Mets Lose Lowe; What's Next?

this i think is the perfect idea, i just need someone to let me know how much you think sheets and perez will cost.

sign perez and sheets to 3+yr deals

Santana
Sheets
Perez
Pelfrey
Maine

(just looking at that rotation gives me the chills)

have Redding pitch in Sheet's spot every now and then so Sheets isnt overused wich lessens the possibilty of injury. also, depending on how redding does, you can start him against the phillies whenever. i say use redding as a fill in for a pitcher thats feeling sore and 5 days just isnt enough....

that is the only move i can think of that will keep the mets better than the rivalry

i think they'll take the contract they offered to lowe and offer it to perez. sheets they should wait on because i don't think he's gotten any offers up to this point, i could be wrong. then when the brewers make their lowball offer they can just pull a yankee signing.

Id say that if the Mets dont get Perez at a reasonable price they should give Sheets a look. Sure the injuries blah blah blah. He still managed to pitch 31 games last year which seems to be a decent amount (didnt johan throw 34 last year) for a pitcher who is injured alot. He is high risk, but extremely high reward if he remains healthy. Id give him one year, with a second option year for around 8-10/yr. Imagine how stacked the Mets rotation would be if you had Santana and a healthy Sheets at 1-2, followed by an ace in the making Pelf, Maine and Redding/Neise. Those three at the top of the rotation would be one of the toughest teams to beat in the playoffs. I say forget ollie and go for Sheets. Even if he's injured half the year he'll still throw as many innings as Jekyl/Hyde (O.P)

and if your able to land them 10/yr you under 2mill with a nasty rotation....

Signing both Perez and Sheets is a bit of a redundant move. They have similar types of value, lots of risk and very high upside. Sheets is even more extreme than Ollie, but he's also shown his upside is ace-level.

Honestly, if you're going to go with Sheets, I'd just look for a better #5 type veteran than Redding. Get a one year deal on Wolfe or try to convince Pettitte to skip on over to Queens. That would be well within the budget room the Mets have left, and even if Redding can't pitch out of the bullpen, I don't think Omar's going to cry over $2.25 million.

Also, on the Mets budget: I understand why they don't want to overspend this offseason. They don't have THAT many raises this year, but they have a TON text year: K-Rod, Wright, Reyes, Santana all have raises locked into their contracts, Putz' option is a big raise, and then you have the arb cases for Maine, Pelfrey, Church, and Green. That's going to add up folks, and even after Wagner and Delgado come off the books, the Mets are going to be left in the same payroll range next offseason that they'll go into this regular season with and they won't have a 1B or LF, and may need a #5 pitcher and who knows what else.

"sampsonite, reasons for mets not to sign both? they pretty much addressed all that they needed this offseason?"

What MEddler said. Perez is inconsistent, and Sheets is injury prone. It would be a HUGE gamble.

And for Meddler, after the 09 season...

- $12M - Delgado
- $10.5M - Wagner
- $5M - Schneider
- $3M - Tatis/Anderson
- $2.5M - Castro

+ $3M - K-Rod
+ $3M - Reyes
+ $2.5M - Wright
+ $1M - Santana

= whatever the 2009 Payroll is minus ~$23M

I didn't include Putz in either category because I'm pretty sure what the Mets are going to do is exercise his $8.5M option and then trade him. I know Putz is great and everything, but $8.5M is a ridiculous salary for a setup man I don't care how good he is.

After the 09 season the Mets will need a LF, 1B and C. The 1B and C markets look to be incredibly weak next offseason, so I think the Mets with platoon Murphy and Evans there (assuming they progress the way the Mets hope), trade Putz for a catcher and sign a FA outfielder (most likely Nady. The Yankees will need a LF after the 09 season as well so you might as well put Matt Holliday in pinstripes now).

i def understand where you guys are coming from, but dont you think that santana, perez, pelfrey, maine, redding/niese will just put up the same numbers as last year? and i know they werent bad numbers at all and the pen blew a lot of saves but if i had something close to a garauntee with all injuries aside, im pretty sure thats as close as it gets. its worth going 5-7mill over payroll.

how much is the pay raise to K-Rod, Wright, Reyes, Santana?

thanks for the numbers sampsonite. all is sounding pretty good right now with sheets n perez....haha

HAHA mets fans, you still wont make it to your bullpen to finish a game out.Better hope you score more than 5 runs before the 6th inning 4 out of 5 games.

if the rangers drop the ball and lose out on sheets, all while pissing off their star player (outside hamilton), i really am going to lose faith. maybe nolan will take over as ad interim gm until daniels learns some people skills. actually, if he does learn people skills, i want someone else.

