Hunter Signing Won't Stop Rolling Angels

Just stick Brandon Wood at short and enjoy the home runs

Willits in my opinion will be packaged with an infielder and 2 pitchers and traded to the Marlins for Cabrera and Willis, or Bedard and Tejada. I think Reggins is wheeling and dealing and isnt afraid to send people anywhere or spend money.

Pure speculation on my part though.

what's the lineup if the Angels nab Miggy?

Angels have to keep Kendrick if they are going to be asking for 3 to 4 more good players.

I'm an Angels fan and I love Howie Kendrick. But you have to look at what would happen to our lineup if we get Miguel Cabrera. We immediately get one of the best young bats at 3B. And then Figgins would move to 2nd. In my opinion, within the next 2-3 years we would get better production out of Figgins at 2nd than we would Kendrick, plus we get Cabrera.

I love Kendrick too you guys, but it's a no-brainer if we can get Cabrera and keep Figgins. Plus we may be able to take on Dontrelle Willis, and dump now useless players like Willits

I don't know about anyone else here but I'm excited for the new season to come, especially if we can pull off Miguel Cabrera. We need to get the younger power hitter instead of Tejada who is aging. It would prolly take something like Kendrick, Adenhart, Willits, Mathis to get Cabrera but the kid is 24 going on 25 and could potentially if all goes right, challenge AROD for the homerun record. We could bring Brandon Wood up at SS and Aybar/Figgins at 2B. All I know is with Reagins guiding the ship, we have a bright and exciting future.

If the Marlins get Kendrick, where is he going to play? He doesn't have the power to warrant a corner infield position, and the fish already have Dan Uggla at second. Really, he shouldn't be part of the trade for either team.

Give up some pitchers and be done with it. Santana and Adenhart plus Willits and some lesser infield prospect should be good, or if they are afraid of Santana's splits even Weaver would be worth it. Either way, With O. Cabrera gone, Figgins should be at short, with an infield of Cotchman, Kendrick, Figgins, and Cabrera. Arguably the best in the game.

I'd compare Cabrera to, uh, A-Rod and Mike Schmidt. The Angels would be lucky if Kendrick--and I mean this seriously, b/c he could also end up being nothing--ends up becoming a poor man's Robbie Cano. And that's a very generous comparison.

But ya, Miggy Cabrera is in another level.. Comparing those 2 is just plain ludicrous.

There isn't many players I would take over Cabrera.. He's a 1.000 OPS proven youngster.. That is extremely rare to say youngster, proven and 1.000 OPS in the same sentence

Yeah, you’re correct there BJ ~ but I have to agree with the others that I’m still not sure where the comparison comes in…

Think of it this way:
One hand you have a bad fielding 3B ~ other hand you have a good fielding 2B…

One hand you have a guy who by 24 is rumored to be moving to 1B because of horrible D ~ other is a guy the same age in great shape that will play his position for the next 5-10 years…

One hand you have a hitter who has always used patience to increase his OBP ~ other hand you have a guy who has never been able to take a walk to save his life; meaning he would have to hit something like 370-380 just to have the 400ish OBP of Cabrera… (ie, the exact reason Kendrick ever had a .400 OBP in the minors…)

One hand you have a guy who never had any speed ~ other you have a fair runner and possible SB threat if he can make it to first…

One hand you have a guy who can only make it to third if the OFer gets a bad read ~ other you have a guy who should give you 4-5 Triples a year.

The only thing they really have in common is that they are about the same age (approx 3 months difference) and that they have both hit in the .330 range in the majors…

I do agree with the first part of that, the second part is a little iffy though. Its still a ¼ chance to make the WS after entering the playoffs, but it really comes down to who is the hottest/healthiest at the time more than who is more talented.

And really, its that “healthiest” part which could give the Angels the most problems in 08-09. If you look around the roster, one thing jumps out at you instantly ~ injury histories… Not saying they will suck or anything, but it has to be a concern because there will hardly be a position filled with a player who hasn’t had nagging to serious problems the last two years…

wow...angels fan and angelfan4life sound like the same person. I see no bias at all with your statements... so if "you wanna crown them, then crown them!"

