Jeremy Hellickson Drawing Trade Interest

Rays right-hander Jeremy Hellickson is drawing more trade interest than any other member of the Tampa Bay rotation, Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com reports. There’s been lots of speculation surrounding James Shields, but it’s Hellickson who has been most popular in the early going of the offseason. Talks are expected to continue at the GM Meetings in California later this week, Heyman writes.

Hellickson, 25, just completed his second full season at the MLB level. He posted a 3.10 ERA with 6.4 K/9 and 3.0 BB/9 in 177 innings over the course of 31 starts. The 2011 Rookie of the Year won't be arbitration eligible until after the 2013 season and he'll remain under team control through 2016. Agent Scott Boras represents Hellickson, an indication that agreeing to a long-term extension could be challenging.

Both Hellickson and Shields drew interest at the 2012 trade deadline. The Padres, Angels, Dodgers, Twins, Royals and Blue Jays are among the many teams seeking starting pitching this offseason.


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213 Comments on "Jeremy Hellickson Drawing Trade Interest"


2 years 9 months ago

Use both pitchers in a trade and imagine what the Rays can get

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

Probably about the same as Price alone would draw and the Rays can only afford price another year, *maybe* 2 years if they cut payroll to a bare minimum.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

25m+/year for ESPN and Fox deals, and new TV contract with extra 50+m are upcoming. They can afford their core players.

suhiscrazierthanyou
2 years 9 months ago

but will they pay them?

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Starting 2014, MLB deals with Fox and ESPN will provide extra 25m for all baseball teams. Starting 2016, Ray’s TV contract expires and will at least double or even triple to the previous amount. Usually renewal happens a year or two earlier, meaning Rays need to maintain high TV ratings at least until they sign new TV contract.

What does this imply? Same as Dodgers taking enormous contracts and Reds extend Votto & Phillips, Rays must afford their core players to earn big TV checks.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

Take a gander to a Rays game sometime.. Please do and ignore the cowbells.. When a “marquee team” such as Boston, NYY, Philly isn’t in town? The stadium doesn’t have more than 10-15k in it and when one of those teams are in town and *sometimes* they have 20-25k? The majority of the fans are ROOTING for the opposition..

That team doesn’t have the support, or until it moves out of St. Petersburg at least it doesn’t..

Horrible announcers (De—Wayne Staats) that can’t call a PBP without whining, Poor location and stadium.. League wide TV revenue isn’t going to have an impact.

javywoz
2 years 9 months ago

I’m a little perplexed how DeWayne Staats has any impact on the Rays affording players, but somehow an extra $25 million per year in 2014, and milions more in local TV revenue shortly after that “isn’t going to have an impact”.
That money won’t necessary allow the Rays alot of help in outbidding teams on the open market, but the funds allow them to keep their own players through arb/contract years without worrying that they are getting “too expensive”. Theoritically the extra funds should allow them to keep both Price and Shields for the next two years if they really wanted to.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

The Staats reference was if they would finally get rid of him (and find anyone else to do PBP) maybe some would start listening to their local telecasts, rather than watching them with the volume set to “off” so we don’t have to listen to him whine and complain each and everytime ANY LITTLE THING does not go exactly the Rays way.. from pitch, to call.. ANYTHING.. On and on and on he goes…

More, possibly neutral fans might actually enjoy the games and watch the telecasts than prefer watching ANY game by.. Say MLB,com than watch Rays games via no audio to tune him out.. Staats, Mel Proctor, Phil Rhizzuto.. Those types of announcers are not good for gathering new fans and only Staats is still calling games.

As for the new found money? yes it could theoreticlly help, so could raising the fan base, moving the stadium to Tampa itself (busting the lease) moving to orlando, or out of Florida itself, because the team will never survive in ST. Pete as was proven (again) with the lowest attendence in ALL of MLB with the 30th ranking.

Is Staats all by himself to blame for chasing off new fans? nope. Is the terrible location? Nope. Is the even worse Stadium? Nope, but you combine all those together and that 50m isn’t going to help one tiny bit in the long run.

GrayhawkAZ
2 years 9 months ago

What?!?! Did I just waste my time reading this?
The TV Deal will be large because Tampa has been in the top 10 of the league in viewership the last 3 years.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

Nationally, because they have been on TV so often (results of being good) or locally?

Not going to go look (yet) but figuring that is nationally, because they have been on more than say… The SDP, KC, Houston…

Guest
2 years 9 months ago

hart and gomez for hellickson

LukeNalooshe
2 years 9 months ago

Corey Hart, and Carlos Gomez for Jeremy Hellickson? The Rays generally look for players under control for longer. they have outfielders as well.

CyYoungSuppan
2 years 9 months ago

I don’t think this would work out specifically, but the Brewers could be a good partner for such a trade. I wouldn’t be surprised if their name is dropped in teams trying to work out a deal if it does happen.

Ben_Cherington
2 years 9 months ago

David Ortiz for Mr. Hellickson?

Ben_Cherington
2 years 9 months ago

Well…not sure what all the negativity is about!!
hmmm…what about Jared Saltalmachio for Mr. Hellickson

2 years 9 months ago

lolol this is awesome. these downvoters don’t know a top notch post when they see one.

