Roy Halladay Rumors: Prospect Update

I think Toronto should approach each team with what they want. If a team has multiple "untouchables", cross that team off your trade list.

Halladay DOES NOT have to be traded, and could still retain much of his trade value this coming offseason - go searching for available suitors then.

Yankees have Montero and Austin Jackson.

Jays have Arrencibia. Don't think they are looking for a catcher.

Sox won't be trading what the Jays want. They could have made deals with Bucholz, Andersen, et al last three years and haven't. This year isn't different and Bucholz is an option to help in Aug/Sept/Oct.

Jays have Arrencibia. Don't think they are looking for a catcher.

Sox won't be trading what the Jays want. They could have made deals with Bucholz, Andersen, et al last three years and haven't. This year isn't different and Bucholz is an option to help in Aug/Sept/Oct.

The Mets are finally starting to get a few of their prospects within a few years of the majors, I'd rather not see them get rid of all of them for Halladay. Their pitching has been ok, they really need to focus on adding a bat. Alex Rios would fit perfectly in Citifield, and I can't see his price being that high. Bats are a much higher priority at this point than another pitcher.

So, this means the Mets, Phillies, and Cardinals aren't getting Halladay.

Unless the Phillies want to give up Taylor, Brown, AND Carrasco in a deal, which is an absolute necessity if Drabek isn't going. No way Cards make a deal without Wallace and no way Mets make one without at least two of the Mejia/Holt/Martinez crop.

"Sox won't be trading what the Jays want. They could have made deals with Bucholz, Andersen, et al last three years and haven't. This year isn't different and Bucholz is an option to help in Aug/Sept/Oct."

Except that Buchholz's value is going down, not up. Anyone who has seen Smoltz pitch this year can see that he's done. Last Monday's start is no different. Keeping Buchholz in AAA drops his value when its obvious the big club could use him. And Lars Anderson's value is also going down.

"So, this means the Mets, Phillies, and Cardinals aren't getting Halladay."

It's too early to discount anything.

Also Met fans, Rios has FIVE more guaranteed years left on his deal, four of them at $12M or more. I don't think anybody would trade for that kind of contract for Rios's production. Not even the Mets.

"Oh, my bad, I didn't know that you were intimately connected with Halladay as to know what he wants and does not want to do. How silly of me."

Well, then let's clarify. Ricciardi himself has said the likelihood of Toronto re-signing Halladay after 2010 is small. Very small. His value will never be higher than it is right now, and he'll fetch more vale than a 1st round and supplemental pick that his likely type A status would net the Jays.

It makes sense, They'd be smart to deal him.

"Oh, my bad, I didn't know that you were intimately connected with Halladay as to know what he wants and does not want to do. How silly of me."

Seriously? J.P. Ricciardi already came out and said they aren't going to extend him and said he didn't think Halladay would want to sign an extension, anyway.

It's got nothing to do with knowing Roy Halladay intimately. It has to do with reading previous articles and radio transcripts already posted on this very site, thenerbster.

"So, yeah Blue Jays fans.. keep telling yourself you don't HAVE to trade him."

***

And keep telling yourself that your team can land him for some cast off table scraps.

No team is going to set the market with a crazy offer just yet expecially if that team needs Halladay badly like many a team does.

They'll make statements like players "may be untouchable" etc.. knowing that the longer things go they can "up the offer" ..

e.g. Phillies offer Drabek, Taylor, Brown, Marson

Jays take that offer and use that as the yardstick...

I expect the real offers to start to come down next week..

If the Red Sox are even sniffing at a trade no doubt YES Network will be on Defcon 5..

Mets would be dumb to trade for Halladay with those prospects.. Mejia is getting projections as a future ace while Holt is being projected as a #2.. Davis has had a great year in A+ and now hes in AA where hes recently gone on a HR streak and is killing RHP.. Flores should also be on that list, hes putting up a great avg/obp for a 17 year old in the SAL

Jays want $20M in salary relief AND top prospects? Good luck.

deeslig,

My team is the New York Yankees.

They are contenders with him, without him, whatever. The team won 26 times without Halladay. They won 20 titles before the guy was even born (that's excluding the title they won in the year he was born). They have made it to the playoffs every single year he's been in the Major Leagues except 2008.

If the Yankees wanted to trade for Halladay, they could. They just aren't dumb enough to trade guys like Montero, Hughes, or Chamberlain for a 32 year old.

