Baseball Blogs Weigh In: Strasburg, Collusion, Cain

On this day ten years ago, Indians' starter Chuck Finley struck out Tom Evans, Royce ClaytonChad Curtis, and Rafael Palmeiro in the same inning after Curtis reached base on a passed ball. There have been 50 instances in baseball history where a pitcher struck out four men in one inning, but Finley did it three times, the only guy to do it more than once. Scot Shields is the last pitcher to strike out four in one frame, doing it less than a week after Scott Baker accomplished the same feat in June of 2008.

Let's take a look at what's being written around the baseball blogosphere…

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39 Responses to Baseball Blogs Weigh In: Strasburg, Collusion, Cain Leave a Reply

  1. bjsguess 5 years ago

    The Players Union, like virtually every other Union today, is worthless.

    Sure, owners are greedy. Sure, they don’t always have fans and winning as their top priority. That said, I find myself siding with management far more than siding with the players in these types of situations.

    There is no collusion.

    • The MLBPA is far from worthless.

    • Zack23 5 years ago

      Yeah protecting worker’s rights is useless.

      Explain why you side with the owners, who have been found guilty of colluding in the past, over the players? (And I hope it isn’t the ‘Try making 50k a year and pay the bills’ line you usually read here)

      • icedrake523 5 years ago

        Unions are responsible for the way Detroit is today.

        • Zack23 5 years ago

          Yeah too bad multibillion dollar corporations had to pay US workers more than $3 an hour and provide benefits too and were protected from unfair labor practices. The Big 3 had great management and great strategies, but the workers are the reason why they failed.

          To blame just one side for the collapse isn’t right, it’s never one thing that is the only cause behind an issue. You can say unions ruined Detriot, I said that if Detriot treated their workers better in the beginnin then they wouldnt have unions.

          • icedrake523 5 years ago

            Except there would be unions in the beginning. Unions today are NOTHING like what they were originally intended to be back when they were created in the 19th century. They sought to protect worker’s rights because there were no federal laws. Today, unions mostly function as groups politicians pander to for support. They are a necessary evil (since you can’t trust all owners), but many are more evil than they need to be.

          • Zack23 5 years ago

            And I can say, many companies are more evil than they need to be. And really, neither of us can prove either of those statements.
            When companies treat their employees fair, unions have little chance of entering the workplace. When companies continue to take actions that their employees see as unfair, that’s when union talk opens up. You can call it a necessary evil, but it’s not because companies were angels and the big bad unions came in and ruined their good policies.

      • Taskmaster75 5 years ago

        He didn’t mean that protecting the rights of the players is wrong, he meant that the people running it are incompetent, as I feel. I tend to stay pretty neutral in those affairs, but the players union just disgusts me with how it does business. Specifically, the way they handled JC Romero’s situation would be a good thing to look at.

        • Zack23 5 years ago

          “The Players Union, like virtually every other Union today, is worthless.”

          How does that translate to ‘The people running the MLBPA, and virtually every other Union today, is worthless”? If that’s what he means then ok, but that’s not what I’m reading.

          Did they mess up the JC situation? Yes. I’m not sure that’s proof that the union is incompetent because of one example though.

          • TwinsVet 5 years ago

            Fransisco Liriano and his agent filing a grievance because the Twins found him too inept to make the roster in 2008 would be Exhibit B.

          • Zack23 5 years ago

            Why is that incompetent? What did they have to lose by filing that? What did they have to gain?

          • TwinsVet 5 years ago

            in·ept   [in-ept, ih-nept] Show IPA
            1. without skill or aptitude for a particular task or assignment; maladroit: He is inept at mechanical tasks. She is inept at dealing with people.
            2. generally awkward or clumsy; haplessly incompetent.
            3. inappropriate; unsuitable; out of place.
            4. absurd or foolish: an inept remark.

            It was “inappropriate”, “absurd”, and “without aptitude for a particular task [achieving the goal of getting service year credit]” because it is fully within a team’s right to keep a player in AAA. All it serves to do is sour labor-management relations.

      • TwinsVet 5 years ago

        We’re not talking about protecting their rights to have bathroom breaks or be provided a hardhat in a coal mine.

