DeRosa Traded To Indians

LOL!!!!!

The Cubs have trimmed roughly "$9MM from the 2009 payroll with their recent moves. Coming in: $3.5MM for Luis Vizcaino (plus another million sent in salary relief) and $2.2MM for Aaron Miles. Going out: $5.5MM for DeRosa and $9.875MM for Jason Marquis."

$9mil sounds about right for what it will cost to get Bradley or any other LH bat.

"The Indians announced this afternoon at 1:30 that they have acquired infielder Mark DeRosa from the Chicago Cubs for minor-league pitchers Jeff Stevens, Chris Archer and John Gaub."

For those interested, none of these guys is listed by BA as being any of the the Indians top 10 prospects.

Stevens(25) in half a season at AAA; 29.2 IP 3.94 ERA 19H 44k's.

Archer (20) in low A; 115 IP 4.29 ERA 92 H 84 BB( yikes) and 106 K's

Gaub (24 at start on '09) in low A; 3.38 ERA 64IP 44H 100K's, pretty good peripherals but he ws kinda old (23) for low A ball.

Not sure if there is any difference maker here and only Stevens appears to be close to the bigs. With regards to a potential pads deal, i dunno. Seems the money was cleared to make room for Bradley more than anything else.

"That's exactly my point. It also doesn't give them the prospects Towers was wanted either."

They had a deal in place. Towers obviously had the prospects he wanted since he PROPOSED the deal, and Hendry turned DOWN the deal. The deal was turned down by Hendry because he did not want to pay all of Marquis contract. The Cubs have now dumped Marquis contract, along with most likely none of the players in the original deal outside of Marquis, and have instead acquired young pitching. I would assume Towers would value this young pitching more than Marquis.

?

"It's referring to a deal they were both discussing, which got stopped because Hendry did not want to eat all of Marquis contract. It was very close. Are you having problems comprehending this, and how?"

Yes I am, because you've put more spin on it than FOX News. You said the Cubs deal was good enough (in a round about way) but this comment PROVES you wrong. Towers did not accept Hendry's deal, he went out and re-worked it and Hendry turned down his deal. Seriously alice, wake up.

CubFanForLife:

It was also reported many, many times, that Hendry had to dump Marquis' salary and maybe another salary (Dero) to take Peavy.

Adding an $85 mil pitcher with elbow problems to a team with bad defense at 2b, ss, rf, and lf, and no offense at 2b/ss/cf is not the answer.

Throw in the high odds that Bradley doesn't even get 400 ab's and this is a bad day by Hendry.

The best answer was keeping Dero and signing Abreu, who Olney says is starting to realize he may have to take a 1 year deal.

1 year of Abreu is far better than signing Bradley.

And let's not forget that Hendry changes course at 2b constantly. We had a lefty 2b in Walker in 2006, but Hendry wanted power at 2b in 2007, so he signed Derosa. In 2008 he wanted a lefty 2b, and he spent all off season trying to trade for Roberts, but Derosa responds with 87 rbi. But Hendry wants a lefty 2b again, so he will sacrifice 50-60 rbi per year to add Miles. It makes no sense.

"Yes I am, because you've put more spin on it than FOX News. You said the Cubs deal was good enough (in a round about way) but this comment PROVES you wrong. Towers did not accept Hendry's deal, he went out and re-worked it and Hendry turned down his deal. Seriously alice, wake up."

Which means there is clearly the prospects there to make the deal happen, since Towers proposed a deal that worked for him. The hanging point rested largely on $$ in Towers counter-offer. It no longer does. This isn't rocket science.

Yours is Adam Kennedy. Cubs win. (Cuuuuuubs win)

"HAHAHA Miles is your starting 2B"

I'd say platooning him and .900 OPS Fontenot isn't too bad of an idea.

Oh yeah, who is your starting 2nd basemen? Adam Kennedy, the guy who is so bad, he demands traded and they can't even do that because he has negitive value??? Lets not even talk about your SS...closer etc.

"Of course you can't see it, because you have no idea what kind of payroll room they have. It's obvious Hendry has more to work with than what's previously been reported. The previous reports on the Cubs budget is absolutely ridiculous considering it would be impossible to know with the team being up for sale."

Couldnt disagree more. Tim has posted a few posts on this topic and the cubs being maxed out. These deals look like it was necessary in order to free up $$$ for the LH bat alone.

