Knobler On Brewers, Vazquez

Would Braves be interested in Corey Hart?

JV has been the Braves best pitcher so far this year. He 2nd in Ks top 10 in IP and Top 20 in ERA. IF they could get a Stud OFer right NOW than by all means you have to sell high and pull the trigger. Though I wonder if the Braves would consider trading Lowe first to bigger market teams that can take on his salary that is in need for SP (Angels/White Sox/Texas) for a Big Bat +. I would find it more attractive long term if Lowe was move because of this contract versus JV production he will give you till his contract expires after 10' in which the braves may feel better in having a Huddy/JV/JJ/Hanson/KK moving forward. Make it interesting for the Rumor Mill...

Trading Vazquez for Corey Hart would make a ton of sense for both teams. The Braves have a glut of starting pitching but desperately need an outfielder. The Brewers need starting pitching and are said to be shopping Hart. Looks like a match made in heaven to me.

DLowe has been just as dominant. He'd be the LAST guy I'd wanna trade from the starting staff. Now with that being said, please PWHJORT, don't suggest trading Jurrjens and please don't think we'd evr get Hard-hittin Carlos Quentin. Not gonna happen. However, if we did in fact trade Lowe to the Rangers, just for imagination, I'd ask for Hamilton or Kinsler. Obviously, we'd have to throw in prospects and KJ/Francoeur depending on who we trade for, but the pitchign-hungry Rangers could become desperate....

"Trading Vazquez for Corey Hart would make a ton of sense for both teams. The Braves have a glut of starting pitching but desperately need an outfielder. The Brewers need starting pitching and are said to be shopping Hart. Looks like a match made in heaven to me."

Milwaukee would have to give up more than Hart to get Vazquez, since he is worth more than Hart.

"JV has been the Braves best pitcher so far this year."

Uh, no he hasn't. Jurrjens wins that award, even after his last start. Javy's been great, though. I'd like to keep him, as he's the only traditional strikeout guy they have, but he is the logical choice as tradebait if they go that way - solid pitcher, short-but-not-too-short commitment.

NL East,

1. I like the idea of trading for DeRosa but the Indians are said to be looking for a top young starter in return. That is too much for him.

2. Anderson also won't be DFA'd. He is a good hitter who has just gotten off to a rough start.

3. There is no one that would want Jeff Bennett...he is terrible.

4. No way to Holliday. The A's will ask for a load of prospects in return. Since the Braves have only a slim chance at making the playoffs why give up prospects for a rental. It would be the Tex deal all over again. Boras clients never sign extensions. He will go to the highest bidder this offseason.

5. I agree with this idea. I think Soriano is the best closer on the team. Gonzo was said to have had a lot of interest from other teams over the summer. Maybe the Rays would be interested. Either way, either Gonzo or Soriano should be traded.

Trade Vazquez, and you arrive at almost the same point that the Braves were in last season. With Kawakami not producing as hoped, and one win from the 5th starter spot all year, it would make zero sense to dump a quality starter, especially for a guy like Corey Hart...Whom the Brewers wouldn't trade in the first place anyway. The only logical moves would be to trade a young, "big league ready arm", or swap Francoeur and a minor league prospect for Hart as a "change of scenery" move..Which still doesn't make sense for the Brewers.

Who here thinks, if he isn't re-signed, we'll sign Bay? He may cost a little and we know the Braves had interest in him. The chances of him ever hitting the open market is slim to none, however, IMO. He is too good a player for Boston to pass up and overpay for Holliday/ another lesser value option, IMO.

With Heyward being ready in about two-three years(msybe four), I would rather sign a short term option like DeRosa or just stick with Diaz/Anderson/??? as a platoon.

Atlanta could consider dealing Javier Vazquez to help out the struggling Braves offense.

-I really think this needs to happen. He's got a high SO rate so he's got value; he's certainly got more value than Kawakami who most likely cannot be unloaded. And NO, he has not "been the Braves best pitcher so far this year." That assumption is laughable for obvious reasons. Don't forget: moving Javy also moves his contract.

