Cubs To Make Offer For Crawford?

I was thinking more like a package of Marquis, Marshall, Cedeno, & a low minor leaguer for Crawford.

I just can't see the Cubs coming up with the best package for Crawford. While I think the package of Cedeno, Hill, and Marmol is somewhat reasonable, I think too many other teams who want Crawford could come up with something better if they got wind of that offer.

From the Cubs perspective, if they've agreed to let Dempster start, I can't see trading Marmol unless they sign Cordero and even trading Hill means that they are relying on Marquis, Marshall, and someone out of the scrap heap for 3/5 of their rotation. I just don't see this one happening.

Or maybe Pie would be part of the package back and Foukdome, etc. is still part of the Cub's plan?

Can't see Hendry giving up Marmol under any scenario.

I can't see the cubs parting with both Hill and Marmol for Crawford. I think the most likely scenario has the package centered around Pie and maybe one of those two. The seem very determined to sign Fukedome so I don't thing that they are completely abandoning pursuing him all of a sudden. The Cubs are a far better team with Fukedome, Hill, and Marmol, then with just Crawford. I think we are going after Crawford to play center while Fukedome is in right. This would end any chance for Pie to start and make him very tradeable.

Crawford is awesome. Would allow the Cubbies to move Alfonso back into the 3/4/5 slots.

It's going to cost you Hill, Marshall, and other pieces.

Don't think the Rays need a replacement for Crawford. They have enough bodies without Pie. The Rays need arms.

Also, if the Rays are in fact looking for a shortstop, the addition of Omar Infante could signal that Theriot has been dangled in such a deal. In addition to Theriot, the Cubs could offer Murton or Pagan. With all of the big name vets he Cubs have, we seem to have lots of young, inexpensive, major league ready talent that would make such a deal possible.

Crawford would be awesome at Wrigley... a prototypical Pinella type guy.

I would regret losing Marmol and even Hill, but there is plenty of time to add a few less desirable arms via free agency.

I'd say plug your nose and make the deal.

RbCubsFan4Life,
Sorry dude, even if the Cubs do get Crawford, Soriano will most likely be moved down to the 4th or 5th spot, most likely the 4th because he really is not good protection for Ramirez since he strikes out so much... Although he could be in the 2 spot as well... I don't know

I'm personally not sure what to make of this deal, but I would rather give up Hill than Marmol. That being said, I'm not really sure if I would rather depleet our pitching or take a risk on Fukodome. Everyone says he is a sure thing, but so was Kaz Matsui as well...

"While I think the package of Cedeno, Hill, and Marmol is somewhat reasonable..."

Somewhat reasonable?!?! That's WAYYYY to much for a highly overrated outfielder.

Hill AND Marmol??? No way!! Marmol is'nt going anywhere. His role is invaluable and he needs to stay in the role he excelled in last year.Maybe Cedeno,Marshall and Pie if we get Fukodome

I just don't see why the D-Rays would do this deal. They have a ton of pitching as is. I feel like they would want a stud catching and 1st base prospect. Pena is going to get expensive soon and catcher is the only position where they don't have a potential star come 2010.

as i've said in the past, i think any trade with crawford going to the cubs has to involve Soto as the starting point. Hill and Soto possibly?? although the rays do have a bunch of young arms waiting to get opportunities, they have an awful bullpen who blew a bunch of games last year. so there is where marmol comes into the picture. cubs fans, you need to quit trying to peddle marquis and marshall in every trade, they are not premeir trading chips.

This trade doesn't make sense unless it is for Cedeno, Pie and pitchers other than Hill and Marmol. Marmol was the MVP of the Cubs last year. I would take my chances with Fukudome and Pie in the outfield before I gave up Marmol.

IF the Cubs get Matsui (Doesn't seem to be much competition) and Fukedome (Hendry's man-crush make this likely) the Cubs will easily have the best lineup in the NL Central and be one of the top 3 in the National League.

Soriano
Crawford
Lee
Ramirez
Fukudome
Soto
DeRosa
Matsui

Matsui had a very good year last year and if he can produce in a similar way this season, there is not really a weak point in that line up. Even if Matsui goes back to his .260 days with the Mets, he is a very good weakest link.