Ben_Cherington
2 years 9 months ago

I thought it was funny!

2 years 9 months ago

Bozos probably never heard of Ben Cherington.

Ben_Cherington
2 years 9 months ago

Haters gonna Hate!

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

Trumbo for Hellickson? Or Bourjos for Hellickson, I wouldn’t trade both though.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Rays would say no. Angels should just roll with Jerome Williams and Richards for their 4-5.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

I don’t know. It meets needs for both sides, and Trumbo has a ton of trade value. If they don’t, Williams and Richards will probably be it. However, I can hope for better.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Trumbo is average 1B whose career line is .259 .302 .478 with mediocre defense and struggled in 2nd half by logging wRC+ 55, 51 last 2 months. Angels may need to add significantly more to balance it, doubt they would do so.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

Hellickson is a .500 pitcher and Trumbo is a 30HR guy….how is this so lopsided? If anything, it might be the other way around…….

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

The Rays will want a player that meets Hellickson’s potential.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

How does trumbo not? Okay so he’s not a pitcher, is Hellickson going to hit 30 HR? No

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

I question whether Trumbo remains a 30 HR hitter.

2 years 9 months ago

good lord, are you citing W/L record?

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Why do you keep bringing up his win-lose record? Dude that is the worst stat you could ever use to rate a pitchers value. This trade would never happen!

cubfan4life
2 years 9 months ago

Trumbo would be hard to resist for TB. If they ask for more than just Trumbo maybe add in Conger or Romine?

2 years 9 months ago

fetus???

Guest
2 years 9 months ago

Trumbo, Richards, Jepsen and Kendrick for Hellickson and Zobrist. Who hangs up first?

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

Angels

Encarnacion's Parrot
2 years 9 months ago

The rate at which pitchers’ records are being pointed to lately has made my brain explode.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Rays in a nano second. Let alone Zobrist, he earned 25.2 WAR for last 4 seasons which is third best in baseball. The other twos are Cabrera and Pujols.

rikersbeard
2 years 9 months ago

Absolutely the Rays. They are giving up the two best players in that deal and not getting nearly enough in return.

jb1031
2 years 9 months ago

Throw in Vernon Wells and you got a deal?? 😉

Stuart Brown
2 years 9 months ago

Trumbo lost a lot of his trade value when his stats plummeted in the second half of the season. He basically pulled a Brennan Boesch.

javywoz
2 years 9 months ago

I don’t think you’re too far off, Lightupthehalo. As a Rays fan, a Trumbo for Helly proposal is a good starting point to start the discussions. Others may need to be involved (on both sides) to balance things out, but 30HR hitters cheap and under team control don’t grow on trees.

2 years 9 months ago

I would take Trumbo for Hellickson in a heartbeat.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

That is not nearly enough. You need to have elite players to acquire Hellickson.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

Why? Show me the stats that prove that? He is no better a pitcher than Trumbo is a 1B/OF. Hellickson is a .500 pitcher that eats good innings with decent strikeout numbers. Trumbo is a 30 HR 90-100 RBI guy. I don’t see the big difference between the two, sorry.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Are you sure using winning percentage is a great measure for pitchers? I guess in your world Cliff Lee is one of the worst pitchers in all time?

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

Its not always the best, but its not like the rest of his stats are Cliff Lee like. He is a great young player with potential, the same as Trumbo, just on is a pitcher and on is guy with a bat.

East Coast Bias
2 years 9 months ago

The crux of your argument is false. Hellickson is a much better pitcher than Trumbo is a 1B. I mean, Carlos Pena had a higher OBP than Trumbo in 2012, in a down year for Pena, and a break out year for Trumbo. IF Trumbo plays like this down the line, I can see a similar OPS and role Pena played for the Rays. Problem is, no one would give up Hellickson to trade for Pena. So why Trumbo?

2 years 9 months ago

Years of control and low salary?

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

Trumbo has had 2 solid years as as Hellickson. Pena is way older than trumbo first off and Trumbo hit 10-13 more HRs than Pena. I know its not all about HRs, but he only has two years in. You make it seem like Hellickson has been doing this for 5-7 years with 15 wins and an ERA of 3.00. Plus Trumbo is far cheaper than Pena, so based on production, would you pay Pena or Trumbo?

East Coast Bias
2 years 9 months ago

Right. My point was that Trumbo is a player similar to Pena, production wise. High Ks, high HRs, OBP is similar where Trumbo has a slightly higher BA, but Pena has a much higher BB rate.

So, would you give up Hellickson for a player with Pena’s numbers? No, you wouldn’t. As such, you wouldn’t give up Hellickson for Trumbo, because he is a similar type player.

That was my point. Not literally Pena, but similar production type of player.

I should point out that I am well aware Pena is years older than Trumbo… but I thought we were coming into this argument assuming everyone knows the obvious…?