I for one am skeptical. Reagins better get M. Cab, because Vlad is walking around like my grandpa.
Anderson was good, about 5 years ago. GMJ was probably the worst signing last year(him or the Great Juan Pierre). But the Torii Hunter deal will probably be seen almost as bad in a couple of years.

What's wrong with Los Angeles' GMs(Angels and Dodgers). Both teams sign over-the-hill veteran players to horrible contracts that end up blocking their talented minor league players. Then you have the Angels signing a CF 2 years in a row, and the Dodgers trying to do the same thing.

The Angels' GMs currently have had two over-the-hill contract signings, so I don't exactly see how that makes them any more 'notorious' for it than anyone else is. And the Angels' system is lacking in one key area, which is outfield prospects, so those two signings have done nothing to block Minor League talent.

I'm convinced that most of you don't know who Nick Adenhart is outside of a name.

For those who don't know, Adenhart was the best high school pitching prospect in the 2004 draft, one that included: Phil Hughes, Homer Bailey, Yovanni Gallardo, David Price, Gio Gonzalez, Scott Elbert and quite a few other legit prospects.

Adenhart hurt his elbow in his second to last start of the season and had TJ surgery, which has a nearly perfect success rate lately. The Angels gambled on being able to sign him away from UNC and did.

Now answer me this, why would you trade a possible ace who you paid nearly nothing to to sign, rehabbed him and then lose all of of the benefits?

Adenhart's closest comparable is Greg Maddux. Angels fans, do you really want to be the team who traded Greg Maddux?

Izturis and Aybar would play SS. Wood isn't ready yet and might have to wait until Cabrera moves to the outfield/DH so he can play third base, his natural position. It might be an ugly left side of the infield otherwise.

palehouse, Brandon Wood came up as a shortstop with the Angels, not as a third baseman. He was moved over to third recently by the organization.

gogopalehose where did you get that Wood's natural position is 3B?
that is completely wrong his natural position has always been SS however because of his power numbers and the angels need at 3B the organization has been trying to convert him to a 3B but he is a natural SS think of a troy tulowotzki with alittle worse defense, alot more power but less average and more strikeouts.

If I'm the Angels, I'd trade anyone BUT Adenhart for Cabrera.

Adenhart is ready now, he should win the final rotation spot out of spring training.

If the Angels could put together a package of Brandon Wood, Reggie Willits, Ervin Santana and Howie Kendrick for Cabrera, there is no way they shouldn't do it.

The Angels will land Miggy Cabrera i said it once and i'll say it again the angels can trade wood or adenhart cuz they have so many prospects in their minor league system that become better then those two guys. I can also see the trade for Miggy is Santana, Wood, Willits, Kendrick. And tell all Angels fans out there if the Angels land Miggy for sure we have chance of walking to the WS and have no trouble with the NL cuz they suck.

yeah, and AngelsFan and AngelsFan4Life really almost have to be the same guy... I think he created two accounts so he could have someone agreeing with his posts...

Tim, do you frown on that and delete the IPs or does it not really matter if a guy posts under two names to you?

Kab, really think about there situation for a second ~ we’ve seen it before... If they are trading all these prospects (which they almost have to) then they will be in the exact same situation that the WhiteSox were in for 05-06.

They will have aging high priced guys clogging the lineup, 1-2 real good players with health concerns and holes possibly all over their lineup (ie 3B, OF, 1B/DH and possibly 2B or SS depending on who is dealt ~ plus questionable SP depth unless they are able to somehow resign everyone) with most of the prospects gone.

By the end of the year the Angels will begin looking so similar to the PaleHose its not even funny ~ but be spending millions more in payroll…

"yeah, and AngelsFan and AngelsFan4Life really almost have to be the same guy... I think he created two accounts so he could have someone agreeing with his posts..."

Rofl. Anybody who says something along the lines of the NL sucks so we will roll thru the WS is an idiot and shouldnt even really be payed attention too. Its such a crap shoot in a 7 game series anything can happen. In the last 7 years the NL has 3 WS wins. 4-3 isnt so dominant. The tigers got steamrolled by a crappy ST louis team last year that barely was .500 during the season. You can stick the worst team in baseball in a 7 game world series and they can win it any given time.