"And let's not forget that Hendry changes course at 2b constantly."

I agree with you there. I have never seen a GM that has moved more at 2B than Hendry.

Teetz1,

How is it "obvious" Hendry has more payroll room to work with than what's being reported?

They have balked at the contract demands of Abreu and Ibanez and gone after Bradley because he's cheaper, asking for less money and fewer years.

hemingways,

Signing Abreu over Bradley would be incredibly stupid. Abreu's value wins the past 3 years:

3.3
2.2
1.1

You spotting a trend? Meanwhile, Bradley posted 3.7 wins last year. A combination of Milton Bradley and Micah Hoffpauir is probably worth a full 3 wins over Bobby Abreu.

"Apparently it is for you since you fail to remember the Cubs didn't have the prospects he wanted, it required 2 other teams! That hasn't changed."

Indeed. We were including DeRosa to get those prospects. We have now traded DeRosa for prospects. If there was a better deal out there in this four team trade for DeRosa, don't you think we would have made it instead of this one? So we just acquired what we could at the most for DeRosa, which happens to be young pitching, which happens to be what the Padres were looking for from us.

But yes, I'm sure it's a huge ridiculous stretch to imagine that such a thing happening would be forecasting a Peavy deal. Hendry probably just wanted to dump a starter off of a playoff team to pick up minor league depth, you're right.

"Of course if you do make the playoffs Miles will probly have more RBIs in teh 8 hole than Soriano Lee and Ramirez! lol"

You have made such an accurate representation of every Cardinal fan I know, it's a beautiful thing.

When I heard this news literally 3 minutes ago I was pissed. Then, I thought we signed Aaron Miles, plantoon partner with Fotenot #2 guys in the line up. Theriot will be the lead off guy. Marquis and DeRosa are gone which Tim said trimmed payroll. Then someone said with Gathright and Miles in CF and infield, Cedeno and Pie are probably gone and going into a package gor someone. Jake Peavy? Maybe. Oh also with Vizcaino now we have another set up guy with Gregg with Marmol closing. This what I think what the roster will look like.

SP- Carlos Zambrano
SP- Ryan Dempster
SP- Ted Lilly
SP- Rich Harden
SP- Marshall/ Samardzija/ Peavy ( would be #1 then)

SS- Ryan Theriot
2B- Mike Fontenot/ Aaron Miles
1B- Derrek Lee
3B- Aramis Ramirez
LF- Alsonso Soriano
RF- Milton Bradley
C- Geovany Soto
CF- Kosuke Fukudome

I've heard rumors that Cubs new ownership could be settled sometime in Jan.

Was Marquis traded?

Ryan Theriot- .307
Mike Fontenot- .305
Aaron Miles- .317

Good top the order guys

the cubs would give up ANYONE on the team for Hanley Ramirez...theres only about 5 players in baseball you wouldn't trade for a cheap very young, best shortstop in baseball

Cyyoung-
well not yet pending physicals

anyone have any numbers on DeRosa's defense at 2nd?

Miles is ok as a super utility guy, just be expecting average to sub par defense.

Cardinals have better defensive options for a utility middle infielder...so if he works for the Cubs, good for him and them. Just don't expect huge things from him; he is a good role player, but not much more.

It's odd that the Indians woul trade for DeRosa who's going to be 34 and a FA after the 09 season. Guess they'll move Cabrera to SS and Peralta to 3rd.

If memory serves me correctly, the cubs did not pull the trigger on Peavy because the wanted to save "what payroll room they had left" for a lefty bat. With the Marquis dump and the DeRo trade, they should have enough to grab both Peavy and Bradley... just my opinion

Cubbies trade off one of the better clutch hitters they have off to get some pieces that they *hope* can convince the Padres will convince Towers to cough up Peavy (since they have zilcho of interest otherwise) and meanwhile, strip themselves of the heart of the team that was currently fielded in the past season and won the NL Central? Have the Cubs lost there collective minds?

Only thing missing now is for Anaheim or Atlanta now to swoop in and make Towers the correct and finish off this madness.

"So we just acquired what we could at the most for DeRosa, which happens to be young pitching, which happens to be what the Padres were looking for from us."

Actually you are mistaking young pitching for "major league ready" pitching, which is what Towers REALLY wanted ( i.e Marshall, which Hendry refused to do). With the exception of Stevens, the other 2 guys arent major league ready. And dare I say that none of these guys is a better prospect, major league ready than Ceda, who ( I think dumbly) was traded for Gregg. No doubt this was about salary dumping and building some depth, but connecting the dots to Peavy again? Dont see it, not with the prospects( or lack thereof) and ownership issues which still wont be decided till some time around spring training.

