Cubs Acquire Rich Harden, Chad Gaudin

Maybe so with regard to the reasons Gonzalez (though I don't know how walking 4-5 batters a game with nearly a hit per inning is pitching well) and De Los Santos haven't produced. But I'll bet the farm Gallagher has a better career than either one.

Not a Cubs fan at all but I tip my hat to the organization. This is a great pick-up for what they paid. All Harden has to do is be healthy come playoff time. Take it easy with him during the 2nd half and hope he gets healed up.

From the A's perspective I just can't understand this. One decent prospect and some fillers. I can only assume that Harden is more hurt than we know. Even at that though I would have guessed that Beane could have extracted more from different clubs.

Great, great move for the Cubs. Not at the same level as CC but huge nonetheless.

On a side note, wonder if the Brewers are kicking themselves right now? They could have landed Harden and kept LaPorta. Even if they don't have a place for him he could be available as piece to help land much needed bullpen help.

“Also, I may be mistaken here, but haven't most of Harden's injury problems been shoulder related, as opposed to elbow related?”

Baseball Prospectous claims he has elbow (from 06) and shoulder (from 07) problems that the team doesn’t know how to address as a longterm solution. I could be mistaken, but I believe it was even his elbow which was bothering him last week as well…

This is a great move by hendry. I knew beane was going to want gallagher, but it also makes sense that he would like murton, an obp guy. Patterson, given a full season's time can hit .290 and steal 40 bases. I think crunchy made a great point when he said that beane got 3 major leaguers here, while the tribe will probably get 2. Laporta could be great, but I think gallagher could be better than most think as well. Gallagher, in that home park, could be blanton of last year, possibly even better on the road.

All around great deal for the cubs who couldn't use 3 of the 4 players they gave up. And I have to say, all the people who constantly biched about cubs fans constantly bringing up murton and patterson types, please take note and be properly humbled.

Bother? I meant BOTH. I've had too many beers.

baseballnuts--

My own current top 10 Cubs prospect list, noting that I am willing to put anyone not currently on the 40-man on such a list:

1. Rich Hill
2. Josh Vitters
3. Jeff Samardzija
4. Felix Pie
5. Dae Eun Rhee
6. Andrew Cashner
7. Tony Thomas
8. Wellington Castillo
9. Jose Ceda
10. Casey Lambert

Honorable mentions: Veal, Maestri, Wells, Hoffpauir, Shafer

I agree lets see if we can get Burnett from the Jays for Marquis and Cedeno.GO CUBS GO HEY CHICAGO WHAT DO YOU SAY THE CUBS ARE GONNA WIN TODAY!

Dark, I'd have liked to have seen Rich Hill involved too. Only because I think he and Piniella aren't a good fit. He needs a new boss and a new environment. Hill's a nice guy, you want to see him do well. Maybe the Cubs still hold out hope for the guy...or maybe Beane didn't want him. Either way, the Cubs have bought some time to let him work things out.

As much as I love Gallagher, this deal came way too easy. And it makes me a litte nervous. But if Harden can be healthy for the playoffs, then you are right, this could be the biggest steal in Cubs history. If he gets hurt, the Cubs haven't lost much in terms of their chances for this year...rather they are right back where they started. That is the genius in the deal and that's what made it a worthwhile risk. On Beane's side, he did well enough. He's got himself a solid starter, who's status as a prospect is underrated (in my opinion). He has an exciting offensive player and potential leadoff man in Patterson. And he's got a decent hitter in Murton who may just need a chance to play semi-regularly. I always felt he'd fit better in the AL anyway. And Beane may still get an offensive catcher in Donaldson... a nice commodity. Time will tell but I'm hoping this deal works out for both teams...really. Gallagher has been my favorite Cubs pitching prospect for the past 3 years. I can't start rooting against him now.

If they could get Burnett out of the Jays also There would be many tears shed in Brewer Town .

And I just don't see how the cubs could be stopped you have a real manager and coaching staff not likely to make a stupid move .

And Soriano when he comes back he has shown he can carry a club .
My favorite CUB is THE RIOT
See in the Series!

GOOOOOOOOOO CUBSSSSSSS

From a Indians fan !

"you arrogant prick. gee, i guess actual baseball people know a bit more about the quality of the Cubs prospects than you, typing away in your mom's basement, huh?"

