Cubs Lack Cash For Prince Fielder?

Yesterday word was the Marlins and Rangers were not in on Prince Fielder, despite Scott Boras' Jimmie Foxx comparisons.  The latest…


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148 Comments on "Cubs Lack Cash For Prince Fielder?"


tfsmag
3 years 8 months ago

this is a big no duh… big boy should push for incentive based option years if he wants a contract past 5-6 seasons. Probably dependent on production, staying off the dl, and keeping his weight down.

3 years 8 months ago

Jimmie Foxx died when he choked on a piece of steak.

Not sure what the risks are for soyfurters, but it’s worth looking into.  As long as we’re comparing…

Blanketsburg
3 years 8 months ago

As much of a masher Fielder is, he’s a big guy. Vegetarian or not. And big guys wear out more quickly than those who are more lean, e.g. Pujols. In this market, I could still see him going for 5yr/$100M+.

3 years 8 months ago

This puts the Jays back in the race for Fielder.  They said they were weary of going higher than 5 years (aka NO chance…) so if the market stays at five they might have a chance.  That or someone might just say EIGHT YEARS!!11!!

disgustedcubfan
3 years 8 months ago

He already turned down 6 years , 120 mill.

Jason Klinger
3 years 8 months ago

He must be eating an awful lot of vegetables.

3 years 8 months ago

I am confused.  Isn’t he a really great 1st baseman and slugger?  Don’t have his stats in front of me.  Why would you not want to sign a guy that is younger than Pujols and considered as a top player in his position to a contract that is around 2 to 3 years less than what Pujols is rumored to be getting?

Infield Fly
3 years 8 months ago

Concerns about how well he’ll age/break down physically, considering his weight (I mean, what if he reaches critical mass?). Seven or eight years is an awful lot to invest in player who may decline considerably faster than a player in much better physical condition — prodigious talent notwithstanding.

3 years 8 months ago

Squawk! Squawk!

Fielder is fat. Fielder is fat.

Squawk Squawk! 

Fielder is fat!

Man alive, years of this with no real analysis is just tiresome.

Skinny guys fall of cliffs production-wise too.

Long term deals, especially 8-10 year deals, are bad ideas.

Especially when they lock up 32 year olds at 25 million per.

Infield Fly
3 years 8 months ago

Squawk Squawk to you too!

chico65
3 years 8 months ago

Squawk you?

sherrilltradedooverexperience
3 years 8 months ago

because if he fails to age well the deal becomes a legendary AND mythical super-albatross that swoops down, scooping up and swallowing whole sharks, sailors, small whales, and baby seals alike; as it is an insatiable sea-bird, one of the animal kingdom wonders of the world, and powerful enough to consume the carcass of the franchise which tries to tame it.

$3513744
3 years 8 months ago

Everybody wants to sugar coat it, but it really comes down to the fact that he’s fat and there’s legitimate fear of how quickly he will break down.

imachainsaw
3 years 8 months ago

then they should probably be splenda-coating it. eh, eh? be here all week.

$3513744
3 years 8 months ago

Maybe they should, and then get Monsanto to pay his contract

imachainsaw
3 years 8 months ago

and then they’ll try to patent him…

Cook27
3 years 8 months ago

why are teams willing to give Pujols a 10 year deal at age 32 and they are scared to give Fielder 7 or 8 year deal at age 27. i dont get it

3 years 8 months ago

Ditto this doesn’t make sense

monkeydung
3 years 8 months ago

Pujols is one of two players in the 40 all-time leaders of WAR who is still active, essentially meaning that by the time he retires he’s top 30 or 20 of all time.

Fiedler is an overweight slugger who’s played his whole career in a hitter’s dream park and is a medicore defensive player.

3 years 8 months ago

Wait until they test for Pujols “fertility treatments.”

He’s a big dude too.  No way he holds up for 5 years, much less 10.

3 years 8 months ago

Pujols is one of the best hitters in the history of the game.  Fielder is one of the better hitters of the past 5 years.  Pujols average year over the past 11 is 155 games, 40 HRs, 117 R, 121 RBI, .328 AVG, .420 OBP, 1.037 OPS while Fielder (over 6 years) is 160 games, 38 HRs, 94 R, 108 RBI, .282 AVG, .390 OBP, .929 OPS.  Yes Pujols is 4 years older, but he is also 6’3 230# while Fielder is 5’11 275#.  Pujols is once in a lifetime.  Fielder is one in a handful of current great first basemen.

