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« Mike Jacobs Pulled From Lineup | Main | Cubs Eyeing Ibanez, Giles, DeJesus »
Marlins, Red Sox, Pirates Talking Manny Trade
12:03am: Baseball Prospectus' Kevin Goldstein believes the Pirates will end up with Stanton, Tucker, and Hermida.
11:21pm: Heyman says there's some prospect haggling but the teams are optimistic a deal will get done. The Marlins and Red Sox seem certain to make a swap, while the Pirates are trying to enhance their part. They are still at risk of being replaced by another club.
Gordon Edes of the Boston Globe thinks a deal may be close, but not done. So we've got journalists on both sides of the fence, but everyone seems optimistic.
10:33pm: The Palm Beach Post says a tentative agreement has been reached, despite Gammons' comments. Here's the deal:
Marlins get: Manny Ramirez, cash, prospect from Red Sox
Red Sox get: Jason Bay, John Grabow
Pirates get: Ryan Tucker, Jeremy Hermida, one prospect from Red Sox, perhaps another prospect from Marlins
10:22pm: More from Gammons. The deal is definitely not done - the Bucs aren't yet satisfied with the players they'd get from Boston for Bay. Nothing has been done in regards to Manny's no-trade or paperwork to the Commissioner's Office.
Gammons expects this to go right down to the wire.
10:11pm: Kovacevic believes Ryan Tucker might end up with the Pirates, though it's tentative.
9:05pm: Gammons: talks will continue into Thursday. Good, it'll give me something to do.
8:50pm: Will Carroll believes the Commissioner's Office has been informed of a Red Sox-Pirates-Marlins trade even though the teams haven't agreed on the prospects. Here's how he sees it:
Marlins get Manny Ramirez, one prospect (BOS), and cash (likely Ramirez’s remaining salary)
Pirates get Jeremy Hermida and three prospects (two FLO, one BOS)
Red Sox get Jason Bay and John Grabow
8:48pm: Perrotto clarifies a bit - Grabow could go to Florida with Stanton joining the Pirates. Interestingly, the Pirates are still talking to the Rays about Bay.
8:29pm: Here's the latest. MLB.com says we're moving closer to the three-team deal. The Pirates could receive a minor leaguer from the Red Sox. Dejan Kovacevic says the Pirates would receive four or more prospects for Bay, as well as Hermida. John Grabow could end up in Boston or Florida. Perrotto says it could be expanded to have Jed Lowrie go to Pittsburgh and Jack Wilson to Boston. The Bucs also like Red Sox prospect Hunter Jones.
7:46pm: Rosenthal talked to a Marlins official who said there's "no way" Stanton is in the deal. The Fish might want young players back if they're giving up prospects.
7:33pm: Gordon Edes of the Boston Globe characterizes it as "strong interest" from the Marlins but not a done deal. Jon Heyman also has the Fish in the lead. Will Carroll has some kind of Bay/Marlins multiteam deal in the final stages. Jim Molony says the talks are real but a Manny to Florida deal is unlikely. Meanwhile, Manny keeps talking his way out of Boston.
7:23pm: Jayson Stark says the Red Sox are trying to get Stanton, Ryan Tucker, and one of Willingham/Hermida for Ramirez.
6:24pm: MLB.com's Joe Frisaro is hearing about a three-way deal that would also send Jason Bay to the Red Sox. Hermida would wind up in Pittsburgh.
5:56pm: Baseball Prospectus' John Perrotto has multiple baseball sources saying the Red Sox are on the verge of sending Ramirez to Florida for three players, including outfielder Mike Stanton. Dan Graziano says Hermida would be in this deal.
MLB.com's Joe Frisaro said his baseball sources aren't dismissing it.
5:31pm: The latest: Buster Olney says the Sox are in "serious conversations" with the Marlins about Ramirez. The Red Sox would kick in money and want three players back, one of whom would probably be Willingham or Hermida. Progress on this is said to be "slow," per Ken Rosenthal's source.