I really don't think C. Hart is the answer. Regardless, the Braves aren't in the same bind other teams are in (ie in need of pitching), so there's no need to make a desperate deal.

....With Kawakami not producing as hoped...

Posted by: OldOak33 | June 01, 2009 at 09:37 AM

Actually, this isn't correct. Kawakami has been pretty good lately. He has given up three runs or less in his last five starts. He really has only had one awful outing the entire season. The problem is that the team is not scoring runs for him. They have only scored a total of 15 runs in his 9 starts. That is less than two runs per start. That has got to be one of the worst run support of any starter in MLB.

The Braves knew what JV's contract was when they traded for him, why, after 2 months of a season would the Braves get rid of him? Especially if he's producing? He's got to be one of the most underrated starters in the league right now.
The speculation that Kawakami is a "gateway" to the Japanese market is pointless. Money talks, and if the Braves got rid of Kawakami, they could easily buy out another #5 guy for 7 mil a year and call it a day. I bet the Braves wish they could move Kawakami right now, and believe me, it wouldn't be because they're scared of burning bridges to the Japanese market.
Cheap, affordable, effective young arms are what many teams are craving this year. That's why they'd be traded for, and traded hard for.

Trading Vaz is not a good idea. When you replace Failcoeur with Diaz (who goes 2-5) then suddenly we score 9 runs. When we have Kelly, Escobar, Chipper, and BMac all healthy at the top of the order we will score some runs. Throw in GA now coming out of his slump and hitting well (HR yesterday!) and continued sold hitting from Kotch all we need is someone not terrible like Diaz in right.

With that said I think if we can trade away Failcoeur's contract to anyone and get even next to nothing in return then we should go after DeRosa. He would give us a solid RH bat to play RF and give us some power and flexibility (with Diaz taking over in RF) at 3B when chipper misses time. I could see Charlie Morton and a lesser younger arm getting sent to CLE for him as Morton has right now MLB stuff and is expendable.

I don't think it's fair to compare stats of a guy who hasn't pitched but two months worth of hitters in the U.S. to guys who have played all their life against them. While he needs to take a little bit better command, he still has room to learn and with a full season and McDowell's help, that shouldn't be a problem.

When you're paid 7 plus a year, anything's fair.

It doesn't really make sense to me to move JV before the end of this season, unless the braves intend on giving up on this season, and taking prospects. If the braves do trade Javy they need to get 2 outfielders not one to compete. I like Hanson, Medlen, and even Glavine and am fine running any of them out there, but only with a formidable lineup (Glavine isn't what he used to be and the kids are gonna have growing pains). If we could get DeRosa for Scott Diamond plus a lower level guy, and then trade Javy for another bat I'd be all for it. Of course this would require moving Frenchy. I just don't see us getting it worked out this year. With 4 guys as potential 1-2s, two top prospects, and KK as a solid number 5, this could be one heck of an offseason. Personally KK is the only one I'd be willing to move right now.

On another note, I really wish the Bravos would lock down Soriano. I'm just afraid the ridiculous 6.1M he's making this year will set too high of an expectation for him. However strong closers still got paid well last year, and its not inconceivable to see him getting 7 or so over a couple three years, and with his injury history I'd want absolutely no part of that.

I have thought the signing of Kawakami was a huge mistake from the start..There's an article on the AJC.com site about the Braves "eyeing" Dero..

On another note, I really wish the Bravos would lock down Soriano. I'm just afraid the ridiculous 6.1M he's making this year will set too high of an expectation for him. However strong closers still got paid well last year, and its not inconceivable to see him getting 7 or so over a couple three years, and with his injury history I'd want absolutely no part of that.

Posted by: bravo84 | June 01, 2009 at 10:09 AM

You know, I kind of think the same thing. I love Soriano and think he is much more dominant as a closer than Gonzalez. For some reason, the Braves seem to be in love with Gonzo. They both have had TJ surgery so they both have injury risks to them.