3 years 8 months ago

Pujols “has been” for 10 years. Not “will be” for 10 years.

I am extremely dubious of guarantees of his future production.  Aside from Barry Bonds, how many “all time greats” maintained peak production into the second half of their 30’s? 

HVega
3 years 8 months ago

His weight!!  Imagine how many ‘vegetarian hamburgers’ he will have consumed 7 years from now….  His weight is a major issue for most clubs. Yes, he has been durable in his tewnty’s but your body changes in your thirty’s and for a baseball player who is responsible for playing 162 games a season, this puts a tone on your body. 

HVega
3 years 8 months ago

His weight!!  Imagine how many ‘vegetarian hamburgers’ he will have consumed 7 years from now….  His weight is a major issue for most clubs. Yes, he has been durable in his tewnty’s but your body changes in your thirty’s and for a baseball player who is responsible for playing 162 games a season, this puts a tone on your body. 

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

I’m sure Fielder will end up with a 6 or 7 year deal when all’s said and done.

vincentjulian
3 years 8 months ago

The only ones really offering Pujols a 10-year deal were the Marlins and Cardinals.

IMO, the team that offers him the 7-8 year deal gets him. If not, it’ll turn into a bidding war for 5+options/incentives contracts.

ellisburks
3 years 8 months ago

And the Angels apparently.

3 years 8 months ago

Fielder wants to play on the Dodgers with his buddy Matt Kemp, he’s just waiting for new ownership to open up the bankbook.

monkeydung
3 years 8 months ago

and Tony Gywnn Jr. – apparently they are super close.

Zuidvogels
3 years 8 months ago

Scott Boras is going to have to go to the safe and get pics to blackmail some GM again, he will get him 7 years. For some reason he always squeezes it out of someone.

3 years 8 months ago

Fielder is one of the top sluggers in the league right now, but I don’t think he’s anywhere close to HOFer Jimmie Foxx.

One a side note, Fielder is the fattest damn vegetarian I’ve ever seen.

Brett Rhodes
3 years 8 months ago

Last time I checked, donuts aren’t animals.

ctownboy
3 years 8 months ago

If I were Scott Boras and I was hoping to get Prince Fielder an 8 or 10 year contract, I wouldn’t be comparing Fielder to Foxx considering Foxx’s last productive season came during his age 33 year.

The more Boras compares Fielder to Foxx, the more teams are going to say, “Fielder is 28, Foxx was pretty much done by 33, so yeah, I am only going to give Fielder a five year contract……..”

not_brooks
3 years 8 months ago

Prince’s pop was done by 33 as well.

Unless the Orioles or Nationals do something crazy, there’s no way Prince gets more than six years.

3 years 8 months ago

cecil?

3 years 8 months ago

this makes no sence what so ever. you give a guy a 10 year 200+ million dollar contract and he so happens to be 31 and will be 32 in a couple months, but your scared to offer a guy who is 27 years old, more then 5 years because of what? weight?

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

He’ll be Prince Fielder-y for the next 4-5 years but after that Fielder’s pretty likely to turn into Mo Vaughn 2.0 — or more appropriately, Cecil Fielder 2.0. Check out Vaughn and Fielder’s stats after age 32 — brutal.

TImothy Harrison
3 years 8 months ago

Or David Ortiz 33 1/3

Citos_City
3 years 8 months ago

5 years???? AA’s limit

ctownboy
3 years 8 months ago

If I were a GM, I would have hard rules about signing players.  They would be as follows:
1)  Don’t sign any Relief Pitcher over the age of 35.
2)  Don’t sign any position player to a contract longer than five years (if the Average Annual Value is higher for a five year contract then so be it.  I don’t want to be stuck with a guy who is overpaid, unproductive and untradable).
3)  Don’t sign any Pitcher for more than three years (again, if the AAV is higher because of this, so be it).

3 years 8 months ago

Pat Gillick? Is that you?

formerdraftpick
3 years 8 months ago

4) Don’t get them wet and don’t feed them after midnight.

Seriously though, I think that what you wrote is a legitimate rule of thumb. I think the most recent deals that we are seeing are in order secure a “future HOF” on the team (in the case of Pujols).

3 years 8 months ago

Enjoy fourth place when all your FA’s bolt for gr$$ner pastures.

jb226
3 years 8 months ago

You could probably get away with #1 and #2, but #3 would destroy you unless you were the best drafting GM in the history of… well, ever, and able to keep a constant influx that way.

