The Twins’ biggest offseason need was no secret — apart from Jose Berrios, every member of their 2019 starting rotation was scheduled to reach free agency. With Jake Odorizzi, Michael Pineda, and Kyle Gibson all hitting the open market and Martin Perez also becoming a free agent after the Twins bought out their club option, the AL Central champs were faced with both a predicament and something of an opportunity.
While Minnesota starters collectively ranked in the top third or top half of the league in most major statistical categories in 2019, the rotation was seen as more of a solid complement to the team’s big-hitting lineup than as a strength unto itself. There was certainly room for not just improvement, but significant improvement to the pitching corps, especially for a Twins club that entered the winter with very few future payroll commitments. As chief baseball officer Derek Falvey told reporters after the season, the club was intent on adding “impact pitching” to its rotation and was open to spending to add those arms.
As the calendar has turned to the new year, Minnesota has indeed restocked its staff with starters both old and new, though on paper, some of that promised “impact” isn’t obviously present. The first steps were equal parts promising and cost-effective for the Twins — Odorizzi accepted the team’s one-year, $17.8MM qualifying offer rather than test free agency, and then re-signing Pineda for two years and $20MM.
After those familiar faces returned to the fold, however, the Twins faced some long weeks of rumors and missed targets before eventually landing a pair of veterans. Homer Bailey and Rich Hill each signed one-year contracts with Minnesota on the same day, with Bailey earning $7MM in guaranteed money and Hill pulling in $3MM guaranteed (with hefty incentives). Bailey got his career on track with a solid 2019 season following multiple rough years with the Reds, while Hill isn’t going to be able to pitch until midseason due to his recovery from primary revision surgery.
The Twins pursued such names as Zack Wheeler, Hyun-Jin Ryu, Madison Bumgarner, Dallas Keuchel, Jordan Lyles, and Japanese hurler Shun Yamaguchi, yet all wound up signing elsewhere. As for the team’s own remaining free agents, Gibson signed with the Rangers while Perez inked a deal with the Red Sox. On the trade front, the Marlins’ Elieser Hernandez have been on the radar, though no deal has been completed. This isn’t to say that Minnesota hasn’t been aggressive, as shown most clearly by their five-year, $100MM offer to Wheeler before the righty instead opted to sign with the Phillies. But, the free agent pitching market moved much faster (and at higher costs) than expected, leaving the Twins missing out on many of their first-choice options.
Barring any further pickups via trades or free agency, the Twins’ Opening Day rotation now stands as Berrios, Odorizzi, and Bailey, with two of the young trio of Randy Dobnak, Devin Smeltzer, and Lewis Thorpe handling the final two slots. Pineda is unavailable for the first 39 games of the season while he finishes out a 60-game PED suspension, and when he returns, one of Dobnak/Smeltzer/Thorpe will continue to start until Hill is healthy and ready. Top prospect Brusdar Graterol also looms as an early-season callup after making his MLB debut in 2019.
It isn’t the slam-dunk collection of upgrades many Twin Cities fans were hoping for, yet it’s also wrong to say that this group doesn’t have any talent. While Hill’s injury status has long been a question mark, he has pitched like an ace when he has been healthy over the last four years. Berrios might well rise to true ace status himself, if he can avoid another late-season slump and consistently pitch like he did in the first half of the 2019 season. Odorizzi and Pineda both pitched well for Minnesota last season, and as a fifth starter option, Bailey isn’t a bad veteran arm to have amidst the younger hurlers.
Also, in not spending big now, the Twins are keeping some financial powder dry so they can spend later, potentially on a midseason trade acquisition if necessary. Then there’s the additional chance that Minnesota could indeed spread some cash around this offseason, though on another major hitter (such as Josh Donaldson) rather than another pitcher.
What’s your take on Minnesota’s rotation moves? (Poll link for app users.)
Wondering if the (2 so far) Voters who picked A are just THAT big of homers… or if they’re cleveland/Chicago fans lol.
I wanted to give a D, but as a twins fan I’m disappointed to the point I can’t give anything but an F
They’re drunks.
Yeah… When starting pitching is your biggest need, you can’t pull an average C and expect to get better. The Twins were a great team last season, but they definitely just got worse. Obviously.
I gave them a B because they did the best with what the market had. For whatever reason, GMs are overpaying for starting pitching this year. It’s not a failure to stick to your valuations, and Ryu, Bumgarner, Wheeler, Cole are all overpays. Sacrificing the future of your franchise isn’t a good decision for a team like the Twins.