- Johnny Rotten

Even someone with such a deficient intellect can probably find something sharp, and their own wrist. Just remember down the block, not across the street.

I don't believe it was the slider that hurt Harden--pretty sure he didn't throw the slider much. He used to throw a splitter, which was his best out pitch. However, this year he has turned his change into a similarly effective out pitch and ditched the splitter.

Re Swisher deal, don't forget the "throw-in" for that deal...Mr. Ryan Sweeney, he has been performing well.

What do the Blue Jays want with Jason Marquis? Oof!

I feel bad for smart baseball fans that cheer for the cubs on this site because they get lumped in with the dumb ones.

The Blue Jays have no use for Marquis. I hope this year he has a decent second half for us as any Cub fan would love .500 from him.

The Jays wouldn't "want" Marquis; no GM could possibly be that dumb. But he'd be a partial contract offset that could make a Burnett trade palatable. Besides his inconsistency, injury history, and prickly attitude, what makes Burnett a difficult trade is his deal--he can either opt-out after this year, or he gets $24MM guaranteed for 09 and 10. So if he's good, he leaves; if he sucks, you're stuck with him.

If Hendry offered to say, pick up the remainder of Marquis' 08 money, then you might be able to get someone to take him. Mets? Phils? Tigers?

You could probably add Simmons and Cahill to that list as well. The A's still have some good arms ready to fill in for Harden, as well as any possible free agent losses they may have in the next couple of years.

I think that's a pretty good idea, Studio. They have enough solid starters to pull it off. Dempster hasn't pitched this much in a few years, Harden has only pitched more than 130 innings once, Zambrano has piled on innings the past couple of seasons. It makes a lot of sense. The only thing is I'm not sure Piniella will buy into it. He's a competitive guy and he's going to try and win every game he can to ward off the Brewers and the Cardinals. That means putting his best guys out there whenever he can. Maybe the best we can hope for is that Marshall/Gaudin get a spot start here and there during a long stretch of games. I can see it happening more with Marshall since he's lefty and may match up better with some teams. If they can spot start him in Dempster or Harden's place from time to time, it would help. I think those two guys are our biggest concerns down the stretch.

i am not trying to start an argument with anyone on this thread, but i would like to add my 2 cents worth

1. Got to tip my hat to hendry and the entire cubs organization, I didnt expect this deal to go down, and face it, you got a steal. You guys didnt give up much at all, and you got a young solid pitcher under club control for a few years (i think). The only concern you have with him is his health. For those who said this was a low risk, high reward deal, i disagree with you. This is a high risk, because harden could get hurt and be out a log time, but if he stays healthy, you have yourselves an absolute steal.

2nd, you honestly cannot say that the cubs will dominate the division from years to come. The brewers undoubtedly have an unbelievable farm system with names like jeffress, escobar, and gamel. You also cannot assume that we will lose both pitchers to free agency. I am very confident that attanasio will not let this team fall apart, with how much he has invested in this team. He will not let this city go into baseball exile like weve been in the last quarter century. I am implying that the cubs and brewers will be competing for the division title for years to come.

Love Greg Maddux for no. 5, but I will take AJ Burnett (another #2) thanks.

This would be kind of cool:

Zambrano
Harden
Burnett
Dempster
Lilly

woah-goosebumps!

yes that looks really nice.

Zambrano
Harden
Lilly
Demster
Maddux

That looks really nice too...

I think I like our top 4 over Burnett too. Its hard to say. I just think Maddux presence is good to have in the clubhouse. I think either one would be amazing.

I'm surprised people are comparing this trade to the Sabathia trade. CC is the reigning Cy Young. Harden has pitched 77 innings this season, more than the last two seasons combined....that includes minor league rehab innings. Honestly, how many more innings does he have in him this season? Not many GMs are going to give up the moon for a pitcher with an injury history as spotty as Harden's. My guess is this was about as good as the A's were going to get at this point. Waiting it out likely would have hurt Harden's value rather than improved it.