        We’re talking about millionaires having the right to 5/10 clauses.

        Sorry if I’m a little short on sympathy…

        • Zack23 5 years ago

          I didnt say you needed sympathy; but if you’re going to make it about money then supporting the billionaires over the millions like the original post makes no sense.

          • TwinsVet 5 years ago

            Why do professional baseball players need a union, when military soldiers don’t get one? Are you telling me the perils of life in the MLB are so much greater?

            White collar unions and millionaire-club unions are utterly comical.

  2. DarthVader87 5 years ago

    I have to say that I think the Rockies should be ranked higher in that organizational ranking thing done by Statistician Magician.

    • I agree, and the Marlins at No. 8 is way too high. Both Colorado and Texas should be higher than No. 10 and No. 14, respectively.

      • Taskmaster75 5 years ago

        The Marlins belong there. A WS with that payroll? Texas should be higher, not sure about the Rockies.

        • Zack23 5 years ago

          Some people may not like how Marlins do business, but it’s hard to knock them for it when you look around at other teams in the league that draft bad, develop bad, trade bad and spend bad.

          • I’m not knocking the Marlins, they’re ran great. But the 8th best organization in baseball? Seriously?

            They have a farm system with pretty much no impact pitching prospects and unimpressive depth, a fan base that could pretty much care less about the team, and an exceptional front office that can only build a contender once every few years because the owner cares more about profits than winning.

            I love Beinfeist and Hill and those guys, they’ve done an awesome job with what they’ve been given. But in terms of resources already in place and the future of the organization, Florida can’t possibly be in the eighth best position of any organization in the game.

            To put things into perspective, FanGraphs put Florida No. 22 in their rankings, and I think that they hold a hell of a lot more credibility than that blog.

  3. WillieMaysField 5 years ago

    I have to believe the Giants are raising payroll by 2012. Cain, Zito, Lincecum, Wilson, and Rowand will have about 75M tied up in 2012. that’s also J Sanchez’s last arb year and Panda’s 1st. The Giant’s are hoping their farm prospects pan out as there won’t be a lot of cash to fill out the roster.

    • slr5607 5 years ago

      I think the young guys are the key to the Giants 2012 team plans. They have high hopes for guys like Ford, Kieschnick, Neal, Crawford, Noonan, Bumgarner, Posey and more. When you look at the team that is on the field now, you have guys like Sandoval and Bowker that they are hoping to still be part of an everyday roster they can run out there. I think the Organization is putting themselves in a difficult position because they are putting all of their eggs in the “prospect basket”. I think that hoping 4 guys comming up and being ready to produce in 2 years is possible with the talent that they have now, but they are making moves that is going to require 6 of them to come up.

      Hopeful 2012 starting line up (in order to be able to afford this pitching staff and not having to get rid of Lincecum, Cain, Affeldt or Wilson.)

      C Buster Posey
      1B John Bowker / Thomas Neal
      2B Nick Noonan
      SS Brandon Crawford
      3B Pablo Sandoval
      LF Aaron Rowand / Thomas Neal
      CF Darren Ford
      RF Roger Kieschnick / Thomas Neal

      That is a lot of wishful thinking by the front office. Sabean has already said that they expect a lot from the young guys in the next few years. Look at all of the free agent contracts that have been signed lately…they all end by the end of 2011.

  4. I understand the often-expressed sentiment that players are making millions (or at least in the high six-figures), but do we really think owners are motivated only by their “love for the game?” Owners leverage players to make money, so their goal is to squeeze out as much production as possible for little $$. While I don’t at all want to compare MLB players with blue-collar workers represented by labor unions, the principle really is the same.

    • That’s not necessarily true. While some owners use their team to make profit, Loria and the Marlins comes to mind of course, there are a lot of owners that actually lose money while owning the team. Some owners truly do it to become a part of the baseball community and history.

      • I don’t disagree that this could be true in some cases, but is this really the case with Loria? (I remember some discussion about how Cabrera and Willis were dealt on a heels of a season in which the Marlins were baseball’s most profitable franchise.) Regardless, the Marlins could potentially put a better product on the field if they spent more money. Being motivated by profit doesn’t have to imply it’s the only concern – just that it dictates how much money (and for whom) is spent.

