Yankees Rumors: Soria, Dunn, Lilly

11:23am: The Yankees dangled Jesus Montero in talks for Joakim Soria, reports ESPN's Jayson Stark, but the Royals weren't interested.

7:31am: SI's Jon Heyman dished Yankees rumors in yesterday's column…

  • The Yankees "made a big proposal" for Soria. With three club options, the 26-year-old righty is under team control through 2014.  Had Soria not signed a team-friendly extension in May of 2008, he'd be eligible for free agency after the 2012 season.  The only blemish on his record was missing most of May last year with a sore shoulder.  How do the Yankees and Royals match up?  You'd expect Dayton Moore to pursue Montero or Austin Romine, though the Royals already have Billy Butler and Wil Myers in the organization.
  • Heyman notes that the Yankees "have been in touch" with the Nationals about Adam Dunn, but "so far found the price prohibitive."  With six days until the trade deadline, will Mike Rizzo drop the price on Dunn?  Heyman also links the Yankees to familiar names Ty Wigginton, Jhonny Peralta, and Cody Ross.
  • Heyman doesn't see the Yankees going after Roy Oswalt, but tweets that they like Ted Lilly.  Teams like the Cubs and Astros have to hope the Diamondbacks' unimpressive return for Dan Haren doesn't have a ripple effect on their available starters.
  • Heyman tweets that the Yankees' offer for Haren consisted of righties Ivan Nova and Zach McAllister plus one or two prospects.  Baseball America viewed Nova and McAllister as future No. 4 types heading into the season.


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151 Comments on "Yankees Rumors: Soria, Dunn, Lilly"


Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Joba, McAllister, + 1 lower level for Soria?

I don’t see Montero or Romine being included. I just don’t, not for a reliever.

twenty1thirteen
5 years 1 month ago

I seriously doubt Soria would be going anywhere close to NY without Montero included in a package. I think people tend to forget that Soria seems to have much more value to the Royals than he would on the Yankees.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

No chance, buddy. What is this another Cliff Lee or Roy Halladay sweepstakes? The #5 prospect in baseball for a reliever. He ain’t Mo Rivera. I understand your excitement, seeing as Soria being one of the better things in the last 20 years. Frankly, this Royals team is not that bad. After watching them the last 4 games, they have a lot of good pieces to work with. Not sure why it can’t translate to winning. Management may need to be assessed.

twenty1thirteen
5 years 1 month ago

Oh, I agree Soria might not be worth Montero, but the Royals don’t NEED to trade him, therefore I can see why they are asking the moon for him.

And your’re correct, I just don’t understand how their front office operates. Dayton has been great in drafting the last few years, but a complete bonehead in FA signings and trades.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Have to agree. I was actually shocked at the quality of some players on the team this past weekend. Their W/L column is not representitive of the actual team. Plus someone said over the weekend the Royals farm is pretty strong too. I understand your point. Neither team needs to make the move, but Dayton would be justified in moving Soria for an all “arms” package. If he could get three arms, then great. Joba would probably do well out there away from the spot light. As many have said, his numbers are still very, very good.

5 years 1 month ago

If Joba is moved, please convert him back to a starter. I almost hope he is traded to the NL so he can show all these NY fans how moronic they were to want him as a reliever.

money941
5 years 1 month ago

I think the Joba as a starter/reliever is split 50/50 among fans honestly. Personally I think his place is still as a Starter, but that’s not going to happen this year as he would have to build up his arm strength yet again, but quite possibly could next year if Vasquez leaves and Pettite retires as the only 3 SP they would have would be CC, AJ, and Hughes which is another reason I don’t see Cashman including him in any deal.

5 years 1 month ago

No more University of Nebraska players please. They haven’t faired too well in KC.

MrYankeesBaseball101
5 years 1 month ago

us Yankees fans know that he isnt good whether he is started or reliever.

5 years 1 month ago

The difference between Lee and Soria is not just starter v. reliever, but years of control. You would have a reasonable contract locked up for a great pitcher for a long time.

Some other things: don’t overvalue your own farm system. Montero is rated highly because of his position, which most are beginning to believe he cannot play. Romine is good, but not great. Joba is the reason you would have to trade for Soria, so in my opinion, he has proven “not good enough” to be a centerpiece.

And yes, the Royals field a competent team. It really is not that shocking. But make no mistake: that team does not have 80 win talent right now.