Granted I think Bailey is a terrible signing, but they won on the Odorizzi and Pineda deals in my opinion. It’s not easy to fill 4 starting spots any year, especially this one. Just bad timing for them unfortunately.
its a failure to use the money the twins have gotten fat with from the publicly financed stadium that was promised in Hearings to be used to Get better players..
cant buy players that don’t want to come there. can u blame them? who wants to live in a place that is froven half the year
Twins are likely going to pull an Angels move by skimping on their pitching (which they needed most) and go for the bats.
Albies: Don’t forget about Keuchel. He may have gotten less money than Cole, Strasburg, Wheeler, MadBum and Ryu but Keuchel was the biggest overpay of all. His 4th year $20 million vesting option kicks in if he averages a mere 160 innings pitched in the 2nd and 3rd year of his contract. That’s very attainable for a back of the rotation innings eater like Keuchel who has been averaging over 200 innings per full season to a long time. Especially considering he never gets injured. In order to avoid that vesting option the ChiSox are basically gonna have to pay him $18 million to pitch out of the bullpen on the third year of his deal and even then they might have to throttle his innings. If not they will be paying him $20 million for his age 35 season. That’s terrible for a pitcher that hasn’t even been that good for his last two seasons at age 30 and 31. Once that option vests, Keuchels contract becomes almost equal to Ryu’s 4 year $80 million deal and withing $7 million of MadBum’s 5 year $85 million deal. Ryu finished top 2 in Cy Young voting last year and MadBum is not only better but is also a few years younger than Keuchel. The way Keuchel has pitched the last couple of years he should be getting paid nowhere near either of those guys but instead he is going to be paid within $7 million overall of both of them. And that even includes the fact that the younger MadBum is signed for a year longer. How Keuchel got a 3 or 4 year deal with a higher average annual value than MadBum I will never understand. I’m not a big MadBum fan but he and Ryu are both obviously significantly better than Keuchel. MadBum destroys him on future potential term worth and Ryu is already destroying him on upside. Ryu was so much better than Keuchel last year even with the injury that it is ridiculous.
PinStripedPride:
Yes. The Twins have had a very disappointing offseason but you are right. Even with Rendon, the Angels have been even worse. The Angels needed 2 of the top 3 or 4 free agent starting pitchers in baseball this offseason and instead they settled for zero of the top 6. Dylan Bundy and Julio Teheran are not going to get it done. None of the other remaining free agent starting pitchers are gonna get it done for the Angels either. They better hope they can swing a trade for someone like Matthew Boyd (overrated), Robbie Ray (older than you would think and likely on the decline) or Trevor Bauer (probably unavailable and a bad acquisition but he would be their next best hope right?). I mean, I don’t think they will be able to get Clevinger unless they throw Adell in the deal and that would be a mistake. They are going to have to sign both Alex Wood and Taijuan Walker and even that won’t get it done. They will just have to get both and hope for the best in terms of trading for more after that. I don’t really understand why they didn’t go for Kluber considering Cleveland treated it like a salary dump for a chance po get a relief pitcher from Texas. Then again, I heard they asked for a lot more from the Angels than they did Texas. I don’t understand that though. It seems like the Angels could have given less than who Cleveland wanted but still topped the Rangers offer. Moreno’s staff needs to work on their negotiating skills. Kluber might not be that good anymore (who knows?) but he was still the best chance they had after Keuchel, Ryu, MadBum, Wheeler, Strasburg and Cole were all gone. The only person on the planet that has had a more disappointed offseason than Angels fans is probably Mike Trout himself. They are wasting the prime of his career. Strasburg and Rendon both got fully no-trade claused 7-year $245 million guaranteed contracts. It would have made more sense for the Nationals to keep Rendon and the Angels to take Strasburg. How the heck did that get reversed? I know Strasburg had $80 million deffered but that just gives the Angels the advantage. They could have offered him the exact same contract they gave Rendon and he likely would have accepted just to keep all of it undefferred. I know Rendon is probably a better player but the Angels needed Stras way more and the Nats needed Rendon way more… AND THEY COST THE SAME! I don’t get what the Angels or Twins are doing this offseason. From what I can see the Angels, Twins, Astros, Indians and Nationals have all gotten noticeably worse this offseason. Well… The Angels might not have gotten worse but they sucked the most out of all of them in the first place and didn’t even attempt to fill their biggest need so they still have little to no chance of contention. How did teams like the Rangers, White Sox, Blue Jays, Reds, Diamondbacks and Braves out do all of those teams? The Dodgers and Cards didn’t try to do any better either and