Gogo,

see, your second paragraph is perfect ~ and really why Anaheim is primed for a 1-2 YR run but will see a big drop-off after (similar to the Sox) ~ and where they did come about them in a tad-different way, the makeup will be similar because of the players themselves (they will just be making more money as I mentioned...)

The first paragraph has a problem on the Angels side though ~ they dont have "prospects" anymore really. What they have is a bunch of young-MLers where many have been up for a year or two already, if not more... Blocking them for another 1-2 years creates nothing more than an aging bunch of guys with much of their potential long since gone. In 2009-2010 when everyone leaves for FA, most of the "young MLers" will be gone and the others will be questionable to use because they would still have so little experience despite 3-4 years in the league. They will be in the same spot as the Sox, holes all over and no one to really fill them...

Otherwise, your analysis of the Sox in the first paragraph seems rather dead-on as well...

Oh, I would add that the contracts to the SP in Chi can be considered vastly over-paying the last couple years though…

nrmx In all of that drop off of free agents sounds good except, Garland said he would sign extension we are already talking wiht K-Rod, Anderson is getting old anyway, We will resign Vlad because he is too important

Darkstar, when you don't know anything about the Angels or what you're talking about, it's best to keep your mouth shut. When someone presents facts, instead of the bs like you do, it only makes you look silly.

What's the matter? You got exposed for making up bs, and now you got no response to it? You made it seem like the Angels had old players everywhere, when the facts I showed you proved you wrong, and in a big way.

As for the future of the team, like I said, we have expiring contracts with GA, Garland, etc. $27 million will be coming off from just those 2 alone. We will likely resign Lackey, Vlad, Escobar and K-Rod.

2010 team.

1B Kotchman
2B Aybar or FA/Trade
SS Wood
3B Cabrera
RF FA/Trade
CF Hunter
LF Rivera
DH Guerrero
C Napoli/Hank Conger coming up, projected to be a middle of the order hitter.

I see Matthews traded, and I am pretty sure the Angels wouldn't sign another CF unless there's something going on with Matthews. Either a suspension, possible void of contract, or he'll waive it and the Angels will trade him.

As for our prospects/ and prospects coming up.

Aybar (already up)
S-Rod
Sweeney
Pettit
Mount

Lackey
Escobar
Weaver
Saunders
Santana
O'Sullivan (projected #3 starter)
Il-Jung (huge potential)
Tommy Mendoza (has huge potential, injuries have stalled his development)
Trevor Bell

We also have Moseley as depth currently.

K-Rod
Shields
Speier
Walden (Huge potential, incredible arm. Fastball could reach 100 mph)
Arredondo (Incredible arm. Throws in the mid to upper 90s and has a nasty splitter)
Marek (nice bullpen arm or possible #3/#4 starter)
Moseley

There you have it. We would probably only have to rely on a FA signing on ONE position, RF. Besides all of that, you're also forgetting something. The Angels aren't a small market team. The Angels could afford a payroll in the $130 million range. We're not the Oakland A's, so excuse us if we could afford our players and not be forced to get rid of them later on.

Wait, there's more. Maicer Izturis! He's a FA in 2011. He could be our 2B if not Aybar. He's a .750+ OPS hitter with speed and capability of stealing 20-30 bases. Very valuable.

By the way, did you know the Angels have one of the best depth in all of baseball? We just don't have positions for many of our young players, who could be very good players. :(

Uh, hello. I just started commenting on prospects who are currently in the minor leagues, such as O'Sullivan, Walden, Conger, Arredondo, Jung, Marek, Mendonza, Bell, Pettit, Sweeney, etc. Many on those list have huge potential. Conger has potential to be a middle of the order hitter. Matt Sweeney has 20-25 HR potential. Walden has potential to be a very good starter or incredible reliever. Arredondo could be our next closer. Jung could be something special. Mendoza has huge potential as well with the kind of arm he has, although his development has been stalled by injuries. Players like Mendoza and Jung are young and nobody can really project them until they move up higher, but they both have incredible arms, so you have an idea of what they'll become. Yet, you completely ignored that and commented on McPherson, I assume, who has an injury-plagued career so far. You think his career is finished? Don't count on it. He has huge power potential, and he's a FA in 2012. The Angels don't have to get rid of him, keep that in mind. It's a win-win situation. If he comes back from his injury and lives up to his potential, we win. If not, we don't lose anything. Izturis is also a FA in 2011. Morales is a FA in 2013. Don't you get it? We have good potential players who will be under club control for a while!