CosaOne
5 years 1 month ago

Actually Montero is rated so high because of his bat not because of his position at all. If you read any of those top 100 lists they all say that he probably wont be a catcher but his bat is so impressive that they rank him top 5-10 regardless of his position. Its not as if Montero is a #7 prospect at catcher and the #45 at 1st base so please dont insinuate that. Hell if Montero was a lock to stay at catcher he would be the #1 prospect seeing how its very rare to find good catchers who are projected to have a bat like him

5 years 1 month ago

There’s no chance the Yanks get Soria without including including Montero or Romine. I know it’s a huge gamble, and you would hate to see either one included, but the fact is the Royals know the Yanks are looking to replace Mo. Soria has HUGE long term value for the Yanks and the Royals will look to cash in on that value.

For this reason, I don’t see the Yanks getting Soria. The Royals will insist on Montero being included and the Yanks will not budge. I will, however, be shocked if Montero ever wears pinstripes. The temptation to trade him will be too great from now until he’s ready.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

you make a good point, but I still don’t see that happening.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

I think Soria has a ton of value for the Yankees.
Not only do they desperately need a reliever right now (and Soria is one of the best), but they also need a replacement for Mo Rivera after next season (possibly/probably).

5 years 1 month ago

You must be smoking something really good my friend to even right the trade proposal.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Huh? English please.

5 years 1 month ago

Looks like you were wrong.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Thanks for taking the time out of your day to point that out.

Cyyoung
5 years 1 month ago

Wow Yankees going in for the kill.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Yanks. Team is fine. Please stay aware from all the aforementioned names. Maybe Soria, but that’s only if the price is right. I’m watching the Yanks prospects almost daily at this point and good lord, man these guys have some serious talent in minors. Yanks are in the lead by a wide margin, they don’t need to do deals, just to do them.

twenty1thirteen
5 years 1 month ago

“I’m watching the Yanks prospects almost daily at this point and good lord, man these guys have some serious talent in minors. Yanks are in the lead by a wide margin, they don’t need to do deals, just to do them.”

Agreed.

aap212
5 years 1 month ago

Myers almost certainly won’t be a catcher in the majors. Romine probably will. And Montero’s an elite enough prospect that they find a way to make him, Butler, and Hosmer work together, even if it means flipping one down the line.

5 years 1 month ago

I still don’t know what the hell the Diamondbacks were thinking, sending Haren to the Angels for that “unimpressive” package, when the Yankees were offering quite a bit more.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

technically without including Joba, the Angels offer was better. Yeah from a depth standpoint, it makes no sense for Arizona, but in content, the Angels gave up more.

5 years 1 month ago

I disagree, as Cameron from USS Mariner said, Saunders is not worth the 6M he’s gonna get in arb. The only thing that could make this a win for AZ would be the PTBNL. IMO, the Yanks (reported) offer was better than the Angels, just like Justin “Mendoza Line” Smoak was no where near the Montero package the Yanks offered the M’s for Lee. Why aren’t the GMs making the best deals for their respective clubs? Or better yet why won’t they do business with Mr. Cashman?

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

That’s the exact point I made in another post this morning. I don’t know what’s going on, but Cashman has presented some compelling options to both the Mariners and Diamondbacks and both have shrugged off. I am still more appalled by the Mariners handling of Lee over this thing with Haren. People want to argue that Montero will be a 1st basemen. Fine, but the way it stands he is a catcher and not a bad one at that. Catching is an area of weakness for the Mariners and they could have molded Montero exactly to that team. Just didn’t make sense to me. I agree with you in that sense.

5 years 1 month ago

Calling Montero a catcher does not make it so. The Yankees keep him there because it increases his supposed trade value. However, other GMs look at him and see maybe 1B, perhaps even DH. That has an impact on value, especially if you have no idea if they will convert well defensively to the position.

I think you are finding out a hard lesson: that other talent evaluators are not valuing the clubs internal players the way you think they ought be. Right now, Joba is not the centerpiece of a trade but more of a reclamation project — he is a 5 ERA reliever just barely hanging on to a job. He’s got some talent, but would be a risk for anyone. The Yankees have destroyed his value — within the next year if he does not improve, it will hit Francouer territory.

Same is true for the Yankees other commodities. There is some talent, but all have risk. They all have a lot of exposure, but exposure does not mean good players. People will trust their own talent evaluators, regardless of whether or not the media commentary matches.

When deciding between two 1B prospects that are projected to hit well, will you go with the one that is older, already to the MLB, and has experience playing the position defensively, or the younger one (admittedly with a little more power) that is in AAA (hitting some lately, but also had struggles) and that is being jerked around as a catcher, hindering his development for the sake of drumming up trade value? If you think about it that way, no way Montero looks better on paper than Smoak. And the complimentary package of prospects was probably better from Texas too.