I agree, his presence, he's great, I'd love for him to win it with the Cubs in his third stint. But, I just look at his numbers outside Petco, and I think I don't want to risk a 5-inning, 6 run outing in a playoff game. I know what you are saying though, he is the best pitcher of the modern era(steroid-free.)

scatterbrian - Marshall is better than Marquis, I'd rather have him in there.

cubs land - Yes, I want AJ now too for rotation previously mentioned. It's so beautiful I'll list it again:

Zambrano
Harden
Burnett
Dempster
Lilly

If Harden gets hurt, Marshall #5

If we win Wednesday and Thursday we would be the first team with three 10 win pitchers. Then Add Harden to the mix, I am getting more and more excited.

Coming off the brilliant trade of Harden Cub fans immediately return to their lunacy by wanting AJ Burnett. Why?

The guy is sporting an ERA near 5.00, has a WHIP of nearly 1.50. He will cost you $6m for the 2nd half of the season, prospects, plus you are faced with a no-win situation in the off-season. If he's good he walks, if he's bad or injured you are stuck with a worthless $10m/year pitcher.

Burnett is like Harden, except he is a mediocre pitcher when healthy. If you are lucky he might put up a sub 4.00 ERA in the NL. But is that really an upgrade?

Try finding some bullpen help first. Trading for a strong pen arm does several things. First, you take some innings off of Marmol and Wood's schedule (they both have pitched a ton so far). More importantly though, you prevent your primary competition (the Brewers) from upgrading their most vulnerable part of the team.

bjsguess--

I agree, I've advocated the Cubs going after Brian Fuentes for some time now. I want another option for a bridge reliever to Wood, I'm concerned that Marmol has been overworked and Howry tends to blow up every 3rd or 4th outing.

LOVE the Cubs middle relief depth now though, it's really over the top. Wuertz, Lieber, Cotts, Eyre (currently on DL), now Gaudin, and I suppose, Marshall or Marquis are all options. Given the dearth of relievers on the market, gotta think Hendry has himself a couple of really nice ML-level trading chips here if he wants to keep playing the riverboat gambler.

Dodgers are ready to cut bait with Matt Kemp, hmmm.....they need a SS, relievers, a 5th starter, and ANYONE that can hit a longball. I think the Cubs can help them out :-)

Burnett doesn't even compare to CC. He has also spent time on the DL in five of the last six seasons. He has pitched 200 innings twice and each time, he followed it up with a couple years of injury problems. He just isn't a durable pitcher and can't be counted on for a full season much like Erik Bedard.

With Harden, I don't really know why everyone is so excited about him. Yes, he has some of the best stuff in the majors, but it doesn't mean anything if he isn't healthy enough to pitch and can't be counted on for even half a season at this point. Cubs fans here talk about him like he'll magically be healthy for the rest of his career just because he's in a different uniform. The guy is falling apart at the seams and that's probably a big reason why he came so cheap. Gallagher will probably have 3x as long of a career as Harden and looks like a pretty good pitcher in the making. You guys are excited about someone as injury prone as Harden and now, you want average A.J.? Why did you even bother letting Prior go? Saying you are obsessed with injury prone pitchers is an understatement. I hope it works out for you guys, though.

As for SOME of the Cubs fans that have participated in this thread, I can only shake my head at the unrestrained arrogance and the attacking of other posters who don't see things the way you do. When I first came to this site, there seemed to be a general dislike of Cubs fans and until this and the Sabathia threads, I didn't really see the full extent of why. Get a grip, will ya? Stop making yourselves look like idiots and start acting like you have some sense. Sure makes it hard to root for you.

Well I was wrong about the Cubs not being able to get Harden. Congratulations to the Cubs. Even if he does turn out to be damaged goods, it's a great risk regardless of the outcome

I think Beane must have been really wary that Harden would go back on the DL before the trade deadline. Either that or he likes these prospects a lot more than their stats/profiles indicate

jesus christ cubs fans 158 posts!!! i have nothing to say but to remind everyone the cards r still in it and when carp and wainwright come back its on. GO CARDS

Well we're just a little excited, as well we should be, just got two very good pitchers, either of which alone, is worth what we gave up.

I agree the Cards are in it, I never ever count the Cards out. 2 of these 3 teams will make the playoffs. I actually hope it's the Cubs & Cardinals, becuase the Cubs would not match up well in an NLCS with the Brewers, and that is what is going to happen if they both make it.

Just a though what would it take to get Holliday?