Soriano, Crawford, and Matsui are all good for 30 SB. Assuming Lee's second half suggested that he is finding his power stroke again, Soriano, Lee, and Ramirez are all good for 30 HRs, Crawford, Soto, and Fukudome at all good for 15-20 HRs. In addition to a very complete offense, the Cubs would also be one of the better defensive teams in the league.

I question some of the potential lineups on here because several people have Soriano not batting first and not playing left field. These things will not change. There is ivy on the walls and Soriano is our leadoff hitter and left fielder for the next 7 years. In addition, the job of short stop belongs to Ryan Theriot until he proves that he can't play the position. Lou Piniella loves him and wants to use him. He had a decent season until the final month or so. I don't see him going out of the starting lineup or to another team. He will probably be in the 8 spot, however, until he can prove to be a more consistent hitter, and not as streaky.

As far as Crawford, the Cubs need a third solid outfielder after trading Jacque Jones and today Craig Monroe. I imagine the Cubs will get a decent AA prospect for him, probably some kind of reliever. The Cubs have had several offers for Rich Hill in the past and Hendry has turned them down. I don't think he will be traded. And Marmol is a closer candidate along with Bob Howry and Kerry Wood, now that Dempster is "moving to the rotation". We'll see how that goes. Personally, I think he should be traded. Here's the Cubs current rotation however:

Carlos Zambrano RHP
Ted (Roosevelt) Lilly LHP
Rich Hill LHP
Jason Marquis RHP
Sean Marshall LHP
Ryan Dempster RHP
Sean Gallagher RHP

The Cubs also have Angel Guzman coming off an injury and is probably in a make it or break it season. Now, all of these pitchers won't make it and Gallagher will probably end up at AAA at the start of the season. But the Cubs have enough starters. Marquis will be dangled in front of Tampa Bay because he is a veteran pitcher who will get 10-15 wins, something the "Rays" don't have a lot of. He's still a 4-5 starter in the American League though. Given that they only had 2 pitchers in double digit wins (and countless in double digit losses), the team I think would welcome him.

I think a realistic proposal is....

Jason Marquis
Will Ohman
Ronny Cedeno
Mike Fontenot or Kevin Hart

Tampa will probably want Hart because they REALLY need pitching and Hart is a good young pitcher. And I'd love to see Cedeno (or as several Cubs fans call him, E6) be gone. Fontenot is a good up and coming middle infielder. His hitting also needs to come along. I dont' imagine the Rays wanting him or the Cubs wanting to break up Fontenot and Theriot.

The Cubs lineup would look like this:

LF Soriano
RF/CF Crawford
1B Lee
3B Ramirez
2B DeRosa
C Soto
RF/CF Fukudome
SS Theriot
P

The Cubs are pursuing Fukudome heavily. He would be a great addition and would bat 7th or 8th depending on Theriot. He's a 10-20 home run guy with a decent average.

I'm thinking Cedeno, Marshall, and Marmol might work out. However, I agree that Fukudome is still in the sight of the Cubs and that signing him makes Pie expendable.

A three way deal with Rays-Cubs-Orioles wouldn't surprise me. The Orioles have an interest in both Pie and Marmol, and have the young arms the Rays want.

Also, some people mentioned that the Rays have a crowded outfield. This is true, since its suspected BJ Upton will be converted to a center fielder once their prospect at third comes up and Iwanimora moves to second (short will probably be defensive minded). However, Pie is better than some of their outfielders, and they need speed without Crawford.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Pie, Marshall, Cedeno for Crawford. I'd be okay with this, I think the Rays would be also but I'm not sure.

Lastly, Soriano should stay leadoff. For the last time, he can still steal bases (2004 he was hurt and stole 18, followed by seasons of 33 and 41... 2007 he stole 19 and is perfectly capable of 30+). He bats much better at leadoff, and Crawford did fine lower in the order last year when the Rays were experimenting with it. Also, they need lefty batters to break up Lee Ramirez Soriano, so batting Soriano 5th wouldn't help (unless Crawford Lee Fukudome Ramirez Soriano... which isn't great)

these are the absolute most ridiculous trade offers i have ever seen in my entire life!!! keep up the great comedy!