5 years 1 month ago

I think right now the YAnks would be sellin glow on Joba, yeah he is having a bad season, so what? Cano had a bad season as well and look at what he has done after that bad season. Joba is still young and has the stools to improve because we know he is better than what he is now.

5 years 1 month ago

That is fine, and you might be right. But that means the Yankees have to go through the development process and take the risks. Right now, his value is not high, and no Yankee fan, or the NYY front office, can expect any team to jump on their under performing rubbish.

CosaOne
5 years 1 month ago

Or the Yankees keep him there because he has improved (from being completely dreadful) and it make no sense to move him before they have to. He is only 20 years if they believe he has any chance to stick at catcher what so ever they are best served letting him play as many innings as possible at that position which his very young age allows them to do.

I think its pretty commonly known that organization value their prospects more, this isnt something strickly related to the Yankees but most teams. The parent organization knows the most about these players and their development track so its only logical that they would have a hard fast opinion of them. You say Joba couldnt be the centerpiece of a deal and at this point im inclined to agree but during these negociations the Dbacks wanted Joba as the centerpiece and they wanted the Yankees to completely take on all Harens money and possibly a bad contract. Thats alot to ask. Joba wont reach Francouers lack of value for quite some time, he’s 24 and while his era is high his other peripheral stats are solid.

Almost every prospect in the minors has question marks and risk, not just the Yankee players. Tim Lincecum is one of the best players in baseball but his fastball velocity has dropped and he’s pretty small for a guy who throws that many innings but analysts/scouts question whether he will be able to hold- do you not consider that a risk? Regardless of the exposure which has no bearing on the actual stats, a good amount of the players on the farm have had very good seasons (Betances,Brackman, Stoneburner, Phelps, Romine, Neosi, Nova, Nunez,Heathcutt, Montero to name a few)

You paint way to negatively a picture of Montero. He has not been jerked around at catcher, thats been his position for his entire life, im not saying he will have a 15 year career at C but dont make it sound like this is some doomed experiment that the organization just made up to destroy his value. He’s 20 even if he has to move to 1st base he would have 3 years to learn the position (the least important defensive position on the diamond) and make the majors to debut at the same as Smoak just did. We arent talking about Short stops here, how much development would Montero really need to play first? Especially when you consider his bat

Cyyoung
5 years 1 month ago

26 yr. old proven reliever in the Majors, who is an All-Star, this isn’t just making a deal to make a deal. This makes this team better now and in the future.

bannister19
5 years 1 month ago

The Royals also have Eric Hosmer, Kila Ka’aihue, and more. There is no room for 1B and Catchers, or DHs.Like I’ve always said, because the contract is so team-friendly, he won’t be traded.If he happens to be, I would expect for Phil Hughes to be included in the contract or no deal.

KCUF914
5 years 1 month ago

LOL @ Phil Hughes comment

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Yeah, I know. Homey pushing it a bit, but at least he tried.

bannister19
5 years 1 month ago

Like I said, the Yankees aren’t getting Soria, because the Yankees aren’t going to give up Hughes.

CSPACED25
5 years 1 month ago

Um so you work in the Royals front office? How do you know they won’t make the trade unless Hughes is included? And including Hughes would be absolutely ridiculous seeing he is probably more valuable than Soria is. Yes Soria is good but he is still a RP. No way does ANY team in baseball trade a young SP with the talent and potential Hughes has for a good RP.

CSPACED25
5 years 1 month ago

Sorry this belongs under the next post not here.

No not “precisely”..You have no idea what the Royals front office is thinking. For all you know they could be thinking Austin Romine is there future catcher or Dellin Bettances is the number 2 behind Greinke they have been looking for.Do I think they trade Soria? Absolutely not…But to sit here and talk like you know what is going on in their front office is absurd.

5 years 1 month ago

No, nobody does. But I do know about the Royals farm system and their needs, as I keep track of such things as a fan. Austin Romine might be the future Royals catcher, but it also might be any of Wil Myers/Manny Pina/Salvador Perez that are in A+ and above. Unless Romine has an elite bat for the position, we have a more developed “defense first” catcher in AAA right now that is hitting decently. We also have lots of really good pitching prospects in the A-AA range (2-3 profiling as aces and actually performing that way), so unless you are offering something more developed or in the Julio Teheran range of elite, how do those trades make the Royals better? The NYY do not have the pieces in the farm system to make the Royals better. Those pieces might be valuable to a team as bereft as the Astros, but or us, what you offer cannot just be more of what we already got. “Value” is a relative term, one not determined entirely by BA rankings. The Royals want to compete, so “value” is about whether or not pieces acquired will be above-average/elite players in the MLB at POSITIONS OF NEED. You may have good bats with no position in your farm system (Montero), but since the Royals already have a lot of those (Hosmer, Kila, C. Robinson, Butler, etc.), Montero’s value to them would be minimal to the Royals — Montero would have to really rake (.300+ average, lots of walks, 30+HRs) to be a marginal improvement unless he can stick at catcher.

