Sherman On The Mets

Two Words...Juan Rivera. he will come cheap (I believe)and would really shine in left field if given a chance to play everyday...make it happen Omar!

If I were Shapiro, I would offer Bentancourt, Blake and Guiterrez. Blake is a super utility guy who can play corner outfield, Guiterrez can play all outfield spots and Bentancourt was shut down setup man last year.

I agree on Rivera but it's going to cost us either Feliciano or Show and a AA pitcher most likely.

Minaya could get Nady if he really wanted him. However, if he thinks the Pirates are going to give him away he's nuts. The idiot GM was fired last season.

I would take Casey Blake at this point. Considering he is making a lot of money for a last-place team and his contract expires at the end of this season, I think a borderline prospect would get it done. He could spell Wright at third whenever he needs a day off (which is rare - I know), Delgado when he faces a tough lefty, and he could play both corner outfield positions. Seems like a good fit without much of a commitment beyond this year.

And everyone is talking about Nady but I don't understand it. At this point I'm not even sure the Mets have the prospects to get Nady, let alone Jason Bay or Matt Holliday. I guess it's the New York way of thinking too big. Leave Niese and Martinez right where they are, thank you.

"Minaya could get Nady if he really wanted him. However, if he thinks the Pirates are going to give him away he's nuts."

Their GM is still an idiot because he wants the moon for Nady. He's a good player, but he's not a perennial all-star.

"Two Words...Juan Rivera."

When was the last time the Angels traded a player? They want too much and never trade anyone.

"Their GM is still an idiot because he wants the moon for Nady."

Actually I think Huntington is doing a ok job so far with the Pirates. He's doing a lot better than his predecessor who got completely fleeced a couple of years back with Perez. I'm betting right now he's playing hardball but will get a good ready prospect for Nady.

While the Mets should just SIGN BARRY BONDS!!; here is a short list of guys I think are suitable replacements - Lance Berkman, Alexis Rios, and Matt Kemp. I don't want to hear about Nady, Bay, or any other SCRUB out of Pittsburgh. Austin Kearns makes me want to vomit. Ibanez should not be discounted because he's a lefty. I'd rather have someone off my list, but Beltran gave Ibanez his endorsement and Omar shouldn't over look that so easily. Matt Holliday of course is always welcomed. I'd also be very interested in Hunter Pence. Notice the Carlos Lee omission. How would the Mets get the guys I want? Well, you could just sign Bonds, but...

METS GET - AJ Burnett, Alexis Rios

METS GIVE - John Maine, Jon Niese, Mike Carp

LOVE IT!!
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METS GET - Lance Berkman, Jose Valverde

METS GIVE - John Maine, Jon Niese, Mike Carp
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METS GET - Matt Holliday, Ubaldo Jimenez, Manuel Corpas

METS GIVE - John Maine, Jon Niese, Aaron Heilman
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METS GET - Matt Kemp, Jonathan Broxton

METS GIVE - John Maine, Nick Evans

OR THEY COULD JUST SIGN BARRY FLIPPING BONDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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METS GET - Hunter Pence

METS GIVE - Jon Niese, Nick Evans, Ruben Tejada

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Casey Blake still makes the most sense, Right Handed, Can play Corner OF, Contract Year from a last place team, as touched on there is a working relationship with Shapiro.

As for potentially seeing F-Mart and Niese this year, I'm just a bit skeptical on F-Mart's ability to contribute when he is only 19 years old, and unless we move Pedro or Perez, I don't see where Niese would pitch. You're not gonna put him over Feliciano or Schoeneweis in the bullpen. If there's an injury why not give him a shot though.

Casey Blake blows.

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Kherub

Why do you not like John Maine?

I like John Maine, but given our current landscape it does and has made more sense to trade him than retain him in my opinion. Are you saying you wouldn't do any of those deals I proposed?

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I'd also do John Maine for Joey Votto and Homer Bailey....

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Matt Kemp and Jonathan Broxton for John Maine and Mike Carp? When will people stop playing fantasy baseball GM?

I agree that Casey Blake isn't an all-star, but the Mets aren't getting an all-star caliber outfielder like Holliday, Bay, or anyone else like that without trading Martinez or Niese, and that goes without saying that some GMs aren't even interested in those players.

The Mets need someone serviceable ala Blake, or maybe even Randy Winn. I'd take Randy Winn in a heartbeat and put him in left field. The Mets just need an upgrade over Fernando Tatis, who has been a great story and all but certainly won't be batting .290 for the rest of the year, and an insurance option in case Church doesn't recover quickly.