Lastly, they can just pay a 1B with power in free agency and keep Hellickson.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Well for one RBI are maybe the worst stat to judge a hitter on in the world. .He doesn’t walk. He strikes out a lot. Do you need me to keep going? Hellickson is kind of an enigma. In a shade above 400 career innings he has 3.06 era. That is fantastic for a young starter, but his fip is around 1.5 higher. If it was a simple case where he had been successful for one year then we could say it was luck but he repeated the performance. He also improved his K numbers and walk numbers. Hellickson has proven to be a #2 or 3 starter in the AL east. He also has five more years or so of team control. 1B is the easiest position to fill in baseball. The Rays can just sign someone like Berkman. You don’t trade good young starting pitchers for 1B who can’t walk.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

Actually thought Trumbo was pretty good and for an offense as lethargic as the Rays? would be something they dearly need, complete with 4 years of team control at probable low cost.

It’s not like TB is going to get a AS player who is getting 90% of their payroll subsidized by the other team for Hellickson or anything.. Trumbo actually is a fair offer.

2 years 9 months ago

I agree.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Or maybe they would acquire young cost-controlled players for what is turning out to be a very good young starter in Hellickson? Don’t you think that if the Rays were to move one of there very good young starters that they would expect to fill multiple holes? You know like Garza? Only this time they would be trading an even younger and more affordable pitcher! If Hellickson is moved I would imagine that any trade talks first start with each teams very best prospect! This means Royals:Myers, Rangers: Profar, Toronto: d’Arnaud. If the Angels even went after Shields I would demand Bourjos, Richards, and Conger. Shields has two years left and 20 million attached. You would have to put together packages for these guys! These are very good starters. We are talking about a 1B here! They are all over the place. He also cannot walk! Trumbo is really entertaining but I’m pretty sure I could find his production on the open market for around 5-10 million and not have to give up any pitchers.

2 years 9 months ago

You’d rather have Bourjos, Richards, and Conger than Trumbo? Good gravy. At least give me Cron if not Trumbo.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

I would rather have Bourjos over Trumbo 1-1! Bourjos is the best centerfield defender in the game. Richards has a solid arm that at worst would be a good back end reliever. Conger can jump into the catching mix with the Rays. We can just start throwing names of better players out all day. I want Cowart, Cron, and Calhoun! What I’m trying to put together is a package that could reasonably work for both sides. Why is everyone seemingly obsessed with Trumbo? The guy is an average 1b.

javywoz
2 years 9 months ago

Bourjos is all glove, no bat. You could possibly live with that if he’s giving you 40+ SB, but so far in the majors, he hasn’t shown he can do that. He’d be a slight upgrade over a Fuld/Guyer platoon, while Trumbo is a very big upgrade over any of the FA’s the Rays would be looking at for 1B.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

“I’m pretty sure I could find his production on the open market for around 5-10 million”

Didn’t TB just try that route with both Luke Scott and Pena to bolster a non existent offense? It didn’t work out to well did it?

Sometimes acquiring prospects can be a terrific thing and sometimes it can be a bad thing. In Tampa’s case? They are working on a short window.. They have a NICE Ace in David Price that they can’t afford, but for another year, maybe 2 max and a GOOD rotation that is going to get expensive as well in another couple of years by arbitration alone.

They are under pressure by that means ALONE to win now and get SOME kind of offense put together. All those scrap pieces they put together last year? It was a fluke that offense performed as admirable as it did even and am NOT saying that to be mean even, but really.. Look at how well the non Pena/Scott’s performed with Longoria out.. It was career years around the team and retreads coming onboard and doing more than could be expected until mid September.

A team cannot think of expecting that again, there must be legitimate protection for Longoria, or every team in the league will just pitch around him and Trumbo is a possibility and profar is just a prospect at this point.. Albeit one of the best prospects.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

So if players have injuries, like Scott did, over a season then you should just make wild irrational trades? So if a couple free agent signings don’t work you should give up a valuable starter for an average 1B? They can just go out and sign Berkman! They can trade for players with equally valuable skill sets like Clint Robinson, Kyle Blanks, Daric Barton, or they can just sign someone like Gaby Sanchez for around three million bucks and probably get the exact same production! Trumbo is not a great player! The dude is an average 1B that almost never walks and strikes out a bunch.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

There is nothing irrational about trying to win within a short window of oppurtunity that TB knows they now have. Will they have that oppurtunity down the line? Possibly, but Friedman has to be smart enough to realize the deck is against him with the new CBA and TB can no longer pluck 5-8 top 100 choices the way that they once did and get teams like he has NOW.

A top bat for friedman, that can help his team win, under team control (reasonable cheap) is something he needs to consider, rather than even more prospects at this point.

As for Scott? His shoulder was a known issue when his deal was signed.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Sure. A TOP bat. This is not Trumbo! Scott didn’t have shoulder surgery before he signed the contract????!!! Uhhhhhh yeah he did. They signed him knowing that he would not be able to play in the field for the first month or so. The effects of labrum surgery can linger for years.

Aron
2 years 9 months ago

Come on dude he’s miles ahead of Gaby Sanchez, not many players can say they hit more than 30 HRs by age 26

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

HR’s are nice, but they are not the end of the world. Sanchez is two years older. In 2010 and 2011 he OPSed .788 and .779 with an average walk rate around 10%. Yeah he had a bad year last year. But if you give me the option of Sanchez at three million or Hellickson for Trumbo??????!! Is this even a question? They are actually very similar players. I wouldn’t be surprised of Sanchez outplays Trumbo next year. Again, Trumbo is basically Chris Davis. Would you trade Davis for Hellickson? It took Davis and Hunter to get a reliever!

