Odds And Ends: Holliday, Yabu, Bay, Latos

If Wren would do that trade, not only will fans call for Wren's job, but also his head. Escobar alone can get both of them plus more.

He could get them plus a whole lot more. They are both rentals, Yunel is cost controlled for 4 more years, I can only see this as a corresponding move to trading Vasquez for the other Escobar, but Milwaukee says he's untouchable. Maybe a three way trade sending Cabrera to the Brew Crew and Hardy to Atlanta, but Hardy alone certainly wouldn't be worth Vasquez and Cabrera, and the braves would still want a good young arm from the A's.

wait a minute, a read this wrong. There is now way that the braves are thinking about sending prospects too. IF he is going to make the tradde, only send esco and get at minimum 4 players in return.

Pretty absurd. And Urban hears the Braves will be throwing in some prospects as well. I wonder who he's hearing. Is it Heyward? Maybe Freeman. Is Hanson still considered a prospect?

Posted by: garriscp | July 14, 2009 at 10:36 AM

Hanson is worth more than the whole A's franchise.

Hanson is worth more than the whole A's franchise."

That is an utterly stupid statement. The As have a ton of good prospects so to say something like that is just ignorant.

Posted by: BucSox | July 14, 2009 at 10:42 AM

Ok, thats coming froming a soc fan that is the cockiest fan of baseball.(or yanks)

Bucsox I believe that was sarcasm.
But if the braves made this trade it would be extremly Dumb. Unless we get an extension out of Holliday and a middle infield prospect that's close to the majors. The A's can keep Orlando.

now there's somebody being reasonable.

The only way i'd like to see the Braves make that trade is leave Cabrera out, and include TWO top ten prospect for Holliday.

escobar only gets on base around 350. batting averages are nice, on base percentages are better. he isnt worth holliday and 2 prospects. i agree the braves dont need cabrera, but im think alone bravesfansince1990 train of thought, holliday with an extension and a middle infield prospect. and dont forget if holliday isnt extended he's worth 2 first round picks as he walks.

4 years of escobar worth more than what 6 years of 2 first round picks? yeah ok

Holliday away from Coors field apparently isnt that great of a hitter. The Braves can find plenty of Of'rs with a .790 OPS to trade Yunel for. Also, Holliday really doesnt have much value with his numbers and being a FA who will likely accept arbitration offered from any team.

Why dont the braves trade for adrian gonzalez. they need power and i would much rather him then matt.

how bout casey kelly jonhson and a prospect(s) for adrian and peavy

Why dont the braves trade for adrian gonzalez. they need power and i would much rather him then matt.

how bout casey kelly jonhson and a prospect(s) for adrian and peavy

he must not be terrible he carries a 373 obp. i sure chipper would help him home plenty of times.

The main point is that replacing Anderson + Escobar with Holliday + Cabrera is not enough of an offensive upgrade (if any) to get the Braves the division. If they want to trade Escobar, they can find a better player to trade him for than Holliday and use Infante at SS when he returns shortly after the break.

i no the braves need a righty but still i would rather a lefty in adrian then a righty in matt who will leave aftr this year. i am not sure about adrians contract but i am pretty sure he is not a fa in 2010

So do you think Hanson is worth more than the A's franchise or we're you just being facetious?

Posted by: DeJay | July 14, 2009 at 10:58 AM

Okay, when i said franchise, i ment MLB team, not whole farm system. There is not one package on the A's team i would accept for tommy hanson alone, even if they paid for the players sent to them.

.270 ave 14 hr 49rbi 51r 11sb and .349 obp

.276ave 8 hr 43rbi 10sb .373 obp

guy on the top is mcclouth. the other is holliday

also holliday is hitting .287 out of oakland. where hitters go to die....

seriously he went from one extreme to the other.

anyone think of luke scott? bet he is cheaper than all the above mentioned guys and i think he is under team control for like two more years

You can't say that Heyward, the #1 prospect by BA, and Tommy Hanson, the former #3 prospect by BA, are not worth their franchise.

Anyway, why do we want to trade Freeman? He's our future first-baseman and is gonna really mash at the bigs,instead of Kotchman, who doesn't fit the bill as far as our needs.

shouldnt production matter more than a name? dudes got 18 jacks in 230 at bats.

lee?