3:24pm: Mike Berardino just can't see the Manny-Marlins thing happening at all. The Marlins remained mum on the topic when Berardino asked, but he cited many reasons why it didn't make sense. Also keep in mind that the Josh Willingham mention was speculation from Ken Rosenthal, not a rumor.
ESPN's Jayson Stark agrees with others saying Manny is staying put. He notes that the rumors could resume into August due to Ramirez's salary. Awesome!
11:22am: ESPN's Andrew Marchand says the deadline for a Manny trade might be 3pm CST today, as he has to sign paperwork 24 hours prior to a deal to waive his no-trade rights. However, it is possible that Ramirez already signed away his no-trade rights for some teams.
9:31am: Ken Rosenthal says Manny is a longshot to be traded. As it was all along. Sounds like the Red Sox will decline his '09 option.
8:24am: Late last night, Will Carroll of Baseball Prospectus had an interesting rumor:
One good source told me that he had heard that the Marlins were involved, willing to give up Jeremy Hermida and Boston-area product Jeff Allison, but I couldn't confirm this. I just don't see this deal getting done.
I imagine the Red Sox would be willing to eat all of Ramirez's salary to get a player like Hermida. As Carroll said, it seems unlikely.
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Has anyone considered that the Sox are eating Manny's 08 salary, while the Pirates obviously won't do the same for Bay, and that the price on Bay may be higher? I mean isn't it possible that the Sox are packaging in some of their own prospects with those they receive from the Marlins to snag Bay?
Posted by: nixa37 | July 30, 2008 at 07:29 PM
"Tucker Stanton and Hermida would be an absurd for 2 month rental."
Manny isn't a rental if the Fish don't want him to be.
Posted by: AA | July 30, 2008 at 07:30 PM
"You really think the Marlins will spend 13 mil on just two players next year? Especially when one is an outfielder. Plus they would have to pay Bay this year."
Yes, why wouldn't they? They can easily field a team paying two players 13m next season and still have a mid-40m payroll.
Also, Loria has already said he's willing to add payroll this season.
Posted by: Nny | July 30, 2008 at 07:33 PM
"Manny isn't a rental if the Fish don't want him to be."
Manny would want the team to decline the options as compensation for waiving his no trade clause.
Posted by: metsfan | July 30, 2008 at 07:33 PM
The Fish could get the Red Sox to cover maybe half of the option. But, I'm sure that would cause Manny to stay put in Boston.
By the way, did anyone see the quote from Manny? "They try to paint it like I'm the bad guy....I love the Boston fans, but the Red Sox do not deserve me." Hate him or love him, the guy is awesome.
Posted by: bravesrule14 | July 30, 2008 at 07:34 PM
Hermida is batting now
Posted by: metsfan | July 30, 2008 at 07:35 PM
I hope this deal goes thru, I'm crossing my fingers, my toes, and if it does ill be singin sweet caroline and doin back flips.
Posted by: elevenahead | July 30, 2008 at 07:36 PM
Bay just singled in two for the Pirates
Posted by: ucfknights | July 30, 2008 at 07:38 PM
I hope this deal goes thru, I'm crossing my fingers, my toes, and if it does ill be singin sweet caroline and celebrate good times...sorry good news always makes me giddy
Posted by: elevenahead | July 30, 2008 at 07:38 PM
I love how julio lugo tried to bail manny out by saying it was all a misunderstanding and unfortunate, then manny flys off the handle with all that stuff he keeps saying, hes shooting his teammates in the feet, thats a new one
Posted by: 04Forever | July 30, 2008 at 07:38 PM
0 respect for anybody who doesnt try. Manny is lazy and i hope for Boston fans he is on his way out
Posted by: cubs land | July 30, 2008 at 07:38 PM
i agree with cubs land at this point, this time he has gone way to far
Posted by: 04Forever | July 30, 2008 at 07:39 PM
It's an absurd haul regardless of what the fish do with Manny.
Thats why Tucker/Hermida/Stanton is incredibly unlikely...
Unless another piece is coming back from Boston.