If he burns the Mets and signs elsewhere I'd love to see him go to the AL and watch his ERA skyrocket to 5.00+.

Now the Mets have to sign Perez.

Derek Lowe would've been a nice fit but I can understand why the Mets didn't want to go the 4 years.

However, I feel that the Mets have taken this thing way too slowly. If this is Omar's plan of trying to wait for pitchers to come to him then it just came back to bite him. Did he really think Lowe and Perez would fight against each other for a spot on the Mets? Sometimes you just have to sit down and compromise, like what the Braves did with Lowe.

I think Omar has to at least say he's in it for Sheets so he has some leverage with Perez. Because Boras knows that with Lowe gone, the Mets don't have any other viable option.

After two collapses, he was doing pretty well this offseason. However if he fails to resign Perez or Sheets, then the Rotation -- not the bullpen-- will be the reason for collapse part 3.

For somebody who's team just won a world series, you don't seem to enjoy it much. All you do is bask in the Mets failure, instead of in your own team's success. You are in every Mets post spewing your worst case scenario Mets suck shtick. Poor fella.

Since the Phils are so left handed heavy, wouldn't it make sense that you would rather see the Mets bring in Lowe instead of Perez? You just said you would much prefer facing K-Rod or Putz to Wagner, so wouldn't you rather face the right handed Lowe then Perez? It is true what they say I guess. Philly fans and even the players have a big time inferiority complex. You just win the world series, but instead of being happy, you just take shots at the Mets. Even Jimmy Rollins is so obsessed with the Mets that he had to mention Johan Santana at the world series parade! Really? Enjoy your world series, but even more so, enjoy falling back into mediocrity in the sports world up in Philly, where you have been forever, and where you belong. Hope you had a pleasant vacation to up to relevantville, come back in another 80 years or so.

I think the mets keep perez and not do anything else major this off season. last year their problem was they had a horrible bullpen. they fixed that. they also upgraded over Pedro by getting Redding. yes Redding isnt as dominant as Pedro when healthy but Pedro has declined dramatically and probally will keep declining.

i personally think if they only sign perez they will be good. if someone is injured they have that Niese fellow who can step in and be pretty solid.

they actually could use a couple of bullpen arms since from what i recall no one in their bullpen was of any good.

so i say sign Cordero, and maybe a few other guys to just kinda shore up that bullpen. prob throw neise in there. other wise your kind of screwed if one of your starters does well but only gets through 5 innings cause of pitch counts getting worked then who comes in for innings 6 and 7?

I don't like headlines like this. The Mets didn't "lose Lowe" because in order to lose something, you have to have had it in the first place. Lowe was never theirs. Just like you can't say the Sox lost Tex. I guess you can say they missed out on him. Maybe I'm just kinda picky with wording...

If you really look at it the Mets had a pretty poor offseason compared to everyone else.

So what that they got a 8th and 9th guy, How are you going to get the them?

Im not bashing, Im just being realistic.

Minaya hasnt done too much to get the team better at all and I think losing on Lowe was a big deal.

1. You dont have a catcher
2. Whos playing left or right?
3. Addressing your rotation by adding Redding, Seriously? Hes pitched of 170 inning only twice in 7 years.
4. Castillo still at second?

"K-Rod vs Wagner = Even
Putz (if healthy) is a nice bridge to K-Rod."

That is hardly even. Unless one believes K-Rod will be out on the DL for 1/3 of the season the way Wagner was.

K-Rod and Putz represent a huge addition for a team whose achilles heel was the bullpen and which blew 29 saves last season.

Assuming Omar signs either Ollie or Sheets, I think he'll have had an excellent winter. It's clear the Mets were not enamored of Lowe as they never courted him the way they did some of their other recent free agent acquisitions.

I keep thinking, why hasn't the Brewers made an offer for their once number 1 guy? He must have issues with his arm. Speculating, but something is wrong here.

i think this would be a scary good rotation, and switch Redding with Sheets since he is injury prone....but still good when healthy...GET THIS DONE MINAYA

I think that if we picked up sheets and Perez we would be comparing our rotation to the Cubs.

Zambrano Sheets
Lilly = Perez
Dempster = Pelfrey
Marshall? < Maine

Posted by: Fish&Mets | January 13, 2009 at 11:53 PM

Where do you leave R. Harden?

"Sheets hasn't proven durability beyond what should be required to give him the kind of cash he's going to ask for. Garland has a proven ability to both stay healthy AND eat innings, both of which the Mets are in dire need of."

Garland eats innings, but they are below average innings. One could argue that a better manager would pull Garland when he begins to get hit, thus removing his "innings eater" label. At least the innings Sheets gives you are top quality, ACE level. Garland is probably looking for at least $8M a year, while Sheets wants probably $12M a year. Sheets is still worth that extra $4M per season, injury risk and all.

