Red Sox Sign Takashi Saito

"saito is playing in the WBC. i highly doubt his injury is of a major concern or he wouldnt be playing."

he's 'trying out" for the WBC, and other countries dont really care if you're hurt or not, you play for your country. look at yao ming in teh olympics, team USA doesnt care about the WBC, other teams do

so you think saito is dumb enuff to go out and pitch if hes not 100% healthy? lol

when the hell did yao ming come into this convo. im saying that saito obv cant be hurt that bad, if hes going to pitch in the WBC.

national pride? if your going to risk further injury for national pride the more power to you.

"national pride? if your going to risk further injury for national pride the more power to you."

That, my friend is exactly my point.

No one was talking about Pavano? Pavano was good when heathly, but definately not on the level of the other 3. You are the only one bringing up Pavano's name.

And talking about post-florida, Beckett has had more then just finger issues(back, oblique, elbow) And in the last three years Beckett has started 90 games, Burnett 80.

I guess, it was just random and off topic.

"That's John's point. Beckett Burnett and Penny are all similar in his opinion. Pavano is the only one from the Florida rotation (who he apparently watched alot) who wasn't the same among the top 4. I think he was just pointing that out."

That was it.. Before the days of MLB.TV and stuck watching only Marlins and Rays games for a few years here since transplanting myself from NE area.

the rays will drop off this year. this div. is a two horse race.

I hope Smoltz and Penny both pan out, but if they don't its not going to kill the RedSox. Imagine if something happens to the Yankees big three FA signings.If the Yanks signings do not pan out they are MOST LIKELY screwed. Not to mention I think that the Red Sox have more depth. People can say what they want about Bowden because he is an unproven commodity. Bucholtz however has proven that he can hang, its just a matter of bouncing back. Not long ago Jon Lester looked to be delving into mediocrity, but look what time can do to talented prospects. The Sox have Bowden, Bard, Tanzawa, and Bucholtz to look forward too. The best part is that there is not even room for any of them unless they prove themselves, or the team gets hit with injuries. The solid foundation of the team will grant our rookies time to mature, it does not mean they will all be good, but it increases the chances.

The fact that the Sox have Smoltz, and Penny, as well as many rookie candidates to start, should allow for Masterson to work out of the bullpen. With Paps, Ramon, Okajima, Delcarmen, Masterson, Saito, and possibly Smoltz contributing out of the pen I feel confident it will at least be a top four bullpen.

Lastly imagine the incredible flexibility the Sox have to trade come July. If Smoltz, Penny, or Saito pan out depending on the teams situation they might be incredibly valuable trade chips when July rolls around. An example would be how the Royals flipped Dotel, and the Rangers flipped Gange years back.

Why do people keep thinking the rays and the rockies have anythign in common. The rockies were mediocre in the worst division in baseball while the rays won the best.

I Don't Beleive the Saito signing will pan out, seeing he is 39 yrs old coming off of a torn ligament. But if either Penny or Smoltz pan out at all this has the potential of being a Dominant Pitching Staff.

I dont beleive the Sox are done yet either, They still want a young power hitter even if its not a catcher. Wouldnt be surprised to see Hanley rumors again... or possibly a sleeper.. Bucholz and others for Big Prince.

NY & Boston have advantages in offense over the Rays. That aside nothing is certain until the season starts, and all projections are just projections. All three could lose their top 3 pitchers in week one and the Jays could compete. That won't happen (knocking on wood), but as a Red Sox fan I am excited to see the rivalry is alive again, and evolving because of the emergence of the Rays.

This is unrelated, but I think the Reds could be great this season. A lot of IF's and maybe's, but they got some talent over there.

Prince would be nice, however I prefer Hanley if I had to choose.....I don't unfortunately.

it has nothing to do with being 'dumb.' yao ming had a stress fracture in his foot and he was out playing in the omplyics.

Posted by: Zack | January 10, 2009 at 12:54 PM

when the hell did yao ming come into this convo. im saying that saito obv cant be hurt that bad, if hes going to pitch in the WBC.

Posted by: glen_quagmire | January 10, 2009 at 12:57 PM

lol...that was too funny...yao ming? LOL

How are the Red Sox stashing all these guys on their 40 man roster? At last count, they've signed 42 guys to major league contracts. Two lesser names (who can probably start for half the teams in baseball) are going to have to be waived.

Instead of giving about $12 mill combined b/w Penny, Smoltz and Saito they would have been MUCH better served just giving Lowe a 3 yr/$42 mill deal.

I am sure he would have accepted the discount to go to Boston.

These guys are all HUGE injury risks with Penny and Saito leading the way.

Of course, I am biased because it would have been great to get the Sox's 1st rd pick and have them overpay for Lowe.