"METS GET - Matt Holliday, Ubaldo Jimenez, Manuel Corpas

METS GIVE - John Maine, Jon Niese, Aaron Heilman"

I'll let the other trades go as mostly wishful thinking especially the Astros trade though the Dodgers one is also laughable. But really this proposal to the Rockies... are you high?

Maine, while good, is NOT an ace, add to it his incredible collapse last year. Niese could be decent but definitely not a can't miss prospect. And Heilman is just an above average reliever. You want to trade all that for a guy who the Rockies are rumored to start the bidding with the Rays at David Price. A talented young Jimenez who projects to be a #3 or #2 pitcher. And a young closer signed with a team friendly contract who has gotten back on track over the last 2 months. Please just try to explain how the Rockies would even BOTHER to entertain this possibility?

Kherub

You are an idiot and are making met fans look stupid. None of those trades will happen.

Mets need some pop out of Left...Winn and Blake don't exactly offer that pop. Blake is an up and down player, and has full flop potential...especially changing leagues. Plus there's no indication he can handle playing in New York. I think you're severely under rating the value of John Maine. A young accomplished pitcher, under contract, and still has potential to get better. Broxton isn't exactly having an all-star campaign, and Kemp is always rumored to be on the move.

The Dodgers wouldn't do it unless they conceded the year though because they're looking for relief as is. I said Evans though, not Carp...they have Loney, they don't need Carp. I would include F-Mart for Holliday if they wanted him. Holliday and Jimenez for Maine, F-Mart, Evans, and Niese? uhh, yeah.

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The Rockies would get 3 top Starters....Maine, Heilman, and Niese would each give the Rockies a chance to win pretty much every time they took the hill. They're not going to get that sort of package from anyone else. No other team could even contend with that offer of return pitching. Sure, Price is better, but the Rays aren't going to do that anyway. Besides, he's just one guy that will at their height of wishes win just 20 games a year for them. Maine, Heilman, and Niese can win them 50 games a year if not more.

The Mets would need to find a set up man somewhere though. The Rockies can keep Corpas; I want Holliday and Jimenez...and I'd include F-Mart with Maine+ to get them. I think that would ultimately interest Colorado pending on the plus...

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Those trades have yet to be bandied about, and I'll concede aren't 'likely' to occur...that by no means makes me or Mets fans look like idiots. YOU WANNA KNOW WHAT MAKES METS FANS LOOK LIKE IDIOTS!!?? PINING OVER SCRUBS LIKE NADY, BAY, BLAKE, DUNN, AND WINN!!! THAT'S WHAT MAKES METS FANS LOOK LIKE IDIOTS!!

THE METS COULD JUST DO THE SMART THING AND SIGN BARRY FN BONDS!!! AND SHOULD!!!

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Some guys on the cheap:

Marlon Byrd- Excellent defensively, has shown offensive ability

Nelson Cruz- Making AAA his personal whipping boy. Plus arm, good speed, putting up monster numbers, and the Rangers have nowhere to put him

Byrd - GARBAGE!!!

Cruz - GARBAGE!!!

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Word is that the only way that the Rockies would trade Holliday to the Mets would be for Beltran and Gutierrez. While the Rockies also give up Torrealba and Taveras.

I'm just thinking realistic, as most other Mets fans are. You are looking at trading for Matt Holliday when it'll take a bounty from any team just to get his services until the end of next season and it's a bounty that the Mets don't even have. This guy should have been the MVP last year and he's following that up with another .340 campaign. And since the Mets are amidst a fantastic pitching run, you want to deplete their pitching staff by trading our #2 starter? Good idea...

You have to think realistic about what prospects the Mets have and by not getting rid of Martinez or Niese, their two best prospects at the moment. Randy Winn makes sense because you could slide him into the #2 hole behind Reyes, he has speed and 30-stolen base and .300 hitting potential, he has a good glove, and he's a switch-hitter. But most importantly, he wouldn't cost an arm and a leg and he definitely wouldn't jeopardize the run that the Mets are having at the moment by messing around with the roster. Again, the stupid Mets fans are the ones playing fantasy baseball GM and that are thinking the Mets are going to get all-stars with the junky farm system they have.

That word is egregiously incorrect. Sounds like a yankay media driven story trying to include Beltran's name in trade talks...totally ridiculous. The Rockies will likely move Holliday, and it will not be for a guy with a contract like Beltran's....totally ridiculous.