Barbaro Canizares? He!! no, he's "29"(allegedly), and is no more than a RH bat off the bench.

Though if we trade Kotchman, he could stop-gap till Freeman arrives.

while we are on the subject... anyone have a clue as to why beane broke script and picked up cabrera holliday and giambi in the first place? in this economy no less....

Well a good mix of vets(Giambi, Holliday, Cabrera) with youngsters(Cahill,Anderson,Cunningham) would be a wise move, however it just didn't pan out.

"while we are on the subject... anyone have a clue as to why beane broke script and picked up cabrera holliday and giambi in the first place? in this economy no less...."

Beane sensed a buyers' market. Nobody expected Giambi and Cabrera to fall off the face of the earth the way they did. Everyone expected a mild decline, but they didn't expect Giambi to drop 200 OPS points and O-Fail to drop that many OPS points AND lose his ability to play passable defense. And, considering what 1 year of similar players to Holliday cost in trade in past years, Beane sensed a buyers' market and went for it. And there was pressure from ownership. If Giambi and OCab and Holliday were even remotely close to their '08 performance (I'm looking at wOBA for Holliday, which is park adjusted), this team would be contending. Oh, and Geren and Skaalen not being morons and changing Cust's plate approach (he's fixing it to an extent though). Irritates me to no end. And, all their contracts come off the books after this season. The team is also likely to spend on the draft, as evidenced by the fact that they drafted overslot guys Green, Stassi, Krol, and Dyson.

"I think beanes getting a little scared that Matt might accept arbitration if offered. His #s are down and he might think hey Ill take 15 mil a year from the A's and see if I can rebound and then hit the market again then...I think the return will be alot less than what people think. A couple decent prospects but no blue chippers..."

Why would Beane be scared of that? That's best case scenario. Having a really good player on a 1 year deal when you play in one of the worst hitters' environments in baseball is a really good thing. The team has a LOT of money coming off the books after this year.

And, Holliday would never accept arbitration. If he wants a 1 year "prove yourself" deal, he goes and gets one in a hitters' paradise, not in Oakland.

i think a Peavy, Adrian Gonzalez deal to ATL for some prospects would work if it were the right prospects. didnt peavy already identify the Braves as a team he would waive his no-trade clause for? getting Matt Holliday could end up being another Mark Teixeira-like situation for the Braves where he leaves after one half a season and the Braves couldn't make a serious playoff run with him anyway

does schaer still have a shot

Alwaysabrave, just shutup please. You are giving Braves fans a worse reputation every time you speak. We dont need a first baseman unless its short term. Freeman will be up probably to start 2011 at first. Why do we need Peavy? We have one of the best rotations in baseball. And by the way the Astros will never trade Carlos Lee or Lance Berkman this year. Also I dont believe this writer that speaks of this trade. I could see us going after Holliday, but I wouldnt think so in this kind of package.

I just wish Bay would have come to us last July.

abuc17,

The scuttlebutt was that the Braves never made the Peavy deal over the winter because Peavy WOULD NOT waive his NTC to come to Atlanta. So even if that deal made sense, it wouldn't happen. Peavy doesn't want to play for Atlanta.

Also, the Braves had Tex for 1.5 seasons, not half a season. They got him in July 2007 and traded him last year.

abuc17,

You may be thinking about a comment Chipper made in which he said Peavy told him he would like to play in Atlanta. When he had the opportunity to do so, however, he refused.

CitizenSnips,

What exactly is ridiculous about that deal? He didn't name any prospects, nor did he indicate they'd have to be big time names. Vazquez is worth more than Hardy at this point as they both are under contract for one more year and Vazquez has outperformed Hardy by miles this year. The Brewers also have Alcides Escobar so losing Hardy wouldn't be a huge blow. As for Yunel for Holliday, that one isn't even close to equal value as Yunel is the far more valuable player. Acting like that proposal is so insane that they might as well include Fielder, Braun, Cahill, and Anderson is just asinine on your part.

I dont think a team will sacrafice draft picks for a hitter who has the Coors stigma, much less for one year.

How many teams who are rebuilding would love to have a SS of Escobars skills to build around?

Escobar, outside of E. Longria, Upton, Kemp, and other player of the elk, is as valuable as they come. A SS with good range and glove who can hit.