Add this to the list - Cedeno/Veal/Patterson/Marshall for crawford - toss in Murton or Pagan too. Rays won't take Marquis - most likely will want Hill and Marmol thus killing deal.

I love Cubs fans, I am one, but many just aren't grounded in reality when it comes to trade speculation. Agreed that the Rays wouldnt be seeking Pie.

Please fellow Cubs fans just stop. These trade ideas although humorous make our fanbase look idiotic.

I know not every Cubs fan who posted was way off base, but still.

There's no way Soto is part of the package, same with Hill.

Marmol should be the number one guy the cubs are willing to give up. He lives off his slider and teams are starting to catch up with it. We have a similar guy in Wuertz, who is disgustingly under-rated (#1 in MLB in inherited runners stranded and K's more then 1 per inning.) As long as we re-sign wood, our bullpen is very deep.

one of Marmol/Pie, Cedeno, and Marshall. MAYBE the cubs throw in eric patterson (hes in the dog house)

I think that there are too many fantasy baseball players who comment on this blog. Crawford commands and deserves a huge bounty. Hill/Marmol/Soto are absolutely the right price for him, if even close to being enough.

I'm all for it as long as the Cubs have a plan to fill the holes. I'm glad that the Cubs at least have a GM willing to entertain the thought of pulling the trigger on a big deal.

any trade would absolutely include 2 of Hill/Marmol/Soto and one lesser player. Crawford's age and contract make him extremely valuable.

Carl Crawford = .315 11 80
Don't get me wrong he's good, but he's not an allstar or superstar.
K's have increase the last 4 years.

Marmol is the National League Equivalent to K-rod. In fact his numbers were better last year. He isn't going anywhere.

Rich Hill isn't going anywhere. Lefties with high K rates are rarely traded. Especially ones who have 4 years before free agency.

Soto is your everyday catcher next year.

Here is who I would look at Donald Veal or Pawleck, Patterson, and maybe Priors rights.

Crawfor is a guy the cubs would greatly need, and i do think they would have to start out any package with felix pie, I think a pie/hill/cedeno package would make this kind of trade happen. You would have dempster replace hill in the rotation or sign a F.A pitcher, you have Ifante as a backup shortstop/2nd baseman or can even use him in the outfield or sign another outfielder

I don't see how Crawford is over hyped. He is crazy good; is very consistent; and figures to stay one of the best outfielders in the game for a long time.

Seems very similar to the Vernon Wells situation, where toronto had to sign one of it's homegrowns just to show a commitment to winning.

But if the Cubs get Crawford, most importantly i would have to think that it would go a long way to making Jays fans happy, since he killed us last year !!! Go Cubs !!!!

The deal can get done without Hill or Soto, but it would be getting extremely complicated. The way I see it, we'd have to go after the one thing that the Rays don't really have, a catcher.

Pie, Marshall, and some upper tier prospects (Gallagher, Veal, EPatt, Colvin, and the like) plus a guy like Wuertz to the Mariners for Clement... then we'd have to flip Clement, Marmol, probably Theriot and maybe even the rest of our good prospects to the Rays for Crawford.

So, yeah, we can probably pull something together based on Pie, Marmol, and Marshall... while still holding on to Hill and Soto, but it'd pretty much bankrupt our farm system except for Samardzija (who nobody will take).

while we are dreaming, why not trade hill/cedeno/some combination not named marmol or soto (fontenot, hart, gallagher, theriot) for crawford, sign fukadome and then make a deal centerd around pie with the twins for johann santana then u have the best one two pirching in the nl and one of the best lineups

*without Crawford in that last paragraph

WTF?!?

You people bitch about Yankees fans being delusional but this takes the cake.

Crawford:

Can hit in any of the top 3-4 spots in the order.

Is 25 years old.

Can play gold glove defense in any of the 3 OF spots.

Can steal 60 bases.

Hits .300+

His OBP has increased every year.

His SLG has increased every year except for this one when it stayed steady.

His OPS+ has increased every year.

He's cheap until the 2011 season when he hits FA, is an excellent teammate and good character guy.

See what the Rangers got for Tex? See what the Marlins are asking for Cabrera? Crawford will fetch something more than Tex and less than Cabrera.

