we'd give up Jhoulys Chacin and if not Fowler, maybe Ian Stewart).

Key Stat: Halladay has pitched 33 complete games since the start of the 2003 season. There are only eight other active major-league pitchers who have more than 33 in their careers.

I think I speak for a lot of Jays fans when i say I might have to look for a new team to Follow if Halladay is delt. However, being the big fan of trades and prospects that I am whatever deal happens might keep me interested in the team.

However lets be real about this, this is Roy's way of getting more payroll for the team to put a winner on the field.

Also a Rockies deal that would be interesting to me is. Holliday - Francis - Stewart - Another prospect - Halladay - Rios

"Matt Holliday
Dexter Fowler
Casey Weathers
Yorvit Torrealba (only because you need something that resembles a productive catcher)

Would that get it done?"

I actually like the general theme of this offer, but I would take out Torrealba and Fowler and throw in Chacin. The Jays could then put Holliday in LF, and move Lind to 1B, and then Snider could come up and be the DH when hes ready.

There's ZERO chance Halladay will be traded and he has already verbally committed to an extension, but as long as we are having fun with it, I think the Rangers would have the best offer.

Saltalamacchia
Andrus
Feliz
Teagarden
Davis

These are all names that would interest the Jays because they are at positions of need.

Think about what they got for Teixeira and then factor in that Halladay is much better and under control for another year. I'd say it takes at the bare minimum, Salty, Andrus, one of those other 3 and another solid prospect. I'm not even sure that JP would accept 4 of those guys for Doc.

"1. Halladays talent (i.e. top 5 starter in baseball)."

Top period, not top 5.

hmm maybe a cardinals trade...

anderson
duncan
reyes
wellenmeyer

for

halladay...LOL