Cubs Willing To Pay $12-15MM Per Year For Fukudome?

Teetz- As the best players in baseball only register a hit for every three at-bats, the ability to lay down a bunt late in a game should not be over looked

Dusty baker? good joke...I am not sure what your refering too.

Nick Swisher has plus power, he should be money over the course of his career for about 30 bombs. He figures to hover in the 260-270 area average wise, but his OBP should always be around .380. Soriano, though he had a good year average wise, is in the 270-280 area but his OBP is more like 320-330.

While a lot of people have given up on Pie for some reason, Hendry and management haven't, thankfully.

Dusty Baker seemingly hates OBP types, guys like Dunn or Swisher, etc. He's pretty much Billy Beane in reverse.

If Baker were still here, I'm sure he'd be looking to re-acquire Neifi Perez instead of trade for Roberts.

I agree with you mike. We need to keep Pie he is worth the shot that he could become the best CF we have ever had. hahah

Why are you comparing Soriano and Swisher? Anyone would choose Soriano over swisher. The biggest thing with swisher is his defense. He is going to play first til he is 33 and DH after that.

Yes, and a bunt is an out. Outs are bad. There is a higher chance of scoring if you don't lay down a bunt and it's been statistically proven.

uww1, I was referring to your lack of knowledge on statistics and just not knowing much about baseball in general. There are more stats than Average/Homerun/RBI's...much better ones to evaluate baseball players.

I agree with you Aduncaroo We need him bad. He is exactly what we are looking for and we have had an eye on him for a long time.

Because at the plate Swisher and Soriano are almost identical as far as K's/Power/Average, except Swisher walks like 60 more times a year, so I don't see how you can be down on Swisher. Oh and Soriano isn't a particularly good defender himself, but he makes up for some of it with his great arm.

I have refered to all the major statistics, including the stat called Defense. All you have said is OPS...There is more to that. Why are you for getting a 27 year old player who has never been more then just an average player? He could turn out to be a better player, but why give up Pie? thats dumb.

Soriano has far superior power to Swisher, and is way faster which leads to more extra base hits. But yes Swisher has him big time on OBP. Still Soriano is a far more valuable player

uww1,

Swisher isn't an average player. Average players don't hit 30 homers and provide a .380 OBP. And I haven't seen OPS referenced as much as you claim. And defense isn't a statistic. Zone Rating is a statistic.

Teetz- That is exactly my problem with your idea that we should trade the farm to aquire ageing stars that look good on paper but don't translate to our system. Theriot has certain intangables that don't show up through stats. Sure there is room to improve, however, there are far more pressing needs

get off being a tool

"That is exactly my problem with your idea that we should trade the farm to aquire ageing stars that look good on paper but don't translate to our system."

Who's the aging star I wanted to trade the farm for? Cubs don't have much of a farm to trade anyhow. Also, what exactly is 'our' system? Every baseball team's system is the same...score more runs than your opponent. Ryan Theriot is below average on both sides of the ball. And yes, intangibles like hustle and grindiness do show up in the statistics. I'm waiting to hear how Ryan Theriot is a pretty decent SS for the Cubs without someone avoiding statistics.

Teetz,

The best argument for Theriot is that he ran out of gas. He is planning on conditioning more. So...someone trying to defend him would say to look at his stats before the last part of August and September, and now having played a full season, they should resemble that more. I'm not saying I fully believe that...but thats what someone saying he is a good player would say.

A few simple evaluations of a baseball player and Ryan Theriot's standing in each:

Not making outs/Getting on base: Bad - Below League Average

Hitting for power: Very minimal - below league average

Moving runners over: His manager knows how dumb it is to bunt - Inconclusive since he only laid down 8 last year...8.

Works the count: Very very bad. Saw the least amount of pitches per plate appearance of any regular on the team.

Fielding: Doesn't get to as many balls as an average SS would get to.

Hustle/Grindy Factor: Very very good. Makes a .250 hitter into a .266 hitter.

Ryan Theriot makes a fine backup....a backup.

Teets- While you have said Theriot is no more than a back-up, i don't see any solutions within the Cubs organanizations or for that matter through free agency in our immediate future. Not every position can be occupied by an all-star and at this time Theriot is the best option

SKY_TAY : Just to let ya know "sport" the Royals have a new GM as of last year just to let you know so maybe you can pull your head outta your ass and realize the Royals are who they once were.. a farm team for other teams.. now they are rebuilding and should contend 1-3 yrs from now if not this year.. ill tell you one thing the royals will finish before the twins and whitesox in the AL central thats for damn sure.. the rotation is far to good and the young hitters, ( INCLUDING TEA E N) just have another year under there built and should tear it up next year.. but I am flattered you want Teahen..

mikeks, I'm just saying he's bad. Just because he's the best option we have, doesn't mean we have to overvalue him. SS is a glaring weakness and hopefully Derosa can play there more times than not. Fortunately, the Cubs aren't in the AL and can afford a weakness at a spot here and there.

lol

Could the Cubs go after Tejada instead of Roberts? That would fix a few things. Would we have to give up more for Tejada then Roberts? How much more?