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I hate to see Kherub here. He has been spamming Mets.com for years now. He is like the Mets version of BaseballGuru. Best to just ignore him. That is all I have to say on that matter.

I agree with the first poster. Juan Rivera, but the funny thing is, when this was suggested in another thread, it was called stupid and Omar was once again accused of only going after hispanic guys even if they stink. The same people who say this drool over the though of gettin Xavier Nady. So my question is, do you take the guy having a down year with the bottomed out value right now, or the extremely similar hitter (in terms of production) who will most likely never have value higher then it is now at any point in his career? Juan Rivera is probably a slightly better offensive player then Nady, but I can see it now. Mets trade 2 pretty good prospects for Nady, fans rejoice, are happy as can be. Omar trades a couple of low level no-name guys to LAA and brings in Rivera, people moan and complain, say Omar will bring in any Latino guy, whether he can play the game or not. Picking up Juan Rivera while his value is low would be an oustanding move for any team. Bringing in Nady right now, while his value is way up, would probably be a pretty bad move for any team. There is my 2 cents on that.

Believe me, I'm not hocking Byrd and/or Cruz as anything special. But if the Mets decide Bay/Nady/Holliday/etc. are too expensive and F-Mart isn't ready, then they may look to get a guy like Byrd/Cruz on the cheap.

"The Rockies would get 3 top Starters....Maine, Heilman, and Niese would each give the Rockies a chance to win pretty much every time they took the hill."

Maine in his first full year of pitching last year was hammered in the second half. Niese has yet to throw an inning in the majors, let alone start and still is not a can't miss prospect. Heilman hasn't started since 05. So where on earth are you getting this "winning 50 games between them" thing?

Even if you include Martinez, it won't get Holliday, Jimenez, and Corpas for one simple reason you're forgetting. Jimenez and Corpas are staying put, no matter what. They are part of the next 5 years of the Rockies. This isn't a formula where I add in more players and I can get more out.

As for your calling your own Mets fans idiots, it always amazes me that that fans from big market teams believe they need a star from any trade or a star is needed to save the team. The fact of the matter is this: Nady is putting up some damn good numbers with the Pirates and was a respectable hitter when he was a Met; Bay's .918 OPS makes him faaaaar from a scrub. All the Mets really need is a small piece.

If John Maine is the Mets number 2 starter, it seems to me like he'd have a greater trade value than you're currently giving him credit for. Randy Winn is signed through next year, and makes a ton of money. I have zero interest in Randy Winn.

If the Mets got back Jimenez in the deal, the Mets wouldn't need Maine. Maine, F-Mart, Niese, and Evans for Holliday and Jiminez...lovely.

Let's revisit Burnett and Rios for Maine, Niese, and Carp. I REALLY Like this deal...a Lot! If the Mets trotted out Santana, Pelfrey, Perez, and Burnett in a post season series...lol, it's Over. Mets win. Rios fills a variety of team needs. He fits in perfect, and after signing that big contract only has 4 home runs in almost 400 at-bats. I think the Blue Jays eat this trade up.

1)SS - Jose Reyes
2)RF - Ryan Church
3)3B - David Wright
4)CF - Carlos Beltran
5)LF - Alexis Rios
6)1B - Carlos Delgado
7)2B - Damien Easley
8)C -

that line-up is raw...and the pitching...forget about it...

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I hate to see nrmax88 here...he is constantly hitting on me, and it's often rather uncomfortable...

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If the Mets go "cheap"...why not just sign an available player out there for the minimum contract...by the name of BARRY BONDS!!! SIGN BARRY FN BONDS!!

Ibanez is the least player that's acceptable here, and they better get him for a Luis Castillo type of deal...I'd also like to supplement an Ibanez acquisition with a Bill Hall one...I want Barry Bonds though.

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Guys, please listen to me, and just don't bother with Kherub. At Mets.com he has been doing this for years. Although Heilman hasn't started in years, Kherub just talks about him as if he is a legit ace pitcher. Last year he cooked upp all sorts of ways to trade Shawn Green for all stars. He is a troll in the truest sense, and there is no reason to even try to debate with him. He says Bay stinks, and Winn can't help, it is silly. Of course Winn can help. He is not old (33), and not the type of player that will decline very fast, not relying on power for his game. He can play LF which is needed, bat 2nd, which is also needed right now, switch hits, which is nice, and because the Giants want to dump salary you could probably get him for next to nothing. You pay him 8 mil for next year, then part ways and F-Mart takes over in 2010. Not a horrible idea at all. But again, Kherub is nothing but a troll and nothing can really be gained by even trying to debate reasonably with him. I would assume that he would probably be banned within a couple of weeks.