Comparing the future Angels to the White Sox is laughable, and here's why.

If the White Sox had ANY decent prospects, and especially prospects that panned out, they wouldn't be in this mess. They had Crede out with an injury. They got Richar and Owens in there, who couldn't hit water if they fell out of the boat. They had to call up on Richar because they simply got nothing good to put in 2B! They're wasting spots on Ozuna and Uribe, who are both terrible. Uribe is just awful offensively. Then they got Pierzynski and his .710 OPS at catcher. They're a mess.

Then you have their pitching. They gave up 839 runs!!! Their pitching is terrible.

How could you compare that bunch to the Angels? The White Sox are a mess, the Angels aren't.

Perhaps you should check up on Casey Kotchman, a grade A prospect who had mono in 2006. His breakout started in 2005. Guess what, Youkilis had the 2nd highest OPS out of any 1B in the AL, only behind Pena. Youkilis's OPS was .843. Want to know what Kotchman's OPS was? .840! We have one of the best offensive 1B in the AL, and not to mention that he plays GG calibre defense.

Our catcher Mike Napoli is one of the best offensive catchers in the game. He ranked 4th in the AL, only behind Posada, Martinez and Mauer.

Not only do we have better, MUCH better actually, prospects than the White Sox, we also have prospects who have graduated and PRODUCED, both on offense and pitching, something the White Sox prospects haven't done. The White Sox prospects aren't even close to being as good as ours, so the point is moot.

We have the pitching, the young players such as Wood, Kotchman, Miguel Cabrera (if we get him) Kotchman, Napoli (Conger waiting in the wings) and other hitters like Vlad, Hunter, Rivera.

Not only that, we have the payroll to maintain our players and get in new ones if needed.

Then we got Walden, Jung, O'Sullivan coming up. O'Sullivan is projected to be a #3 and Walden and Jung could be something special. Mendoza could also be something special once he moves up and we see what he's capable of, although injuries stalled his development so far.

None of that equals the White Sox. Only a fool would think the White Sox (Uribe, Richar, Ozuna, Owens, Pierzynski, Erstad) is equal to that.

Your hatred for the Angels is causing you to think irrationally. Perhaps you should lighten up. I don't think this obsession is healthy.

Man, how anyone could compare Richar, Ozuna, Owens, Pierzynski, Erstad and Uribe (The White Sox "offensive" bunch), to Kotchman (graduated, one of the best 1B in the AL, offensively and defensively), Miguel Cabrera (great young hitter), Napoli (one of the best offensive catchers in the game) Wood (WAY better prospect than anything the White Sox have), Rivera (good hitter), Izturis (.750+ OPS hitter with nice speed and gets on base), Hunter (4th best offensive CF in the AL according to OPS), Vlad (nuff said) and whoever else we get in there is beyond me.

That's laughable. The White Sox could only dream of even having Maicer Izturis, LOL!

Man, you lost all credibility there. All aging vets?

1B: Kotchman. Only 24. He's under club control through 2012.
2B: Figgins. He's 29.
SS: Brandon Wood. Only 22. He would be under club control for 6+ years.
3B: Miguel Cabrera. (If we get him) He's 24 and we'd sign him to an extension.
RF: Vlad, he's 31, although he's DH bound, so we'll likely get younger in RF.
CF: Hunter. He's 32. Not old.
LF: Juan Rivera; He's 29. I think Matthews gets traded if/when he waives his NTC.
DH: Garret Anderson, he's 35 and his contract expires after 2008, thankfully. That would take $15 million off the payroll.
C: Napoli. He's 26. He's a free agent in 2013.

Lackey: He's 29. He's signed through 2009 (club option) and we'd give him an extension.
Escobar: He's 31. Signed through 2009.
Weaver: He's 25. Free agent in 2013.
Garland: Swap of expiring contracts, likely setting the stage for a Miguel Cabrera trade.
Saunders: He's 26. Free agent in 2013.
Santana: He's 24. Free agent in 2012.

So, basically, Anderson's and Garland's contracts expire after 2008, taking off $27 million of the payroll.

