Mystery Team After Cliff Lee

A mystery team is pursuing Cliff Lee, tweets Ed Price of AOL FanHouse.  According to Price, the Cardinals "may be it."  Price believes that top prospect Shelby Miller is a possible chip.

Six years of Miller would be an impressive return for two-plus months of Lee, but the Cardinals would have to be intrigued by the possibility of having three aces in the rotation.  Drafted out of high school, Miller is a few years away from the Majors but is said to have number one starter stuff.  Since the Cardinals signed the first-round pick on August 17th of last year, he could only be traded as a player to be named later (named after a year has passed from the time of his signing).


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144 Comments on "Mystery Team After Cliff Lee"


chaifetz10
5 years 1 month ago

As much as I want the Cardinals to trade for Lee, 6 years of Miller for 2 months of Lee is a little bit pricey. There is no way they would be able to resign him and pay him big bucks as long as they still want to resign Pujols and keep paying Waino, Carp, and Holliday.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

im ok w/ carp leaving/reworking his contract. no secret he is on the decline. and he has a pretty hefty option, which i hope can be reworked and spread over 2 years, if not, its been fun watching him.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

im ok w/ carp leaving/reworking his contract. no secret he is on the decline. and he has a pretty hefty option, which i hope can be reworked and spread over 2 years, if not, its been fun watching him.

boy9988
5 years 1 month ago

I agree. I’m a Mariner fan and i would love to get Miller, but I just don’t get it from the Cardinals standpoint. They cant keep both Lee and Pujols. This one doesn’t pass the smell test.

boy9988
5 years 1 month ago

I agree. I’m a Mariner fan and i would love to get Miller, but I just don’t get it from the Cardinals standpoint. They cant keep both Lee and Pujols. This one doesn’t pass the smell test.

chaifetz10
5 years 1 month ago

As much as I want the Cardinals to trade for Lee, 6 years of Miller for 2 months of Lee is a little bit pricey. There is no way they would be able to resign him and pay him big bucks as long as they still want to resign Pujols and keep paying Waino, Carp, and Holliday.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

is that even fair?

a rotation of

carpenter
wainwright
lee
garcia
penny

would absolutely be devastating..i mean seriously how many people can say they have a cy young winner as their #3?

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

then again, the rotation could be re-ordered to go

carpenter
lee
wainwright
garcia
penny

for the R/L/R/L/R thing.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

then again, the rotation could be re-ordered to go

carpenter
lee
wainwright
garcia
penny

for the R/L/R/L/R thing.

Piccamo
5 years 1 month ago

In what world is Lee not a #1 on that staff? He’s better than both Carpenter and Wainright, even with accounting for park and defense.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

ok, so then wainwright would be a #3. how many teams can say they have a guy that should have won the cy young last year as their #3?

happy now.

Piccamo
5 years 1 month ago

Haha fair enough. With those three the order really wouldn’t matter, Lee just happens to be my favorite pitcher at the moment 😛

Piccamo
5 years 1 month ago

Haha fair enough. With those three the order really wouldn’t matter, Lee just happens to be my favorite pitcher at the moment 😛

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

ok, so then wainwright would be a #3. how many teams can say they have a guy that should have won the cy young last year as their #3?

happy now.

Mickeyblue
5 years 1 month ago

In a world that Wainwright is pitching that’s where

wwy
5 years 1 month ago

I’m a big Cardinals fan and a big Wainwright fan, but Lee would have to be slotted in as the #1 starter in any of these scenarios. I would go Lee, Wainwright, Carpenter. But I don’t see any sort of Lee deal happening with the Cardinals.