But Lowe is a MUCH more superior signing due to the fact that he's durable and, let's face it, he's a very good SP.

But probably the Sox didn't want to give their 1st rd pick up to the Dodgers.

Hell with the Texas catchers, guy I would like to see Sox go for if giving up good prospects is Buster Posey.

"Hell with the Texas catchers, guy I would like to see Sox go for if giving up good prospects is Buster Posey."

Just drafted, not eligible and for that matter... not available.

Too bad this year already projected to AA.

If goes there this year at least I will get to see, him. Last year saw Weiters, saw Mauer here too in NB.

Hey gym 399-- Shields pitched 33 games Sonnanstine 32 Jackson 30 Kazmir, your number five freaking starter pitched in 27 games.

How many of those guys are going to make 27+ starts next year? Beckett missed a bunch of starts, Wang and Joba missed substantial starts. The injury bug will hit your team's starting pitching this year and you'll have a Paul Byrd/Sidney Ponson.

You're right, Crawford and Upton weren't great, but Longoria came up and gave them more than they could hope a prospect could. Navarro became a .300 hitter, and Pena, while not as good as '07 is still more than anybody thought he would be.

The Rays were good, but relax.

Theo Epstein: "It's quantity, not quality, that counts."

Posted by: whatever | January 10, 2009 at 02:58 PM

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You cant seriously say that:

Brad Penny: Career ERA:4.06 (not good, not bad)
Career 2.1 SO/BB Ratio(decent)

Takashi Saito: Career 1.95 ERA (GREAT)
Career 4.7 SO/BB Ratio(GREAT)

John Smoltz: Career 3.26 ERA(DECENT)
Career 3.1 SO/BB Ratio(Pretty Good)

Rocco Baldelli: Career .325 OBP(good)
Career .281 Batting Average(decent)
With 58 SB over 6 MLB seasons
(around 5 per season)
*consider he is a 4th outfielder*

Isnt good? I think that for the money they spent they got some real quality players. If healthy they would have really added to their team.

Yea i understand..but IF healthy Saito is Awesome..and baldelli is only a fourth outfielder...for the little money the red sox payed for these players...they deffinately got their money worth!

Kulaid--

Penny, Smoltz, Saito: Recently injured.
Baldelli: Still sick.

Posted by: Rob NY | January 10, 2009 at 03:28 PM

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And i understand that. My point is, assuming they get healthy...and pitch up to their potential (they all have GREAT seasons in the past) the red sox made out great. Considering they spent MILLIONS and MILLIONS less then the Yankees did.

The risk factor in all of these deals is low...they are all signed to one year deals..if they dont work out..then the red sox move on and sign a person like John Lackey to fill a rotation spot next year. IF they do work out. the red sox could get a lot of production out of something they spent very little money on. These deals are great compared to the deals the yankees made... expecially with burnett. if he doesnt pan out..then the yankees are stuck with him for years to come...and the possiblity of anyone wanting him via trade goes down if he proforms poorly.

Bullying everyone's comments? No not really. When someone is 100% wrong (like glen was above saito's elbow) yes ill confront them, but im not sitting here writing "red sox suck" "ortiz sucks, drew blows" ahhaah. All of my posts have been civil and looked at from both sides.

Smoltz was a starter for pretty much his whole career. A 3.36 ERA is outstanding for someone who has pitched as long as he has.

Did anybody else catch this?
"The risk factor in all of these deals is low...they are all signed to one year deals."

You are right. Potentially wasting 5 roster spots because of injury isn't a risk, whatsoever.

I think the point of every signing that Boston has made is this: None of them are for players that they absolutely MUST have. They already have a very solid 1-4 in Lester, Beckett, Dice-K and Wake with Masterson, Buch and Bowden being the internal candidates and penny plus Smoltzie being the obvious veteran #5 guy starter now. Neither has to be really effective for a season and the Sox are hoping for several months at best out of any and all of them.

Baldelli and Saito same thing, Baldelli is a serious risk for DL time and Kotsay will be the 4th OF should that happen, again.. No serious problem on the field if it happens, just very personally important.

The Sox already have one of the deeper BP's in the game, but why not try and add a guy like Saito on the cheap? If he can come back a perfect 8th inning righty to go with Okie-J and what? 1.5 million? Give me a break.. That was dirt cheap. I posted on another topic don't see why the Yanks don't do the same with either Cordero or isrinhghausen.

Look at this BP for depth:

Papelbon
Okajima
MDC
Ramirez
Masterson (or 5th starter)
Lopez
Aardsma (if his quad is fine now)
Saito

What an outstanding 8 relievers and no chance you have 8 on a staff at any given time, maybe not even 7, but only 6, so why the fuss about depth?? It's obvious that is all every last one of these signings were if you look at them.