Aron
2 years 9 months ago

But you guys need RUNS! and in a hurry before your window of opportunity closes with all your pitchers becoming too expensive for you. And again I’m still not saying a straight up Trumbo for Hellickson deal but I’m sure the Angels could throw in a decent prospect (although not many are left after that Greinke trade) and another decent Major Leaguer while eating some of their contract. That would be miles ahead of Gaby Sanchez.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Who is “you guys”! I’m NOT a Rays fan! I am a baseball fan. I am pointing out the obvious flaws in these trades proposed. I am in no way favoring one side. Trumbo is an average 1B that does not walk. That’s what he is. the Rays have better options than him even without moving Hellickson. I’m just stating facts.

Aron
2 years 9 months ago

Aha okay, my bad on that part, but other than that what I said made sense from a baseball perspective. Even as a Blue Jays fan I like the Rays (whoever beats the Yankees and Red Sox is good in my books). And the Halos may be pressed to make a trade if they can’t re-sign Greinke and I’m sure they could offer cash from their end with the money that was left on the table for Greinke. In my mind a decent trade would be Trumbo, Conger, and cash, what do you think about that?

2 years 9 months ago

Can Conger play still? Scoscia is weird about benching good hitting catchers, so it’s hard to know, but maybe he’s also a PCL product like Gamel.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

For Hellickson? That’s not even close. It doesn’t matter though. There is no way they move him this offseason. Maybe in two years, but it makes no sense to do it now. They would have to be just blown away.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

It would take something around the Latos deal. Plus or minus here or there, but very close. Hellickson is cheaper and has pitched in the more difficult division and park. He doesn’t have the strikeout numbers, but I think they are pretty comparable. That netted the Padres a 1B, C, Sp, and Rp. If someone came up with an Alonso, Boxberger, Volquez, and Grandal trade then the rays might bite. The Angels and everyone else are much better off looking at Shields who would require more of a Garza type deal. That’s three of a team’s top ten prospects and a good starting pitcher. There is just no major reason for the Rays to move him now.

Aron
2 years 9 months ago

I agree with most of what you’re saying other than finding production like Trumbo on the FA market, there’s only one batter better than him in this FA class (although it is by a lot) in Josh Hamilton. BJ is the only other comparable FA and they’re not even the same kind of player so not even he will get you the TYPE of production Trumbo brings, a solid bat and loads of power. Trumbo is one of the better bats in the league and now a days those bats are all being locked up. Although Hellickson is a great starter he’s still only a 2-3 pitcher, comparable to the likes of Sanchez, Haren, McCarthy (when he’s healthy, which admittedly is always a big question mark) and others that are currently FAs. So I’d say Trumbo is a more rare commodity, although not necessarily better but something the Rays definitely need more of. I’m still not saying a straight up Trumbo for Hellickson deal would work but he is the type of player that you guys need in terms of production and cost efficiency. it’s not as bad a deal as you make it out to be. Both are still young and coming off their second year. Hellickson is even more affordable which is one of the main reasons he will fetch more than just Trumbo, but as Rays fan you should be considering it.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

One of the better bats in the league? An .808 ops is one of the better bats in the league?

Aron
2 years 9 months ago

Still young and projectable, and plus a pitching friendly park like the Angels stadium can offset some numbers, put him in Yankee stadium and he probably mashes 40 HRs regularly. And even then he had an OPS better than that of A. Gonzalez , Pedroia, Texeira, and many other great players. He just doesn’t walk a lot, and strikes out too much, but those are things that a player can refine with age, unless you’re Adam Dunn.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Not so. Yankee stadium does benefit lefty with pops but not as much to righty.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Comparing the OPS of a 1B and 2B is not the same. He out OPSed Tex by .001. Tex walked way more. He als out OPSed Gonzales by .002.

Trumbo wRC+ -122

This puts him in line with Chris Davis and Goldscmidt.

His wOBA is .346 which puts him below Davis.

Would you seriously accept Davis for Hellickson? I think Davis will actually end up being a better player than Trumbo, but I would not for one second even consider making that trade. Also, just because someone is paid lots of money, it doesn’t mean that they are the best player. Lastly, why the heck would trumbo hit 40 HR in yankee stadium? Did he all of the sudden turn into a left-handed hitter?

