Molina Extension Talks On Hold, Won’t Give Discount

3:30pm: Rains' full article on the situation is posted at FOXSportsMidwest.com. While there doesn't seem to be a deadline on talks, Molina did say that like most players, he prefers to focus on the game during the season rather than his contract. He also shot down the idea of offering St. Louis a hometown discount:

"I don't know about that,” Molina said. "Like I always say, I like the town and I like the city, but at the same time, I have to think about my family. You have to worry about your family like they worry about the team. This is business. If I get good money, I'll take it. If not, I'll go away.”

2:37pm: Yadier Molina spoke very candidly about his contract situation today, according to B.J. Rains of FOX Sports Midwest, who reports that he and the Cardinals have put extension talks on hold for the time being. Rains notes that Molina said he's still willing to re-open negotiations (Twitter links).

The Cards picked up Molina's $7MM option shortly after their World Series victory, ensuring that the youngest Molina brother would be in St. Louis for at least one more season. MLBTR's Mark Polishuk recently identified Yadi as an extension candidate, concluding that he could fetch a four- or five-year deal with an average annual value in excess of $10MM on the open market.

A fourth round draft pick of St. Louis back in 2000, the Puerto Rico native has spent his entire career with the Cardinals. Molina signed a four-year deal worth $15.5MM prior to the 2008 season. That value has escalated to a total of $22.85MM over five years after his option was exercised and he picked up $350K in bonuses for his four Gold Gloves and three All-Star selections.

The 29-year-old enjoyed a career year last season when he hit .305/.349/.465 (career highs in average and slugging) and also added career highs in homers (14), doubles (32), and RBI (65).

Thanks to Cot's Baseball Contracts for details on Molina's contract bonuses.


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102 Comments on "Molina Extension Talks On Hold, Won’t Give Discount"


Devon Henry
3 years 6 months ago

His stock is as high as it ever will be. If i was him i would get a deal done.

thebigbangdito
3 years 6 months ago

I really think he should sign with cards… coming from an angel fan, which we would probably be one of the top teams going for him next year..and i wouldnt mind having him… but i still think he should stay with cards.. its just a good fit.

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

Scoscia would just find a way to bring back Mathis and have him play in front of Molina…

3 years 6 months ago

Originally he said he wasn’t going to close off talks. Sounds to me he’s as good as gone.

David McCutcheon
3 years 6 months ago

I can see him fetching $70m from the Yanks on the market at 5 years. It will be interesting to see how the Cards handle this, as Yadi will presumably walk away. Cards fans tolerated Albert due to the large contract, but it will be interesting to see how many talented guys they can watch the organization lose before becoming uncomfortable, given the question marks in Lance Berkman following 2012 and possible complications to Waino’s TJS. It will certainly be an interesting 2012, unlike ’07.

Jason Richards
3 years 6 months ago

Theres no way molina gets 70 million…………..

3 years 6 months ago

Not even close….

Stuart Brown
3 years 6 months ago

No? That’s just $14MM per year. He’s definitely worth between $12-15MM per year. Possibly more depending on the teams involved.

3 years 6 months ago

Nowhere close…. you would have to be crazy to pay a catcher with limited to no power that kind of money.

johnsilver
3 years 6 months ago

Matt Holliday deal bites St. Louis again. 1st it probably affected how far they were willing to go for Pujols and now may for one of the best defensive catchers in the game, as I see him getting 4/40-45m and mid market cardinals not being able to pony it up, even with a couple of bad contracts leaving. They have other holes to fill also.

some teams can absorb a 7/120m contract and get away with it for a player like Holliday, but sorry cardinals fans.. holliday is a complimentary player outside of Coors field and not someone you build a team around.

astrostl
3 years 6 months ago

Holliday is the #1 MLB LF and #9 MLB position player per fWAR over the past 3 calendar years.  The Cardinals only have 68MM committed in 2012, 24MM in 2013.  Holliday is a top-tier baseball player, and his contract should not rate to limit an extension for Molina – if they want it.