5 years 1 month ago

No way…you’re deeply undervaluing at least wainwright…

5 years 1 month ago

No way…you’re deeply undervaluing at least wainwright…

Taskmaster75
5 years 1 month ago

I don’t think so. Wainwright is the 2nd best pitcher so far this year behind Jimenez in the NL, and has been absolutely brilliant, and although he had a rough start in his last turn, he would still be the #1.

wwy
5 years 1 month ago

I’m a big Cardinals fan and a big Wainwright fan, but Lee would have to be slotted in as the #1 starter in any of these scenarios. I would go Lee, Wainwright, Carpenter. But I don’t see any sort of Lee deal happening with the Cardinals.

Mickeyblue
5 years 1 month ago

In a world that Wainwright is pitching that’s where

Piccamo
5 years 1 month ago

In what world is Lee not a #1 on that staff? He’s better than both Carpenter and Wainright, even with accounting for park and defense.

5 years 1 month ago

The Giants could. (Zito)

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

just throwing some names out their:

allen craig, tearing it up in the minors. no spot for him in the cardinals future
+
eduardo sanchez, great reliever, future closer.
+
tyler greene
+
deryk hooker

too little? or about right. this is for just 2 months after all….

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

None of those guys is enough to be the best player in a trade for Lee. I’m assuming if he can’t get someone with greater upside, Jack Z would rather take two draft picks.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

good point. i keep forgetting that lee would also get 2 high draft picks.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

good point. i keep forgetting that lee would also get 2 high draft picks.

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

None of those guys is enough to be the best player in a trade for Lee. I’m assuming if he can’t get someone with greater upside, Jack Z would rather take two draft picks.

Jiujitsu411420
5 years 1 month ago

Throw in pujols and you got a deal…..Jk/hahaha

Lanidrac
5 years 1 month ago

Um, Craig is expected to be the starting right fielder in 2 years after we have to let Ludwick go in free agency.

DJ_2
5 years 1 month ago

Yankees!!!!! Although that would make no sense since they don’t need a SP. Also, since when are the Yankees a “mystery team”. Anyways, I was bored and felt like posting something.

Why would the Cardinals be interested. Their rotation is dirty with Wainwright, Carpenter and Jaime Garcia. Makes no sense to rent Lee for 2 months when you can already win the division the way your rotation is now.

DJ_2
5 years 1 month ago

Yankees!!!!! Although that would make no sense since they don’t need a SP. Also, since when are the Yankees a “mystery team”. Anyways, I was bored and felt like posting something.

Why would the Cardinals be interested. Their rotation is dirty with Wainwright, Carpenter and Jaime Garcia. Makes no sense to rent Lee for 2 months when you can already win the division the way your rotation is now.

5 years 1 month ago

Remember, it’s 2 months of one of the top 5 pitchers in baseball for an insignificant amount of money, plus the two high draft picks he will net next year. This seems like just another speculation piece by a writer trying to make a story (a “mystery team” that “may be” the Cardinals and a trade piece “may be” Shelby Miller)… But a team giving up a top prospect for the package of such an amazing pitcher and a couple draft picks wouldn’t be out of line.

5 years 1 month ago

I think top 5 is a stretch…

Bodhizefa
5 years 1 month ago

Even after missing a month, Cliff Lee is tied with Roy Halladay for most WAR thus far this season. It’s not a stretch at all. Cliff Lee is one of the top 5 pitchers in baseball right now. And there’s a good argument to be made that he may even be #1.

5 years 1 month ago

I think top 5 is a stretch…

5 years 1 month ago

Remember, it’s 2 months of one of the top 5 pitchers in baseball for an insignificant amount of money, plus the two high draft picks he will net next year. This seems like just another speculation piece by a writer trying to make a story (a “mystery team” that “may be” the Cardinals and a trade piece “may be” Shelby Miller)… But a team giving up a top prospect for the package of such an amazing pitcher and a couple draft picks wouldn’t be out of line.

5 years 1 month ago

I doubt this is going to happen; if for no other reason that the Mariners have said they want “Major League ready” talent. A rookie with a 1-3 record in A ball with a 4.75 ERA hardly screams “ready.” Unless some combination of Rasmus/Carpenter/Ludwick are thrown in, I don’t see this coming to fruition.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

the era is hardly a telling sign…how about the fact he was drafted out of high school and has is striking out hitters at a nice 12.2K/9innings rate or that almost all high schoolers have command issues (no seriously, how many polished high school pitchers have their been) and has a 3.53 K:BB ratio. those are much more telling than ERA.