Posted by: Meoveryouok | July 30, 2008 at 07:40 PM
I hope this deal goes thru, I'm crossing my fingers, my toes, and if it does ill be singin sweet caroline and celebrate good times...sorry good news always makes me giddy
Posted by: elevenahead | July 30, 2008 at 07:43 PM
I dont think the Red Sox will land Bay, unless Pittsburgh gets something else in the deal.
Posted by: yanks26ngoin | July 30, 2008 at 07:46 PM
On the low end, Florida might be getting George Kottaras back in the deal. On the high end - especially if Hermida's in the deal - I'll go *way* out on a limb here and speculate that Clay Buchholz or Justin Masterson goes to Florida in the deal.
Posted by: ColonelTom | July 30, 2008 at 07:47 PM
http://trades.mlblogs.com/
Posted by: lowellfan25 | July 30, 2008 at 07:48 PM
final stages?
Posted by: lowellfan25 | July 30, 2008 at 07:48 PM
You've got to by joking me Tom!??!?!?!? You think that the sox are going to include a hall of famer and a prospect that's better than all three of the ones coming back? I dont think so, but i know Kottaras is on the Bucs radar and that is a possibility to include for Bay.
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 07:49 PM
Well, a Marlins official just denied strongly that Stanton's in the deal, so that takes down the value considerably. If he were in there, the Marlins would have to be getting back a *lot* more than two months of Manny - perhaps one of the two pitchers - to make this deal fly.
Posted by: ColonelTom | July 30, 2008 at 07:53 PM
Well, Manny is still in the game and Josh Beckett apparently forgot that you don't throw fastballs to Garret Anderson, especially in the low 90s.
Posted by: AA | July 30, 2008 at 07:55 PM
The Red Sox look dead to me, i think they need to trade Manny.
Posted by: Kramerica Industries | July 30, 2008 at 08:04 PM
from Devan's blog:
"8:52 p.m.: I am aware of the three-team scenario that has been floated in some circles -- some more definitively than others -- that would get Bay involved in a three-way trade between Boston and Florida that would send Bay to the Red Sox, Manny Ramirez to the Marlins and Jeremy Hermida to the Pirates. But I just spoke with a source in Miami who threw water over the whole thing, even the more commonly reported Ramirez-Florida straight-up suggestions. Waiting for independent confirmation either way."
Posted by: ucfknights | July 30, 2008 at 08:05 PM
Dejan - pardon me
Posted by: ucfknights | July 30, 2008 at 08:06 PM
Trade Manny! For anyone! He's in the heads of the Red Sox... even Youk made an error!
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:06 PM
Im 100% convinced that they NEED to trade Manny.
Posted by: Kramerica Industries | July 30, 2008 at 08:08 PM
This is ridiculous, Sox look absolutely terrible!
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:08 PM
This whole situation is affecting all the players. 2 hits last night. Beckett sucked tonight. This is terrible.
Posted by: ikilledthehobo | July 30, 2008 at 08:13 PM
Bay just hit again
Posted by: ucfknights | July 30, 2008 at 08:14 PM
Maybe the Angels are just that good.
Posted by: metsfan | July 30, 2008 at 08:18 PM
Sox also are talking to the pirates about John Grabow being included in the three way deal-Olney
Posted by: lowellfan25 | July 30, 2008 at 08:20 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=mlb_trade_deadline
Posted by: lowellfan25 | July 30, 2008 at 08:21 PM
If the Pirates aren't getting Mike Stanton back, they need to end talks in this now.
Hermida isn't even as good as Bay, Pirates would get hosed with a three player trade.
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 08:21 PM
Angels are good, but lowell(last night) and youk having errors has nothing to do with that.
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:23 PM
Mike Jacobs was just taken out in a 5-4 game. Were than any teams intrested in him?
Giants mabey?
Posted by: Sal from Tampa | July 30, 2008 at 08:25 PM
"Maybe the Angels are just that good."
Don't tell Athletic Domination that. Our resident "Sabermetric expert" thinks the Angels are a lucky .500 team.