Hill, Marmol and Cedeno. Please.

Rays will trade Crawford for a cheap ace. Cain, Lincecum that sort of player.

Cubs fans defiantly seem to always put up the most far-fetched trade proposals

These deals are just too much for me to handle. Unbelievably delusional.

First, stop mentioning Marquis. He's horrible with a terrible contract. Why don't you just trade him to the Rockies for Tulo, or to the Brewers for Braun. Sounds good?

Realistically, Crawford is a very good OF and would be tough to get for the Cubbies. Pie doesn't have as much value for the Rays than most, so I just don't see a fit.

I love this website.

@nic:

I'd love this website too if it weren't for the god awful commenting system.

Really Tim... please fix it. Have a look at Disqus.

I'm a Cubs fan, and even I agree a lot of these proposals are unrealistic. Crawford is a young stud and would cost a ton. See I don't think he would cost as much as Teixeira or Cabrera would. Those guys are middle of the order forces, and posted high numbers in every category that didnt relate to speed. Crawford on the other hand is an above average outfielder that will post a 315/365/480 line with 20 hr and 60 sb on a good season, and that makes him a star, but not on Cabrera's level. He would require a top prosect, at least one, but Felix Pie really doesn't have much valie to Tampa because they already have Upton in CF, and D. Young, Baldelli and others to play the corners. It would likely have to be a deal surrounding around pitching. If I were the Cubs I would be determined to get this deal done without Rich Hill, who is a bonafide 3 starter starting next year, and Carlos Marmol, the Cubs' closer for the next 10 years. Even though those seem like the exact players the Rays would want, I think the Cubs could still get this done. They would have to offer the Rays a lot of depth, and no Marquis: he sucks and he's expensive. Offer the Rays Sean Marshall, Ronny Cedeno, Eric Patterson, Kevin Hart and Sam Fuld. Thats two talented young pitchers and three talented young position players. Odds are that at least a couple of those guys will end up as above average starters. Patterson and/or Cedeno could probably start immediately for the Rays, and Marshall, and maybe Hart, would likely join Kazmir, Shields, Sonnastine and Edwin Jackson in the rotation.

"Offer the Rays Sean Marshall, Ronny Cedeno, Eric Patterson, Kevin Hart and Sam Fuld."

You had us believing that you weren't one of the delusional ones there for a second!!!

Really? I thought that was five good to decent prospects for Crawford. Seemed reasonable, but i guess not.

5 to 1 offers are RARELY ever equal value for both sides

usually the team offering 5 players is getting a steal

I tried to find 5 guys that I thought had a chance to be pretty good players, but I guess the main flaw is none of those guys really looks like they could be anything more than that. Only problem though is the only young guys the Cubs have like that are like Pie, Gallagher, Marmol, Veal and Vitters. The only one i could see them moving in a deal like this is Gallagher though, and maybe Marmol

Crawford > Tex in trade value right now. He's cheaper for longer. Tex is arguably the more valuable hitter.

Do you really think that the Rays could get 5 good propects, including the best 3 that an organization has to offer?

(a la Teixeira for Salty, Andrus, Harrison and others)

Here's the fact of the matter when it comes to this deal. Unless the D-Rays are willing to take some decent prospects who are not ready for the big leagues this year, but will be in a year or two, this deal doesn't go down. Marmol will not be traded, they're prepping him to take over the closer spot in '09. After the revolving door of catchers we had last year, Soto will also not be going anywhere. People need to stop mentioning Prior. He's not even going to be ready to pitch again until late this season, if at all. I'd hate to see Hill go, but the Cubs could handle his departure, although he's young and cheap and we all love his curve. If the Cubs are planning on nabbing Crawford and Fukudome, then Pie has to go somewhere because the Cubs won't want him rotting away on the bench or in the minors for 3-4 years.
I don't see this trade happening unless Hendry has stopped caring about the Cubs and his job, or the D-Rays are willing to take some down-the-road prospects. The last option is mildly realistic considering there is no way in hell that they actually are going to be contenders for a few years, after Crawford nears free agency anyways and heads somewhere with a payroll over $30 million. It's really going to come down to whether they want trade him now or in his FA year.