Given a choice I keep Soriano over Gonzo...but you are right 7 mil a year is too much for him....or Gonzalez.

I tend to like the Vasquez trade idea if we can get Hanson up and see what he can do before we trade JV away. In this pitching depleted market, Vasquez can be a power right handed arm that isnt out htere.

@Tsweet and BravesAllTheWay

Morton is the max I would give for DeRosa as he would be a perfect fit for our needs RF/3B with above average OPS. I offer him only because he is our most expendable of our MLB ready arms that CLE is demanding.

If they would go for something like Redmond, Diamond and throw in arm for DeRosa that would definately be a good deal.

Just for the Kawakami knockers I'd like to share this tibit of info. When given an extra day rest he is 2-2 with an ERA of 3.00 and has a K/9 of 9.75. Not to mention the fact that he hasn't given up more than 3 runs in any of those starts. I'm not sure whether that means he'll be fine when he adjusts to the 5-man rotation or if he just needs to be the number 5 so he can have extra rest more often, but I guarantee you if I was trying to trade him I'd spin the crap out of that. I do think he's overpaid and wish that money had gone too hitting, but I don't think that contract is immovable right now. In the offseason when FAs are available it might be, but with all the pitching starved teams out there he could definitely be moved. Not sure what the return would be, but there would be takers. At the deadline the braves will have already paid him 5.8M of his 23M contracts. 17.2M isn't enough of a committment to scare off a pitching starved team.

The fact that he NEEDS that extra day is the problem Bravo84...It's only the first day of June, and he NEEDS that extra day..or more

If that's your way of reasoning this situation, I hope the arm of a veteran Japanese pitcher can adjust as quickly as a stomach can

And DeRo for Vazquez is only a good deal if there's another move for an extra hitter in the works. (And Cleveland picks up all of JV's remaning salary.)

Ink-stained scribe,

Agreed completely. That's an interesting trade: JV for MD. Both are pending FA's and both could help a team that is contending/trying to contend. As you said, if that is the trade, hopefully there is another move fixing to happen or something.

Ink Stained, I totally agree with you. The Braves are a solid hitter away from being a contender in the NL East. The Phillies have pitching problems, the Mets are old, the Marlins are young and falling apart, and the Nats are one of the worst teams in baseball.

There is one trade that would make sense for both teams but would never happen. The Nationals need pitching but have great hitting. The Braves are just the opposite. How about trading Vazquez for Adam Dunn. They both make close to the same amount of money and are signed for the same amount of years. Both teams would improve their weakness and neither would have to give up good young prospects to do it. I'm not a big fan of Adam Dunn but someone that can hit home runs in the middle of the lineup would sure be nice, especially with all of the Braves' high OBP buys like Escobar, KJ, Kotchman, etc.

OldOak33,

Don't put words in my mouth. Nowhere did I say or even suggest that the Braves intended to trade JV this soon after getting him. Wren hoped that the roster he assembled coming out of camp would hit well enough to support the fine pitching staff he built.

Doing that meant a full rebound by Frenchy, Schafer not playing like a rookie, GA being healthy and productive, and Chipper not missing a lot of time from injuries. Wren has pretty much said that recently: He hoped the offense would do better than most people expected.

You can argue whether that was a good plan or a bad plan, but what's clear now is that it hasn't fully worked.

So if you're a GM who's invested a lot in winning this year, what do you do? You make adjustments. If trading Vazquez nets you a hitter and improves your chances of winning this year, it's one thing you consider.

Wow this is awful. A lot of you are saying we should break up our strongest aspect of our team in order to fix the team. Why would we trade JV who can go deep into every game? Everyone is talking about trading him and using Hanson/Medlen/Glavine. Hanson and Medlen are both giant "IFs" and we don't know how they'll fair in the bigs. Glavine will have an extremely hard time going even 5 innings, he had trouble doing that before the surgery. All trading him is doing is creating another gaping hole in our team. The only thing that makes sense is to trade prospects who don't really have much of a future in Atlanta such as Morton/C. Johnson/Locke for an impact bat. Not another average hitter like derosa/spillborghs/hart.