K-Rod - He's 25. The Angels might sign him or might not, could go either way.
Shields: He's 32. FA in 2011
Speier: He's 34. FA in 2011

See how foolish you look? All aging vets? Yeah, we're the SF Giants alright!

The White Sox also wish they had Izturis's production compared to the trash their offensive bunch gave them (Richar, Ozuna, Uribe, Pierzynski, Erstad and Owens.)

Jermaine Dye also had that career year in 2006, yet went back to his career numbers in 2007, which was expected. His .803 OPS is good, but nothing special. His career OPS is .823.

Then they have Konerko. Casey Kotchman was the better play. Hey, at least they got Thome surrounded with 6 terrible offensive players, 1 above average one and another good one.

No, those prospects aren't better than Adenhart. Check up on Adenhart and his scouting reports when you have the chance.

The Angels won't be in financial disarray since we got cheap young talent all over the place, both on pitching and offensively.

By the way, also check up on Walden, Conger, Arredondo, Jung, Mendoza, etc. when you have the chance.

LOL at you thinking Adenhart is better than de los Santos and Gonzalez. Gonzalez is the minor league strikeout champ while walking less batters in about the same number of innings as Adenhart. So Gio had an ERA that is lower by half a run, about 10 less walks and about 70 more strikeouts(in a few less innings might I add). de los Santos is projected to be an ace by many, including Baseball Prospectus. So yes, they are better than Adenhart.

I should correct myself. They aren't all aging vets, but they simply can't afford to retain Figgins, Lackey, Escobar, Cabrera, Guerrerro, and have a shot at Garland and K-Rod, especially after handing out rediculous contracts to Hunter and Matthews. Shields and Speier, their key set-up men, are aging and Shields is starting to fall off a bit.

So yes. They might be the best team in the American League(although unlikely) and they might win the world series(even more unliekely). But remember who told you so when they come crumbling down in a few years.

As for Garland, why would the Angels want to keep him when we got so many options? A #4/#5 starter like Garland isn't worth $12 million.

Lackey
Escobar
Weaver
Santana
Saunders
Moseley

Anderson's and Garland's contracts expire after 2008. That's $27 million off the payroll.

...and again, yes, we could afford to retain Vlad, Lackey, Escobar and K-Rod if we want them.

I guarantee that Gonzalez will be higher on a top prospect list than Adenhart and de los Santos will be on many, so just stop trying to prove that he's some sort of uber-prospect OK? The hitters think that Gonzalez and de los Santos are filthy and that Adenhart, while solid, doesn't quite match up. The White Sox are stacked with good, young arms.

No, he won't be, because his ceiling isn't as high as Adenhart's.

I never said Gio was going to be an ace but he should be a number 2 for a long time behind de los Santos who projects as a number one starter. Adenhart projects as a number two starter as well but right now Gio Gonzalez is the better prospect because of his great AA season and Adenhart's mediocre AA season.

Oh, and Gio does throw in the low nineties, for the last time, in case you haven't found out yourself.

http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/pneumonia-pony/tag/PittsburghPirates

*Sigh*

The site you posted is a *blog* created by a *fan* who also doesn't even use punctuation marks when he types. His spelling is also awful.

Nice source!

All scouting reports I've read on him has his fastball in the 80s, but I can see why you had to choose a random blog.

"Gonzalez is making his second tour of duty with the White Sox organization. He was the club's supplemental first-round pick in 2004 out of Monsignor Pace High in Miami before being traded to the Phillies last offseason in a deal for Jim Thome. The 5-foot-11 lefty generates easy velocity--occasionally reaching 93-94 mph--and spins a hard curveball as his out pitch. He also mixes in a quality changeup."-Baseball America

"Gonzalez throws a fastball 90-93 mph, a curve ball and a change up"-Wikipedia

"Traded away by the Sox for Jim Thome and then reacquired for Freddy Garcia, Gonzalez should be first in line for any opening in the starting rotation. His low 90's fastball compliments his out pitch, a devastating curveball. His performance last season didn't reflect his skills and he will need to keep the ball in the park and lower his walks before that happens."-Baseball Examiner(this is pre 2006; he really lowered his walk totals last season)

I could go on forever because every credible source knows that he pitches in the low nineties. Now will you give it up already?