Alright well I've seen about enough of these rediculous trade offers. As a writer for the rays magazine, I feel the need to jump in here.

First off, the Rays will not accept a package of prospects. They have been very up front in saying that they want major league talent for major league talent in any trade. They already have the best farm system in baseball, why trade for any more prospects? Their minor league system is stacked, especially in starting pitching and outfielders, and they have obvious holes to fill on the major league roster. They will not, and I repeat, will not center any trade around any prospects, especially ones mentioned that would fall way down the depth chart. Price, Davis, McGee and Niemann are all BA top 100 prospects and should all be up by 08 or 09.

Here is how I see it going down. Marmol is involved no matter what. The Rays relief pitching is by far the biggest weakness and I can't see the Rays not getting Marmol in this deal.

Secondly, they would demand either Hill or Soto in the deal, with Soto being the perferred player.

Marmol and Hill/Soto seems like a lot from the Cubs perspective, but I GUARANTEE this is what they would demand. If the Cubs aren't willing to give in, then the Rays know 20+ organizations that would be willing to part with such a package for a 26 year old 2-time allstar with 3 years left on his contract.

Please, Please stop throwing names like Cedeno, Gallager, Marshall, Patterson, Pie, and Marquis around. Im not saying those players are bad (well Marquis is), but they would not interest the Rays at all. We already have better internal options and Cedeno would only be a throw in.

As I mentioned before, I do not see it happening without Marmol and I would be completely shocked if Soto or Hill was not part of the deal. I wouldnt even be suprised if the Rays asked for all three, trying to offer something else in the deal to get it done.

So start all of your trade proposals with Marmol and leave your prospects out.

Well, this deal would leave the cubs pitching staff in trouble. The cubs need Marmol because, in my view, he is one of the best middle relivers in the league. We need more relievers, not less. trade off excess defensive players, and go for free agents. trading for these guys is good, but we need to go for more free agents. it would make a very strong email, so lets hope...

Can I get an Amen from the choir for delmonmvp?! Amen!

haha thanks. I just know the rays system very well and I know what they are looking for. The Rays are going to ask the moon for Crawford and I guarantee someone is going to give in. In the same sense, someone is going to pay A-rod 35 million a year. Is he really worth that? Probably not. Personally Id rather have three 10 million dollar players. In the same sense, someone is going to give the Rays what they demand for Crawford. Its way to early in the offseason for the Rays to give in to the first offer they get for Crawford. I bet almost every team has been kicking the tires on what it would take. Marmol and Soto/Hill is just being realistic.

raysrule07, if those are the terms, then Hendry has to walk away. The Cubs are stronger not making that deal.

Thinking more about it...as good as Marmol is, I think he is at absolute peak value. When looking at his contract and talent...he is probably the most valuable in the game. Honestly...is there anyone better for cheaper for longer??

That being said...Hill and Soto are untouchable to me. Trading either creates a hole that they cannot fill this offseason. So if a deal can be done with Marmol + 2 "good" prospects, fine..think about it. Otherwise, there is just no way the deal gets done. It doesn't have to happen Cubs fans. I don't know about you...but if we can get Fukudome...I would be MORE than happy to have an outfield of Sori, Pie, and Fukudome!!! Then we can take a look at SS and still have a somewhat decent farm system.

By the way delmonmvp...how about a job?? Ha...

Crawford actually has good power, but just needs to have more confidence pulling the ball. He goes through stretches when his conidence builds and he can jack 5 homers in a 2 week span. Other times he gets slap happy and won't hit a homer for a couple weeks. As he matures as a hitter, his power numbers will increase. He has the build, 6'2 220lb, to hit for power, but right now its his approach at the plate that is limiting his potential. Most experts see Crawford as an annual .300+ BA and 20+ HR hitter for the majority of his career, and at 26 with almost 1,000 career base hits already, he has a lot to look forward to. As should any team who trades for him, as his often considered the most exciting player in baseball. He is truely one of the players you have to see play, day in and day out, to appreciate the intrinsic qualaties he possesses. Some people actually predict that he could develope into a 30-35 HR hitter some day, ala Carlos Beltran.