        • The Marlins have continued to be the game’s most profitable franchise, as Forbes pointed out just a few weeks ago.

          Loria has had numerous opportunities to improve the on-the-field product, supplementing their stars like Hanley and Johnson with short-term veterans. But Loria would prefer to be an 80-win true talent team with a tiny shot at contending in order to increase profits.

          Loria ran baseball out of Montreal, and runs the Marlins with far too little concern for their competitiveness. I’m sure that Loria wants to win, you don’t buy a baseball team with absolutely zero interest in winning, but you simply can’t argue that it’s his No. 1 priority, given how the team has chosen to use its money.

          Yeah, the Yankees and market sizes mess things up a lot, but owners like Loria can do a lot of damage to the competitiveness of the league, too.

  5. TwinsVet 5 years ago

    Mets Blog made me laugh. I’m pretty sure it’s just some kid writing a list of everybody he remembers having played in an All-Star game the past decade.

    • Very succinctly put TV. My sides still hurt and I think I broke my office chair laughing…

    • Triteon 5 years ago

      It’s kind of like he found a box of baseball cards in his closet. “Hey, these guys are good, or somethin’.”

  6. TwinsVet 5 years ago

    Collusion in a marketplace of 30 buyers is very difficult to maintain. Every single team has a direct incentive (winning) to break from the collusion and bring in a free agent that other teams are attempting to maintain at sub-market value.

    Further, if the sellers (MLBPA) is allowed to collude to demand wages (league minimums, no salary cap, etc), why is it wrong for buyer (owners) to collude? That sounds like a lopsided marketplace.

  7. bobbybaseball 5 years ago

    Wow. Whoever writes that Mets blog is a stone cold idiot. Interesting debate, but why include a link to something that idiotic? Soriano, really? I could go on but it’s just not worth the time.

  8. Ferrariman 5 years ago

    cardinals and redsox too high but still up their. rangers too low. flip-flop KC and pittsburgh.

  9. You realize that even after adjusting for Coors, he’s still one of the best hitters of all-time, right?

    I really hope that by the time he retires, people realize that Coors could only do so much to pump up his stats. Helton was a truly special player and if he keeps going for a couple more years, I wouldn’t be remotely surprised to see him in the Hall. His numbers are pretty damn good.

  10. TwinsVet 5 years ago

    I agree. Helton also lacks any hardware (GG’s, WS rings, MVPs, etc) that typically are found in that HOF pedigree.

    His home/road splits are pretty substantial.

  11. 0bsessions 5 years ago

    Helton’s great and all, but “one of the greatest hitters of all time?” That’s a pretty big stretch. I’m not sure he’s even one of the greatest hitters of the last decade.

  12. TimotheusATL 5 years ago

    I didn’t realize Helton had only K’d 100+ times one year in his entire career — and that was only 104. That’s one surefire sign of a pretty darn good hitter.

  13. Drew 5 years ago

    I mean, a guy with the 10th best OPS OF ALL TIME deserves a little more consideration. Home/Road splits be damned, a run counts as a run when you’re playing a baseball game.

  14. TimotheusATL 5 years ago

    He’s likely going to be known as that franchise’s best player since inception — especially since he’s spent his entire career there (thus explaining the lack of hardware). While it may not be the most reliable way to judge a HOF candidate, how many teams out there can you think of whose best all-time player is not in the Hall?

  15. TwinsVet 5 years ago

    You’re making a great case for him to be a first-ballot into the Rockies’ HOF…

    There’s another impact of him spending his career in COL; media outside the western time zone have missed a majority of his games. The majority of voters’ live on the east coast, and how many stay up for Rockies’ games? How many have EVER seen him play?

    Bert Blyleven remains on the outside, and one of the big knocks is he never dominated on a big-market, well-known team. (I happen to think that’s a bogus critique, but apparently SOMETHING makes voters continually come up short on him)

    For the record, I consider Helton “on the bubble”. I’m not advocating for or against him – just noting why he’ll be an interesting case.

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