3 years 6 months ago

Holliday is the #1 MLB LF… I think WAR needs to be recalibrated as well. The other day a scouts radar gun clocked Kazmir at 91 and now WAR says Holiday is the #1 Lf’er in all of baseball. Talk about a weak field then if that is truly the case. Don’t get me wrong, when healthy he is one of the best hitters in all of baseball. His defense however leaves much to be desired. How about Alex Gordon from the Royals  maybe he’ll be #1 in 2012.

astrostl
3 years 6 months ago

#2 and #3 are Braun and Crawford.  If you look at (park and league-adjusted) offense alone, he’s #2 behind Braun.  fWAR uses UZR for defense, and rates him at about +4 runs above average per season for the last 3.  If you look at Aggregate Defensive Ratings (weighted average of UZR, DRS, TZL, and FSR), he’s still right around +4/YR.  No advanced metric indicates that his defense leaves much to be desired.

jeffmaz
3 years 6 months ago

at this point…you have to leave Braun out of all stat comparisons 

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 6 months ago

Why? He’s not guilty of anything yet…

jeffmaz
3 years 6 months ago

nobody has ever beaten a positive test…nobody
so yes, he is guilty

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 6 months ago

Nobody publicly. We shouldn’t even know Braun failed a test.

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 6 months ago

Nobody publicly. We shouldn’t even know Braun failed a test.

Wainwrights_Curveball
3 years 6 months ago

@Lefty Matt Holliday is one of the best defensive LFers in baseball according to UZR. I have no idea how you think otherwise…unless you think that dropped catch back in the 2009 NLDS is somehow indicative of how he always plays defense…

johnsilver
3 years 6 months ago

Didn’t say he wasn’t a good ball player at all. I just see the cardinals struggling to find who will go into the rotation after lohse/westbrook/Carpenter are finally gone, then covering a few other holes with 18m still committed to Holliday per season until 2016.

Just thinking here.. But they also going to have to figure Wainright is going to cost them big time after that 2013 option also, probably at least as much as Holliday makes.

There are going to be some issues and a complimentary piece is what Holliday would be considered on a mid market team, regardless of War/OPS etc.. this team cannot afford budgets of 120m a season for more than a year or 2.

astrostl
3 years 6 months ago

 “a complimentary player outside of Coors field and not someone you build a team around” drastically underrates a consistent top-10 player in a 30-team market.  What metrics are you using for performance measurement?

As for pitching, we have Shelby Miller and Carlos Martinez tearing up the prospect lists, and Garcia locked up for several years.  I don’t expect Wainright to be resigned to a big deal.

Next 5 years of salary commitments: 68MM, 24MM, 26MM, 17MM, 1MM.  I don’t understand how you think the budget will be constrained at all, much less by a player like Holliday in particular.

johnsilver
3 years 6 months ago

” I don’t expect Wainright to be resigned to a big deal.”

THAT could free up money. He was one of the key factors as considered him a huge salary raise **if** he is healthy and returns to form.

astrostl
3 years 6 months ago

 The money is not committed, so it is already free.

3 years 6 months ago

Way to snub Vernon Wells.

Sniderlover
3 years 6 months ago

Holliday is worth every penny. Solid defensive LF with a great bat. He posted .912 OPS last season and .922 the year before that which is close to his career .929 OPS (that’s the same as Fielder BTW). He’s also got a world series to show so I have no idea how that contract can be considered bad. If anything, it’s a great one consider what Werth/Crawford/Fielder got. 

RedSx799
3 years 6 months ago

ouch…I’d hate to see the Cards lose Molina one season after Puljos.

California_RedBirds
3 years 6 months ago

This is not what I want to see. C’mon Mo, just get him extended

3 years 6 months ago

The Cardinals are not giving a blank check to any player. There are plenty of players who would love to play in St. Louis.

gocubs418
3 years 6 months ago

I think your family will be quite alright with your $22 million dollars you have.  Bothers me to hear them complain that they need MORE money.  Greed

Rabbitov
3 years 6 months ago

Actually agree 100%.  You would think 5 million would be enough to live off, what need does anyone have for 50? 

bayareabeast
3 years 6 months ago

i agree too but if you were in his position, 50 mil sounds a whole lot better than 5. definitely annoys me though

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

It’s not that he needs it, it’s that he’s earned it. We live in a free market economy… One that says MLB players are worth over 400 thousand dollars at the minimum. As one of the top 3-5 catchers in baseball now he will earn money that represents that. Are there other, less glorious jobs that deserve more money? Of course. But that doesn’t change the fact that we as a populace have decided that we care more about the people that entertain us (athletes, musicians, movie stars, etc.) than the people who teach us, save us, or serve in the army in our names. Look at it this way… You are on a blog that earns advertising money based on the amount of hits they receive from people… who want to read about baseball.