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

I’m with you on 2 — although I would make an exception if the guy is still really young (ala Cabrera’s Detroit deal) or gives you a hometown discount (Griffey’s deal with Cincy — although that one kind of proves your point).

I sort of agree with #3 — although you’d never sign difference-making pitchers in that case, and would be stuck with a staff of guys like Bruce Chen and Bartolo Colon unless you had really solid player development (like the Rays).

The first one I don’t agree with because there are many examples of relief pitchers over 35 who do very well — Saito, Hawkins, Rhodes, Oliver, etc. But I wouldn’t give out a multi-year contract for a relief pitcher over 35.

Not that anyone will ever hire me to be a GM. Sigh.

not_brooks
3 years 8 months ago

Sounds like the Orioles, except for the relief pitcher thing. Overpaying relievers in their mid-30’s must be Peter Angelos’s favorite thing to do.

Mikey Roederer
3 years 8 months ago

I am really starting to jump onto the Fielder to Cubs bandwagon, if it takes 7 yrs I would be ok with that..going above that tho could get really really dangerous. Everyone knows the cubs won’t compete until ’13 or ’14..which puts Fielder into his prime years..I would be ok with that

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

The Cubs have to do … something. And with Pujols gone, stealing Fielder from the Brewers would be like one-upping two division rivals (two-upping?). But seems like Epstein is saying they can’t afford him. That Soriano deal is just hilariously terrible.

Guest
3 years 8 months ago

If the cubs sign fielder who’s to say they wont comete until 13 or 14? The Central would be considerbly weakened before then. The Reds look to be the team to beat now with the brewers and cads losing their big bats.

davcamp
3 years 8 months ago

I think the Nats are going to get Fielder…

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

He’s going to get more money than Carl Crawford, especially if he goes to an AL team. My guess is he goes to the Mariners for 8 years and 160 million.

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

Mariners, in order to make room for Fielder, trade Ichiro (16MM), Figgins (9MM) and 5MM cash to the Tigers for Delmon Young (7MM) and Brandon Inge (6MM). Mariners net gain at least 7MM in space and 14MM if they chose non-tender Young. Ichiro gets to leadoff for a contender in his last season of his contract. Figgins gets a rebound shot and an option to play at 2b or 3b. Tigers only spend an extra 7MM on two of the fastest players in the league. Tigers save all their prospects and give up next to nothing. With Pujols leaving St. Louis, you can’t blame the M’s for cutting ties with Ichiro if it’s in the best interest of the team long-term. M’s lineup…

2b) Ackley
RF) Trayvon Robinson/Saunders
LF) Carp/Delmon Young
1B/DH) Prince Fielder
DH/1b) Smoak/Carp
C) Olivo/Jaso
3b) Inge/Seager
SS) Ryan/Franklin/Wilson/Triunfel(still figuring that out)
CF) Gutierrez

As a Tiger fan, I am a proponent of this trade, what do you M’s fans think?

FS54
3 years 8 months ago

no way, Ichiro approves of that trade.

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

Yeah. And no way the Mariners GM (not to mention the Mariners fanbase) approves of that trade either. Ichiro will never get traded — sells too many jerseys/tickets.

3 years 8 months ago

the mariners luuuuuv itchyballs….he will retire there….bet on it

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

the cardinals luuuuuv albert pujols….he will…..oh wait

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

Pretty sure Pujols sold a lot of Cardinals jerseys too dude

Guest
3 years 8 months ago

It’s not the same thing. The amount of the contracts is vastly different, and Ichiro is under contract for 2012, while Pujols wasn’t. If the M’s offer Ichiro a contract after 2012 and Ichiro signs elsewhere, then it’s a similar situation.

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

Let me rephrase. The situation is different, the precedent is the same. The precedent is baseball is a business in its truest form. Barring injury, the Mariners’ business, in the long run, is much better off having Fielder for the next 7-8 years at 160MM than Ichiro for just next season.
Another thing to note, like you said, it’s not the same thing. Pujols is locked in to the Angels for the next 10 seasons and will most likely finish his career there. Ichiro could and probably would come back to an M’s team that’s probably built to contend in 2013 with Nick Franklin, James Paxton, Taijuan Walker, Alex Liddi, and Guillermo Pimmentel all likely ready to add to an already exciting core of Ackley, Fielder, Smoak, Robinson, King Felix and Pineda

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

Let me rephrase. The situation is different, the precedent is the same. The precedent is baseball is a business in its truest form. Barring injury, the Mariners’ business, in the long run, is much better off having Fielder for the next 7-8 years at 160MM than Ichiro for just next season.
Another thing to note, like you said, it’s not the same thing. Pujols is locked in to the Angels for the next 10 seasons and will most likely finish his career there. Ichiro could and probably would come back to an M’s team that’s probably built to contend in 2013 with Nick Franklin, James Paxton, Taijuan Walker, Alex Liddi, and Guillermo Pimmentel all likely ready to add to an already exciting core of Ackley, Fielder, Smoak, Robinson, King Felix and Pineda

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

You don’t think Ichiro would want to play for a contender in his last season of his contract? Postseason success always boosts the value of your next contract, and Ichiro rarely has been on a winning team.