So, if you don’t have those things and you want something from the Royals, then you have to give up something you also value on your MLB team. If that is too much, then a deal cannot be made. If we want, we can keep our player, or trade him to someone else that can give us something we can REALLY use.

In the abstract, the NYY have enough “value” in the farm system to make trades for good players. But when it comes right down to it, the teams you want stuff from don’t need your “value” as much as you think.

bannister19
5 years 1 month ago

You don’t have to work in a front office to know the obvious. And just like now MLBTR reported that we weren’t interested in Jesus Montero. Some things are basic knowledge of farm systems and organizations.Next, yes, many teams in baseball would trade young pitchers, especially those with huge payrolls. The Royals need pitching, and Joba is intriguing, but doesn’t match the value of Soria. Young players like Hughes are traded quite frequently, actually. Also, please try not to over-rate Phil Hughes. He’s young, good, and valuable, but he isn’t David Price. It’ll take a lot for the Yankees to trade Hughes and It’ll take a lot for the Royals to trade Soria. Neither of them are impossible, but the difference is Soria has already established himself as one of the best closers in baseball, and he’s under contract for LONGER than Phil Hughes.

Oh, and keep in mind Soria was a starter his entire career before being Rule 5’d, so that’s more value for a team who would take the risk in converting him.

BWOzar
5 years 1 month ago

You’re on drugs if you think Soria is equal value to Hughes. Last year Hughes, as a reliever, put up 2.2 WAR, Soria’s best season was 2.4 in ’07 and hasn’t been above 1.8 since (he’s on pace for 1.6 this year). That’s comparing relief pitchers to other relief pitchers. Notwithstanding the fact that decent starting pitchers – let alone 24 year old All Star level pitchers with upside – are always more valuable than great relief pitchers. At the simplest level: 200 innings are more valuable to a team than 70 (Soria’s MLB career high is 69 innings).

bannister19
5 years 1 month ago

The ONLY reason Hughes WAR was that high is because of his his few starts that added up innings. WAR takes a look at innings pitched. Like I said, Soria is under contract for longer, and just like Hughes has always been a starter throughout his career, Soria was often a starter in Mexican leagues until turned into a full time reliever with the Royals. The Royals have toyed around with the idea of turning him into a starter (and not a good idea because our bullpen would take too much of a blow at this point, until somebody like Louis Coleman can come up), and that has value as well. Soria is a couple of years older, and already established himself as one of the best closers in the majors. Phil Hughes has value, but please stop over-rating him. You act like he’s Tim Lincecum or David Price.

BWOzar
5 years 1 month ago

You’re dead wrong about Hughes’ WAR, he was actually sub-replacement level as a starter in April and May. He had a negative WAR thanks to giving up 21 runs in nearly 35 innings and had to make up for that when he returned as a reliever.

Relievers are, in the vast majority of cases, failed starting pitchers. Soria never made the move back to the rotation because they felt his secondary pitchers were not advanced to retire major league hitters. Look I love Soria, I think he’s a great pitcher but he is nowhere near as valuable as Phil Hughes (or other young starters comparable to Hughes like Buchholz, Hanson, Anderson or Price – who, fyi, is nearly a year older than Hughes and has a higher xFIP 4.15 to Hughes’ 4.12) because he doesn’t pitch enough innings.

Soria is under contract through 2014, but those years are not exactly a bargain – they’re just a bit under fair market value for his services (assuming he isn’t seriously injured before then) at 8 and 8.75 mil in 2013 and ’14.

I’d also point out that the Royals building around a closer is like having an awesome sound system in your home theater, but no television, movies, blu-ray player or couches. A good closer is the last piece on a good team and (if you ask the Phillies or Rays in recent seasons) a piece you can get to the World Series without.

BWOzar
5 years 1 month ago

Which isn’t to say that the Royals don’t have good pieces on the way to majors – Moustakas and Hosmer, in particular, are great players to build around. Just that a closer really isn’t that important and if you can move him for someone that can be a core building block of your organization (like a Montero, regardless of if he catches, plays 1B or DHs) then you’ve got to make that move.Frankly, I wouldn’t trade Montero for Soria if I were Cashman – I would have moved him for Haren, however, and would move him for Greinke because he doesn’t have a place in the Yankee lineup if he can’t catch long term (because of Teixeira at 1B and the need to use Posada and the aging regulars at DH).

