Details On Angels' Cabrera Offer

I think its known that the Mets dont have the prospects to land a big-time player right now. Most of their prospects are over hyped anyways.

Mets have been in these talks for some time. The idea would be a move to the outfield.

the Mets aren't knew if you are a Met fan. Omar LOVES Cabrera. The Marlins also love Fernando Martinez and were asking for him in every D-Train trade thats why the Mets never got him. If the Mets were to give F-Mart, Pelfrey, Church, Heilman, and 2 more guys they MIGHT be able to get it done.

On a more realistic note what if the Angels included both pitchers, BUT the Marlins also included D-Train I would do that if I was both teams what do you think?

I think the Fish hold on to Dontrelle and see if he rebounds, if not throw him away at the deadline.

The twins are looking for a young, stud third baseman. Maybe the Mets feel they are better off trading for Cabrera and flipping him for Santana. How about Pelfrey, Guerra, Gomez, Anderson Hernandez, and another prospect for Cabrera; then Cabrera and Mulvey for Santana. This way they keep Wright and Reyes and still land Santana.

Mets fans still pushing Heilman as a valuable trade chip?

The mets can throw more young quality into a trade than any other team in baseball. Wright and reyes are both signed long term for cheap, Maine still has 4 years prior to free agency. If omar packaged several guys like gomez, pelfrey, mulvey or martinez along with 1 of these guys, their package would beat anything currently being talked about from the angels. Omar is capable of getting anyone he really wants.

Wow SkiBolton... No it wouldn't. Did you seriously compare the prospects offered by the LA Angels? They are giving them at least two major league already players and a good prospect. Gomez is a good prspect. Pelfrey is major league ready but not like E Santana or their 2nd Baseman. And Mulvey or Martinez is just over hyped...

Wright alone is probably better than the whole package LA has supposedly offered...espescially since he's signed cheap until 2013. Do you honestly think Kendrick is worth more than a guy like reyes? I didn't compare the "prospects" being talked about...I said anyone who thinks the mets don't have the talent to match a deal like the angels are offering is nuts.

@SkiBolton

I think they have the quality if, as you are willing to do, they offer Reyes or Wright. Many Met fans would do Reyes for Santana. The problem is that Omar hasn't budged on his unwillingness to trade those two, which leaves us with the usual suspect 4/5 guy packages.

Angels better not cave.

Marlins can have Kendrick OR a combination of Adenhart and Wood.

To give up Kendrick + Adenhart of Wood is too much.

I don't really see any other great matches right now. Kind of like the Yankees and Twins. Florida will cave, as will Minnesota if the Angels and Yankees stick to their guns.

I like the idea above regarding Uggla. However, it's unclear whether FLA is willing to off-load him. They may want to move him to 3rd and use Kendrick at 2B.

What about Kendrick/Mathis/Santana/Adenhart/Mid-level pitching prospect for Cabrera/Uggla.

The Angels would finally have a sick lineup to surround Vlad and go with their great pitching. Something like...

1. Figgins -- SS
2. Matthews -- LF
3. Vlad -- DH
4. Miggy -- 3B
5. Hunter -- CF
6. Anderson/Rivera -- LF
7. Uggla -- 2B
8. Kotchman -- 1B
9. Napoli -- C

That lineup would actually rival the fire power of NYY and BOS. Maybe not quite there...but close. Dumbass Scoscia will still probably have Miggy involved in hit-and-run bullshit.

No way you bat GMJ 2nd. Kotchman and his .840 OPS and .370+ OBP will bat 2nd if Kendrick is traded.

Figgins
Kotchman
Vlad
Cabrera
Hunter
Rivera
Napoli
Izturis
Matthews

If they were to include Uggla, then Figgins shifts to SS and Uggla takes over SS, leaving Izturis as backup.

Oops, I left out Anderson.

Figgins
Kotchman
Vlad
Cabrera
Hunter
Rivera
Anderson
Napoli
Izturis

With Matthews benched. No way would the Angels want to lose Rivera's production for Matthews.