We didn't trade for Santana.. man, that really came back to haunt us.

Enjoy last place for the next decade.

Carini...all the points in your post are very valid, I'm with you on all of them. That shot at the end is not really needed though, Melonis is certainly entitled to his own opinion, and it shouldn't lead to questions regarding his intelligence. He's proved time and again to have plenty of knowledge about baseball.

mooNy,

I was trying to be nice and all but you made a point I've been thinking about for a while. The Jays can finish in 4th in the AL East with or without him.

What's the old saying about the MVP award? Why would you give it to a player on a team in last place because they could finish there without him?

Same premise applies. I agree that they should try and get as much as they can for him but I'm sorry Drabek, Brown and then some are as good or better than the two FUTURE draft picks who could just as easily be squandered. If I were the Jays I'd hold him until the offers start flooding in and then try and up the ante. I just wouldn't go more than one of Drabek/Knapp and one of Taylor/Brown and then all stuff around the middle from Savery, Carpenter, Marson, Donald etc.

ANd given my preference I'd give Drabek and Brown. That's two of the top 25 MILB prospects and then solid players around that.

"Also Met fans, Rios has FIVE more guaranteed years left on his deal, four of them at $12M or more. I don't think anybody would trade for that kind of contract for Rios's production. Not even the Mets."

Take a look at an article at fangraphs of the Rios/Wells contracts. While they prove Wells' contract is downright horrible, look what they find for Rios. He is a "+3.5 to +4.5 win player in the prime of his career," and also one of the top defensive outfielders in the game. Therefore, according to fangraphs Rios has an excellent contract and should be someone the Jays keep and build a foundation around.

Withpower, THEE NEW YAWK YANKEES!??!!!!??

It's not even complicated. Roy Halladay is 32 and is signed up for 1.5 years. That's it.

Blue Jays fans want teams like the Red Sox, Yankees, Phillies, Angels, and others who are ALREADY contenders for the World Series WITHOUT Doc.. to basically just let them circle whatever names in the Top 20 they want.

It's laughable.

Carini...all the points in your post are very valid, I'm with you on all of them. That shot at the end is not really needed though, Melonis is certainly entitled to his own opinion, and it shouldn't lead to questions regarding his intelligence. He's proved time and again to have plenty of knowledge about baseball.
______________________________

86 Mets is such a good peacemaker. He is like the only Mets fan ever that I like (and my dad is a Mets fan).

But I have watched Smoltz pitch this year and I think he may be done. He has lost more than a little off the fastball and he just doesn't look sharp. Maybe you are right and it's just rust... as a life-long Braves fan I hope you are right because I'm rooting for him.

And Anderson's losing value? Really? I didn't know 21 year olds playing in AA - who have one bad month - were suddenly written off as guys "losing value". He's been playing through lower back pain and it's affecting his swing...

I thought you were supposed to be one of the smarter guys on this board?

This is disappointing...

Posted by: carini26 | July 09, 2009 at 03:07 PM

actually to be honest, ANderson is having a bad YEAR. He had a good couple of weeks but overall a bad year for someone who was projected to be the "next big thing".

Seriously? J.P. Ricciardi already came out and said they aren't going to extend him and said he didn't think Halladay would want to sign an extension, anyway.

It's got nothing to do with knowing Roy Halladay intimately. It has to do with reading previous articles and radio transcripts already posted on this very site, thenerbster.

Posted by: withpower

What you said isnt true

This is what JP said
"We have kept him from free agency twice and I don't think we have the resources to keep him from free agency a third time."

This is what Halladay said
"For me, I just feel like it's a different situation. I'm still under contract for two years and unless you force something, create a big stir, it's not even an option for me. I feel like I'm still happy here. I feel like I have a chance to win here and that would be my ultimate goal, to win a World Series here, more than anywhere else."

Halladay doesnt sound like someone wanting to go somewhere else, and JP doesnt sound like someone who wants to trade him - just someone who fears he cant resign him. If they trade Rios though, that changes fast.

SuzysMan,

Halladay is being a good soldier.

The Blue Jays have zero shot to win. Zero. It's as plain as day.

"For me, the best I can do is try to avoid letting it become a distraction and go from there. I understand, obviously, the economics of the game and how the game works. It's a situation where I think if it's best for the team, if it's best for me, then you go from there. At this point, it's too hard to tell."

