Heyman's Latest: Sabathia, Manny, Lowe

Well, that officially takes the Phillies out of the Lowe sweepstakes. The day they offer 5yr/$90MM to a pitcher is the day the world will end.

And when did Derek Lowe become a #1 starter? boy...

Manny admires the dollar.

BREAKING NEWS!!

"Manny Ramirez "admires the dollar." Just letting you know."

Manny needed a new slogan since the "Gas is up, so am I." thing really doesn't apply anymore!

Lowe pitches 200+ innings, posts an ERA right around 3.50. Posted an ERA+ of 131 last year.

That's a #1 starter for most teams in baseball.

That said, no way is he worth 5/90. A 4/60 deal is more likely.

The White Sox are not the mystery team for C.C. No way they dish that much and for that many years for a pitcher. I'm not against it, though.

5/90 will not happen....5/80 might...

oh and if Lowe ever gets 5/90

what on God's green earth will:

Lincecum, Cain, Hamels, Lester, Billingsley, Lackey etc going to be worth.

How underpaid is Halladay now if he gets this???

Wonder what the other two competing owners for the Cubs think? Hard to see the Cubs cutting the budget at this point. Holding steady would be more like it. Any serious bidder for the Cubs has to be familiar with the fans and cutting budget right now, even in a poor economy, wouldn't be that wise. Get this close and then start making it harder for yourself, not the way a new owner should want to introduce himself to the Cubs Nation.

I doubt the Cubs will cut any budget for 2009, new owner or not. What they have is in place. If a new owner comes in and the first or second order of business is to cut salary, that sends a nice message to fans whom they want to show they are 'in it to win it'. The end of 2009 could be different as some contracts come off the books. I'm sure they do cut budget. It makes sound business sense. But not so loud and all at once. Again, there are ways of handling it and they have smarter people than I that know what they are doing.

Hendry will have to clear some salary this offseason. It will be interesting the next few weeks and approaching the July deadline.

anything over 4 years for any pitcher is dumb
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Like Daisuke's deal for 6 year deal with Boston?

just kidding with you...no need to attack. :)

Wouldn't the Yanks be going after the same player Boston is coveting in Tex? Didn't Boston have one of THEE biggest ego's in sports with Man-NY and won 2 ws champs? Pedroia, Youks, Ortiz don't have ego's? DO you really think Arod and Tex wouldn't give 100% and put individual egos aside to finally win a title. C'mon dude. As a Yanks fan I would say that ego's were the last thing that have kept the Yanks from winning another title. More like lack of pitching and timely hitting.

Yanksfans all you hear about is the need for CC Sabathia, Burnett or Lowe, and maybe a 3rd tier starter if they don't pay Pettite...where or where is the timely hitting going to be fixed?

Hoping on Cano or maybe a partially healthy Posada who had the best year in his contract year 2 years ago?

Bosox87:

There is ZERO, absolutely ZERO, point in arguing with YanksFan about the Yankees.

Frankly I'm shocked he hasn't started in with his "Red Sucks" bull**** yet.

You might as well attempt to convince the ocean to stop being so wet.

IN ANSWER TO HALLADAY.... I would envision 5 years 110 maybe 115.

"Derek Lowe is looking for $90MM over five years. He wants at least five years; ten teams are after him."

Ten teams are willing to go 18x5...what recession.

LOWE IS THE BEST F.A PITCHER AVAILABLE.......PERIORD

Kenan and Kel:

Just because I address stupid, biased comments doesn't make me a homer. I have no problem saying that, as constructed, the Yanks are maybe the 3rd best team in baseball. But to say that a team won't win because of too many egos is a stupid comment. Every athlete has an ego. You mean to tell me that coming off of 2 ws title in 5 years that Boston doesn't have a bit of an ego? Do you really think that regardless of all the accolades, etc that Arod led team doesn't want to win because of ego?