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

All of that being said, the need to take care of one’s family is a cop out to avoid sounding bad that just comes across as greed to those of us trying to look out for our families on our more meager salaries…

Houston_Astros
3 years 6 months ago

Why is it wrong for him to want to establish financial security for his family three generations down the line?  It really doesn’t make sense for us to criticize him for this, considering everyone else would do it in his situation.  Plus, there is probably a subtext here; he is probably upset that they let Pujols get away.  Why not frame that as ‘listening to other offers’ rather than being angry at the front office?  Molina hasn’t done anything wrong here. 
This isn’t to you so much as everyone who is complaining about his wanting to maximize his income.

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

I don’t think he’s wrong by any means… I just think the real motive is maximizing his earning potential at something that he is better than 99.5% of the population at, as opposed to the welfare of future generations. Either way he’s not in the wrong… I just personally think that him saying he’s looking out for his family is an easy way for him to say he’s looking for a big deal while saving face…

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

I don’t think he’s wrong by any means… I just think the real motive is maximizing his earning potential at something that he is better than 99.5% of the population at, as opposed to the welfare of future generations. Either way he’s not in the wrong… I just personally think that him saying he’s looking out for his family is an easy way for him to say he’s looking for a big deal while saving face…

3 years 6 months ago

He wants alot of money imagine that??? The Card’s want the most money too but where is the anger at that??

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

I take it you chose to completely ignore my post directly above saying he’s earned the right to ask for his market value as one of the best catchers in the game?

3 years 6 months ago

sorry dude did not see it. my bad

NickinIthaca
3 years 6 months ago

 No worries… 

Rabbitov
3 years 6 months ago

Yea thats all true, but it doesn’t change the fact that Molina isn’t “thinking about his family” if he takes 82 million instead of 80 million.

FS54
3 years 6 months ago

I am not sure it is just greed. Would you be willing to work at a job for less than average salary because that lesser salary is more than enough for your family? I would want to be paid for what I am worth.
Not sure the argument of overpay works anymore. Players want more money, owners pay them that, and fans still go to games and buy merchandise.

mdrulesstl
3 years 6 months ago

I don’t recall 20 years ago ever hearing such complaints about not making enough money and if they don’t get paid a certain amount then they will just walk away from the team that help make them who they are.  Players used to bleed and die with the team the started their career with. These athletes make millions of dollars and all they can say is thats not good enough.  I don’t blame anyone trying to get what they think they are worth, BUT PLEASE, stop making organizations look bad because they CAN’T pay you the excess millions you think you deserve.  The STL Cardinals are a very traditional sports team and it pisses me off to have Pujols and Molina disgrace this organization when they say they won’t stay for a discounted offer.  That’s far from the truth.  They just don’t overpay for selfish players.  The reason the Cardinals are more successfull than teams like the Cubs, Angels, Boston and Both New York teams is because they build their team on chemistry and heart combined with talent.  This goes farther than Selfish and selfless athletes that ONLY CARE ABOUT MONEY!!!

bayareabeast
3 years 6 months ago

“This is business. If I get good money, I’ll take it. If not, I’ll go away.”
that would scare me if i was a cards fan

sam_lammert
3 years 6 months ago

im teriffied

bayareabeast
3 years 6 months ago

teRRified is another good word for it.

sam_lammert
3 years 6 months ago

touche

Houston_Astros
3 years 6 months ago

At least he is being honest about his motivations.  I think that someone will be willing to pay a thirty-year-old catcher too much money.  For example, I think Joe ‘I used to be a replacement level catcher’ Girardi would field a team of catchers if he could.

Yankees420
3 years 6 months ago

Good thing Girardi isn’t in charge of signing guys to contracts. 

Houston_Astros
3 years 6 months ago

A truly wonderful observation.  Thank you.

Yankees420
3 years 6 months ago

You’re welcome. 😉

3 years 6 months ago

If he puts up one more great year like he did last year he could fetch a lot of money as a free agent.

