Pitching Links: Edwin, Marlins, Saunders, Felix

Here's the latest on the arms race from around the majors…

  • Edwin Jackson and John Danks have comparable numbers over the last three years, which is why Mike Axisa of the River Ave Blues blog thinks Scott Boras will use Danks' recent extension with the White Sox as a model for Jackson in free agency.  "Now I know hearing five years and $65M+ for Jackson is a little wacky, just because he [doesn't] come off as the type of pitcher deserving of that kind of commitment…but I refuse to bet against Boras," Axisa writes.
  • "Anytime you hear a pitcher's name, you can safely say the Marlins are in," a National League source tells Clark Spencer of the Miami HeraldMatt Garza, Roy Oswalt, Wandy Rodriguez and Joe Saunders are all mentioned as possibilities for the Fish, though if the Marlins didn't have the minor league talent to acquire Gio Gonzalez and Mat Latos, it's hard to see them being able to deal for Garza.  Rodriguez is a possibility since I'd guess Houston's larger concern is getting his salary off the books rather than obtaining a large haul of prospects.
  • Speaking of Saunders, he talked to Nick Piecoro of the Arizona Republic about the negotiations between he and the Diamondbacks.  Arizona offered Saunders a two-year, $12MM deal and Saunders' camp countered with a three-year, $27MM deal.  The D'Backs never made a counter, and though Saunders said he then offered to take a two-year contract worth around $16MM, the club non-tendered him and moved on.  I've got to side with the D'Backs in this case — with the rest of their rotation so cost-controlled, if you're going to splurge on a starter, you can spend your money on a better pitcher than Saunders (perhaps Hiroki Kuroda).
  • The Mariners not only shouldn't trade Felix Hernandez, argues Shannon Drayer of ESPN 710 Seattle, but if the team absolutely feels the need to swap a starter, they should deal Michael Pineda instead.  Dreyer calls Pineda "replaceable…There is a very good chance that by the end of next season Danny Hultzen could be Michael Pineda on the hill in regards to development, path, and what he brings to the rotation."
  • Kevin Goldstein of ESPN (Insider subscription required) presented 10 Major League scouts and executives with a field of Matt Garza, Zack Greinke, Ian Kennedy, Ricky Nolasco and Justin Verlander and asked the question, "Based on talent alone, would you take Yu Darvish ahead of this pitcher?"  Aside from the Verlander comparison, Rangers fans will heartily enjoy the other answers.


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80 Comments on "Pitching Links: Edwin, Marlins, Saunders, Felix"


3 years 8 months ago

I guess you proof-read Mike’s latest post, but Mike just…

3 years 8 months ago

I wonder what a package for Pineda might need to look like.

Encarnacion's Parrot
3 years 8 months ago

Pretty godlike, though his away splits definitely show that Safeco helped him out. If he gets traded, it’s more likely to happen at the trade deadline, IMO.

3 years 8 months ago

I can’t see Pineda being moved this season. Neither side would know what they truly have. I’d say it’ll either be him or Felix moved next winter.

m4r1n3r
3 years 8 months ago

It would have to be pretty significant. He has insane stuff. I don’t want the M’s to get rid of him. If they were to move him now they might not get as much value. Another solid season in the AL under his belt and his value will be sky high… Like Felix Hernandez type of value.

3 years 8 months ago

lol he had a great season, but he has a ways to go before being near Felix’s value.

m4r1n3r
3 years 8 months ago

The League kinda figured him out but for a rookie he was showing ‘ace like’ stuff. For a while it seemed like he WAS the ace of the pitching staff. I love Felix but Pineda deserves props for his first season in the Majors. Like I said. If he can do it again AND improve next season he will be worth a LOT more than he is now.

3 years 8 months ago

No doubt. Which is why they shouldn’t trade him (if at all) until his value is higher in a year or two.
I got to see his very first start this season when the M’s came to Texas. It was an awesome game (Pineda v. Ogando). Both guys making their first starts and they both looked amazing. I’d give Pineda the leg up obviously for only giving up 3 runs in a 3-2 game against our line-up.

Kingmojo101
3 years 8 months ago

if yankess were to do it, it would be dellin batances,austin romine and ramiro pena.