Make better comments based on facts, numbers and a thought out arguement not just I hate all things "white and blue w/ pinstripes". Go look at history. You don't think great Yankee teams from the past didn't have multiple stars w/ huge ego's as well?

Doesn't Lee have a NTC meaning he'd have to approve any trade (and might need extra incentive to do so)?

Marquis has a 100 ERA+ over the past 2 years with the Cubs. He's been solid and better than everyone is complaining about. He is set to make 9.875M this year, but if the Cubs were to eat 3M of that, especially with the current markets for pitchers, Marquis could be a solid #4 on many pitching staffs.

As for trading Lee, PLEASE stop talking about this. He makes 26M in the next two years, which is probably right in line with his current production. He does not have a high trade value. The real issue, however, is that we DONT have a backup 1B for Lee if we move him.

For all you people saying to start Hoffpauir, learn from mistakes of the past. He's a 29 year old AAA player for a reason...

The reason I say learn from the past is 2004 Neifi Perez:

62 AB .371/.400/.548/.948 OPS+ 140

2008 Hoffpauir:

73 AB .342/.400/.534/.934 OPA+ 137

Perez then went on to gain Dusty's love, and followed up those first 63 AB with an OPS+ of 64... I can't believe you people are watching the same thing unfold and you're already calling for shipping out Lee. If you don't learn, history will repeat itself...

The #'s seem to show that NL ERA is about .75 lower than in the AL over the past few years, plus the Dodgers stadium is very favorable towards pitchers (similar to the A's). Those are the things that scare me more than anything with Lowe in the AL East.

Can any Dodger fans say what they feel about possibly losing Lowe? Do you care at all? How did you view Lowe...big game guy or innings-eater?

bdlugz wrote:
Yanksfan,

Your team as currently constructed doesn't have a pitching staff. See what you do on the FA market before you start calling yourself the 3rd best team in baseball, when you're struggling to be the 3rd best team in your division.

Also, to say that too many egos cannot break a team you have no idea what it takes to win in baseball. Chemistry is one of the most important pieces in all of the game. You can pay $200M+ to get above average players at every position, but if they dont mesh well you just end up with the Yankees.

Egos and chemistry play a HUGE role in making a working team.
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Excuse me. I mean to write the 3rd best team in the AL EAST (I thought that was infered but I should have made that clearer).

And that should have read "meant to write".

bdlugz wrote:

Also, to say that too many egos cannot break a team you have no idea what it takes to win in baseball.
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Every athlete has an ego. If you have 9 star players and they all work together for a common goal (winning a championship) vs a team with a "Man-NY" and a Randy Johnson (I actually like him as a player) and 7 role players then who stands a better chance at winning? Ego's aren't a problem. Ego's attached to bad personalities w/ selfish intent are the problem.

CMM:

I agree with you. Look at the 2004 Boston team:

Man-NY, Schilling, Lowe, Youks, Ortiz, Pedro, Tek, etc. A lot of colorful players, a lot of egos and a very diverse locker room. WHy did they play so well together? Chemistry? Or were they a group of talented individuals who put their personal interests aside and focused on a common goal?

If chemistry were as important as they say then that would infer that Man-NY, previous to 2008, wasn't a clubhouse cancer as some would say. In fact he was probably the same person as before but in 08 his motivations were different than previous years (winning a title vs wanting his option picked up and then ultimately to get out of Boston). The Yanks haven't won since 2000 because a lack of pitching talent and not enough athleticism at key positions.

"Or were they a group of talented individuals who put their personal interests aside and focused on a common goal?"

That is chemistry, the ability to put your ego aside and play as a team.

That is chemistry.

Kenan and Kel:

Do you realize you're making my point for me? How many stars a team has isn't the issue. It's the personalities of the stars and what their intentions are in their hearts.

The intentions in their hearts?

Come on and get over this crap. These guys have played basebal for 25 years. This is their job. They don't care about chemistry. They do their jobs and try to win. The sportswriters all talk about chemistry and what's in their hearts. It is a crock.