the Cubs and Brewers just flat out got worse. How are the Braves and Yankees the only playoff teams from last year that actually even attempted to improve themselves? Everyone saw some of that coming but the Twins and Angels should not have let teams like the Blue Jays and Diamondbacks outbid them for starting pitching. Nobody saw that coming. Ryu and MadBum (however flawed they each might be) were eaaily attainable by both the Twins and Angels and each would have stepped in as the Ace #1 Opening Day starting pitcher for both teams. If you have a playoff caliber team that desperately needs starting pitching during one of the best off seasons for starting pitchers and you refuse to pay even $80 million on a pitcher, then you aren’t even trying to win. Teheran is gonna be terrible for the Angels. He is their next Matt Harvey. I have watched almost every start he has made for nearly a decade. His ERA is always decent but deceptive. He is nowhere near that good. There is a reason he was left off the Braves playoff roster. He doesn’t have great or even good stuff and when he misses his location it always happens IN the strike zone on a 90 mph fastball. That is easy Pickens for MLB hitters. I wouldn’t be surprised if Teheran leads the lead for home runs allowed and/home runs allowed per inning pitched next year with the Angels. He will only get worse there. The sad part is that the Angels needed (and darn near promised their fans) top of the rotation starting pitching more than anything or any team in the league and Teheran was their biggest acquisition in that department. Unless the Angels are secretly planning on teaching Anthony Rendon how to pitch like an ace, they really screwed up this offseason. I know the offseason is only technically about half over but almost all the top players are gone… So it basically is over. Neither Josh Donaldson, Nick Castellanos, nor Marcell Ozuna know how to pitch so when it comes to the Angels/Twins offseason/2020 season: It’s over, Grover.
Actually the market is just correcting itself from a major down turn. Wheeler and ryu got market value and bum took a sweetheart deal to pitch where he wanted. He left 20 mill on the table and surely had higher offers. And there’s a ton of FA pitchers this year- so it’s almost the perfect year to fill 4 spots and the cheap skate twins signed a bunch of scrubs! I’d be livid if I was a twins fan. They have all the other pieces to compete.
I am so tired of hearing that “no one wants to play in Minnesota” pathetic excuse. Mostly because 95% of the time it’s not remotely true. Offer the money, you’ll get the players. If not, you’re a bad GM for not being able to “sell” why the team is a good landing spot
I’m here to tell you that nobody is going to read that. I admire your passion and the time you must have put into writing that – however no one will sit here and read that many words dude sorry.
WAY too long…didnt read one word.
[DOWNVOTE]
What are you? A reporter clamoring for more news hole?
Of course he’s a Braves fan on a soapbox. Dude’s on a ledge until Josh signs. Please stop taking other teams’ posts hostage.
…or maybe he’s still mad about Hrbek – which, then he’d be justified – and continue on…
You all know you like it. Please stop acting like you’re not impressed.
Was it a slow day at work?
No StandUpGuy we don’t like it, we hate it. We think you’re self-absorbed.. You actually think we want to read 100 lines of brain vomit? And no, we aren’t impressed. Pretty much no one reads any of your comments over 25 lines. See how clepto got 6 upvotes for calling your comment too long? He’ll probably get more. Yet you keep doing it. You think we owe it to you to read you. We don’t. And fortunately we don’t have to. You’re nuts.
why do you care, honest to god my man is just trying to share some thoughts. Don’t read it if its 3 lines two long, because I thought it was a decent comment and had interesting ideas if you actually took the time to read it. shut up and take the 0.00001 sec to scroll past it.
Polls are for the hoi polloi. I always lie.
Good to know.
Same here.
I’ll say C because they did well with what was still available and it was cost effective but at the same time, the moves are game changing and Pineda will be out 39 games and Hill until mid season as the article states. That said, they can still pull off a trade or signing possible midseason when they have a better idea what they’re rotation looks like. So low C grade at best since both Hill and Bailey could flame out.
Not game changing moves is what I was trying to say.
Would be nice to see them add donaldson
I’ll bet it would, you wouldn’t have to face him in the NLCS
It’s a C- at best
I graded them a C, but D seemed more appropriate. This rotation was cobbled together with the idea that everything will have to break just right to realize success.
A, because it’s hard to ever fill 4 rotation holes and come out the other side a better team (and yes, im neither a Gibson not Perez fan)
They could have had Ryu. That contract wasn’t bad they could have matched it.
They should have never let 4/5 starters get to free agency.
They get a D and not an E only because they actually made moves.
so they could have extended the same players and had…the same players or they could’ve exceeded Toronto’s risky offer. Ryu would not be the offer id go over to be honest.