I think that if the Angels were to want Uggla as part of the deal as well, then they would probably have to part with Brandon Wood, considering the Marlins would need someone to take over at 3B. It'd probably be something like
Angels get: Cabrera and Uggla
Marlins get: Kendrick, Mathis, Adenhart, Willits, Wood

Then instead of playing Uggla at third base, the Marlins would have Wood to play third, which they would probably prefer longterm anyways if he can cut down on the strikeouts

I'm a little surprised the Diamondbacks don't get in on this. A package of Upton, C. Jackson, Montero, Tracy/Callaspo or Alberto Gonzalez, and maybe Nippert/Eveland answers a lot of questions for both teams. Upton is going to be a stud ballplayer and gives the Marlins an up-and-coming superstar in return for Cabrera, who would move to 1B for Arizona (as he will eventually) and Reynolds takes over 3B. It doesn't supply the pitching component the Angels offer does but Upton is a better ballplayer than any they'd be getting from Anaheim. The Diamondbacks have the young talent to tweak the aforementioned offer, and Arizona NEEDS that big bat in the middle of the order.

I'd be fine with Kendrick, Adenhart, Mathis and Willits for Cabrera, but to include Wood in place of Willits just for Uggla wouldn't be a good move on the Angels part.

If the Marlins won't take a "Kendrick, Mathis, Adenhart and a mid level prospect" for Cabrera, why would they take a Kendrick, Mathis, Adenhart and Wood for BOTH Cabrera and Uggla? The addition of Wood in lieu of a mid-level prospect costs them Uggla too? Don't think so.

As for the Diamondbacks not being able to afford Cabrera, well, they're paying Randy Johnson a pretty penny and he'll be off the books before long; Cabrera is a much better investment.

Easy to look at numbers alone without knowing anything else. [including injuries]

Here...let me break it down.

Kendrick had a short 27 AB stint when he was 23 (2006), and he was pressing too hard. He only had 3 hits in 27 ABs. He was sent down. He was recalled later on, and hit around .310 since then that season. So, his first season numbers are skewed because of his short 27 AB stint. Either way, what he did after was impressive for someone that was 23.

Second, Kendrick suffered broken bones in his hand and still managed to hit over .320 for the year in 2007. How many players, who end up with broken bones in their hand, after getting hit not once, but TWICE in the same spot, manage to have that kind of season?
If you remove May, which was the month he returned from his hand injury, he hit over .340 for the season. He hit over .350 since the ASB, which are in line with his minor league numbers.
Look at this:
Kendrick in April: .327/.365/.490
He then got hit in the hand that month and went down with broken bones.
May: .152/.200/.242
This is the month he returned from his hand injury, and he was rusty, understandably.
June: .333/.350/.475
July: .286 batting average in 4 games played, since he got hit in the hand again.
August: .395/.435/.488
September: .340/.353/.470

As you can see there, the month of May brought down his numbers by a lot. That's the same month he returned from having broken bones in his hand.

The guy was injured and still hit over .320 for the season and an .800 OPS.

He was also *23* for the majority of the season!

This is unreal, I was arguing about Howie Kendrick with that LABrooks guy a couple days ago and he was making the same argument. How can you not see the talent in this guy? When everyone else is listing a million reasons why this guy is special, and all you can bring up is his OPS from his age 22 season, then you're probably wrong

I'm not saying the DBacks wouldn't love to have Cabrera, just that they can't afford him.

It would take several of our starting players to get him and his salary would leave us unable to fill any of our pitching depth.

After Webb and Davis our pitching is a huge question mark.

Bottom line is that we don't have the money to improve on both pitching and offense and our prospects on offense are far better than our pitching prospects.

Personally I find Mathis, Kendrick, Adenhart/Santana, and mid level prospect unacceptable for the Marlins.

Acceptable IMO would be:

Willits, Santana, Kendrick, Adenhart

Kendrick, Adenhart, Wood, mid level prospect

or lets add Uggla

Cabrera, Uggla for Wood, Adenhart, Kendrick, Willits, mid-level prospect/Morales/Mathis

If neither of those options is possible I think the Marlins should hold on to Cabrera. Then call teams again close to the trade deadline and see whats up....

Keep dreaming.

Miguel Cabrera is under control for 2 more years! The Marlins don't have to give him up! This is what I see the Angels giving up. Trading Chone Figgins to the Braves for some porspects like Jo-Jo Reyes, Chuck James, Jason Heyword, Jordan Schfaer. Obviously Figgins wouldn't bring in all 4 but maybe 2. Then flip around those prospects for Miguel.