5 years 1 month ago

Precisely. For the Royals to trade a player of Soria’s caliber, they have to win the trade hands down. Right now, the Yankee farm system does not match up well for the Royals (who likely already have the better farm system). The pieces the Royals would need to help them in the future are the pieces that the Yanks want to keep. So in this case, you cannot help your bullpen without hurting another part of your team. We don’t need 1B/DH prospects that are being set back developmentally by playing positions they cannot handle. We really don’t need relievers (like Joba) right now. We need CF prospects or players, SS prospects, real catchers (that have some offensive ability), and starting pitching prospects. If you don’t have that, or are not willing to give it up from your Major League team, then we do not have a match. You find the asking price humorous, but let us make this clear as well: the Royals are not shopping Soria. The Yankees inquired because they covet him. We can use him too. So, when you ask the Royals to give up a piece that will hurt the major league team for the next couple of years, you got to make it worth their time.

twenty1thirteen
5 years 1 month ago

Sing it sister!

DJ_2
5 years 1 month ago

Right now the Yankees really shouldn’t give up Montero or Hughes for anyone on the market except for Prince Fielder. Dunn could also potentially get Montero for the Nats, but if I’m the Yankees Dunn will most likely be a rental and/or an aging DH. Prince Fielder is still young and could plug the DH hole for a long time. With Scott Boras as his agent he is also likely to want to sign a huge contract with the Yankees, similar to what Teixeira did. Not to mention, CC and Prince seemed like they had a good time in Milwaukee together so some recruiting could be going on.I think that Cashman is probably getting a little angered by being denied Lee and now Haren (for Joe F-ing Saunders), so he might want to stick it to the other teams and acquire Prince. I just feel that Cash has something up his sleeves and will swoop in and make an offer that the Brewers can’t deny. Maybe something centered around Joba and Montero/Romine.

sportsnut969
5 years 1 month ago

Boy if the Yankees would put Montero / Hughes together in a offer for Fielder the Brewers would be stupid not to pull the trigger on that deal.

5 years 1 month ago

I agree. Prince is a long-term DH in the AL. You would be giving up a lot for a player whose only skill is to hit the ball out of the yard.

BWOzar
5 years 1 month ago

Yup, give up your #2 starter and a top 5 prospect in baseball for 1.5 years of a designated hitter when you already have a superior 1B and need the DH spot for Posada and the other aging veterans next year. That’d be a GREAT move for the Yankees. [End Sarcasm]

sportsnut969
5 years 1 month ago

Are you really serious, you would rather have Posada long term over Prince Fielder at DH, IMO there would be plenty of AB’s for everybody. I just don’t see Posada as a 30 + homer guy and if you are a Championship quality team like the Yankees you have to have a guy in the DH slot who is going to rake 30 year in and year out IMO.

And for the guy who said a year and a half of Fielder. There is NO WAY that the Yankees trade for this guy and not lock him up long term.

Fielder in that awesome Yankee line-up in the middle somewhere would just make a sicker line-up even sicker.

BWOzar
5 years 1 month ago

Did you read my comment? Is that what I said? No, it’s not.

I said it’s ridiculous to trade a top 5 prospect and your #2 starter for a DH for 1.5 years and I stand by that. Do I think Prince Fielder could hit 50 home runs as the Yankee DH? I sure do – but the upgrade from someone like Posada (or Rodriguez considering his health issues or Jeter considering age) DHing regularly is not worth the cost of the team’s 24 years old all star starting pitcher and one of the best hitters in the minors. They would be a worse team with Fielder instead of Hughes because the marginal upgrade from Posada/Thames/etc to Fielder is far smaller than the downgrade from Hughes to Dustin Moseley (or Mitre when Pettitte comes back in a few weeks).

I’d also point out that they don’t need a 30 homer guy as the DH, Matsui never once hit 30 homers in a year (though he did hit 28 in ’09, his career high). Fyi, the most frequent DH for the Yankees in the championship years: 2000: Shane Spencer, 1999: Chili Davis, 1998: Daryl Strawberry and 1996: Ruben Sierra – hardly the 50 home run power of Fielder – they don’t need that to win.

jedietrich11
5 years 1 month ago

i’m not arguing against anyone, but could someone explain why montero is so good? his minor league stats don’t really tell me much of his upside because they look very average (from a quick glimpse)

j6takish
5 years 1 month ago

If the Yankees keep refusing to trade him, when they do eventually trade him the other team will think they are fleecing the Yankees. His value is in his mystique

5 years 1 month ago

I agree, but I think the Yanks are finding that a lot of teams are seeing right through it. I find it interesting that the Yankees were shut out of the two biggest names to be traded so far, even when they included their “top” prospect. I’m not denying Montero has potential, but I think teams are not as in love with him as the Yankees were hoping.