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

No it is not! It is an Angel’s fan dream offer. There is no way that the Rays would ever and I mean EVER do a 1-1 for Trumbo.

johnsilver
2 years 9 months ago

Anaheim may not either. We don’t even know if they are really interested.

meanwhile.. Luke Scott is taking warm up swings at the on deck circle while Friedman searches for anyone better to help TB’s offense.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

I think the jury is still out on whether Bourjos remains an everyday outfielder. I could see him starting on a second division team or being a super 4th OF on a contender…but I don’t think he gets Hellickson.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

I would agree in that he is not better than Trumbo, but it depend on what the Rays value more. There is no doubt though that Trumbo would do it.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

I’m not real high on Trumbo long term. He strikes me a as a guy who has a few decent seasons and fades.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

I respectfully disagree. Any baseball person knows the more at-bats one gets the more comfortable they become. Trumbo is not going to be a .330 hitter, but .270-.280 with 30+ HRs is possible.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

Sure…but the more at bats one gets the more pitchers also get comfortable..and the more the bats slows down.

mmiller54
2 years 9 months ago

Just saying, but Bourjos and Trumbo have very different values. Trumbo is probably too much for Hellickson, but Bourjos not enough (likely a part of a package)

Contrarian30
2 years 9 months ago

Hosmer for Hellickson.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

That’s not a bad trade for both, however, I hope the Angels get him.

cubfan4life
2 years 9 months ago

while Hosmer still has a lot of upside he doesnt have the track record i think that it would take a little more for the Rays. Maybe Hosmer and either Collins or Crow?

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

This is why Trumbo would work. They both have 2 yrs of success and fill needs for each side.

rikersbeard
2 years 9 months ago

Stop with the Trumbo suggestion. It is way too off base.

2 years 9 months ago

It’s not really. It’s actually a really good idea. A good starting point, at least.

LazerTown
2 years 9 months ago

Not nearly. Hellickson has proven that he is a capable #2 starter. Trumbo had a good first half this year, and has shown to have good power, but look at that awful OBP. He needs to figure out a way to get that up if he wants a long career.

2 years 9 months ago

you are severely underrating Trumbo. And slightly overrating Hellickson.

LazerTown
2 years 9 months ago

High strikeout corner outfielder with bad obp skills. I’m sure they could work with him to change his approach a bit, but at current time that is all he is.

2 years 9 months ago

He’s a 1b that the Rays need. He is a power hitter. He made adjustments and improved in his 2nd season in the majors. I guess he is what he is CURRENTLY AT THIS MOMENT because it is this moment, but he’s got years of control left, so it’s not just about what he is now. It’s about his potential, also.

James Scheuerman
2 years 9 months ago

Replace Trumbo with Kendrys Morales and a prospect and I think it could happen

2 years 9 months ago

Because Trumbo is too much to give up? Are you giving an Angels point of view here?

LazerTown
2 years 9 months ago

That is even less likely to happen. 4 years of hellickson is worth may more than 2 years of a DH that isn’t all that great.

2 years 9 months ago

If they get a starter, it would have to be one not knocking on the MLB door like Crow (is Crow still a starter? He is in my Show Franchise).

cubfan4life
2 years 9 months ago

Crow would be an 8th inning reliever.

2 years 9 months ago

interesting.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

Hosmer is potentially going to blossom into Joey Votto soon. I’d actually be a little surprised to see him dealt right now.

2 years 9 months ago

I’d be surprised, too, but that’s quite the expectation.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

His performance in 2012 was a little less than expected. I could actually see them dealing Wil Myers…why not go after David Price?

2 years 9 months ago

That would be interesting, but Myers would only be part of a package. But he would be a step in the right direction of the Royals acquiring Price.

cubfan4life
2 years 9 months ago

potentially being the key word. id be surprised to see him dealt. i think the royals would push for TB to take Gordon instead. But if i was TB id push for Hosmer over Gordon.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

I think the Royals need to make a massive push for front end pitching now…I think their offense could contend right now.

2 years 9 months ago

Royals were 12/14 in the AL in runs scored last season. That’s not exactly competing. Rays even scored a few more runs than them, had amazing pitching, and still missed the playoffs.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

I believe that last year was a conservative outlier for a young Royals team. I believe that in 2011 they were one of the better offenses in the AL with essentially the same young team. They should atleast return to where they were…if not improve. There’s no reason they can’t be above .500..and in the AL Central that means contention. If the offense performs and develops…it’s only the pitching that will hold them down. They certainly can muster the offense of an Oakland.

2 years 9 months ago

true. they were 6th in the AL in 2011 and were definitely one of the better offenses in the league.

I think part of my issue with what you are saying is that while I agree they just need pitching, they need pretty much an entire pitching staff, and that’s not a small deal. Maybe in a couple years with the right deals. It would be nice if they could produce a decent starter from their system, too.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

They do need an entire rotation…that’s for sure. I just question if they can muster one from the system in enough time for it to not be a moot point as the young hitters hit free agency. They acquired Ervin Santana and I look for that to be the tip of the iceberg if they get their way during the offseason, but they aren’t in a vacuum. They’d made overtures in the past on Ubaldo Jimenez (questionable now) and Gio Gonzalez (would have been nice)….so I think they’ll dangle prospects to get pitching. They gave up nothing in getting Santana…but did signal that they are willing to spend money in the process.

Red_Line_9
2 years 9 months ago

People tend to get a little prospect giddy. One of the strengths of having a strong farm system is being able to deal prospects when the need arises to acquire talent. Royals are going to break some eggs at some point to build a winner on the KC roster….I’m sure the next Royal winner will be largely farm built…but they are going to have to assess who they can cut ties with to augment the major league roster. Makes no difference how many AA titles the system wins.

stl_cards16
2 years 9 months ago

Gordon has 3/$31.5MM left on his deal with a $12.5MM option for a 4th year. Not really the kind of player the Rays are usually interested in. Doubt his name would even be brought up in talks.