TophersReds
3 years 6 months ago

Thank you, Captain Obvious.

rainyperez
3 years 6 months ago

I might also add if he doesn’t do well and gets injured he will not get a lot of money as a free agent.

3 years 6 months ago

Actually I think it’s refreshing to hear a ballplayer tell us, very straightforwardly, that his only incentive is money, not loyalty.  Us mere mortals could live a very satisfying life, and set up our children and grandchildren, on the $22 million he’s earned over the past 5 years.  I’m tired of ballplayers lying to the fans about why they move from ballclub to ballclub.  I understand their careers are short & I don’t have any problem with them making whatever they can get.  Just be honest about it at least.

3 years 6 months ago

I said it earlier and I am still afraid that this might become a problem in the clubhouse before the year is over!!! I am a huge Cardinal fan and would love to see Molina stay but Also as a fan I am fed up with hearing these players talk like they barely make enough to put food on their table…the Cardinals are bigger than Molina and they are bigger than Pujols!! If he leaves I wish him well!!!!! Just saying!!!!

3 years 6 months ago

Why do you act like they should only make what the Owners want them to? The owners have tons and tons of money so why should the guys on the field not try to get paid the absolute best they can in the small window of time they have to use their talents?

BranchRickeysGhost
3 years 6 months ago

It isn’t about who makes more money.  Both sides make a lot of money.  The problem is either side talking like they are poverty stricken, especially in this economy.  It is insulting to people who really are struggling.  Saying it is a business and you are entitled to get the best deal you can is fine.  Saying you “worry about your family” when you are making millions is condescending and insulting.

3 years 6 months ago

where did yadi talk like he was poverty stricken?  setting your family up for as long as possible is the responsible thing to do…just like dewitt will try to maximize the value of the team for when he leaves it to his children…just like you’re presumably doing

BranchRickeysGhost
3 years 6 months ago

It’s not about reality, it’s about rhetoric.  You don’t yell “fire” in a crowded theater and you don’t say you are “worried about your family” when you are a millionaire.  It gives the wrong impression in a industry where public relations is important. 

3 years 6 months ago

why is public relations really important for professional athletes?  i dont expect them to be perfect, or even good people for that matter.  i want them to be entertaining on the baseball field and hopefully good, for my team

BranchRickeysGhost
3 years 6 months ago

Public relations is important in any entertainment industry and that is what sports are.  You alienate fans and no one makes money. You may not be insulted by such remarks, but there are plenty of fans who are and will not spend their money because of it.

3 years 6 months ago

exactly!!! someone who gets it!

Philley11
3 years 6 months ago

I get fed up when the owners act like they aren’t making any money. They certainly have alot more of it then the players do.

stl_cards16
3 years 6 months ago

I agree with you, but the owner have a lot more risk than the players do.

Philley11
3 years 6 months ago

Is it just me or does it seem the Cardinals expect/hope all of their players to take hometown discounts. Maybe it’s just the whole Pujols negotiating process and now Molina. Seems kinda lowballish considering I’ve read that the 17 people who make up the ownership of the Cards are worth a combined 4 Billion, according to St. Louis Business Journal. I know you don’t make money by giving it away but Molina seems like he is worthy of a extension that isn’t a hometown discount.

cardinalmike
3 years 6 months ago

They’ve come to expect it because players continue to help them.  Look at the nice “hometwon” discount Carpenter gave them last summer and Schumaker wanted to stay so bad he took less to stay and basically agreed to give up a starting position to be a super sub.  Linebrink just said the Cardinals were his #1 choice although he could have done better going to SF or Colorado.  I’ll also bet that Wainwright gives them a discount to stay.

I suspect that Molina’s agent is looking in the 4 year/$48M range with one option year.  I suspect the Cardinals are in the 4 year/$36 M range.  I have my doubts as to whether team/player will be able to bridge that difference.

cardinalmike
3 years 6 months ago

They’ve come to expect it because players continue to help them.  Look at the nice “hometwon” discount Carpenter gave them last summer and Schumaker wanted to stay so bad he took less to stay and basically agreed to give up a starting position to be a super sub.  Linebrink just said the Cardinals were his #1 choice although he could have done better going to SF or Colorado.  I’ll also bet that Wainwright gives them a discount to stay.