As a Jays fan I wasn’t thrilled with the fourth year however someone has to pitch & he was actually willing to come here during the rebuild. What irks me about the Twins is that they actually need him (so do we btw) & the money isn’t even that egregious. Both teams have less than 4o million committed after this season & as of now both teams have less than 20 mill on the books for what will be his final season. If a publicly traded company isn’t worried about the ire of it’s shareholders when a contract doesn’t work out, why does an owner who’s club is valued at 1.2 billion act like the only thing in his wallet are moths?
Well, we all know how they could have done that actually. The price tags of each of the rotation improving pieces are publicly available. They just needed to pay good players what good players are worth. The Twins only get to be decent for narrow windows because ownership never cares to do that,
starting pitching wasnt exactly cheap this offseason, so to sign 4 better starters would have cost quite a bit. theyre not in the Donaldson race in that case then. additionally, we know nothing about how interested any of the players on the market were in actually going to Minnesota.
C
they should be looking to acquire Robbie Ray
Yep that works too I kinda like ray
Robbie only averages 4 innings and throwing over 100 pitches.
ha
welcome to starters in 2020
Robbie Ray isn’t the ace we need though and now we have a few mid tier options I don’t think it would make a lot of sense. They need to go big in a trade and go win now because if they don’t this core will leave and we’ll be left with no championships or even a bid for one.
Sign Donaldson to a 4 year deal now that Washington just signed Harris and then trade Rosario and prospects to Colorado for Jon Gray. If Falvey and Levine were to even come close to that I would be in awe
Colorado has plenty of LF/RF, that would be a forced fit. How about Byron Buxton ?
I dont know that Buxton will ever stop running into walls and getting hurt. So, I wouldn’t be completely sad to see Buxton go for some top tier pitching.
Buxton is no guarantee to ever return to the modicum of a bat he ever was.. He has near zero trade value I’d expect til he shows he can play after the surgery..
Buxton is going to break out in a big way this year. He absolutely has trade value
coming off MAJOR shoulder surgery.. his value is minimum.. they don’t have a clue as it if he will even make it all the way back.. many don’t
that’s what happens when you go all out and give 100% every night while playing at an elite level at a premium position. Buxton definitely making a return this year MAJOR comeback
We’ve heard this story for multiple years in a row. Buxton is great when he’s healthy but he’s never healthy for more than a month plus at any one time. Unfortunate too…he’s a talent for sure!!
I’ve been hearing that for the last however many years and hes had one half of a good year so far
hopefully
Buxton probably has the highest trade value on the team. What are you talking about? The Mets wouldn’t discuss Syndergaard without Buxton on the table,
just like everyone says that about Pivetta each year.
Sure. Byron Buxton isn’t good because Nick Pivetta isn’t good. It’s not like Buxton has had two seasons where he was much more valuable than Pivetta’s best year or that position players are easier to forecast than pitchers.
Gray doesn’t improve the rotation to extent of which it’d even worth subtracting Rosario from our lineup.
Gray is a legitimate breakout candidate. Rosario could be replaced/upgraded in free agency by Marcell Ozuna or Nick Castellanos. Or they could get creative and sign a Josh Donaldson for an offense/defensive upgrade and stick Marwin and Cave out there in LF.
There’s no pitchers out there in the FA market anymore. Much easier to fill a positional player slot.
Heres a crazy idea, not sure if the Indians would go for it and if they will pivot to full sell mode BUTTT. what if the Twins could pull off a trade for Lindor I mean the guy can mash at the plate and would provide a defense better than Josh Donaldson (arguably) then you would move Polanco to second because a large majority of his errors came for throws so shotening up that throw turns him into a plus defender then throw arraez at third såno to first and suddenly we have one of the best defensive infields in the league plus some MAJOR pop with Lindors bat and enough salary room to potetially trade for some pitching as he cost far less then Donaldson(even with him getting a raise) And He has a EVEN better bat. The only downside is we’d have to hemorrhage our future for two years of Lindor. Keep in mind we would most likely receive a draft compensation pick when he does leave.
What happened to that guy who ran the roster resources site that used to write here?
Jason Martinez, was let go a while back. He still does RR.
He can now be found at Fangraphs
I like to root for the Twins, but their rotation moves have been uninspired. The Angels moves have been meh and they look better than the Twins moves.
C
Graterol needs to be part of that pitching staff from the beginning of 2020. Give him the chance to prove he is/isn’t ready.
Fully agree, although the cold weather definitely complicates things considering the health of his shoulder.
Whether it’s a full time starting role or on an innings limit, they need to pick a role and stick to it. Give him the chance to run with that role and send him to AAA if he shows he’s not ready. His stuff will play in the big leagues.
Totally agree with you guys. He has no. 2 stuff and is ready. MLBTR seems to consistently discount him as an option and I’m not sure why.