I’ve been trying to think of a traded Yankee that turned out to be great but can’t think of any. Can anyone help me out? Could it be that teams are being skeptical of the Yankees player development system?

j6takish
5 years 1 month ago

Its a little early to tell, but so far Austin Jackson is better than advertised.

5 years 1 month ago

Austin Jackson has a .435 BABIP.

5 years 1 month ago

Precisely. This is not a “everybody loves to hate Cashman” issue. It is a cold hard fact: Yankees prospects get a lot of media attention for their results, but in all honesty, they are no less risky than prospects from any other farm system. Cashman is trying to cash in on the “Mystique” factor, while other teams are telling him that his farm system just is not that good. Furthermore, Montero and Joba are good cases in point, they will sacrifice the future for the present; they will stunt the development of their players for short-term wins and for trade value. Joba should be learning how to start in the major leagues, but he is now a (failed) bullpen piece with little value. Montero should be learning how to play first base, but instead, they are pretending to keep him at catcher in order to make him an “elite” prospect. Anyone that takes those guys has to rebuild the future of those players; that takes time and has some significant risks. The Yankees do not get credit for what they could be, but for what they are — misfit toys that they have participated in breaking.

BWOzar
5 years 1 month ago

First of all plenty of people that have nothing to do with the Yankees are very high on Montero, such as Keith Law, Baseball America and Baseball Prospectus – those aren’t NY media or Yankee plants. They recognize that he has, arguably, the best bat in the entire minor leagues and that he doesn’t fit well at any MLB position as he’d be a poor C or an untested 1B.

As to Yankee prospects that have been traded in recent years that have done well: Mike Lowell, Ted Lilly, Jake Westbrook have all had strong careers. Arodys Vizcaino has been superb in the Atlanta system since they traded him for Vazquez. Nick Johnson and Juan Rivera have had nice, if injury filled, careers since the Yankees moved them. Damaso Marte did quite well in Pittsburgh. Marcus Thames has had a decent career. Ian Kennedy has had a solid year in Arizona as has Tyler Clippard in Washington.

DJ_2
5 years 1 month ago

He’s been average this year, but check out his stats for his minor league career:

link to baseball-reference.com

Not so average, right?? Up until this year he’s raked the minors.

He’s also not legally allowed to drink yet, so struggles at AAA can be expected. Montero is the #4 prospect in baseball and plays C (sort of) so he deserves his hype.

j6takish
5 years 1 month ago

“Sort of” plays catcher like Victor Martinez? or “sort of” plays catcher like if Miguel Cabrera were to throw on the gear?

BaseballFanatic0707
5 years 1 month ago

What’s the difference? Victor Martinez is a terrible defensive catcher.

withpower
5 years 1 month ago

Uhh… a career .312./.372/.497 line in 1425 PA from a 20 year old in AAA (where he’s actually increased his walk rate) and you can’t quite put your finger on his upside..?

5 years 1 month ago

but there’s quite a difference between the minors and the majors. Players have done awesome in the minors only to struggle once called up to the bigs

withpower
5 years 1 month ago

I dunno.. I mean, I definitely agree with you. But its a pretty well established pattern that guys who hit like Montero has at such a young age at all the different levels he’s done it at.. I mean, developmentally, the guy is in line with the likes of Cabrera.

5 years 1 month ago

They look average? Are you looking at the same stats I am? The guy OPS’ed over 900 last year as a freakin’ 19 year old in High A and AA. He has been on one of the hottest streaks in the minor leagues for over a month this season. He is an elite bat, no matter what position he plays.

5 years 1 month ago

Then keep him. He’s the Yankees best prospect — their future. As for the Royals, he is not our best hitting prospect. Both Hosmer and Moustakas are young and comparable, if not better this year. Also, they have had the unique experience of actually practicing the position at which they will play in the majors, rather than the Royals putting Hosmer in CF to increase is positional value in a trade.

If this trade was actually offered and the Royals thought in any way Montero would be a catcher, it would have happened last week.

Potrzeba
5 years 1 month ago

Why isn’t Boston in on soria? We need him badly.

5 years 1 month ago

Because Theo is too scared to trade away his blue-chips?

dc21892
5 years 1 month ago

I’d love to see that, but for that to happen they’d have to flip Paps first. Philly remains interesting because the Sox are interested in Werth. Why not try to add Papelbon to a deal with Philly? Imagine being able to add Werth and Soria and not killing the farm system? That would be awesome. Theo is capable of it too.