I suspect that Molina’s agent is looking in the 4 year/$48M range with one option year.  I suspect the Cardinals are in the 4 year/$36 M range.  I have my doubts as to whether team/player will be able to bridge that difference.

3 years 6 months ago

yeah…and bruce chen took less guaranteed money to stay in KC…dont act like stl is special

BranchRickeysGhost
3 years 6 months ago

I see the green eyed monster is rearing it’s ugly head.

cardinalmike
3 years 6 months ago

It happens elsewhere, to be sure, but the Cards do get a lot of help from certain players. My point was that Cardinal management has come to expect it and not all players are so willing.  They have a system in STL that puts a $ value on a player and the Cardinals don’t seem to move much from that number.

Philley11
3 years 6 months ago

I don’t know if the Cards get more discounts then anyone else, that is not the point. The point is, like you said cardinalmike, they seem to expect it more then other clubs and aren’t willing to budge otherwise.

I will admit that I’m basically making that judgement off of this one offseason with Pujols and Oswalt and now Molina. It is a good thing they play in the central because I doubt they would have much of a chance to win a division otherwise, AL or NL and East or West.

JamesOrLurch
3 years 6 months ago

There is not a decent catcher in the Cards system and there won’t be another catcher with Yadi’s talent available on the open market. A deal that will work for both sides is very doable and should get done. He won’t command a salary that will hamstring the club like Pujols would have so there is little reason to not lock him up. I just hope that it happens before he reaches free agency, otherwise another team will snatch him up. I’d love to see him remain a Cardinal for life.

3 years 6 months ago

im sure you guys could trade for joe mauer and he’d immediately offer to cut his contract in half simply for the opportunity to play in front of self appointed ‘best fans in baseball’

JamesOrLurch
3 years 6 months ago

 1. If we were the “self appointed ‘best fans in baseball'” someone should alert the media to stop calling us that.
2. Joe Mauer wouldn’t leave his hometown team nor would we want him with his insane contract for the mediocre results he has produced since signing said contract.
Try again.

BranchRickeysGhost
3 years 6 months ago

The “Best Fans in Baseball” was based on a 2009 poll by USA Today of major league baseball players.  It was not a concoction by  Cardinals fans.  Having said that, I wish the Cardinals and the media would stop using it because it just causes hard feelings with other fan bases.

3 years 6 months ago

He wants to come play with Albert and continue the Molina tradition in Anaheim

3 years 6 months ago

has to think about his family?? what like his great-great-great-great grandkids?? 

i get the idea of wanting to be paid what you’re worth, but comments about family from these guys make me laugh. they make it sound like a hometown discount would put their family out on the street.

3 years 6 months ago

why shouldnt he add another ‘great’ to that list of family….why SHOULD he give the cards a hometown discount?  he’s played at a price below his market value for his entire career

3 years 6 months ago

i’m totally fine with him not giving them a discount, but please, dont try to pretend its about taking care of his family.

soxin10
3 years 6 months ago

Stole my thoughts. I don’t begrudge the man making money, but the “feed the family” thing after having earned over 15 mil with another 7 mil this year is just disingenuous. I would rather have players say “pay me fairly” or “according to what other players of the same caliber make”, but feed the family? those are my issues, not his.

3 years 6 months ago

I’m not for the owners or the players, but I don’t remember reading where the Cardinals asked for a hometown discount. Just get tired of players that think they are bigger than the TEAM!!!! It is def his choice if he wants to sign or leave so I wont lose any sleep over it one way or the other!!!!

3 years 6 months ago

those terrible offers they gave to pujols werent asking for a hometown discount?

3 years 6 months ago

Yeah, because 220 over 9 is just horrible. C’mon.

3 years 6 months ago

He said he likes the town and he likes the city. What’s the difference?

DrHMD
3 years 6 months ago

I don’t think the Cardinals are cheap in their offers. I think they are reasonable. First, note that they are 7th overall in payroll and the teams above them play in New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Los Angeles, San Fancisco, and Detroit . Detroit and LA have just signed people to huge contracts which they may or may not regret. But for a medium market team, the Cardinals pay pretty well.