Fuentes

For

Wuertz/Cotts
Cedeno
Randy Wells
"Mid Level Prospect"

The Cubs should now go after Fuentes and/or Burnett. Burnett isn't going to be terribly expensive, and Fuentes is also readily available. Think about a rotation of Z, Harden, Burnett, Lilly and Dempster. No one can match that. Add Fuentes to Wood, Marmol, Howry etc and the pen is unmatched as well.

What do the Cubs have left to trade? In no particular order they have Veal, Cedano, Hill, Pie, Theriot, Colvin, Samardizja (sp?), Ceda, Ascanio etc... Not a great lot to work with but definitely enough to get another deal or two done.

People tend to generalize too much without looking at specifics when it comes to deadline trades. Burnett can be had in part because of who he is and in part because of his contract situation. His price is going to be lowered accordingly, especially considering that Toronto would likely enjoy getting out of his contract and/or getting something in return considering he could leave at the end of the year. Simply put, he's not going to cost multiple high end prospects. The Cubs had enough to get Harden, but not Sabathia, and they still have enough to get more. Haters don't change reality just because they hate. The Cubs farm system, while not high end, is still productive. Just ask Billy Beane.

@92-93

I will stand by earlier statement - Burnett is mediocre. I'll grant you that his career ERA is solid. But I really don't care what the guy did 8 years ago.

I look at the last three years. I see a guy who has been OK. Over that time he has posted 4.16ERA. He's pitched 135 and 165 innings in the previous 2 years. And he has been just awful this year. He's the wrong side of 30 and is a major injury risk. The only good news is that his arm should be relatively fresh because he just hasn't pitched much over his career (avg of about 140IP per year).

If we were having this discussion last year it would be a totally different situation. Last year he could have helped. He would have been an upgrade. This year he has been bad and Cubs have superior alternatives in house.

Finally, you mention that his career ERA is better than Sabathia and Bedard. The difference between those guys and Burnett is huge. Primarily because both of those guys have moved beyond just potential. They have managed to post big numbers. With Burnett everyone's wondering when he will finally match his stuff with end results. He has never been dominate and has flashed #1 starter numbers just twice, in 2002 and 2005.

I just don't see Holliday as a fit. Fukudome can't play center on an everyday basis and you can't platoon him. It would be nice to have Holliday though.

The Cards have no business being where they are and yet I always respect their play and never count them out.

I always wanted a Cub/Cards/Brewers rivalry going. This year I get my wish. Top it off with the White Sox doing well and I really am loving this year. The thought of the Cubs winning against the Cards or Brewers for the division and then winning against one of those two for the NL crown would be a rush. Then the Cubs win against the White Sox for it all...

'Dream on', right. The odds are overwhelmingly against this happening. Yet the first half of the season is shaping up to be a possibility. Who knows.

I still think maddux will go to milwaukee. Maddux would like to pitch for a contender and i think he could come up big come playoff time. The brewers could give tony gwynn jr for him.

I would have no problem bringing Greg back. I don't care if he never started a game. His presence on the team would be helpful. I heard Dempster in an interview that he has talked to Maddux about pitching tips when he was a Cub last time. I'm sure others could learn something if they asked him. I'm not saying Greag can wave a magic wand over everyone. Who had Dempster winning 10 gaves at the break? I had him at 10-12 wins all year. I don't think he is coming here. I would not want him to go to the Brewers with his bro, either.

"Sweeney's been ok, but he hasn't hit for much power."

Was he really expected to though? No? He is a big boy, but has shown no propensity toward power hitting. He is a high average/high OBP speed player who bats left handed and has an excellent outfield arm..

Yeah Joel, living in St. Louis, I have a respect for the Cards and the way they play. Still, especially with Mulder's showing tonight, they really need to take a long look at seeing what Burnett/Bedard would cost. I think Burnett is the better option for them, and is one of those players who can get hot and dominate in any given stretch. If that stretch happened to be the second half, you would be in great shape. I just don't see Wellemeyer/Piniero types being as reliable as you need down the stretch.

However, you are kind of playing with house money, since most didn't expect more than 3rd place from the Cards anyway...so who knows.

What about this?

Duncan and Reyes for Burnett? Jays need power and a pitcher for the rotation if he leaves, so seems like a win win to me...