Keith
2 years 9 months ago

Ike Davis for Hellickson…

Lefty_Orioles_Fan
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
2 years 9 months ago

What???? No!
Also, who would play first base for the Royals?
As for me I am a bigger fan of Hosmer than Hellickson despite that Boras is his agent.
Not really a fan of Hellickson.

2 years 9 months ago

Butler?

Contrarian30
2 years 9 months ago

Butler at first even though he is a downgrade definsively. Maybe we could sign Lance Berkman to be our DH.

cubfan4life
2 years 9 months ago

if you were going to bring in a broken down berkman to be a dh and have a sub par 1b in butler why wouldnt you bring in someone like Carlos Pena who is a very good defender to play 1st and can add some power even if he cant hit for average

Contrarian30
2 years 9 months ago

Butler is not bad defensively as he does not have Hosmer’s quickness. Maybe Pena would be a safe alternative. But Berkman still has a potent bat.

cubfan4life
2 years 9 months ago

Id hardly consider a guy who only played 32 games potent

2 years 9 months ago

Pena is losing his ability to play the field at the level he used to play at. He singlehandedly blew a Rodney save by throwing away a ball at the end of a game in Seattle. Awful. His GG days have long been over.

2 years 9 months ago

DONE DEAL! Make it happen, Frieds.

Stoibs
2 years 9 months ago

Only one player that the Royals have that I would ever consider doing a one-for-one with and that would be Wil Myers.

LazerTown
2 years 9 months ago

Not fair. Hellickson has proven himself wheras in 2 years hosmer has not proven he can handle mlb pitching. If thats all royals would throw in they could trade hellickson somewhere that will actually give up a proven player. Hosmer has tons of potential, but has not proven anything in 2 years.

PUDGE4MGR
2 years 9 months ago

Holland and Leonys Martin for Hellickson…

2 years 9 months ago

lol what are they going to do with Holland? Put him in the BP?

Atta_bebe
2 years 9 months ago

In before Rays fans vastly overvalue a meh pitcher.

Paul Shailor
2 years 9 months ago

Hmm, we need a mlbtr poll about what rays starter will be traded, or all 3! I think they will keep hellickson for another year or maybe 2 and let him develop more then deal him at his peak. I personally think they will trade price to texas for profar and prospects.

LightUptheHalo
2 years 9 months ago

I like the poll idea, however, the Price for Profar and prospects not so much.

Paul Shailor
2 years 9 months ago

Yea I have heard Profar is as untouchable as they come, if anything it would probably be olt. However I like the Rays and would rather see them get Profar.

diesel2410
2 years 9 months ago

If the Rays trade Price to Texas, it would be for Andrus AND Olt

Paul Shailor
2 years 9 months ago

The thing is the Rays wouldnt want Andrus, he is what 2nd time arb eligible this time around? They would be in the same situation with Price.

2 years 9 months ago

he actually signed a contract extension through all of his arbitration years and would be cheaper than Price over the next 2-3

2 years 9 months ago

wish the pirates could match up with a trade for him

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Hellickson career numbers: 402.1IP 3.06ERA K/9:6.13 BB/9:3.11
Hellickson’s 2nd half: 14G 78IP 2.54ERA 61K 19BB
Hellickson’s 2012 number: 177IP 3.10ERA K/9:6.31 BB/9:3.00

Granted, his FIP and BABIP are out of the world and sabrematricians cannot not justify Hellickson’s performance. He overcame their predictions 2 consecutive seasons and many articles agreeing whether he is one of those outliers or let’s wait and see. He gives innings and doesn’t give up runs while facing toughest offensive lineups in baseball. That’s enough said.

walnutfalcons
2 years 9 months ago

Jeremy “Matt Cain” Hellickson

Stuart Brown
2 years 9 months ago

His numbers are Matt Cain’s to the extreme. Cain posts ERAs that are .25-.75 less than his FIP. Hellickson posts ERAs that are 1.5+ less than his FIP.

Trequartista
2 years 9 months ago

Also Weaver is. His E-F is close to 1.0 in last two seasons.

sourbob
2 years 9 months ago

In Matt Cain’s “worst” full season in the majors, he put up more WAR than Hellickson has over 70 career starts.

doyers
2 years 9 months ago

maybe the Dodgers can go after him if the asking price for shields is to much.

walnutfalcons
2 years 9 months ago

asking price for Hellickson would likely be as high if not higher than Shields. He is younger, cheaper, and still has upside.

2 years 9 months ago

hopefully

baseballdude
2 years 9 months ago

I would be more than happy to let anibal sanchez walk and trade Nick C. for hellickson if i were the tigers.

rikersbeard
2 years 9 months ago

Not enough.

Ausome7
2 years 9 months ago

Hellickson to the the tigers is just another Porcello with his groundball rate, grant it a better porcello but with two rocks patrolling the corners I would rather have the tigers get Shields if they don’t get Sanchez back.

2 years 9 months ago

Porcello career GB%: 52.3

Hellickson career GB%: 38.2

PRACTICALLY THE SAME GUY!