"My goals have always been the same," Halladay said. "I love Toronto. I want to stay here, but I want to win as well. That's becoming more and more of a goal for me. Obviously, my first choice would be to do it here. Like I've said in the past, whether or not our organization and my goals line up, it's never always going to be that way. Sometimes teams have to take steps back and I understand that. I think you always keep in mind the direction you want to go as a player."

"I don't know if you were to talk about something like that what it would entail. I think my biggest decision would be, 'Do I feel like this is going to go in a direction where we have a chance to win, and quickly?' And that's it. It's hard to tell, but it's not going to be a decision based on whether it's a certain years or a certain number. It's going to be based on winning."

"He knows where I'm coming from," Halladay said. "I really believe, even in situations like this, that maybe he's looking for my best interest, too. Obviously, I'm grateful to have a guy who does take that into account. We really haven't had those talks, but I think it's always been open communication."

"That's a hard question to answer. Really, at this point, I have to do the best I can to focus on my job here. If something does come up, you weigh your options at that point. I hate to put the cart before the horse and start saying I don't want to go here, I want to do this or I want to do that. I think you just evaluate situations when they come up. I have to focus on my job here."

"That's tough. That's a tough question to answer, honestly," Halladay said. "I want to stay here, but I think when an organization is kind of thinking that maybe we kind of want to go this direction and it's a situation that suits the team and yourself, then you have to evaluate that and say, 'Maybe this is the best thing.' I'm really not in that situation yet."

Translation? Toronto is an awesome city but I'm kind of getting tired of the $180 million dollars the team committed to Vernon Wells and Alexis Rios keeping us in 3rd to 5th place for eternity.

Your quote digging skills need some work, SuzysMan.

"And, lmao @ "untouchable prospects".

Writers who write this drivel are losing credibility. It's Roy Halladay. Untouchable prospects don't exist unless their names are Wieters, Price, or Kershaw. That's about it.

Posted by: melonis rex | July 09, 2009 at 02:44 PM"

True but every rumors has Kershaw plus Kemp going to Toronto..

If Wieters and Heyward are untouchable how exactly are Kemp, Bills, Kershaw, Ethier, Broxton and Loney not?

Not directed at you Melonis.

Hold on, Its true the jays have 0 shot to win this year and I agree. However to suggest the jays have no shot next year is completely laughable. You all seem to forget the jays were in 1st place in the AL East for awhile this year and that was without most of their starting rotation. You know the starting rotation that was the best in the entire MLB last year?

A healthy Blue Jays team is as good as the Red Sox and Yankee's right now. Lets see how well the Red Sox do if they lose their #2,#3 and #5 starters for the entire year and then some of the guys that you have to replace them as well.

nrmax88,

Rios is also 28 or 29, isn't he?

How many more years is he going to be an elite defender? If he is an elite defender for the duration then you're right.. he's probably not terribly overpaid.

But this is Toronto.. they are only a big market team when the team is good. Can Toronto afford to have that much money tied up in him?

Devmac,

The Orioles were in first place for a while a few years ago, weren't they?

I'm a New York Yankee fan. I watch all the games.

I worry about Boston, Anaheim, Tampa Bay. You know, real teams.

SuzysMan,

You are reaching and are trying to say that I'm reaching.

His quotes are as plain as day. Who wouldn't want to win a WS ring with the team they came up with?

I've been to Toronto, it's a great city. Living there would be really cool.

But the Blue Jays have been "almost" ready to contend for how many years now?

Toronto has zero shot without either a salary cap or a decade of top-5 picks like Tampa.

Devmac,

Who cares? Baltimore and Toronto will be playing for 4th and 5th until New York and Boston sign David Price and Evan Longoria.

Then they can fight for 3rd.

And another thing, Devmac..

Toronto had the best rotation in 2008 WITH AJ Burnett.

He's wearing pinstripes now, or do you need another copy of that memo..?

isn't that just like a yankee fan, for the last few years to all yankee fans AJ was overrated and not that good. Often saying he's just a .500 pitcher. Once they sign him he is now one of the greats in the league!

It would be very interesting to see how Halladay's numbers improve if he were out of that brutal AL East and went to the DH-free National League or to the Angels, where he would get to pitch there and in Seattle and Oakland several times a year.

Would he reach 25 wins?

"You are reaching and are trying to say that I'm reaching.

His quotes are as plain as day. Who wouldn't want to win a WS ring with the team they came up with?

I've been to Toronto, it's a great city. Living there would be really cool.