Snoochies8
3 years 8 months ago

and Jesus Montero

Kingmojo101
3 years 8 months ago

doubt they will trade 2 catchers i might even add nunez or gardner

notsureifsrs
3 years 8 months ago

there’s only one catcher in that package

nictonjr
3 years 8 months ago

Pass on Betances.  His walk rate is way too high.  Seattle wants/needs offense…

Wes Whitenack
3 years 8 months ago

Well looking at what Gio Gonzalez got, as an M’s fan, you’d assume it would be quite a large haul, which is pretty excited to see what we would get. Plus with Hultzen, Paxton and Walker in the wings, our pitching depth is solid.

tommyhilfigure
3 years 8 months ago

rangers should trade dervish 4 lincecum or cane

John McFadin
3 years 8 months ago

Someone please respond to this serious post.

Encarnacion's Parrot
3 years 8 months ago

They won the bidding for Dervish? Awesome! Jays still have a chance for Darvish!

3 years 8 months ago

haha

3 years 8 months ago

I see you’re trolling on all of the pages.

Phillies_Aces35
3 years 8 months ago

Makes no sense for the Rangers if it’s just a one for one swap. One of Brandon Belt, Pill, or Buster Posey needs to be included.

3 years 8 months ago

Not unless Sabean hates his job…

JacksTigers
3 years 8 months ago

You know, in the ’30’s, they called this an Uncle Spinny Dervish

-Tom Tucker

FacelessGeneralManager
3 years 8 months ago

I love when players can just be called by their first names. Like Edwin and Gio.
Way more fun.

Joey Doughnuts
3 years 8 months ago

I like when my General Managers have faces.

Vmmercan
3 years 8 months ago

This made me giggle one of those awkward giggles where it has a second wave to it after I thought I was done. Just thought I’d share.

Encarnacion's Parrot
3 years 8 months ago

He used to have a face, but then he took an arrow in the knee.

FacelessGeneralManager
3 years 8 months ago

Thats sort of the point of my name. Im no GM, I’m just a faceless person who thinks i could run a franchise better than anyone just like a lot of people on here. I can say whatever i want and propose any trade i want, cuz I’m faceless.

vtadave
3 years 8 months ago

I went to a few Arizona Fall League games and sat next to scouts while Hultzen was pitching. Let’s just say the consensus is that while he’s polished and could be in the big leagues quickly, he doesn’t have near the upside of a guy like Pineda, who the M’s should be building around barring some ridiculous offer.

When I say “ridiculous”, I’m talking Montero, Banuelos, and Betances.

notsureifsrs
3 years 8 months ago

were the scouts talking about pineda too, or is that your comparison? i am not a huge fan of pineda personally

YanksFanSince78
3 years 8 months ago

I wish I had access to the Goldstein subscription just to read what the scouts thought of the IPK vs Yu D question. I would think Yu would win easy but I’ve always liked IPK’s ability. I still think others will dismiss his success on the NL West competitiveness until he has a couple of more years like 2011.

Joey Doughnuts
3 years 8 months ago

IPK?

YanksFanSince78
3 years 8 months ago

Ian Patrick Kennedy

3 years 8 months ago

…why didn’t you just say ‘IAN’.

YanksFanSince78
3 years 8 months ago

Just always known as IPK.

The Real D Guar
3 years 8 months ago

Edwin Jax can’t get a full season in on one team, much less 5 years. How many ways are there to say…not happening?

FacelessGeneralManager
3 years 8 months ago

He should really hold out for a no trade clause, lol

JacksTigers
3 years 8 months ago

Edwin Jax? You can’t do that. It’s either E-Jax or Edwin Jackson. You can’t just say ‘Edwin Jax.’ It’s un-American!

Snoochies8
3 years 8 months ago

can someone with insider access tell us what the results were for the darvish vs. (pitcher) poll?

3 years 8 months ago

Darvish voted over Nolasco 10-0
Darvish voted over Garza 7-3
Darvish voted over Kennedy 7-3
Darvish tied with Greinke 5-5
Verlander voted over Darvish 10-0

3 years 8 months ago

How’d they pick the pitchers. Because I’m wondering why they chose to put Nolasco and Verlander in there. Seems like they’re a pretty sure bet to go 10-0 and 0-10.

YanksFanSince78
3 years 8 months ago

my guess was to run the spectrum of decent to superb inorder to gauge where Yu is seen?

MB923
3 years 8 months ago

If anyone had picked Nolasco, then that’s saying Darvish is going to be a total bust

Tigers94
3 years 8 months ago

Are these scouts dumb? Why the hell would anyone want Justin Verlander over Yu Darvish? Doesnt make sense

Tigers94
3 years 8 months ago

The funny thing is, Ian Kennedy, or “IPK” as that yankees fan said a few posts above, is better than Zack Greinke

Wes Whitenack
3 years 8 months ago

Darvish vs:
Nolasco, Darvish 10-0
Kennedy, Darvish 7-3
Garza, Darvish 7-3
Greinke, Tie
Verlander, Verlander 10-0

harmony55
3 years 8 months ago

I had proposed five years of Michael Pineda, one year of Brandon League, two-plus years of Chone Figgins and cash to Cincinnati or two years of Edinson Volquez and six years each of Yonder Alonso and Yasmani Grandal. I’m not sure how that compares with the Reds’ trade for Mat Latos.