Morley C
3 years 8 months ago

With the comma in your sentence it sounds as though you’re saying Ichiro approves of the trade.

sourbob
3 years 8 months ago

I would have a conversation about this idea with you in a bar, but on this board, it violates a cardinal rule: “Does your comment contain a lineup? If so, FAIL.”

101andCounting
3 years 8 months ago

I’m actually somewhat of a proponent of including a basic lineup in a comment – Helps to eliminate confusion, especially when discussing three-team trades. However, trade discussions are *supposed* to happen in the Forums, which are, in my opinion, one of the most underused facets of this website.

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

my bad, just wanted to stir the pot

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

i don’t normally do lineup cards, but figured the question would be asked, who leads off for the M’s then?

sourbob
3 years 8 months ago

Reasonable question. That’s why I kept my snark minimal. For verification of this unwritten rule, read any five posts you see with lineups and rate their quality. Almost infallibly low.

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

true, I too grew especially irritated with the constant Red Sox lineups that had Hanley Ramirez at SS and Justin Upton in RF acquired for Lars Anderson and Josh Reddick last year.

sonofsnake
3 years 8 months ago

As a Mariners fan I think Brandon Inge and Delmon Young suck.  The Mariners have the money for Fielder without trading any salary, it’s just a matter of making the commitment.     

3 years 8 months ago

I don’t think I’d necessarily say Inge and Young suck, especially when Seattle has a pretty bad 3rd base situation at the moment.  Inge could bridge the gap for Liddi possibly (unless the M’s want to just give the spot to Seager, which I’m not against).  I’m thinking Jack Z has no problem giving Prince 7-8 years; if Z really thought his weight issue was such a huge risk, would he have pushed so hard to draft him with the Brewers in the first place?

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

I disagree. I don’t think they have the money for this season , especially with 25MM commited to Ichiro and Figgins in 2012, two players that can barely contribute with the M’s current offense. You don’t think Z would prefer to have an extra 7-14MM to work with to sign Fielder? Brandon Inge would be solid for the M’s for one season to develop Liddi and/or platoon with Seager (LH). As for Young, you can always non-tender him. With Ichiro, the Tigers would without doubt non-tender Young. So instead they trade him, and give Seattle the choice. Personally, I would think Z wouldn’t mind a 1-year gamble on a vet coming off a strong 2nd half and postseason. Then he’d be able to have competition for the last OF spot between Robinson, Saunders, and Carp. He may even decide that Guttierez should be replaced by Robinson or Saunders.

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

I’m a Tigers fan, too, but this makes no sense for the Ms. Ichiro is too valuable to them — not only as a lead-off hitter but as a franchise player who singlehandedly sells probably a third of their season tickets. Doubt the Mariners would consider trading him at all, and if they did, it wouldn’t be until the deadline. Ichiro’s situation is very different than Pujols — Pujols made a decision to leave, but the Cardinals clearly wanted him back.

And I bet the M’s will offer Ichiro a 3 year Jeter kind of deal (well, for less money) after this season, too. He has a legit shot to get 3,000 hits as a Mariner.

The Mariners would do well to sign Fielder regardless — they can afford him. Ichiro/Ackley/Fielder/Smoak/Carp (in LF)/Olivo/Gutierrez/Ryan/Figgins isn’t a terrible lineup, in theory.

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

that same argument could have been made for Pujols. It’s not that different. The Cardinals always had the option to match, they chose not too. The Mariners have the choice to commit 16MM to Ichiro next season, but could chose 20MM to Prince instead. Would you blame him? You don’t think Fielder could draw fans in Seattle? They haven’t had a sound LH homerun hitter like him there since Ken Griffey days.

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

The amount of money involved is nowhere near comparable. And the Cardinals didn’t trade Pujols. Either way, the Mariners have the money to sign Fielder without trading Ichiro, so I don’t really get your point.