He isn’t an established option. That is most likely why and it’s a common occurrence with blogs/team articles on websites and other media outlets. Opportunity is what turns a promising rookie into a rotation staple.
Graterol has made 9 starts above A+, zero above AA, and is only 20. no need to push him yet.
I’d like to see them go get a long relief / 5th starter, (Michael Wacha would’ve been perfect). Just somebody to maybe slot in as your 5 like maybe a King Felix, and then you could move hill to long relief. I’d just like to see them get more options instead of just going crazy and getting a front-line starter like Darvish. I’d rather see them put their money towards either Donaldson and/or a good bullpen arm.
C…needed a legit #2 guy at worst, and that’s just not likely now
It’s the Twins. Did you expect Cole @ Strasburg? Seriously thou…
Lots of options in between Cole and friggin Homer Bailey.
My guess was Kuetchel and some dumpster scrapings.. well, I did get 1 part right..
If there goal was to Win a world series: They have Failed to assembly a rotation that any sane person would call World Champion class…. a Clear “F”…
I’d go C- since I’m doubtful the starting rotation is even as good as last year. The Twins had one glaring need and in the ballpark of $70M to spend and still weren’t able to improve the team..
I get that it’s unlikely now, after missing out on MadBum, Keuchel, and Ryu, but next offseason I’m expecting that the Twins seriously pursue lefty starters like Ray and E-Rod.
I expect them to start their next rebuild.. They have no long term players other than Kepler and Polanco..
Seriously… Last time I checked they’ve got plenty of young talent: Kirilloff, Lewis, Graterol, Balazovic, Arraez, Larnach, Duran, Thorpe, Jeffers, Javier.
While Sano is more likely to leave for a big market team, I at least expect Berrios, Buxton, and Garver to be retained, maybe even Rosario for a couple more seasons.
Not mention the FO can always utilize the FA market to improve the team as well (ex. Donaldson??)
Sano and Buxton haven’t done anything of note yet. The Twins future outfield of Larnach, Kirilloff and one of Buxton/Kepler/Rosario should be good for years. Rooker at 1b won’t be a slouch either.
Rosario is a trade candidate: sano and Buxton only have 1 year. the Twins haven’t developed any top line starting pitching.. average prospect development time in the majors is 3 years.. and the White sox are done rebuilding in a lot less time and they have a lot more pitching talent who will be in the majors staring this year.. I expect sano to be traded if he hits and at the trade deadline the twins aren’t clearly in the running for the division.. same with Rosario.. They got a lot of maybe in a few years going on…
Sano has two years: 2020 and 2021, Buxton has three: 2020, 2021 and 2022.
Sano will probably be traded before he’s a FA though.
Things aren’t always as they seem. While disappointing, MN just isn’t the ideal landing spot for a number of free agents – yet. MN missed on Bumgarner and Wheeler, as did many others, because they already had determined where they wanted to go. We know Bumgarner turned down more money to go to the desert where he wanted to be. And let’s be honest, the Twins were never going to spend the money on a Cole or Strasburg, and I’m glad they didn’t. Too much invested in just one player.
One can only hope that the FO is still aggressively looking at who is available through trade. I think they are. There are options out there, and our farm system is deep enough to land one or two and still be in good shape. One bright spot of a trade – it takes the players opinion out of it, so if their club wants to make a deal, they are going!
I think you still see the Twins accomplish the task of landing a front line starter. Not being a homer, just trying to look at the facts.
Just saying, but Boston’s David Price, and the Yankees J.A Happ are still available for trades. It is only 96 M and 17M for Happ. lol.
Actually it would be less for either as both the Sox and NYY are prepared to eat some of those contracts.
How can the answer be anything but an F? They failed miserably. Even if they weren’t going to play in the Cole/Strasburg sweepstakes, there were still a number of solid starters that could’ve materially improved their rotation.
Look at the facts – the only true established solid starters that were BETTER than what they have in ODO and Pineda were Wheeler, Bumgarner and Ryu. Wheeler wanted to go to Philly, and Bumgarner wanted to go to Arizona, so no matter who had offers to them, they took the ones they wanted. And there is no way I would have been comfortable giving Ryu the kind of money he got for the injury record he has, especially at his age.
The Twins haven’t been bashful about going after guys, but in the FA market, the players have choices. So far none of them have chosen MN, and not for financial reasons.
This FO likely is working on a contingency plan right now for the trade market. Have some patience. The sky isn’t falling. There is plenty of time for them to still add to what is already a very good team.