"but lowell(last night) and youk having errors has nothing to do with that."
Neither do they have to do with Manny.
Posted by: AA | July 30, 2008 at 08:25 PM
Mike Jacobs perhaps instead of Stanton...?
Posted by: lowellfan25 | July 30, 2008 at 08:26 PM
Mike Stanton the former Yankee reliever? jk
Posted by: Sal from Tampa | July 30, 2008 at 08:26 PM
I hope the Redsox dont trade Manny. If they trade him for 3 young guys from the Marlins that means that there future is goin to be really bright. Maybe they dont win the world Series thiss year but if they make this deal I could see them win it in a couple of years.
Posted by: yankfan1 | July 30, 2008 at 08:27 PM
Mike Jacobs is Craig Wilson and I would be very mad if we trade Bay and Grabow for him and Hermida.
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 08:28 PM
"The current sticking point, according to a well-placed source, is that the Marlins want the Red Sox to add a prospect to their take in the deal."
They certainly better be. Otherwise they should be cutting Boston out and moving Bay for Hermida and a prospect.
Posted by: Not Joe Morgan | July 30, 2008 at 08:29 PM
Willinhamm and Hermida are still in. So Jacobs probably isn't part of the Red Sox trade.
Posted by: Sal from Tampa | July 30, 2008 at 08:29 PM
(Obviously the wording is flipped there, should be "moving Hermida and a prospect for Bay". Another high five, TypePad.)
Posted by: Not Joe Morgan | July 30, 2008 at 08:30 PM
Im not saying that they do but i am saying that if you were watching the game you'd realize that something isnt right with this team... and it's not the angels being good
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:33 PM
although they are
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:34 PM
"Mike Stanton the former Yankee reliever? jk"
hahahaha thats what i thought at first i was like this trade makes no sense at all. i clicked that link to see who mike stanton was soo fast hahaha
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 08:34 PM
There is a report on SI that the dodgers are willing to give up Kemp... id take that one over this, especially if Stanton isnt involved.
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:37 PM
"There is a report on SI that the dodgers are willing to give up Kemp... id take that one over this, especially if Stanton isnt involved."
If that actually happened, it would probably either include another Boston player or get Colletti fired.
Posted by: AA | July 30, 2008 at 08:40 PM
If it is the less complicted configuration where we give up manny and a triple A player for bay and grabow in return i would definently jump on it. I would like at all possible to hold onto Lowrie instead of Jack wilson who is hitting something like 217 in july
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 08:42 PM
Now Jack Wilson is involved, we are up to what 30 player trade?
Seriously, I would be shocked if anything happens. When more and more names get tossed teams are farther apart then thought to be.
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 08:42 PM
8ball, it really just looks like sloppy play; plus, Lowry did a poor job getting in front of the throw-down. Some of that "Willie-Mays-Hays ole bs."
Manny's comments have cemented his departure and hurt the Sox' bargaining power. They're get $0.70 on the $1. They'll NET Grabow and Bay, pay Manny's team and lose Hanson.
Posted by: borninmainelivinginexile | July 30, 2008 at 08:43 PM
Jacobs is still in the Marlins dugout and was celebrating the runs they just scored
Posted by: ucfknights | July 30, 2008 at 08:44 PM
Manny's up
Posted by: borninmainelivinginexile | July 30, 2008 at 08:45 PM
I bet Manny doesn't go back in the field.
Posted by: eephun | July 30, 2008 at 08:48 PM
http://baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=967
Posted by: ucfknights | July 30, 2008 at 08:52 PM
I just heard some people talking that Jacobs had been traded for Molina. True?
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:52 PM
I called this a miricle trade yesterday in the tuesday blog and now there's actually something to it....
...the sox have the opportunity to get bay, wilson, and grabow???
Goodbye manny, goodbye hunter, good bye jed, and please god good bye hansen.....good night moon.