5 years 1 month ago

I won’t disagree that those are more telling numbers, and I am not disputing the fact that he is a very highly touted prospect, I am simply commenting on the fact that the M’s have repeatedly said they want MLB ready talent for Lee. And at this point, a 1.5 WHIP and 4.75 ERA in A-ball is still a few years away.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

the era is hardly a telling sign…how about the fact he was drafted out of high school and has is striking out hitters at a nice 12.2K/9innings rate or that almost all high schoolers have command issues (no seriously, how many polished high school pitchers have their been) and has a 3.53 K:BB ratio. those are much more telling than ERA.

chaifetz10
5 years 1 month ago

I can guarantee you that Rasmus/Carpenter/Ludwick would not be in any deal for Lee. Prospects and other players such as Schumaker or Ryan could be part of the deal, but the three you list are major keystones on this team.

5 years 1 month ago

Agreed. Which is why I said I don’t think this will happen. The M’s aren’t going to give up one of the top 3 pitchers in baseball for Brendon Ryan (.201 BA, .274 OBP, 15 rbis) or Skip Schumaker (.258 BA, .324 OBP, 18 rbis) as the “MLB ready” talent they want…even if the deal does include Miller.

Nicolas_C
5 years 1 month ago

Then you probably won’t have Cliff Lee. It seems like Rasmus is a player the Mariners would really want, since he clearly is major league ready (as was said above the Mariners want major league ready talent), and has incredible potential. The Mariners wouldn’t even want Carpenter or Ludwick, since by trading Lee they would show they aren’t playing to win now. The only other way is if you package Miller, David Freese, and a couple medium-high upside guys.

chaifetz10
5 years 1 month ago

This is why I feel that teams should not overpay for a rental. Yes top prospects are great to use as trade chips, but a player like Rasmus who has proven to be the Cardinals CF of the present and future is not even on the block. And David Freese has claimed himself the 3B for years to come…thus I wouldn’t even want Cliff Lee if you demanded Rasmus or Freese.

Nicolas_C
5 years 1 month ago

Don’t forget, it’s a rental of Lee and 2 high draft picks, since there’s a 99.9% chance he declines arbitration. I agree that trading Rasmus is pretty unreasonable but I’m just saying that pretty much means Lee isn’t heading to St Louis. I think the trade with Freese is pretty reasonable because while he’s an above average 3B, he doesn’t have much potential to be a star, since he’s already 27. Basically, Miller and Freese would be given up for Lee and the 2 medium-high upside guys would be for the 2 draft picks he would net.

Also, a few months ago I read an ESPN article, and it showed the team acquiring the big name got the better side of the deal than the one that got the prospects about 75% of the time.

chaifetz10
5 years 1 month ago

This is why I feel that teams should not overpay for a rental. Yes top prospects are great to use as trade chips, but a player like Rasmus who has proven to be the Cardinals CF of the present and future is not even on the block. And David Freese has claimed himself the 3B for years to come…thus I wouldn’t even want Cliff Lee if you demanded Rasmus or Freese.

Ferrariman
5 years 1 month ago

no way they let rasmus go. he is leading the NL in slugging. oh yeah, he is a center fielder. the amount it would take to get him far and beyond exceeds cliff lee. i think he is also top 3 among NL outfielders in OPS as well.

Nicolas_C
5 years 1 month ago

Then you probably won’t have Cliff Lee. It seems like Rasmus is a player the Mariners would really want, since he clearly is major league ready (as was said above the Mariners want major league ready talent), and has incredible potential. The Mariners wouldn’t even want Carpenter or Ludwick, since by trading Lee they would show they aren’t playing to win now. The only other way is if you package Miller, David Freese, and a couple medium-high upside guys.

chaifetz10
5 years 1 month ago

I can guarantee you that Rasmus/Carpenter/Ludwick would not be in any deal for Lee. Prospects and other players such as Schumaker or Ryan could be part of the deal, but the three you list are major keystones on this team.