The Mets need to Win. That's the bottom line. An impact bat greater enhances those chances. Plain and simple I want to win. I want an impact bat. Nady is NOT an impact bat. I don't care if he's having the season of his life; I don't trust in him the way I would a guy who's done it before.

John Maine pitched almost 200 innings last year, had almost a K per inning, won 15 games, and had a 3.91 ERA in his first full year as a starter. This after pitching extremely well in the post season establishing himself as a big game pitcher. He's on pace to better his numbers across the board this year, and will likely do so again next year, and the year after as well. He's under contract, and amidst all this retains signability. You better believe this guy's trade value is a whole lot more than you're currently giving him credit for.

Aaron Heilman in my opinion is a sub 3.50 ERA, 15+ Win guy. Actually I think he's a tick better than Maine as a Starter, but stupid Willie Randolph robbed Heilman of his rightful chance. As for Niese...the kid is gold. Young lefty with plus stuff? Are you kidding me?

I think the Rockies will make a deal that will be best for the club with out parameters. If that includes Jimenez along with Holliday to the Mets they'll surely do so. To suggest otherwise seems bias.

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Nrmax88...just out of curiosity what do you get by saying those things about me? I'm just a fan that likes to talk baseball...I really don't understand what your vantage point is....

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Because I spent a lot of wasted hours trying to reasonably debate baseball with you at Mets.com and is just was not worth it. You are too stubborn and you seem to think of your opinions as facts and although I agree with you on some things, you are impossible to debate with because you will continually insist on things like Heilman being a top starting pitcher, which he may or may not be if he started, but it is irrelevant because other teams do not see him as such. I am just trying to save others some time before the try to reasonably debate with you.

Uhh, if I continue insist something and you continually refuted it....wouldn't that be the same as you continuing to insist that you were right, and making YOU impossible to reasonably debate with?

I wouldn't have to continue to emphasize my points if you didn't continue to insist they were wrong...which they weren't....

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to*

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I don't like Jason Bay. At all.

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SIGN BARRY BONDS!!

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ANGELS GET - Jose Reyes, David Wright

ANGELS GIVE - Garrett Anderson, GMJ, Eric Aybar, Macier Izturis
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This trade makes tons of sense.

Garrett Anderson was an all-star several years ago. He rattled off many 100+ RBI seasons.

GMJ would shore up the outfield. He makes great catches over the wall. The Mets need more over the wall catchers.

Eric Aybar would replace Jose Clubhouse Cancer Reyes. He is much cheaper giving the Mets more payroll flexibility.

Macier Izturis also comes much cheaper than David Wright. David Wright is so over-rated. The Mets totally collapsed last year when he played 3rd base. The Angels did not collapse when Macier Izturis played 3rd base.

All the Angel players, sans Aybar, have playoff experience. This counts for much more than stats or actual performance. They have intangibles. Plus I project Aybar to hit 350, knock out 40 HR's, and steal 60 bases. That's much better than what Jose Reyes can do.

Finally 4 > 2 - The Mets come out ahead because they are receiving 4 players. The Angels are only getting two.
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It's fun pretending to be Kherub.

Jose Reyes and David Wright are worth more than the entire Angels team + Mike Scioscia...

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I don't like Jason Bay. At all.

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Why, Kherub? What did he sleep with your sister or something? Outside of his 2007 season, in which he played on a bum knee, he has been a model of consistency and is one of the best OF in the game ranking in the top 10 in the MLB (for OF) in OPS and runs created every year since 2005. In 2004 he had .908 OPS and was ROY. He plays avg. to good defense, runs the bases well and has an affordable contact that runs through 2009. Again, what's not to like? When you factor in Holidays home/road splits Bay is clearly the better player. It's not like PNC was built for right handed power hitters either.

METS GET - The entire N.L. all-star team

METS GIVE - Carlos Delgado, Fernando Tatis for teams to fight over for Omar Minaya's amusement.

Kherub is the biggest tool I have ever seen on this board. Is there any New York (AL or NL) fan out there that can legitimately comprehend what the value of their players are and make a reasonable trade proposal? I'm finding it incredibly hard to believe that one such person exists.