Posted by: elevenahead | July 30, 2008 at 08:53 PM
I guessed Florida and Dodgers a few days ago. Marlins make a lot of sense if the money is covered.
http://www.rotosavants.com/2008/07/where-can-manny-ramirez-go.html
Posted by: Trizza | July 30, 2008 at 08:55 PM
"I just heard some people talking that Jacobs had been traded for Molina. True?"
which molina?
but if the trade where we get bay and grabow for basically 2 prospects money and manny goes through thatd b a really good pick up for the sox
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 08:56 PM
Bengie
Posted by: magic8ball | July 30, 2008 at 08:58 PM
"I just heard some people talking that Jacobs had been traded for Molina. True?"
Molina is still listed in the starting lineup tonight. Mabey that will change.
Jacobs for Molina.
Thats what I was thinking ealier.
Posted by: Sal from Tampa | July 30, 2008 at 08:59 PM
i was going to say why are teams throwing players at the yankees. i like the yankees picking up pudge though, the pitchers are unfamiliar with him and people like mussina called molina the best catcher theyve played with. they gain some bat but theyll lose that pitching thats been keeping them in games
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 09:03 PM
Wow that is a massive deal...
Hopefully FLA and PIT bled Boston for Top prospects.
Posted by: BraunHolio | July 30, 2008 at 09:04 PM
Everyone get your jason bay red sox tshirt jersey's....
Posted by: elevenahead | July 30, 2008 at 09:06 PM
Damn, I would hate to see the Sox get better.
The Rays haven't been agressive to get a deal done for Bay.
Posted by: Sal from Tampa | July 30, 2008 at 09:08 PM
So. What Gammons says contradicts everything everyone else is saying. I'm going to side with Will Carroll on this one.
Posted by: Paul | July 30, 2008 at 09:09 PM
gammons said nomar wasnt traded in 04 at 4:00 pm and then seconds later he was gone...sorry buy peter doesnt have the best sources
Posted by: lowellfan25 | July 30, 2008 at 09:10 PM
gammons is a reliable source for the most part but i believe this is far more progressed than he thinks.
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 09:12 PM
I wonder who the prospects the Sox have to give would be in this deal.... I like Gammons with the Red Sox rumors.... If this deal goes through, I think Theo did a solid job by getting bullpen help and replacing the bat so they can win now instead of sending Manny away for prospects
Posted by: 9thmanout | July 30, 2008 at 09:24 PM
NESN just reported that Manny left Fenway in street clothes before the clubhouse was even open. Any importance to this? Could be.
Posted by: ikilledthehobo | July 30, 2008 at 09:26 PM
NESN just reported that Manny left Fenway in street clothes before the clubhouse was even open. Any importance to this? Could be."
hopefully hes on his way to get on a plane to florida. i dont really think him leaving in street clothes before everyone means anything its just him being disgruntled again
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 09:28 PM
"Will Carroll of Baseball Prospectus says the Red Sox, Pirates and Marlins have agreed to a three-team Manny Ramirez deal, pending Ramirez waiving his no-trade clause and league approval."
dont know how reliable carroll is but i like what hes reporting
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 09:31 PM
What an unfortunate end to a circus of a career for Manny in Boston. He may be a space cadet but he was our space cadet. I have to believe that Boras had something to do with his transformation from a harmless knucklehead into a teamate slapping, old man pushing, front office bashing jackass who may force his way out of town and kill our hopes for a repeat in '08. If he is in fact traded the Sox are not going to be a better team, period.
Posted by: pedroiaroy07 | July 30, 2008 at 09:32 PM
we pick up the vital relief help we needed, got 8 years younger in left field, found a replacment for him last year and got a similar hitting replacment for the cleanup spot. how is that not a better team?
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 09:36 PM
next year*
Posted by: CSIZZL3 | July 30, 2008 at 09:40 PM
Manny OPS this year .932
Bay OPS this year .900
Plus he can play defense, steal 10-12 bases.
And we get a lefty reliever although his FIP shows he's not as good as his ERA shows.
This deal makes the Sox better.
Posted by: Trizza | July 30, 2008 at 09:41 PM
Love Prospectus but, to be fair, Carroll did blow a Johan to Boston declaration last offseason. Could have been nothing, could have been a sign of bad sources or a guy too eager to jump.