BTW, the Seattle beat reporter is Shannon DrAyer.

nictonjr
3 years 8 months ago

Why would the Reds want Figgins?  Even if the Mariners sent $16 mil to cover his salary…

Larry Ellsworth
3 years 8 months ago

Boras is not John Dank’s agent.    John Danks left Boras last year.    

pmc765
3 years 8 months ago

So true. Boras’ many unsigned clients should contemplate that.

Danks got 5/$65. He didn’t pack his bags. He stays in the place he evidently wants to pitch.

Maybe he could have gotten more, you say? We’ll never know, but if he hadn’t fired Boras the Sox would have peddled him already, safe in the knowledge that NO Boras client extends his contract. 

And that would make him a gypsy like EJax, multiple teams in two years as teams sought to recover some value for a wasting asset. 

Enjoy Christmas, Boras clients! This uncertainty and anxiety is what you signed up for. Maybe you’ll cash in for more than your old teams would have extended you for. Maybe.

Wes Whitenack
3 years 8 months ago

reply fail

Wes Whitenack
3 years 8 months ago

Double fail. Tonight’s not my night.

3 years 8 months ago

If there’s a “good chance” that Hultzen will become Pineda by next season, that does NOT mean you trade Pineda. That makes negative sense! You don’t trade a cheap, young, ace type pitcher just because you have another coming up. That should give you even more reason to keep him.

Felix/Pineda/Hultzen is absolutely incredibly dangerous. You might be able to “replace” Pineda short-term, but not long term. Don’t get that idea.

DickHarden
3 years 8 months ago

Did you even read what it said?

xthetouristx
3 years 8 months ago

Unless it gets you hitting, which the Mariners need.  Plus James Paxton is nearly ready as well and he has a very high upside as well.

3 years 8 months ago

It’d better be several high upside hitters, because Pineda is a beast of a young pitcher.

xthetouristx
3 years 8 months ago

It would have to be something like what the Reds gave up for Latos.

MNTwins12
3 years 8 months ago

I’m a fan of Edwin Jackson, but he’ll be massively overpaid this offseason. 10 million a year should be the absolute maximum for him.

3 years 8 months ago

Agreed on both parts.

John McFadin
3 years 8 months ago

I think there would be the possibility of him performing well to a contract around 4/52 or so.  Would be fair for both sides and the possibility of surplus value unless he implodes.

3 years 8 months ago

Seattle are doing the right thing… sticking to their plan. In 3 years from now my Seattle team will be great and full of young talent. I know we are not going to win in 2 years… I can wait that long, as long as i can see it happening. J-Z is doing a good job. (except Figgins)
I think Seattle should look at Billy Butler. 
I think Seattle should sign Hiroki Kuroda.

DickHarden
3 years 8 months ago

Anyone still feel Hultzen was an overdraft?

DickHarden
3 years 8 months ago

“Trust me, guys.”

SOXFISH29
3 years 8 months ago

Red Sox need to go after jackson, everywhere hes been he is pretty successful and he would be another relatively young arm in the rotation

johnsilver
3 years 8 months ago

” everywhere hes been he is pretty successful”

Excuse me.. But exactly where has he been pretty successful? Mediocre at best, or flat out awful is more like it and his better seasons have been in pitchers parks, not in places like cozy Fenway.

Really doubt Cherrington & Co. will even bother giving a cursory nod over the list of available SP this off season.

SOXFISH29
3 years 8 months ago

sorry boss the key word was “pretty” successful, would you rather have Edwin Jackson or John Lackey pitching for you? Jackson has been on some mediocre teams, thats part of the reason for  his .500 record. Im just saying hes an option and i know he is better than lackey or any of the other back of the rotation options the Sox had this season.

baseballbill77
3 years 8 months ago

Is the package the Reds gave up for Latos better than what the Yankees would be offering for Felix/offered for Cliff Lee? 

JacksTigers
3 years 8 months ago

No.

xthetouristx
3 years 8 months ago

Yes it is.

qudjy1
3 years 8 months ago

Wow – Saunders – That seems like alot to ask.