But the Blue Jays have been "almost" ready to contend for how many years now?

Toronto has zero shot without either a salary cap or a decade of top-5 picks like Tampa."

You are inserting your personal beliefs into everything you claim, so I am reaching? YOU say he doesnt really want to be there. YOU feel they cant possibly complete. YOU think he is upset over the 180 million spent or whatever. YOU limit the payroll comments to mean Halladay has to be moved. Everything is what you think - what has been said only fits what you want it to if you want it too, and easily could mean quite different things.

So I again repeat, try to keep your feelings separate from the actual situation - a situation people can only form possible opinions off, not facts like you are trying to portray you opinions to be.

Lumping together, ftw?

AJ Burnett is what he is. I'm dealing in reality, and you're telling me "what's just like a Yankee fan".

AJ Burnett was in the 2008 Toronto rotation. Now he isn't. I'm not worried about Romero, Litsch, or anybody else in the Blue Jays system anymore than I'm worried about David Price, Clay Bucholz, Brad Penny, Jon Lester, Michael Bowden, Brad Bergenson, Chris Tillman, etc etc.. and anymore than you are worried about CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett, Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain.

Your team still has to pitch to Longoria, Ortiz, Rodriguez, Teixiera, Jeter, Bay, Pedroia, Crawford, Upton.

I'm not worried about Toronto in the least. If you guys were going to do something, you'd have done it by now.

AJ Burnett struck out a lot of batters.. Nothing more.

Hill is better then Pedroia and in case you didn't notice Lind has or at least a couple days ago the highest OPS in the AL.

Also this year I'd take Scutaro over Jeter. Far better defense monster OBP and a pretty good batting average or at least I should say to this point I would.

cortez101,

You know what the best part about MASSIVELY overpaying Alex was?

How it didn't stop us from getting CC, Tex, Burnett, Swisher, and keeping Hughes, Joba, Montero, and AJack.

Posted by: withpower | July 09, 2009 at 04:18 PM

and YET you still haven't won with him. WOW.

Swisher LOL .... you kidding ???

Hughes ... if he was sooo good he'd be starting instead of Aceves...

please ...

anyways its a moot point...

Halladay is gone... we get a boatload and JP gets fired and someone with better judgement gets the GM spot ... like say buddy from the Twins whose name escapes me ... former GM .. you know ... built them into a legit contender on a tight budget

cortez101,

Nah.. the worst contract in baseball is Vernon Wells. Then it's Barry Zito.

Alex is off the juice and killing the ball. I don't think the Blue Jays will finish with a better record than the Yankees for the entire duration of that contract.

Little Bear...

Smoltzy has been hitting 91..

slider is crap... not the same arm anymore .... I have no idea why they have Buchholz in the minors and not starting...

Theo is a great GM I'll give you that...

Hughes should be starting. The team is giving some reason about him not being stretched out. He's been lights-out in the 8th inning and the team has won 13 of their last 15.

The Bombers are tinkering with ways to just flat-out dominate teams this year, like they did when Joba came up and was pitching the 8th.

And you can laugh at Swish all you want.. he's got plus power, plus patience, and a plus glove. He's on a reasonable contract, too. Cost us nothing.

Cashman for the win. Again.

George Costanza is that you ...?

Well first off forget the illusion that the GM does everything. In a lot of cases I think they get given all the information from scouts look at current market values for players as well and then make budgets for different areas for your ball club. If your the yankees you can then sign more high priced prospects from the draft then anyone else can. As well as sign free agents no one else can.

You don't have to be some "special baseball person" to be able to see good talent or have a decent idea of what is good value trade wise.

Also keep in mind I don't think I could be a great GM by any means but you have a lot of leeway with the yankees because money can easily fix mistakes.

Hah I can't say I would of went after Romero to be honest but I surely wouldn't of signed the contract you did with AJ Burnett.

To be honest while lots of people would like a Salary cap I would be more happy with some sort of real Draft cap. Which is the real advantage those teams you listed have.

New York has over 19 million people

Toronto, with a population of 2.48 million people (5.5 million in the GTA - Greater Toronto Area)

Also not to mention there is far more money in New York then Toronto. The main thing is tho Ownership is dedicated to winning in New York its more of a business in Toronto.

Anyone talkin about the Brew Crew in this trade. I mean if the Brewers could send Parra, Escobar, Jefferies(as a token since bad test could be his down fall) and Taylor Green in return I think this could be Braun's wanting.