".well its good they have the money to gamble, and if only one of the three pitchers works out good the media will praise theo as a genius, what else is new"

Joba, how much would it have been worth to the Yankees to have done that come late July with 3 healthy starters?

saito has a sprained lig in his elbow. i really think the zack just makes stuff up just to contradict everything someone says. read it for yourself. the mri revealed a sprained lig not a torn on or part torn.

http://sportsblogs.latimes.com/sports_baseball_dodgers/2008/07saituhoh.html

In fairness to Zack, there is at least 1 site that I saw that said he had a torn ligament also.

I saw on a couple places that he took injections of some kind to avoid TJ surgery and wonder how that could avoid it also, it all sounds scary after 10-15 innings, but we will find out soon in the 2009 season am sure.

"To this day, team physician Dr. Neal ElAttrache can’t definitively say that injecting platelet-rich plasma into Saito’s elbow is what allowed him to avoid Tommy John surgery. ElAttrache also won’t guarantee how long the elbow will hold up or that Saito won’t have to have surgery in the future. "

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/oct/03/sports/sp-dodfyi3

Then you talked about the 58 sb in 6 years...do you see anything wrong with your math? You said that is about 5 stolen bases a season...how about you double that, for one thing. For another thing, he has played 5 seasons not 6. Bringing that average from around 10 sb per year played, to just under 12 per year played.

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03 04 05 06 07 08 maybe i added wrong or something but im pretty sure that is 6 seasons for badelli..as for my math..yea i know its not five..i must of mis typed it in my calc.

Baldelli is a FOURTH....FOURTH...FOURTH outfielder...want me to say it again? FOURTH...a .330 OBP production out of someone is going to spend more then half the season on the bench is pretty damn good. not great..but a FOURTH outfielder doesnt have to be above adv.

And for smoltz..yeah its more then then Decent..but i didnt want to say great because it isnt all that great when you look at what some starters today are pitching.
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Did anybody else catch this?
"The risk factor in all of these deals is low...they are all signed to one year deals."

You are right. Potentially wasting 5 roster spots because of injury isn't a risk, whatsoever.

Posted by: baseballismylyf4 | January 10, 2009 at 03:56 PM

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Key word Possibly....if they come back from injury and pitch decent...then this will be a great offseason for the red sox..if they flop and dont get better. the red sox have the dept to put young players in IE. Buchholtz, Masterson, Bowden, Bard. So it wouldnt be a waste watsoever.

Baseballismylyf4....tell me what team you fallow and i will tell you what risks they did.. Baseball is about taking risks on players. Every time you sign a player you risk their health and their proformance based on their health.

Last i checked Bartolo Colon did just fine for the red sox. Theo is just doing what any good GM would do and taking a risk on players he feels will be able to bounce back from injury and help the team win a world series.

"if" penny, smoltz, and saito do revert back to there form of 2007 (which was only a year ago) then yeah those signings will be better than the yankees

"if" penny, smoltz, and saito do revert back to there form of 2007 (which was only a year ago) then yeah those signings will be better than the yankees

Posted by: glen_quagmire | January 10, 2009 at 04:28 PM
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Exactly.. i have been saying IF....that is a BIG IF...but IFFFFFFFFFFFFFF they come back to their 2007 form...the red sox will have outsigned the Yankees.

Sometimes people baffle me.... As soon as you typed "expecially" read it again, and clicked post you let us all know you're either too young, or too stupid, to make a rational argument.

But to say signing a bunch of injured and/or old players is better than signing a top 5 lefty ace, top 3 power hitting first baseman,and a guy with #1-#2 potential, all positions of great need for the Yankees, is just coocoo for coacoa puffs. But you did spell especially with an 'x' ... so I guess I should have known.

Posted by: Rob NY | January 10, 2009 at 04:24 PM

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Yeah because Burnett hasnt been injured all his career.

What does it matter what team I follow?

What matters is the fact that this move has the potential to be an INCREDIBLE success, or it can potentially damage the Red Sox beyond repair? Any time you sign 5 players with past injuries, whether they be recent, severe, chronic, or even minor injuries, you still assume that risk. Any time you give 5 roster spots to said injury-risks, you are taking on a much larger risk than is necessary.

Posted by: baseballismylyf4 | January 10, 2009 at 04:33 PM
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Yeah it has great potential..however i dont feel as though signing these guys is a waste of space. IF something doesnt work out..then they will try to trade/move them down to the minors and put in a young guy. The risk for the red sox is a LOT lower then for the yankees. All of these moves were ONE YEAR DEALS..that means if they are injured then the red sox get rid of them at the end of the season. The Yankees on the other hand have these players for a long contract..if they have injury problems...then they are stuck with them for years.. This is why if healthy the boston signings are a lot better then the Yankees. However if the Yankees stay healthy then i agree with Rob NY. Because signging a Number 1 pitcher...and top 3 1B and a POTENTIAL #1 or #2 person adds a HUGE amount to a team.