Posted by: Not Joe Morgan | July 30, 2008 at 09:41 PM
NESN just said they don't see the deal happening cause of money involved and Manny waiving his no trade clause.
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 09:42 PM
"NESN just said they don't see the deal happening cause of money involved and Manny waiving his no trade clause."
The same Manny who just said in an interview 3 days ago he'd go and approve a trade to wherever he was wanted, even "if Iraq?"
I don't see the problem for him going to FLA. If they exercise his option, he gets paid big bucks. If they don't, he still gets big bucs on the FA market. I don't see what there is for him to lose.
And you have to consider the source NESN. I don't think the typical Red Sox fan is going to be happy to see Manny go and Jason Bay come because they think Pirates = Suck and Red Sox = Awesome.
I'm curious about the prospects we get from FLA and BOs. Any ideas of who FLA could give us in terms of pitchers? I assume Maybin is off the table and the Sox won't part with Masterson but who else?
Posted by: cactusbix | July 30, 2008 at 09:50 PM
"NESN just said they don't see the deal happening cause of money involved and Manny waiving his no trade clause."
I read another report that makes it sound as if Manny would not have a problem playing in Florida. He lives in Southern Florida in the off season so he would be playing at home. I also don't see money being an issue. Boston wants rid of this headache so they would gladly eat most of the $7 mil. If the deal falls apart it will be over which prospects are involved.
Posted by: Slick | July 30, 2008 at 09:50 PM
That asterisk makes all the difference in the world.
Posted by: pedroiaroy07 | July 30, 2008 at 09:51 PM
Can u imagine my Marlins lineup looking like this???????
Marlins Lineup.
1. SS Hanley Ramirez
2. CF Cody Ross/Alfredo Amezaga/Cameron Maybin
3. 1B Jorge Cantu
4. LF Manny Ramirez
5. C Bengie Molina
6. 2B Dan Uggla
7. RF Josh Willingham
8. 1B Wes Helms
9. Pitcher
My only question is where Willingham will go if we get manny and give away hermida. thoughts?
Pitching:
Volstad
Johnson
Mitre
Miller
Olsen
Sanchez
pick the best 5 and the rest go to the bullpen, we also have sinkbeil and have stanton, hernandez and coghlin in the minors. whoo! :}
Posted by: FLAMarlinsFan | July 30, 2008 at 09:53 PM
They also said, whatever Manny said today should be taken with a grain of salt. He could wake up tomorrow and refuse to waive it.
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 10:02 PM
I hope we take Sinkbeil or Stanton off of you. :)
As for Manny, sure he could change his mind. I don't see why though. If they're trying to ditch him, that means he's probably not getting his option picked up next year. So he's off the team one way or the other.
Posted by: cactusbix | July 30, 2008 at 10:07 PM
someone other than Will Carrol says the deal is all but done:http://www.palmbeachpost.com/marlins/content/sports/epaper/2008/07/30/0730ramirez.html
Posted by: Kramerica Industries | July 30, 2008 at 10:07 PM
Looks like Pittsburgh is getting the following:
Hermida
Jones (BOS)
Correll (FLA)
Tucker (FLA)
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 10:08 PM
If the Sox give up
Manny and two prospects for Bay and Grabow while at the same time paying Manny's salary I will eat my socks.
Posted by: pedroiaroy07 | July 30, 2008 at 10:13 PM
Latest rumor has the Marlins, Pirates and Red Sox combining on a three-way deal, with Manny, Hermida and Jason Bay the primaries.
The Beaver County (Pa.) Times had it first, but now XM radio has come along with a version that has Manny, Pirates lefty John Grabow and $6 million in case coming to the Fish.
Fish would give up Hermida and minor leaguers Hector Correa, a Class A RHP who has made just four starts this year due to injury, and Triple-A OF Jai Miller, which doesn’t seem like nearly enough for what they’re getting back. That, to me, wouldn’t be enough to rent Manny for two months, let alone get a top lefty AND enough money to rebuild Col. Steve Austin.