You only get to use the Wheeler excuse if you’re the team that sacked up and offered him close to what he signed for. He went to Philadelphia for the $18M more than the Twins offered. He spurned the White Sox NOT the Twins. The White Sox, though, decided to still try to improve when they missed their top option instead of shrugging their shoulders and signing a couple of bargain bin half measures for the fiftieth year in a row. It will be fun to watch a 100 win team sit on their hands, slide backwards, and watch the team that actually made an effort to improve fly by them on the way to the playoffs this year.
AGREED.
Id take those additions over what the Padres added to their rotation anyday.
The Padres already had a full rotation.
D. Especially because of how they responded to the White Sox signing players. Unless they save the money for Donaldson i assume most Twins fans are disappointed in the offseason.
No way this is anything but an F. They stated they wanted an impact arm and did not get one. Then they downgraded at two of the rotation spots. They could easily get nothing from rich hill and bailey will almost certainly be blocking a better AAA option. Blutarsky!
You bring very valid points to this thread; however, I have this offseason pitching ranked as a C. They really could’ve done worse, and if you compare them with the Angels, who have advantages in finances, location, and market, they didn’t do too bad.
Now, you must remember you have to allocate money to provide a security guard for the cop in the bullpen so Rich Hill doesn’t try to fight him. And allocate funding for bail in case he does!
Last, they did get impact arms as promised – they will just be a negative impact
You do have a sense of humor, Mr. Mick. Good to see you using it. Happy holidays.
B. Hill and Bailey had better years in 2019 than Perez and Gibson (by WAR).
And by only signing their new guys to one year deals they’ve given their upcoming prospect pitchers time to develop.
The Twins got incrementally better in their rotation without committing huge money and years. Solid.
On a side note, Twins fans seem to be the least snarky of all the posters on MLBTR. Good for you Mid-Westerners, doncha know!
It’s called Minnesota Nice.
The twins face Chicago as the top
….
Both have no pitching. I predict Chicago 1st
I am no Twins fan but losing their core of pitching they had last year, gives a black eye to the roster. What they accomplished last year was incredible considering Indians were the favorites to win the division. Now that Twins have a partial new rotation, it’s hard to believe they will repeat the success the previous rotation had. Homer Bailey stinks worse than Oakland’s stadium with backed up sewage. If you are riding on hope that Bailey being a perfect plug in piece, you have to be crazy. Since Twins signed Bailey, they should trade for Chris Archer to help them lose about 30 games. I say 15 losses a piece.
There was plenty of high hopes for the Twins this offseason. I ranked their moves at C. The rotation pieces they signed are #3 or backend of the rotation type of pitchers. I laughed when I read they wanted Jordan Lyles in the rotation. From wanting Lyles and signing Bailey, Archer could be the final piece to their coffin. Such a shame. I guess I go on and root for the White Sox as the underdog to win the divisional now. Indians are in trouble, Twins are piecing a broken rotation, and Tigers are aiming for the first pick in the draft. I will say, at least the Twins aren’t as bad as my pitiful Pirates.
Even I pursued the “top” name pitchers this off season for my
softball team.
I just didn’t have enough $$$…..
Ugh, Jorge, like you I am so tired of that poor excuse.
I like the Twins approach.
No more big time bust contracts like the Mauer
one…..
Yeah, that is a good point, especially with the Twins because it can be monetarily prohibitive.
Only if the owner allows it to be. Don’t get me wrong I’m not suggesting they run a Red Sox/Dodgers/Yanks payroll but there’s no reason they *can’t* afford a frontline starter. Maybe they’re just not good at bookkeeping & can’t figure out a way to make it work.
homer was so bad they let him walk with 21 million. sucks with the fans, in the clubhous, and with the media. he only had decent season because he was in two enormous parks.
C- if you don’t count Odorizzi, C+ if you do.
Berrios is an excellent pitcher. Odorizzi is average. Pineda will miss 25% of the season, which is the norm for him. Don’t forget he was out all of 2018. Bailey has been injury riddled for most of the last 5 years. Hill is 40 coming off major surgery. He will be lucky to pitch 50% of the season.
They will be forced to trade away hitting depth in hopes of making the staff as good as last years.
That may cost them the payroll they could have used on Donaldson.
The rookie pitchers will have to contribute to keep this team going. Good luck with that.
Total F. You win 100 games, get smoked by the Yankees in the playoffs and your best foot forward is Homer Bailey and Rich Hill? Might as well shop Nelson Cruz and Marwin Gonzalez if that’s how you want to play the offseason. No excuses.
The moves are pretty underwhelming but they got some of the best value this offseason. Odorizzi helped a lot in the regard by accepting the QO. Can’t go higher than a C though because they still lack long term answers for their rotation.