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

Miller was considered a top seven or eight talent in a much better draft last year. I wouldn’t worry about the stats.

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

Miller was considered a top seven or eight talent in a much better draft last year. I wouldn’t worry about the stats.

5 years 1 month ago

I doubt this is going to happen; if for no other reason that the Mariners have said they want “Major League ready” talent. A rookie with a 1-3 record in A ball with a 4.75 ERA hardly screams “ready.” Unless some combination of Rasmus/Carpenter/Ludwick are thrown in, I don’t see this coming to fruition.

showmejoe
5 years 1 month ago

If they only had to give up Miller I would do it, and I am a huge Cardinals fan. I know their system is not good right now, but there is no guaratee that Miller is going to be a superstar and we all know Lee is. Even if they do not resign Lee they get draft picks when he signs elsewhere. Nobody knows when Lohse or Penny will be back and it would be a waste of a season if they do not go deep into the playoffs because of a weak back of rotation performance.

showmejoe
5 years 1 month ago

If they only had to give up Miller I would do it, and I am a huge Cardinals fan. I know their system is not good right now, but there is no guaratee that Miller is going to be a superstar and we all know Lee is. Even if they do not resign Lee they get draft picks when he signs elsewhere. Nobody knows when Lohse or Penny will be back and it would be a waste of a season if they do not go deep into the playoffs because of a weak back of rotation performance.

stl_cards16
5 years 1 month ago

I would think the Mariners would want quite a bit more than Shelby Miller. If it’s not going to cost much more than him, then the Cards should do it. When Lee leaves via free agency you will pick up a 1st round pick anyway. I would think any team would be willing to deal a high ceiling prospect thats 3 or 4 years away from the majors. You can just draft another one next year. Only thing it would cost the Cardinals would basically be Millers signing bonus and the rest of Lee’s salary this year.

Just can’t see it being the Cardinals

stl_cards16
5 years 1 month ago

I would think the Mariners would want quite a bit more than Shelby Miller. If it’s not going to cost much more than him, then the Cards should do it. When Lee leaves via free agency you will pick up a 1st round pick anyway. I would think any team would be willing to deal a high ceiling prospect thats 3 or 4 years away from the majors. You can just draft another one next year. Only thing it would cost the Cardinals would basically be Millers signing bonus and the rest of Lee’s salary this year.

Just can’t see it being the Cardinals

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

I buy it. The Cards have shown willingness to trade a big first rounder the following year, and Miller’s a nice top piece for a package.

Maybe Miller and Bryan Anderson?

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

I buy it. The Cards have shown willingness to trade a big first rounder the following year, and Miller’s a nice top piece for a package.

Maybe Miller and Bryan Anderson?

progmatinee
5 years 1 month ago

Franklin Morales, Esmil Rogers, Greg Reynolds, and Greg Smith for Lee .

Hawpe and Lee will get about the same compensation at the end of the year so its all those young pitchers for the last few years of Ichiro’s career.

progmatinee
5 years 1 month ago

Franklin Morales, Esmil Rogers, Greg Reynolds, and Greg Smith for Lee .

Hawpe and Lee will get about the same compensation at the end of the year so its all those young pitchers for the last few years of Ichiro’s career.

progmatinee
5 years 1 month ago

oops. originally i had an elaborate scheme to trade all those pitchers plus hawpe for lee and ichiro, but then realized how silly it was, but forgot to delete it all. haha.

progmatinee
5 years 1 month ago

oops. originally i had an elaborate scheme to trade all those pitchers plus hawpe for lee and ichiro, but then realized how silly it was, but forgot to delete it all. haha.