Potrzeba
5 years 1 month ago

I was thinking that to. It would be pretty legit. I was thinking we trade papelbon and a prospect for werth and happ, then we center a trade around happ.

5 years 1 month ago

I read some of the trade proposal and people must going crazy. Soria for Montero? I don’t care how many years he has left, at the end of the day he still only a reliever. I would’t give up Romie either.

5 years 1 month ago

Mariano Rivera is also just a reliever, would you give up Montero for a younger Rivera? I’m not saying Soria is Rivera, but he still brings long-term stability to the 9th inning. Closers are hard to come by, and for the last 15 years the Yankees have had the best in the league(history). It’s not so much that the Yankees are looking for another RP, they are looking for a Rivera replacement. Soria is clearly the best option out there.

TheodoreRoosevelt
5 years 1 month ago

Good post!

Far, far too many people get red-faced, purse their lips, and act coy around Montero. At the end of the day, he’s a bat. A very good bat for many years to come in all likelihood, but still just a bat. The Yankees won’t be struggling for that kind of player.

But a new Rivera? That is pure gold dust. You don’t find them on the trade/free agency market every year. I like the Yankees’ long-term thinking on this one, and I respect KC’s understanding of Soria’s worth.

5 years 1 month ago

Soria is not “only a reliever,” he’s a top-tier closer. Closers may not win games for you but they make sure you don’t lose them. That’s still pretty valuable and vital in tight games.

chucktb
5 years 1 month ago

They’re not that valuable to 90 loss teams.

5 years 1 month ago

Do the Royals need a closer? Of course not. Are they right to ask for a lot for Soria? Absolutely.

Cyyoung
5 years 1 month ago

Epstein doesn’t have that insight. 3 games against the Angels and the Sox will be sellers.

Bernaldo
5 years 1 month ago

From Benji A – “I read some of the trade proposal and people must going crazy. Soria for Montero? I don’t care how many years he has left, at the end of the day he still only a reliever. I would’t give up Romie either.” It is worth noting that closers have high value on championship caliber teams and that Soria is a dominant player at this postion. Teams with high expectations place a high value on set-up guys as well. Soria in the 8th and Rivera in the 9th makes the Yankee’s a much better team this season. And, if/when Rivera retires, Soria is there to step in and close. Montero does not make the Yankees a better team tihs season and probably not next. Montero has never played MLB and while he may be a solid prospect, he may be a player without a position and is just as likely to be a mediocre player as a good one.

Dylan
5 years 1 month ago

Honest Question: The more you dangle a prospect, does that lower his value? I feel like the Yankees are saying he’s not as good as we thought because he was once untouchable….maybe I’m completely wrong on this, so feel free to say so.

5 years 1 month ago

I think the reason they do it, is because they have other good catchers in their minor league system

CosaOne
5 years 1 month ago

Supposedly he’s been offered for Halladay and Lee who are argueably the 2 best pitchers in baseball. Lets not make it seem like they are offering him up for Ty Wiggington or Ollie Perez here.

If you are rumored to be offering a top prospect for a top starter that can dominate then I dont think it hurts a trade chips value. Also its not like the trade talks hurt Monteros numbers in the minors he’s 20 and holding his own in AAA thats imoressive to say the least

Keith Law, Baseball America and Baseball Prospectus have no incentive to rank Montero as a top 5-10 prospect if they dont feel he truly is. They arent on the Yankee payroll, and stand nothing to gain, rather they could lose credibility if they just blindly ranked any Yankee prospect highly if the guy didnt deserve it

chucktb
5 years 1 month ago

Surely Dayton Moore isn’t so stupid that he turned down Montero for Soria. Soria’s really good, to be sure, but pretty unnecessary for a team as bad as the Royals. Furthermore, closers are eminently replaceable. Top 2 or 3 hitting prospects in the major leagues are not replaceable. If Cashman really did make that offer, and I’m skeptical, Moore should jump on it. Of course, knowing Moore, he’s liable to turn it down and then turn around and trade Soria to the Mets for Jeff Francoeur.

5 years 1 month ago

This is the problem: the Roylas have 3-4 prospects in the top 20 right now, most in the high minors, that play 1B/DH. They have good bat prospects, and it is unclear that Montero would be that much of an upgrade. He is a top-5 now because the NYY have him dressed in drag as a catcher, and is rated based on being an elite bat at the position. If nobody besides the Yankees (who have an interest in artificially inflating his prospect status) think he is a catcher, then the offer, even if good value, is a bad fit for the Royals organization.