"It's odd that the Indians woul trade for DeRosa who's going to be 34 and a FA after the 09 season. Guess they'll move Cabrera to SS and Peralta to 3rd."

Don't forget they picked up Valbuena from Seattle, and view him as a very ML ready 2B. I think this is just a one year stopgap to let him develop a bit before handing him the job. I forgot all about him, but I have little doubt DeRosa plays 2B now with Peralta moving to 3B and Cabrera to SS, since Valbuena was projected to play 2B soon.

"Actually you are mistaking young pitching for "major league ready" pitching, which is what Towers REALLY wanted ( i.e Marshall, which Hendry refused to do). With the exception of Stevens, the other 2 guys arent major league ready. And dare I say that none of these guys is a better prospect, major league ready than Ceda, who ( I think dumbly) was traded for Gregg. No doubt this was about salary dumping and building some depth, but connecting the dots to Peavy again? Dont see it, not with the prospects( or lack thereof) and ownership issues which still wont be decided till some time around spring training."

They have enough money for Bradley now with the Marquis deal. They don't need to dump anymore salary unless it was to make another trade. So it's not a salary dump just to clear space. I don't see how this points to anything other than an immediate deal somewhere else once this is finalized.

Will people PLEASE stop saying that the Cubs ownership situation is going to prevent them from making deals, signing FAs, or adding payroll? Hendry and Crane Kenney have said MULTIPLE times that they have the flexibility to add payroll, and Sam Zell allows Kenney to operate the Cubs pretty much however he wants. New ownership won't be in place till around opening day and if you think the Cubs are just going to sit on their hands waiting for someone to buy the team, you're nuts.

As an Indians fan I hated seeing them trade away Casey Blake this past season. He could play many different positions, was a fan favorite and a good clubhouse guy. I'm hearing the same things about DeRosa so i'm really happy about this trade even if we only have him for one year.

Clearly, both of these trades hurt the Cubs, we gave up our fifth starter who's averaged 13 wins the last 5 years and a versatile 80 rbi guy and only got miles/viscaino in return which won't help much next year.

These were salary dumps, so the only way it makes sense is if Hendry has a deal worked out for Peavy already and is just waiting for new ownership approval.

I see a blockbuster coming. I think the Orioles still want Pie and are waiting for a Pie - Olson trade. Could the Cubs be back in on Roberts?

Cubs Get Peavy, Roberts
Orioles Get Pie, Miles, Marshall, Hart
Padres Get Olson, Gaub, Archer, Cedeno, Vitters

Just thinking this would be great.

Mtzxc: Anyone is ALWAYS available from the Marlins for the right price. They're the Marlins. Hate to say it but it's true.

HA here we go:

Roberts
Lee
Ramirez
Bradley
Soriano
Soto
Fontenot
Theriot

Peavy
Z
Dempster
Lilly
Harden

Cubsfan23 you might be right on that? I sent it and then was thinking maybe not.

Substitute Mike "little Babe Ruth" Fontenot for Miles.

LOL

This is quite the impressive scheme the cubs are pulling off here. They trade DeRosa to Cleveland for prospects. Then they sign Miles to take DeRosa's place. And finally they use the prospects they've aquired from Cleveland plus their prospects to trade for Peavy...not bad I must say.

iowacubs: sure, he COULD be had for the right price, but that right price would be one hell of a package. Something starting with Soto and Vitters. The Marlins would have ALL of the leverage...

I really don't understand the Orioles supposed fascination with Pie, unless Macphail really loves him from his Chicago days. If I'm Towers, I want AT LEAST Marshall and Vitters, plus two other major league ready players. I still don't see the Cubs having what it takes to get it done, I think this was just a salary move to get Bradley.

"And finally they use the prospects they've aquired from Cleveland plus their prospects to trade for Peavy...not bad I must say."

Pretty presumptous considering we dont even know if Towers likes any of these guys. Are any of these guys even considered top Indian prospects? According to Baseball America, they are not even in the top 10. Are any of these guys better than the pitching prospects better than what the cubs were supposed to be offering at the winter meetings? I dont see how the "prospect" think changes with this deal. Im still not sure they have the money, ownership approval for any Peavy deal.