Dunn doesn't have the passion for baseball. Really? He is pretty damn good for a guy who has no passion. Comments like that are a distraction from reality. Teams win or lose on talent and execution, not because of how well they get along. Teams that win always manage to get along and teams that suck seem to always have a malcontent or two...why is that? Because chemistry is a result of perfromance, rather than being a cause of performance.

If what is in their hearts had anything to do with performance, there would be a whole lot of different people playing in MLB.

CMM:

I'm not sure if you're directing the statements to me. The statement the other guy made said that if the Yanks picked up CC, Tex, etc that it would effect the team and keep them from winning because of too many egos. I said that the number of stars a team has means nothing. All athletes have egos. It's the abiility to put self-interests aside and play for one common goal. Chemistry comes when everybody's on the same page. I don't think there was a big difference between the 2004 and 2005 Boston teams. Man-NY was the same player those years as he was in 2008. The difference in 2008 was that maybe Man-NY was a distraction but it's not like his distraction kept them from winning or anything. At the end of the day the team with the most talent, stays healthy and plays with the most concerted effort wins.

LOWE IS THE BEST F.A PITCHER AVAILABLE.......PERIORD

haha. are you kidding me? Did you not see CC carry the Brewers on his back? They don't sniff the playoffs without him. And he was their most clutch hitter when he pitched too. I saw several games on MLB.com and he would be at like 110 pitches in the 8th and they'd leave him in and he'd get a double.

Don't get me wrong, Lowe is good, very good, but he's NOT a #1. He's a #2 on a good team, a number one on an average one.

Put him on:

Mets--he's 2 to Santana
Phils--he's 2 to Hamels
Braves--he's 1 or 1a to Hudson (when healthy)
Marlins he's 1 (I could argue Nolasco but won't)
Nationals he's 1

Cubs--he's 2 or 3 to Dempster and Harden
Milwaukee-he's 3 to Sabbathia and Sheets
Houston--he's 2 to Oswalt
Cincinatti- he's 1 or 1a to Volquez
Pittsburgh-he's 1

Dodgers--he's 1a or 2 to Billingsley
Arizona-he's 3 to Webb and Haren
SF-he's 2 or 3 to Lincecum and Cain
SD-he's 2 to Peavy

NYY--he's 1a or 2 to Mussina
TB-he's 1 or 1a to Shields
Bos-he's 3 to Daiske and Lester and 4 if Beckett was healthy
Balt-he's their 1
Toronto-he's at best 2-2a behind halladay right with Burnett
CWS-he's 1 or 1a with Danks
Minn-he's 1 but he's 2 if Liriano is healthy
DET-he's 1
Cle--he's 2 behind Lee
KC-he's 1 just ahead of Greinke
LAA-he could easily be considered 3 behind Santana and Saunders
Sea-he's 1 just ahead of King Felix
Oak-he's 2 behind Duchscherer
Tex-he's easily the 1

So by my count (feel free to bash it) he's a solid ace on
a total of 6 major league teams and at minimum a 2 on 13 teams.

And Boras wants someone to give him 5 years and 90 million? Boy he sure better be working on that "book" for him because no one should buy that non-fiction.

Zambrano is either the second or third best pitcher, depending on what Dempster does this year. If Harden and Dempster repeat 2008, then Zambrano is the 3rd pitcher. He is a nutjob towards the end of the year. This is coming from a lifelong Cubs fan, too.

I can't see anyone paying that kind of money for Lowe with the exception of the Yanks. Lowe was number three on the 04 Sox and he was in his prime years. They couldn't get it done in 03 and had to go get Schill for 04. There is no way Lowe is considered the best at anything especially not at his age. It's a little funny to me that he has a few good years in the NL and is being called the best.

If the Sox could get a good deal on Lowe or Sheets I say go for it. But that seems unlikely. Burnett can find his money somewhere else, same for C.C. Good deal or no deal. I would rather take my chances with Masterson/Buchholz/Bowden in the 4 spot then pay one of these guys crazy money.