5 years 1 month ago

For this reason it does make sense that they refuse that deal for Montero.

chucktb
5 years 1 month ago

He’s a top hitting prospect regardless of where he plays. It’s silly to turn down prospects who can hit like Montero, who are much younger than everyone else in the league, simply because they play the wrong position. You could move Montero or one of the other prospects later for something else if you want but Montero is an elite bat and the Royals should jump on that and worry about whether he sticks at C or 1B later.

5 years 1 month ago

Except, they have a lot of players that profile in that position that can also hit and get on base at a really nice clip. Not only would Montero’s “elite” upside only be a marginal improvement upon what we got, he would have to hit the very top of that upside in order to be much of an improvement at all. For the Royals, Montero would only be insulation against 3-4 players flaming out.

Moreover, with that kind of logjam in the upper minors, it depresses the value of the other commodities you have at that position. If everyone knows you have to move some bats, then they will low-ball you.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

“Of course, knowing Moore, he’s liable to turn it down and then turn around and trade Soria to the Mets for Jeff Francoeur.”

Hilarious. I’m wondering if a handful of these GM’s where all shipped the bad batch of kool aid.

gcheezpuff
5 years 1 month ago

Maybe the yanks would take Lilly and Fuku in exchange for the underperforming Granderson. He’d bring speed and a lefty bat to the cubs outfield.. Pretty unlikely as the yanks wouldn’t have much interest in fukudome, but they may have soured on Granderson.

5 years 1 month ago

First off the last thing the yankees need is another pitcher who
1. is old
2. will come to the american league and get lit up like a tree on christmas
Then the next to last thing the yankees need is
1. a decent outfielder who cant hit

5 years 1 month ago

I dont know how legit any of these rumors are .. but it sure is funny to watch all the NYY fans cry about it.

5 years 1 month ago

If the NY fans cry, then the Royals fan must be commiting suicide with that team!

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Well, at least we win things, homey.

Cyyoung
5 years 1 month ago

Im lucky here I’ve seen Montero play, in Double AA, kid is really a good hitter. People keep knocking his defense, he keeps working on this he will be better than you think. This coming from a Sox fan. In the Eastern League in recent years I’ve seen Mauer, and Weiters, Montero can hit, the ball flies off his bat.
I know he is in AAA, now but if I was KC I would have to think about this.

5 years 1 month ago

I agree. I’d do a trade involving Montero very quickly regardless of Butler and Myers (who may still be 2 years away). Montero can play next year in the big leagues and he can be good.

The thing is though… a shut down reliever is harder to find than people think. There’s only a handful of them in all of baseball and Soria is one of the best. The Royals may feel like their team is better off with a shut down reliever at the end of games than with a young stud maybe catcher, maybe 1B player.

Guest
5 years 1 month ago

Well, I take back most of my comments this morning. This speaks in volume why the Royals are a consisitent losing team. Cashman offers Montero for Soria (a reliever) and it is apparently turned down. Why an f’ing stupid move. My god, just when I thought the GM’s this season couldn’t be any dumber, I am yet proven wrong again. I don’t want to hear from anyone why he didn’t take it. They are a losing team. That’s a fact. They continue to be a losing team. That is a fact. They have little forecasted for the next year or two. That is probably true. The team friendly contract will be irrelevant in about 3 or 4 years. Fine, they didn’t have to take it, but boy, another masterpiece by one of these losing GM’s. Makes you think no?

stl_cards16
5 years 1 month ago

LOL…..so when you were wrong, you counter it by saying that’s because the Royals are a losing team? They didn’t want an overrated NY prospect, it’s not too hard to understand. With that team friendly of a contract, the Royals have plenty of time to trade him. Especially with the lack of relievers on the market this year, they can really make someone pay. They are set at 1B and it’s always a poor decision to pick up someone to be just a DH for multiple years. If the Royals are really interested in moving Soria there will be plenty of good offers. Maybe not with players with the upside Montero has, but someone who will be able to have a bigger impact in a position of need for the Roayals.

5 years 1 month ago

A. Jackson was overrated has well.

5 years 1 month ago

That was Cashman getting taken for a ride. Granderson is not that good.

However, the BABIP comment about Jackson needs to be remembered — his hitting numbers are not sustainable over the long term. Regardless, DET got rid of its high priced CF with crazy platoon splits for a player that is about as good for them.

It does prove that the NYY can have some real talent in their system, but it also shows that Cashman is not exactly the best evaluator of the talent (and development of such) that he does have.

5 years 1 month ago

The yanks should consider trading for the prince, think about it you trade joba and montero the yanks get a DH which they would probably use for Montero anyway in the coming years and the Brewers get a kid with great stuff who could be converted into a frontline starter. Montero could fill the 1st base vacancy immediately or even stay as a catcher