Sixth best SS in the MAJORs in OPS.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting?split=0&league=mlb&season=2009&seasonType=2&sort=OPS&type=reg&ageMin=17&ageMax=51&state=0&college=0&country=0&hand=a&pos=ss&startDate=null&endDate=null&minpa=0

Dont see this deal happening unless another team gets involved as I dont think Okland has what the Braves want.

Let me know what you think.

Braves get: holliday,hardy, and prospects from brewers an a's

Brewers get: vazquez

A's get: yunel

I would also like holliday to be a sign and trade.

Posted by: OklahomaBrave | July 14, 2009 at 12:01 PM

Actually, this makes some sense but I would prefer getting Alcides Escobar to Hardy. He is younger, better, and team controlled longer. Hardy is too streaky.

how do guys all figure escobar to be "one of the best fielding ss in the national league" he's 11th among starting nl ss in fielding percentage. there are only 16 starting nl ss. and he is tied for second in errors. thats not "best" thats more like worst. and his "career .300 batting ave" seems heavily influenced by a great rookie season where he hit what .326?

"how do guys all figure escobar to be "one of the best fielding ss in the national league" he's 11th among starting nl ss in fielding percentage. there are only 16 starting nl ss. and he is tied for second in errors. thats not "best" thats more like worst. and his "career .300 batting ave" seems heavily influenced by a great rookie season where he hit what .326?"

Fielding percentage is an awful way to measure defense. But The Fielding Bible liked his defense, and UZR has generally varied on him (it was really good last year, but meh this year). Considering positional adjustments, which are HUGE, he's a solid defender.

And looking outside of BA, he's still one of the better OPSing SS in the league.

It isnt only about fielding percentage and errors. Yunel regularly makes plays very few other shortstops can. He plays game changing defense.

and let me ask you this: how well would yuniel hit in oakland? rotowire has their stadium in the "extreme pitcher's park catagory" and atlanta in the neutral catagory. atlanta's park yield the third most runs in the nl last year whereas oak's had the least amount of runs scored in the al. does his numbers drop in oakland? do hollidays improve? obviously not to the point of colorado... but could he hit 25 hr in atlanta?

Escobar is not a home run hitter. He has a line drive stroke. Changing parks would not make a differences.

roguesaw,

Even Melonis Rex, an A's fan, will freely admit that Yunel Escobar is far more valuable than Matt Holliday. What's you're point here? Escobar is one of the better young SS in the game. He's a very good hitter for the position and is at least solid defensively. He's also under team control through 2013. That's a very valuable commodity.

Oh and trying to classify parks by the number of runs scored there doesn't work as it doesn't adjust for the relative talent of the hitters and pitchers playing there. That's why park adjustments compare the relative performance of a team and their opponents at the team's home park and the rest of the parks in the league.

How about something like Cody Johnson and Medlen for Holiday ? Johnsons a former first round pick with a ton of upside. If the A's are worried about Holiday accepting arb then this wouldnt be a terrible return. Offer them Barbaro as well, he could be a nice piece to a AL team.

what package the braves can put together that is similar to what they gave for nate mcclouth is probably about on par for what they should give for holliday.

if escobar is the second coming of derek jeter or hanley ramirez than i guess that doesnt include him.

Wow is this escobar that overrated. no way beane buys high on this guy. the a's need some pop in the lineup and this guy sadly reminds me a little of bobby crosby which is the a's worst nightmare. Escobar is alright but not going to be a perenial all star. holliday and cabrera should be dealt in separate deals. cabreras value has to be jumping as of late with his bat. holiday has just been jinxed by the coaching of bob geren who I believe has never coached a 300 hitter. The only coach that knows how to turn 300 hitters to 250 hitters.

well for starters if his as good as all you guys say he is why trade him? why include him if offers, why does every rumor start with him? is he that good or are you selling high? and what do you have to play the position if you move him? infante? who?

you guys are what? 6 games off the division lead? 7 from the wild card? you have an opportunity to make a run you make it. go get holliday.

also whats with the vazquez rumors?

does anyone really thin beane even trades holliday? isnt the draft what he lives for? i cant imagine holliday takes arb to play there another year. could a team like the yanks use him? now there is a stadium to resurrect a career.