D at best. Resign 2 of your own, one who can’t even participate till mid-season, then sign 2 utter reclamation projects, again, one of which can’t pitch til mid season due to injury (if at all). And on top of all that, even if all the cards drop the Twin’s way and these guys pan out — they are all only signed to one year deals so we have no rights to them going forward.
They were a playoff team. Which rotation move struck fear in the hearts of the other playoff contenders? If the answer is nothing the best grade available is C.
I give them an A for effort and D for what they ended up with. I picked C because of that.
Out of every starting pitcher in baseball that has had at least 100 starts (20 starts/yr) over the last 5 years Homer Bailey is THE WORST (in ERA). Absolute bottom of the list. The Rich Hill signing wasn’t much better. Yes they may catch lightning in a bottle in the 2nd half of the season, but it’s very unlikely that he will put up anywhere near the numbers he’s put up in LA. Not after coming to the AL and coming off basically an elbow reconstruction surgery in the off season. The Twinkies get a big fat “F” for these two signings. Also, Odorizzi will likely look more like the guy we saw in the 2nd half last year than the first half. It’s not looking good for the Twins. They’ll score a lot of runs again, but also keep in mind they lost 48 HR’s and 137 RBI’s from last year’s offense when Schoop and Cron left. No they aren’t superstars, but they each had some pop. The White Sox are going to run away with this division in 2020. People don’t realize that guys like Luis Robnert and Michael Kopech are legit starts in the making. Kopech has absolutely electric stuff and Robert could be a top 5 player in all of baseball very soon.
I’m a huge White Sox fan, but pump the brakes a little. I don’t expect the Sox to run away with the division. The Twins’ offense should see some regression, but is still powerful and Berrios and Odorizzi are still a solid 1-2. Then, if the Indians don’t trade Lindor and Clevinger, there’s them to worry about. They have little offensively outside of Lindor and J-Ram, but that starting staff is the best in the division, no question. The White Sox finished 28.5 games out this past year. Yes, the Twins have gotten worse and the Sox have gotten significantly better, hopefully enough to make this a three-team race, but I do expect it to be a race. There’s a learning curve, as demonstrated by Giolito and Moncada, who struggled for a full year before finding their game. If that happens to Cease, Kopech, Robert, and Madrigal, the Sox could still finish in 3rd, albeit a much closer 3rd.
I gave it a C but the more I’m thinking about it I really think it is an F. They went in with some a lot of quality options on the market and supposedly a lot of money they could spend and didn’t get any of them other than Odorizzi coming back. The 2 they lost are nothing special but I feel Bailey is still a down grade from them and Hill is either a very smart move or a very expensive mistake since I see him hitting his contract goals easy. Bringing back Pineda wasn’t a bad idea but they will still need to fill that spot for the first 40 games too.
The main reason I give it an F though is that they really didn’t improve much and are in a worst spot next year. They will have 3 free agents again and even if Bailey and Hill do pitch well there is no way you offer either a QO due to age and past performance respectively. And Odorizzi feels like a lose-lose situation for them too. If he pitches well he can’t get the QO again and could pitch himself to a spot where they have to bid against a bunch of teams at a high price. If he doesn’t pitch well you lost the pick and probably miss the playoffs. Of course they could still work out an extension before the season but you would think they would have already done that.
It’s hard for anyone’s “Grades” to be accurate until you see the stuff these guys bring out this year.. The Twins, in recent years, have been good at taking piss poor pitching and improving it. Plus most MLB seasons some dud becomes a stud, and some ace becomes a has been. Hopefully the Twins are on the positive side of such a swing. Though I also agree that it’s disappointed they didn’t get a big name arm, I’m THRILLED we didn’t overspend. At least one of this years big name signings is bound to be a bust, and the team will be set back for years due to the high contract for a decent pitcher… I am so ready to see what the 2020 season has in store! GO TWINS
Also, if your comment is longer the the original post GET OVER YOURSELF . Anyways, Carry on!
Great job. Demonstrates how a well working team rebuilds. I am a Tigers fan and out team is frying to move down to Double A.
I gave them a D. In an offseason that not only had Cole and Strasburg (who weren’t that realistic), but MadBum, Ryu, Keuchel, Wheeler, and a host of mid-range guys, they come away with just Homer Bailey and Rich Hill. Hill is still good when he’s out there, but he’s so rarely out there and Bailey is, well, just not good anymore and hasn’t been for a while. They’re lucky Odorizzi took the QO; otherwise, this could grade out as an F.
If you put lipstick on pigs, aren’t they still pigs?
D
What moves?
They were lucky Odorizzi took the qualifying offer and Rich Hill won’t pitch for half the season if he pitches at all. Bailey?meh.