Rob NY, you posted in your last comments to me at least several reasons for not doing getting a top 5 lefty ace and a top 3 power hitting 1st baseman and you already know why if you will think about it:

Sox have Youk, why wpend 22 million for 7+ years on tex. I know Sox management was try to do so, but my hopes all along was for it to flaa through and wait on an outfielder either this year, or even next to replace (take your pick) Drew or Bay, even replace Ortiz if they must and he declines. The Sox can afford to eat some contract and Drew will be down to 2 years left after 2009, so why force the trade of GG'er, clutch hitting Lowell for a guy the Sox really didn't need and move Youk to 3rd where he is not as good at fielding? Both Youk and Lowell are GG'ers, just like Tex and granted Youk probably isn't going to have as good of a season as he did in 2008, but both him and Tex were neck and neck this past season and on equal terms with the glove at 1st.

Absolutely -0- reason for the Sox to even go near what the Yankees offered CC, they already have 1,2,3 as good as anybody and a reliable and cheap 4th guy with Masterson and unproven Buch plus Bowden and knowing they can get fillins via FA for remaining rotation if they want? It would have been crazy for them to offer him 23 million. The Yankees had 100% different circumstances desperately needing to rebuild a rotation and it was a brilliant move on their part to get him, just as it was a brilliant move on Boston't part not to with the rotation already top 5 in the game for certain and probably top 3.

Love when my posts get filterd out :)

Thank you Scott.. Someone who agrees with me!

It's beyond me as to how anyone could say these signings could damage the Sox beyond repair. That's just straight ignorant.

Criticizing someone for spelling mistakes is about as petty as you can get...especially in a sports forum.

"IF something doesnt work out..then they will try to trade/move them down to the minors and put in a young guy."

Wrong. You think that an AAAA+ pitcher is going to outproduce Smoltz if Smoltz gets hurt?

There is no injury risk with the Yankees, aside from Burnett's impending arm explosion. The only thing wrong they did was length of contract. But they didn't go after players with chronic injury pasts, or recent injuries.

To me it's who you go after, and how long. The Yankees went after the right people, they just gave them too long of contracts. The Red Sox went after dead weight who could potentially sink their 2009 season.

"

Yankee fans. You gotta love 'em. They jump on these recent Red Sox signings without thinking about the garbage on their own roster.

For a total of $14 million in base salary, the Red Sox got Smoltz, Penny, Saito, Kotsay and Baldelli. I'd rather have those five guys than Matsui, Posada and Damon at a combined $39.1 million."

AMEN

"IF something doesnt work out..then they will try to trade/move them down to the minors and put in a young guy."

Wrong. You think that an AAAA+ pitcher is going to outproduce Smoltz if Smoltz gets hurt?

There is no injury risk with the Yankees, aside from Burnett's impending arm explosion. The only thing wrong they did was length of contract. But they didn't go after players with chronic injury pasts, or recent injuries.

To me it's who you go after, and how long. The Yankees went after the right people, they just gave them too long of contracts. The Red Sox went after dead weight who could potentially sink their 2009 season.

Posted by: baseballismylyf4 | January 10, 2009 at 05:14 PM
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Oh yes they will completely sink their season...yeahhh surrrreeeee. i might add that the red sox made it the American League Championships last year..brought it to 7 games..and almost made it the world series ONCE AGAIN..and no where on their roster was anyone named Smoltz, Penny, Baldelli, or Saito. The point is the red sox are a good team..and they were a good team without them. The red sox made it that far with major injuries last year. Basically the core of the team is coming back. I dont know of any realllllly big free agent that the red sox lost that was a HUGE part of the season last year. There is no risk in any of these signings. The red sox dont NEED these players to be competive, if healthy then adding these players will be huge...but they mostly going to finish higher then the Yankees just because of the amount of depth that the red sox have.

As for "There is no injury risk with the Yankees" everyone is injury risk, the red sox signings just happen to be just coming off of one/still in one and are more PRONE to getting them. CC and TEX and Burnett could easily be hurt during this season. The difference is...THAT WOULD TRUELY DESTROY THE YANKEES SEASON!

baseballismylyf....for someone who says baseball is their "lyf," you really don't know much about it. there is no way the Sox recent signings are going to ruin their 2009 season. Not a chance. I don't even really need to explain it...it's pretty self-explanatory.

Yea...Lugo was a bust. Cano and Wang are good players that happen to be making a lot less money then they should get compared to the League adv at their positions.

The comparison above was made because at their highest..those players are better then the Yankees players listed.