GrayhawkAZ
2 years 9 months ago

HAHAHHAHAA wow… this is embarassing

EightMileCats
2 years 9 months ago

I wouldn’t do it… Nick C could be a special kind’ve player. And I don’t know that Cabrera will be back after this contract… they’ve gotta pay JV.

SmokeyMcBudd
2 years 9 months ago

Hellickson to Milwaukee for a package of Hunter Morris, Martin Maldonado, and Mark Rogers. Too much or too little? Thoughts?

2 years 9 months ago

meh

Lucas LeMaster
2 years 9 months ago

Value wise it’s close, but with Hart headed for free agency after 2013, I can’t see
them moving Morris. Maybe Gamel, Thornburg, B prospect would work

2 years 9 months ago

that is god awful. Gamel is a bust already and beyond awful. I can’t imagine any team is looking to acquire him in a trade, especially for a good SP. Thornburg seems like a stud, though, but if the Rays are trading Hellickson, it’s because they have too many pitchers at the major league level already, so that wouldn’t address that issue.

2 years 9 months ago

Gamel isn’t a bust or an awful player. He’s just never been given the opportunity to start in the majors, and when he did last year, he had a freak injury that put him on the shelf for the year. Obviously, he isn’t too desirable as a trade chip, but there’s nothing there that says he can’t still be successful as a major leaguer. He just needs a consistent spot in the lineup.

2 years 9 months ago

Gamel has PCL stats written all over him. The Brewers wouldn’t have started McGehee for so long if Gamel was anything worthwhile.

2 years 9 months ago

Wow…

Why would the Brewers replace a guy that hit .301 with 16 homers in 2009 and .285 with 23 hrs, 102 rbi’s in 2010…and was dirt cheap? With those breakout numbers by McGehee, Gamel was switched to first base in 2011 to get acquainted with 1st base to take over for Fielder when he departed.

As it turns out, McGehee struggled in 2011, but Gamel was already being groomed for 1st base. Rather than disrupting their future plans, they let McGehee try to work out his struggles, but he never did. Rather than throwing Gamel in at third base in the middle of a pennant chase and playoff run, they put Jerry Hairston, the solid, veteran presence, at third. Gamel continued to work at first to take over for Prince in 2012.

The simple fact is that Gamel has always been a bench player when brought up to the majors, so he never got consistent at-bats to deliver on his potential. The fact that you are using 240 sporadic at-bats over the course of 5 years as proof that he is a bust is sad.

Please, stick with evaluations of your own team. It’s painfully obvious you don’t the know circumstances surrounding Gamel, and the barriers that blocked him from making the majors.

2 years 9 months ago

awesome story.

2 years 9 months ago

and here’s this: “10/4/2012: Gamel (knee) will likely open next season in a reserve role, Tom Haudricourt of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports.”

He’s already 27. If he’s any good, the Brewers would’ve had him starting already.

2 years 9 months ago

He’ll be in a reserve role because Hart turned out to be a very solid first basemen, and Aoki is a very solid piece in right field. Therefore, a starting spot is once again blocked by proven major league talent. The Brewers offense was tops in the NL last year, and everybody is under contract for next year. Why would they remove anyone from that stellar offense for Gamel?

Give it up, guy. There is nothing wrong with Gamel (other than an injury history); he’s just in a bad situation with the Brewers. They’ve had solid starters blocking him for the past 4 years, and now they have an even better 1st base prospect in Hunter Morris coming up through the minors. He has no place on the team going forward, except in a reserve role. He’s definitely a guy that could flourish with a change of teams and being given consistent playing time.

Sam Mullins
2 years 9 months ago

owned so hard

2 years 9 months ago

Except for the fact that he has only received 240 at bats over 5 years explains why he would be considered a bust.

2 years 9 months ago

I swear, none of you people read. He has been blocked from playing by Casey McGehee (which I detailed above), Prince Fielder, and injury in 2012. Whenever he is called up, he is always used off of the bench; hence, the low at-bat count and bad numbers. There aren’t many young prospects that thrive in bench roles, when they don’t get consistent at-bats.

East Coast Bias
2 years 9 months ago

Royals could be a viable trade partner for Hellickson, but imo, he isn’t going anywhere.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

Hellickson and Shields are drawing interest from the Rays and from what I’ve heard, over 12 teams have expressed interest in RA D i c k e y. This is going to be an interesting offseason.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

If I’m the Rays this offseason, Im holding onto every single one of my top starting pitchers. This core group of starters can easily win a World Series in Tampa. Having Price, Shields, Moore, Hellickson, and others is amazing. You can never have too much pitching. I know offense is a need they need to address, but that can be done by making Moves on the free agent market. This Rays team is LOADED with pitching and if they hold onto their best, this rotation can coast them toward a World Series Championship. I fully believe that.