Then again, Pirates’ talks about Bay with the Rays aren’t dead yet, so this could still collapse.
http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports_baseball_marlins/2008/07/manny-oh-manny.html#comment-124612710
Posted by: russell | July 30, 2008 at 10:22 PM
Tucker and Hermida for Bay is a solid move for the Pirates. Of course, it makes me wonder why the Marlins don't just do that straight up and walk away from Manny and the Red Sox. Boston must be sending something else of value to the Marlins in the deal.
Posted by: ColonelTom | July 30, 2008 at 10:25 PM
Damn right the Pirates aren't satisfied. If pghman and/or russell are accuarate, we're trading away Bay and Grabow for a whole lot of mediocrity.
We should get at least ONE top prospect out of the deal...and no, Hunter doesn't count.
It sounds like the BoSox are not offerring anything in terms of prospects and the Marlins are just offering marginal players. This deal is totally unacceptable.
Hey Neal, it's not about QUANTITY, it's about QUALITY. I'd rather have 2 players if they're Masterson and Hunter rather than 5 scrubs.
Posted by: cactusbix | July 30, 2008 at 10:30 PM
If this gets pulled off, Theo Epstein will go down as possibly the greatest GM of all time. He gets rid of Manny, replaces Manny, and gets lefty bullpen help all in one deal. Talk about killing three birds with one stone.
Posted by: Andrew34 | July 30, 2008 at 10:32 PM
Manny is in the perfect situation with this Trade, And Pittsburgh would be the Winner so I hear that pitt is not done with the Prospects and for that I hope we THE Pirates get a good deal for Bay were in Boston he will be pitched to more with Help, Bay is Better than NADY! Offensively and Defensively.
Posted by: Pirates_pitt25 | July 30, 2008 at 10:34 PM
If the Pirates get back Hermida, Tucker, and Hunter Jones in the deal, that's a very solid return for Bay and Grabow. I'd take Jones for Grabow in a heartbeat, Hermida is a budding star (125 OPS+ at age 23 last year) who hasn't even hit arbitration yet, and Tucker's a potential front-of-the-rotation guy. What's not to like?
Posted by: ColonelTom | July 30, 2008 at 10:42 PM
Pirates are getting hosed.
Posted by: icedrake523 | July 30, 2008 at 10:47 PM
So the sox give up Manny, cash and two prospects for Bay and Grabow?
I don't really like it either, but I suppose they feel pressured.
Posted by: Meoveryouok | July 30, 2008 at 10:48 PM
Pirates are getting hosed... They need to end yalks if they are getting just Hermida and Tucker.
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 10:49 PM
This isnt going to get done...
Posted by: pghman77 | July 30, 2008 at 10:53 PM
ghman & icedrake speak the truth.
On what planet does Hermida and Tucker = Bay? We don't need more OFers and Hermida is far from a "budding star." A budding Xavier Nady perhaps. But that's not what we need.
I have no problem with Tucker but he isn't a "centerpiece" of a trade if that's the BS they're trying to sell.
Red Sox are giving up nothing in Hunter. He's a marginal prospect and a relief pitcher at best. Who needs that? We need starters.
So the Sox think they can get Grabow and Bay and just give up Manny for them? They're getting prospects from the Marlins so they're not actually giving anything up.
Terrible terrible deal for the Pirates. Huntington better get on the phone and demand the Sox pony up a good prospect as well or walk away. This trade will ruin this team.
Posted by: cactusbix | July 30, 2008 at 11:04 PM
If they do this deal the Bucs need to ship Wilson to Boston and get Lowrie too he is the same player except several years younger with lots of upside.
Posted by: BucSox | July 30, 2008 at 11:06 PM
I like Willingham Better Than Hermida. Pitt needs more from the red sox for Bay.
If we get jones for Grabow then who would be good enough for Bay I hope not Hermida even with Corell and tucker.
Posted by: Pirates_pitt25 | July 30, 2008 at 11:09 PM