I would imagine Tejada would come far cheeper that Roberts as his number have slipped, however, i think roberts has a far better upside

yes I agree with you mike but we have a 2B and a backup at SS.

What about a trade for roberts and tejada?

ya I agree I was just kind of talking out loud. We need Fukudome.

Bedard would be an awesome addition. They are asking way too much though.

An official offer?

And you're comparing Matsui to Fukodome on what basis? That they're both Japanese? At least I've tossed out numbers to compare, and so far he compares far more closely to a Iwamura or (at best) Iguchi. And that's a $12-$15M investment?

The only thing we both agree on is this: we BOTH want him on the Cubs.

And I'm hardly upset that the Cardinals window closed; we enjoyed an extended run including two WS appearances and one win.

Cubs rumored to have offered Fukudome 3yr/45M: http://www.sanspo.com/mlb/top/mt200712/mt2007120607.html

Some stats for you guys who don't know where to get them:

Hideki Matsui in Japan:
http://japanesebaseball.com/players/player.jsp?PlayerID=163

Ichiro Suzuki in Japan:
http://www.japanesebaseball.com/players/player.jsp?PlayerID=28

Kosuke Fukudome in Japan:
http://japanesebaseball.com/players/player.jsp?PlayerID=1064

Now you can know instead of guessing.

One thing that makes me mad is for the past three days, the papers have been saying "Fukudome will decide tomorrow!" He hasn't even decided if he's coming to America. I mean, there's a 99.9% (if not 100%) chance he is coming, but you think they could at least report that by now.

Two guys from two different leagues? They both played in Japan and their production can indeed be compared along with how that production translated to the bigs.

There's nothing, repeat, nothing in Fukodome's stats that show why he deserves $15M per year in the major leagues.

Devish, you are right. However, the Cubs lineup is set:

C Soto
1B Lee
2B DeRosa
SS Theriot
3B Ramirez
LF Soriano
CF Pie

except for that RF. The perfect RF would bat L, have a high OBP, have good defense, and could take over CF when the Cubs play lefties because Pie is struggling big time against them. No other play on the market can do that except for Kosuke Fukudome. Just like a puzzle that is missing a part of two is marked down 50%, you will happily overpay to buy that last piece individually.

All the money is going to Fukudome, but we are paying for the puzzle.

I think I was talking to 2 different people on that last post

I was wrong...I thought I said that I was wrong before...sorry man if I didnt. I am a big fan of DeRosa

I read above that some fans are thinking that picking up Tejada would be good. Not a bad idea if he isn't on the Mitchell report.

"for whoever talked about the Cubs getting "destroyed" in the playoffs...you are retarded."

As a diehard Cub fan I was embarrassed by the Cubs performance in the playoffs. They may not have been "destroyed", but they showed the world what kind of team they were. A team that doesn't take pitches and still can't find a way to get on base. They can't move runners over and they can't drive runners in with less than two outs. And to top it off out pitching staff fell apart at the worst time.

If we could get Roberts, Teahen, and Fukodome I think that would drastically change the outlook of our team. But Hendry MUST do something to improve the offense because it sucks!

Fukodome in my humble opinion is not much more than a very expensive Jacque Jones. I have only seen highlights of Fukodome play but I really don't see much difference. Their numbers aren't that different and one played in Japan. So I cant see signing him unless they want to get in to the marketing aspect of the Japan market. That's it.

He and Jones numbers are very different. By the way, Jones had what, like 3 home runs last year? He will hit at least 15 and play great defense, and doesn't throw worm burners...at least from what I've seen. He also hits for a much better average and gets on base at a MUCH better rate than Jones ever has...ever. They are very different.

agreed Ben.

"if he wasn't such a great contact hitter he would strike out 150 times a year here."

That comment alone makes your post worth nothing. Thats like saying..."if the guy didn't swing so hard he wouldn't hit so many home runs." Thanks for that amazing piece of information.

By the way, Ben said at BEST he is an all star, and worst he still fills a bunch of needs. That was a bad post buddy...

hey aduncaroo, he swings at many pitches out of the zone and therefore gets outs. not everyone can be like vlad and hit bombs at pitches around the neck.

go ahead sign him, block all ur OF prospects, see how good his transition is. bring ur payroll up to the highest in the NL and still get squashed in the first round of the playoffs. and then watch low payroll teams like the rockies and dbacks dominate the NL with a third of the payroll since they dont block prospects. buddy.

Well, now Fukudome has no choice, he has to play for a team in the states. From Japanball.com is a report from the Yumiuri Giants saying they have officially pulled out of the Fukudome "chase". They said they got word from the MLB's winter meetings, that the American clubs were offering more money than they could contend with. The report also claimed that it was between the Cubs and the Royals as to who would recieve his services. I just hope they don't know something medically that we do not. Japanball.com in the news link