Hoosierdaddy92
3 years 8 months ago

It’s debatable and unclear that the Mariners have enough money for this season. They have very little money off the books from 2011 and a few sizable arbitration raises on the way. There have been a lot of mixed reports about their financial situation. With my proposal though, it ensures that they do indeed have the money for this season for Fielder with 7MM to 14MM depending on if they non-tender Young. they aren’t going to have an opportunity to land a hitter of his caliber next season. (I don’t see Hamilton leaving Texas and if Joey Votto becomes available, I’m quite positive the Blue Jays will do everything in their power to get him.)

rsanchez1
3 years 8 months ago

What, so they don’t want him because he’s not latino? If no one will give him more than five years, the Marlins can probably snatch him up for six. They won’t get screwed over with a 10-year contract to a 32-year old player.

Damnit Marlins don’t make any sense.

angryredmenace
3 years 8 months ago

The Marlins wanted Pujols because they thought him being latino would bring in more latin baseball fans to the new marlins ballpark.Prince not being latino gives the marlins management the impression that Prince won’t be able to draw in the latin market like Pujols, making giving Prince a big contract not worth it.

DT
3 years 8 months ago

This also explains their dogged pursuit of Carlos Juan “CJ” Wilson.

angryredmenace
3 years 8 months ago

Apples in oranges.Take a look at what the marlins offer CJ Wilson and take a look at what they offered Pujols.CJ Wilson would have only been a piece of the puzzle, Pujols and someone like Prince Fielder would have been the center piece, the face of the franchised.The Marlins didn’t want Pujols for production alone.The Marlins believe with his star power and pedigree he would have brought in not just the latin baseball fans, but miami latino residences who only have a casual interest in baseball who would come out to see a superstar latin ballplayer.I mean, you can’t be that stupid.

“a high-ranking Marlins official told Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports. Fielder can’t drive the Latin market like Albert Pujols could have.

What do you think that means? It’s obvious you too simple to grasp something so clearly stated, but you can at least give it a try.

DT
3 years 8 months ago

It was a joke, I didn’t mean to rip you.  Sorry if it came off that way.

Having said that, it’s not like their offer to CJ was peanuts compared to what they would have to offer Prince, so it’s not a TOTAL apples-oranges comparison. Less for CJ than Prince, sure, but not a tiny fraction by any means.  

I guess the argument would be along the lines of “We need a pitcher like CJ, we don’t care about his marketability.  we don’t need a first baseman as desperately, but we’ll make an exception for a marketable guy like Pujols (but not Prince).”  

mistermonkey
3 years 8 months ago

I once finagled a press pass to cover a Yankees game in 1997 when Cecil Fielder was on the team. In the locker room before the game, a reporter for a Latino newspaper approached him and said, “Hey, Cecil –.” Fielder cut him off there because the guy had pronounced it like Cecil Cooper, not Cecil Fielder — Fielder corrected him in this really sarcastic voice by saying, “It’s Cecil…” But the guy continued undaunted. He asked: “Are you Latino?” And Cecil said, with a smile on his face, “Uh, no.” And then he just walked away from the Latino reporter. None of it made any sense but it was totally awesome in every way.

That’s basically the Marlins vs. Prince right now.

chico65
3 years 8 months ago

So the Cubs had enough cash to be in on Pujols, but not enough for Fielder?  Umm, sure.

swankwank
3 years 8 months ago

Please the Cubs don’t have the money to spend is a load of it.

jb226
3 years 8 months ago

Yup.  The Cubs could easily afford it if they so desired (and with no commentary about whether or not that would be a good idea).

They may not WANT to spend the kind of money it would take on Prince Fielder, but that is not the same as not having it.

Jays Fan
3 years 8 months ago

Seriously, Alex Anthopolous. Pujols set the bar. Offer Prince 5 years, $125-$130m which is Pujols money without the years. Offer him options for years 6 & 7, and get it done. Now is not the time to sit back while the Angels are loading up.

Rcsully
3 years 8 months ago

Watch out for the Orioles

not_brooks
3 years 8 months ago

It’s the one thing I’m not ruling out for them.

There’s no way the Orioles will sign a FA pitcher for more than three years.

There’s no way they’ll trade Wieters, Jones, Hardy or Markakis (not that anyone would want Markakis at his current salary).

There’s no way they’ll trade Britton, Arrieta or Matusz (not that they could get anything for Arrieta or Matusz at this point).

But Prince Fielder? Peter Angeles just might be desperate enough. And Dan Duquette just might be crazy/stupid enough.

We’ll see…