Please please please stop trying to fill a hole by creating another, it's ridiculous.

bbxxj

So your going to bank on Diaz all year in RF?!?! I say we trade Vazquez, Francoeur and Freeman to the Rangers for Nelson Cruz and a PTBNL(Justin Smoak)

I'd keep Medlen in the rotation unless he absolutely crashes. So here's how my team would look.

Johnson
Escobar
Jones
McCann
Cruz
Anderson
Kotchman
Schafer

Lowe
Jurrjens
Kawakami
Hanson
Medlen

We'd still have Morton, Reyes, Glavine and Hudson(who'd be just like acquiring a SP at the deadline) if anyone in the rotation begans to slump.

BravesRed

Um.......I think Smoak has more value that your not giving him credit for. Do you know who Justin Smoak is?

im gonna be honest i just wish the Braves would do something soon. because i am getting very tired of an inconsistant braves team where they score 2 in one game then the next day break out 9 runs. i just want some stability and i think someone like Derosa would bring that to Atlanta. i just hope that Wren can get something done before we are out of the race in the NL East.
Do you really want to give up a pretty consistant SP (JV) for Hart, who is in a serious slump right now, and in danger of losing an everyday pos and could be platooning?

Trading Vazquez makes sense? Absolutely.

Trading him for Corey Hart? Oh god no. Corey Hart is not that good. He had one really good year in 2007, but besides that, he hasn't had another season where he's been worth more than 1 WAR. Considering arbitration increases, he'll probably be worth less than his arb salary next year.

Vazquez is easily a 4-5 WAR player.

Trading Vazquez makes sense, but there is ZERO reason for the Braves to trade Vazquez unless they're getting a young, good, cost-controlled, and under Braves control for at least 2 years bat.

Vazquez is probably one of the most underrated players in baseball.

Adam Jones is NOT going anywhere. Period. Teams generally do NOT trade their young superstars who are controlled for long periods of time.

Stark has a piece up saying that our entire rotation and Hanson are off limits according to his sources and that we would demand a significant return for any of Reyes, Morton, or Medlen.

DFA Anderson*

whoever said that vasquez and derosa have the same amount of years on there contracts is wrong. derosa is a free agent after this vasquez has another year left, that would be a horrible trade. derosa is a good hitter but they would have to through in choo with us throwing in a prospect. braves should have three trade options:hawpe,l scott or a dunn. dunn to the braves could work if they traded soriano and got rid of francour move diaz to right lineup would look like this
cf infante(schafer every 5th day or pitch running)
ss escobar
3b jones
lf dunn
c mccann
1b kotchman
2b johnson or prado
rf diaz
pitcher
they would save 6 mil on soriano 3 on francour
fact of the matter is they should have picked up dunn in the offseason anyways he sat on the open market forever. i dont wanna hear this crap about openning a road to the japennese market because the only good player from there is ichiro and even he is like 40 so big deal if they could keep soriano and trade kawakami and hanson should be up because he is past the super 2 thing right?

I think JV has done a great job thus far, however he is expendable. Medlin has done fine, Glavine will to fine, and I think Hanson will excel. Hudson shouldn't factor in because I think he will start in the pen. I think there are two perfect fits for a trade, baltimore and nationals for the two guys many of you have mentioned, Scott and Dunn. I think one outside the box option is Carlos Lee with Houston, the only holdup is his massive contract. But unlike the other two he is RH. I think JV would have to be included for contract reasons and then you can deal Francoeur for some minor leaguer. The $ virtually was for two years, and we are left with the 3rd.

The Garret Anderson haters are getting annoying. He has been probably our most productive outfielder in May and since he got off the DL is hitting around .350-.375 with 2 homers and 15-18 RBI's. He is doing fine.