2 years 9 months ago

Their pitching staff set an AL record for Ks in 2012, and it was completely dominant. The Rays missed the playoffs. There is no such thing as too much pitching, but 2012 proved that there needs to be a halfway decent offense to go along with even a historic pitching staff.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

Sure and that’s why guys like Niemann and Davis would be available for trade. Price, Moore, Shields and Hellickson will carry this team.So valuable

2 years 9 months ago

Okay. I get that, but it’s not what you said earlier. Niemann and Davis probably can’t bring much offense in, though.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

I said they are loaded with pitching and if they hold onto their best, they can coast into the World Series. In no way is that a false statement, especially with Fernando Rodney in the Ninth inning for another year and a healthy Evan Longoria. Their best pitchers in my mind include Price, Shields, Moore, and Hellickson. From there, they have depth at the 5th spot who would be middle of the rotation guys for most teams! With Niemann, Cobb, Davis, Archer. This is the group they can trade from in my opinion. Not the front 4 who are all capable of being Aces. Go for broke and try to win it all with your filthy 1-4 rotation, I think they truly can.

2 years 9 months ago

you said you’d hold onto every single one of their SP. But yeah, I agree they’re on the verge of getting back to the WS.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

In the same way you said Carlos Pena is losing his Gold Glove Caliber defense because of ONE traumatic misplay (give me a break) that you happen to remember… I can not expect you to correctly comprehend what I am writing. And that is sad really. You have a lot to learn.

2 years 9 months ago

Did my comment get taken down where I quoted this guy?

“If I’m the Rays this offseason, Im holding onto every single one of my top starting pitchers.”

Please don’t be condescending, Dan. Take responsibility for your words.

alan104
2 years 9 months ago

Davis will hopefully remain in the bullpen. He wants to go back to starting and might be a decent trade piece.

2 years 9 months ago

They did miss the playoffs, but that is a product of the Orioles defying all of the odds more than anything.

2 years 9 months ago

except your obviously a yankees fan and wouldnt understand that a small market team like the rays cant afford to bring in offense the way NY does. In order to do so they must trade peices.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

I know that it takes pitching to win. I’ve seen it done so many times. Despite being a Yankee fan primarily, I am just a huge baseball fan in General. I would love to see the Rays win the AL East next year. They are loaded.

And Im not asking them to bring in offense the way the Yankees do. You perceiving it that way is your own fault. There are over 200 free agents on this years Market and trade routes to take also. Guys will ultimately find themselves taking 1-2 year deals on a discount. It happens every year. If the Rays wait the Market out and invest in the right players (they did this last year with Pena, Scott, Keppinger, etc) and keep their core pitching in tact. They will be a force. You don’t need to always make the big splash to improve your ballclub.

I’d love to see Jonny Gomes brought back. Think moves along that line.

2 years 9 months ago

Pena and Scott were not the right players, though. That’s a bad way of doing this whole FA thing if you’re a GM with a team that has serious needs like the Rays on offense.

LazerTown
2 years 9 months ago

If I were them I would look into trading shields, keep rest. I don’t think that Price/Hellickson’s value will be all that much lower next offseason, and they get that benefit of an extra year. They need to find the balance between production and trading players for prospects. Kind of like what they did with Garza.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

I could definitely see that happening if a team overpays for Shields.

DerekJeterDan
2 years 9 months ago

The Rays are a few moves away from being a powerhouse next year.

That pitching is fantastic and all they need is a better offense.

2 years 9 months ago

But you don’t recommend any trades?

Jeff Ball
2 years 9 months ago

Hellickson will not be traded. The Rays would not trade a young controllable Starting Pitcher.. Isn’t that what everyone strives to get there hands on? If he were to be traded the Rays would want way to much, as they should in there financial situation.

sourbob
2 years 9 months ago

The thing is, Hellickson’s FIP has been a run and change higher than his ERA the last two seasons. The Rays might prefer to trade him and get value for the pitcher he seems to be from a casual glance to hanging onto him and watching him come back down to earth in their uniform.

Jeff Ball
2 years 9 months ago

He has done it two years now.. He was not been a one season wonder. He also had fantastic results in the minors.. It’s not like he has come out of nowhere. I’m willing to say unless they are blown away with an offer, the Rays will be holding on to Helly.

DerangedAngry Hilbilly
2 years 9 months ago

One would think that following their normal modus operandi, that they would be trying to move Shields for a controlled bat thus freeing up money to try and acquire a second bat in free agency. I don’t see how moving Hellickson(who is cheap) would be in their best interest. He’s been decent, but his walk rate and mediocre K rate aren’t lighting up any leaderboards. (nor is his inability to get out of the 6th inning) IMO, Shields offers the greatest amount of return for the $$$ and talent.

javywoz
2 years 9 months ago

If the Rays end up moving anybody, it would be my prefence that it would be Shields to open up some funds to be more flexible in the market. If Shields (+) is traded for a 1B deal of some sort (Trumbo, Hosmer, Craig), they could use the funds to go after a Napoli (C/1B/DH) or Swisher (1B/RF/DH) in the market.

2 years 9 months ago

cards wont trade craig for hellickson as they have alot of young arms

Jonathunder
2 years 9 months ago

Not a one for one deal, but anyone have thoughts on a deal centered around Shin-Soo Choo for Hellickson?

EightMileCats
2 years 9 months ago

I think the main issue there would be that Choo is just under contact for 1 more year. Then he’s probably in line for a decent pay day. The Rays are gonna want someone younger and under contract for longer.