Angels get:
Miguel Cabrera
Dan Uggla

Marlins get:
Jason Heyward/Jordan Schfaer
Jeff Mathis
Howie Kendrick
Nick Adenhart
JoJo/Chuck James

The problem for the Marlins in waiting is that all of the deep pockets/ prospect loaded teams had a potential need for a 3B this year. A-Rod and Lowell going back to their original teams, and Frank McCourt doesn't have the bank account or the good sense to pull this off. Only the Angels remain.

And much of Cabrera's trade value is tied to the fact that he has 2 more years under team control. The closer he gets to being a free-agent, the less value he has.

I suspect the Marlins & Angels will work things out this week.

Jason Heyward/Jordan Schfaer
JoJo/Chuck James are some of the Braves top prospects. The Angels have Erick Aybar and Brandon Wood for their SS position. Figgins would not play at SS. Uggla fills in the 2B hole when you trade Kendrick. Figgins starts in CF for the Braves.

Your not going to have Figgins if you get Cabrera. Trade him to the Braves for prospects. That way your not giving up all your prospects. Plus you get Uggla who hits 30+HRS a year.

How are we not going to have him?

If the Angels trade Kendrick, Adenhart or Santana, Mathis and Willits for Cabrera, that leaves Figgins at 2B, since he can't play 3B anymore.

The only players I'd hurt to see go are Kendrick and Adenhart. Mathis is our backup catcher to a much more talented offensive catcher and Willits is a 4th OF on our team, but he could start for many other teams. He's an OBP machine, although he has zero power.

The Marlins have turned down that offer. You need to trade Figgins to upgrade your prospects. Thats how your not going to have him. Either your going to give up exactly what the Marlins want (Adenhart,Santana,Kendrick,Jeff Mathis)or your going to trade Figgins for prospects then trade them

The Angels don't have to give in, and they won't.

The Marlins also accepted that offer but tried to get more at the last second, according to Arte Moreno. That means they're trying to see if they could get more.

If not, they either A) Hold on to him or B) Accept that package.

If they hold on to him, then they could expect to get even less later on. A player one year away from free agency won't net you the same package as a player that's two years away.

What exactly is Johan Santana going to be getting in return? The Marlins are not going to accept the package. Miguel Cabrera is top 3 hitter in baseball. What are any of those players? Prospects? They might not even turn out to be great like Cabrera.

Have you looked up Jason Heyward or Jordan Schfear?

Yes, but they won't, lol.

"You might not consider them valuable, but people who understand those players (specifically Kendrick and Adenhart) do.

Santana's problem is mental. He's dominant at home, while garbage on the road. That's a mental problem and since he's 24, he could fix it."

Not saying that they are not valuable because they are. Its the way that they are package in the deal that is no so valuable.

If the deal included those 3 together(Santan, Adenhart,Kendrick) as you mention above + a Willits then thats a good and fair deal. But it doesn't. Instead its:

"Mathis is our backup catcher to a much more talented offensive catcher"

+ a mid level prospect

Howie Kendrick can't even spell W-A-L-K

Well his OBP and OPS are barely league average...but he's a "special talent" right?

He's special when compared to the average person playing baseball. Not major league players...just the average guy swinging a bat down at family fun center. However, when compared to MLB players he is the antithesis of "special." He's not especially good or bad. He's exceedingly average!!!

I would trade Kendrick, Adenhart, Wilits, and Mathis. Talk about a good deal for both teams. And mlb1 batting Matthews second makes him better. If you were an Angels fan you would know that Matthews batted above .300 while he batted lead off. Once Figgins, Wilits got hot and Garret Anderson got hurt he was moved down to 5th and 6th. Having him up in the order is good. Kotchman grounds to many balls to second and first it is all he does sometimes.

kbrooks. Average players don't hit .320 in their rookie season or in any season. Average players hit .280 or something lower like a Jay Payton or somebody like that. I know he doesn't walk but which Angel does. And Mike Napoli and Reggie Wilits are the only Angels who do that and they are not that good.

Hah, it's not really worth making a new reply again, so I'll just copy and paste what I wrote previously.