Sometimes holding things together is a major accomplishment. The Twins cannot and should not buy into the top tier. They’re only hope is to: 1.develope they’re own. 2. Try for some low risk/high upside gambles. 3. Trade from depth when they can. The bullpen can be upgraded much cheaper & easier, which they are doing. I’d give them a B.
I’ll go with a D-. They re-signed 2 of their own mid rotation guys and 2 nobodies that are past their prime and probably won’t make 30 starts between them. This was a team with a ton of money to spend and they weren’t really aggressive on any of the bigger names. It’s asinine.
Twins fans are upset because the front office spoke about all the $$$ they were going to spend then went out Epller on them and signed a couple of has beens who probably will be released by mid year. Hill won’t be released early because he is already injured but you get the point.
I gave them an F. What a pathetic front office! Then again these are the same people that wouldn’t beat the Mets offer for Stroman & then lied about it to deflect the fan backlash. Lying seems to be a common theme with them as they lied about Ryu. From a Yahoo Sports article:
“Earlier in the week, a Minnesota Star Tribune article, citing multiple Twins sources, said Ryu wanted to stay in the West. But speaking to reporters after a local sports awards ceremony in Seoul, Ryu wondered aloud where that came from and added, “I’ve never once said anything like that.” He went on to echo Boras’ earlier statement, saying “all other players would feel the same way about keeping their options open.”
They have little to no $$ on the books after this season so they could have easily beat out the Jays but they chose to do nothing instead. Don’t get your hopes up for Donaldson either. They offered (insulted) him $22.5 MM AAV. That’s less than he made last year trying to rebuild his value knowing full well that his ego demands a minimum 25. Just another excuse for the FO to miss out on a big money player. I’d be torching the village & beheading their elders if I was a Twins fan.
I am a star athlete in the prime of my life. I can buy anything, and have any girl I want.
I think I’ll set up shop in Minneapolis.
I wonder how many major league towns have less appeal to superstar athletes than Minneapolis…
Dude, stop. That is absolutely a false narrative.
Most players who play in cold weather cities don’t live there year round anyway. The Twin Cities is a pretty cool town..
I gave the Twins a ‘D’….Didn’t get the Ace arm they were looking for to truly upgrade the rotation, they just replaced Gibson/Perez with Bailey/Hill(who’s out the 1st half of the season) Would’ve got a ‘F” if Odorizzi didn’t do them a HUGE solid and accept the QO!
Just wait……Wes Johnson can work wonders with pitchers……
Anywhere from a C right now up to an A after Wes Works his Wonders.
There was only one ace Garret Cole whom no one not named the Yankees had a chance to sign. Then there were a couple no.2 starters Twins never had a chance at Madbum because he took less money for ARI. So the twins really only misssed out on Wheeler. Rich Hill is a good signing. Rest of pitchers are garbage-Kuechel isn’t worth it.
edit: You’d think they could’ve signed Ryu if he was willing to go to Toronto I don’t see why not Minny.
Kuechel is better than both Bailey and Rich “over-the” Hill.. Funny how fans of teams that missed out on free agents ALWAYS say that another team “overpaid” for a player. You know, like Rich Hill, who only has to reach 75 innings to make $12.5 million. This guy hasn’t pitched a full year in forever. Now after he returns, barring setbacks, he’ll only have to make a handful of starts to reach the incentive..
Mediocre moves by the Twins. I give them a D just for making moves and not sitting on their hands. They were just bad moves to make
I didn’t like Ryu because i feel like he would be a really nice piece if we already had depth but realistically your only going to get him some of the time because of his injury proneness. Also think Wheeler is overrated yeah he sometimes has really lights out stuff but he is also abysmal at times and shows a lack of consistency. And at 29 years old idk how realistic it is for him to turn things around in the latter of his prime. I liked Mad Bum but he had his mind made up on Arizona. Keuchel would have been nice if paired with an infield defensive upgrade but his ground ball rate is what makes him effective and with the twins sub par infield defense I really didn’t feel like that was a fit. Strasburg and Cole were out of our price range right from the get go. IDK i think the front office did an ok job in the starting pitcher free agent market given their options and have at least got our rotation back to where it was last year.(when Pineda and Hill come back.) But our starting pitching was definitely our main weakness in the playoffs last year and I am hoping for starting pitching via trade.(Jon Grey, David Price, Sale?, Trevor Bauer, and possibly Marcus Stroman.) I wouldn’t mind waiting until the deadline for a starter either to best determine what we’re getting Also a bullpen piece such as Ken Giles to really lock up an already solid bullpen. (at least in the second half of 2019) Until they take the next step they’re getting a C for me.