As a devout BRAVES fan, I like the METS pitching rotation.....I think when we play each other, the game will be more interesting.... I don't think Sheets is as washed up as everyone thinks he is and I do believe if indeed the METS do sign him, the would give you guys a pitching edge if he can be penciled in at the 5(this guy is a certified Braves killer when healthy)The season still has yet to unfold so............Go BRAVES!!!!!!!!!!!

"Mets may be good enough for the wild-card, because the Brewers got worse, so did the Cardinals and Astros."

And so did the Phillies. Downgrade in LF, lose Romero for 50 games, and Utley for 2 months. That, coupled with the theory that with JJ Putz and K-Rod, the Mets probably won't be blowing 26 saves again this year, more then makes up for the 3 games you won the division by.

Posted by: nrmax88 | January 14, 2009 at 01:10 AM

Ibanez is a downgrade in LF???
Prove that please....
ALL the stats says he's a better hitter AND he won't be playing just 7 innings per game like Burrell did.

Romero will be replaced by Happ. Happ is very good or we could still sign someone, there are at least 4 lefties still available.

Utley is way ahead of schedule, some talks that he may even be close by opening day... at MOST, we lose him for the 1st month...

Giles and Donald will fight for his spot if he starts the year on the DL. Rumors have it that we may also sign Garciaparra.

Our rotation is better than last year. Our hitters are better.

Phillies are and shall be the "Team to Beat" as long as we hold the titles... Hey, at least I gave the Mets Kudos as I chose them to win the wild-card!!!

Its not saying the Mets suck, everyone knows they don't... they just aren't Championship level yet.

Lowe would have been a HUGE addition, but the lowball offer prolly cost you him. Omar blew that one. Now you have to settle for the leftovers.

As far as Redding goes... really? Okay.

Omar please please sign Sheets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"FyreKnight, you are right about Ibanez being an upgrade in LF; he is a much more consistent hitter and fielder than Burrell. But the injury to Utley will cost the Phillies. Marcus Giles hasn't been good in a long time. And there is always the possibility that Utley coems back to early and reinjures himself. J.C. Romero was terrific last season and his absense for the first third of the season will be felt. And how has your rotation gotten better? Moyer is another year older; do you consider Chan Ho Park as an upgrade? He most likely will not even be in the rotation. Yes the mets missed out on lowe, but who wants to be paying someone 15 million dollars when they turn 40? You fail to acknowledge that the mets did significantly improve their bullpen with putz and k-rod. With all that said, the phillies still are the team to beat, simply because they are the World Series champions; but i'm not so sure that they are the best team."

You said this very well. The Phils are the team to beat, not necessarily the best team in the east. The only place I disagree is that I still think Burrell is a better hitter then Ibanez, and he just fit better as a RH bat. As for defense, Ibanez is hardly Carl Crawford out there.

You can go back and forth as to who is the overall better hitter, but don't forget how Burrell mashed and drew walks from lefties during games where the rest of the team was barely getting hits. Ibanez isn't going to replace that.

I like Sheets, but if I have to choose one between him and Ollie, I will take Ollie. He is just younger and more durable. The walks will drop at some point, and his success will rise. Those 2 things are completely intertwined. Less walks, better production. That is the one thing holding Ollie back from stardom.

"I like Sheets, but if I have to choose one between him and Ollie, I will take Ollie. He is just younger and more durable. The walks will drop at some point, and his success will rise. Those 2 things are completely intertwined. Less walks, better production. That is the one thing holding Ollie back from stardom."

I agree with taking another chance on Ollie, but not for $14mil/yr. For that kind of money I want some overall numbers that support the investment. Last year he wasn't an innings eater, he didn't have an impressively low ERA, and he walked a lot of guys.

I feel like if you're going to pay that kind of money, something should be guaranteed. Ollie didn't guarantee anything last year. He was just a erratic hurler with an upside. Pitchers with an upside should be $10mil/year tops IMHO.

sean green will be a lot more than a long reliever; he will likely be a more important part of the bullpen than sanchez.

I like the Idea of Ollie and Sheets... Basically if it happend, Minayas actually aknowledging that theres been a problem the last two years and is stopping it...

Depth in the Rotation is what we need, just like in the bullpen. Last year we had what 5 different people in the number 5 slot... Neise, Figeuroa, Knight to name the ones i can remember....

Sheets to a 1-2year deal and Ollie to 3-4 year deal with Redding as long relief and taking over when someone goes down seems to me like it is a great plan to prevent us from struggling to find a pitcher...

And theres always Neise incase 2 people go down...