"Pretty presumptous considering we dont even know if Towers likes any of these guys. Are any of these guys even considered top Indian prospects? According to Baseball America, they are not even in the top 10. Are any of these guys better than the pitching prospects better than what the cubs were supposed to be offering at the winter meetings? I dont see how the "prospect" think changes with this deal. Im still not sure they have the money, ownership approval for any Peavy deal."

My take is that one or two would be replacing Marquis in the deal Towers proposed, and yes, I'd take Stevens over Marquis.

A Peavy trade is possible before and now. But I still dont see it happening. None of the pitchers that were acquired in this deal are what the Padres were reportedly looking for. Which was young controllable major league ready pitching. I could be wrong. But its still a move that allow the cubs to take on Peavy's salary.

Personally I think the Padres are going to still ask for the moon, and they haven't changed that. And it will depend on if the cubs are willing to part with Marshall or not.

"A Peavy trade is possible before and now. But I still dont see it happening. None of the pitchers that were acquired in this deal are what the Padres were reportedly looking for. Which was young controllable major league ready pitching. I could be wrong. But its still a move that allow the cubs to take on Peavy's salary."

Have to disagree, I think Stevens is exactly that, young major league ready pitching that hasn't had a day of service time yet. I think the Cubs will come off Marshall when it comes down to it, but I think the Padres would love Stevens in their bullpen.

The point of signing Miles was to play second base. To take DeRosa's spot. I don't see them getting Roberts out of this. But the cubs needed more prospects in the Peavy deal and now they have them. Maybe the cubs and Towers planned this all out from the beginning...don't know...

If the Padres wanted any of these prospects from the Indians, wouldn't they have traded for them themselves? They could have easily traded Kouzmanoff for some of the Indians young pitching... I'm not buying this as a precursor to Peavy.

because the Padres need to dump Peavy's contract, and he has a full ntc

How about making everyone happy?

Cubs get Peavy and Roberts, so many stars!
Padres get stuff
Orioles get Pie who has been their whacking materiel for years and finally..... my Rays get Bradley

All parties down for this?

Come on, folks, get a clue: this means Bradley plus a likely trade coming with Padres and/or Os.

I like DeRo, but these recent moves, and the one(s) that will follow, make sense. DeRo had a very good bat and leadership but was scary defensively (yes he could play multiple positions subpar), bats righthanded and has high current value in the last year of his contract. And he couldn't lay down a bunt--just like Cedeno who can't lay down a bunt (and thankfully will soon be gone).

Now we have a guys (Miles) who can back up Font, switch hits, plays defense and lay down a bunt. To the earlier poster, the Cubs don't need him to hit a home run anyway.

I kinda of like Stevens, but I'm guessing he won't be a Cub for long...

"Have to disagree, I think Stevens is exactly that, young major league ready pitching that hasn't had a day of service time yet."

I dont see it. Looking at his peripherals and his age, I dont see this guy as any different than Kevin Hart. Im not buying that some guy who hasnt pitched in the majors let alone a full season in AAA is a guy who all of the sudden gets the Peavy deal done. And again, at the point of sounding redundant, Stevens has never been labeled by either Prospectus or America as being one of the Indians' top pitching guys, not even cracking Top 10 ever. Hes a nice prospect, but come on, we are talking about a guy who will probably be a nice 7th, 8th inning guy. I dont see this changing anything with regards to prospects. Yes the cubs have a little minorleague depth, but come on, from the pads perspective, does anything change? Wheres the "arm" difference maker in this deal that Towers wants? Again, I think its more a deal of quantity than quality. Didnt work last time, dont see it happening now.

I think KT will be more inclined to move Peavy at the deadline where the playoff race always ups the ante and the possibility that more losing in SD makes Peavy a little more liberal in who he might wnat to waive his NTC for. And before someone comes on here saying "Towers HAS to move Peavy", no he doesnt. Its been reported here numerous times that KT can keep him to start the season. Would he like to move him
? Of course. But hes not gonna take a lesser package just to appease Peavy. I think that is one thing we can take from the winter meetings. KT is gonna get what he considers good value.

Oh well, nextgm if YOU don't see the Pads or O's wanting them, then that must be the truth. LOL

From what ive been hearing these prospects they've got from Cleveland aren't that special, so lets say they're not going to use these prospects for Peavy, then what was the point of dumping DeRosa for Miles?