Hello, there's a difference between consistently pitching in the 90s or touching the 90s when a pitcher rears back.

#1 His fastball is mostly in the high 80s (That's a FACT). He ranges from the mid 80s to low 90s, while being in the high 80s most of the time. Just because he can touch the low 90s doesn't mean he stays there.

You can keep convincing yourself though that your pitching prospect is great. I'm not knocking on him, but when you try to proclaim him the second coming, and it's clear you don't know what you're talking about, then go right ahead. You're only setting yourself up for disappointment when you find out he's not all you think he is. He's a decent prospect, but an ace or a #2 he isn't.

What scouting reports of yours that are so good say that he throws in the high eighties? Everywhere I look it says low to mid nineties.

Hey angels fan i dont why these people think that were just one person. But on ur comment about Napoli he can sometimes be offensive but right now i have to say he is there top catcher in team. But i think that next season he will improve because now he doesn't have to worry about being the backup because Jose molina is gone.

Ok MLB1, I just read all of that I came to the realization that you seem to not be able to grasp 3 things very well. Here, let me explain them once again…

A) Players being blocked ~ If you have a prospect who is ML-ready this year, you can not expect to keep him in the minors of have him on the bench for 4-5 years then just toss him into the lineup anticipate his “potential” to show itself. *This* is the exact situation that many Angels “prospects” are already in though, many of them have been sitting around waiting for a chance to break the lineup, only to see that chance once again be taken away because the team brings in even more ringers in 2008. These guys have been wasting away, and they will be expected to waste away even longer now ~ the way this organization has been run is destructive to your “depth”.

Dallas McPherson for an example… DMcP was ML ready as early as 2004-2005. He got a bit of a chance in 2006 and did OK. He then got hurt though, and of course had to be replaced for 2007. Now ready to play once again ~ but we have a problem don’t we, the team is now going after another 3B in M.Cabrera. When Cabrera needs to move to 1B or DH in 2009 or 2010 then I guess McPherson gets his shot ~ 6 to 7 years after he was ready for it! How can you expect much out of him at that point? For 6-7 years he basically ran in place, do you seriously expect him to live up to his potential after that? Shoot, he specifically would be 29-30 YO at the time!

B) Prospects ~ It may be news to you, but not all prospects pan out. So far you have a team which in 2010 will be gutted of almost all its stars, see the other stars being much older and ineffective than you obviously want to believe and have very little money to play with because of their cost plus the cost of the select kids which did pan out and are making millions from arbitration. But even if you do have 10 “top-prospects”, odds say that only 2-3 Max will live up to be anything resembling a star, 2-3 more might have an ok career providing nothing too special and the other half will never make an impact at all in the ML. But, the situation your team is currently is is one in which they have not been able to determine which guys will/will-not work out because they have barley been able to see them play ~ they have mainly been blocked! So, the Angels will set out and trade a bunch of them now, not really knowing which ones will be the good ones, and be stuck with the leftovers in essence.

But you don’t think the ChiSox is a comparable team do you? How do you think they lost all their prospects? The Sox traded from their system to support their 2005 run and what few prospects they have left is exactly the same as the few prospects you will be left with form your crops once 2009-2010 rolls around. You try to bash their prospects, but how do you know yours will actually pan out instead of fizzle away like theirs did? You don’t, its pure speculation ~ but the fact that so many of yours will have been buried longer says that its extremely likely they will face the same fate.

C) Age… See, you seem to have a major problem grasping this one as well ~ and I don’t understand it at all… If a player is say 32 today, next year at this time he will be 33, the following year 34 and so one. When a player is past-his-prime and still going for a few years he would be considered “aging”. Secondly, “aging” can refer to those players which are seeing a downward physical trend regardless of their age. A guy can be 31 but have bad knees and starting to suffer from back problems ~ he would then be considered “ageing” as well… But lets just take a couple players from the Angels squad real fast and see is they are “ageing” or not…
~ Vlad. Guerrero will be 32 in 2008. Now actually that isn’t an old “age”, so in this case we have to go to the second part and think about the player. Humm, he has difficulty the last couple years already with regard to staying healthy enough to play 150+ games. I guess he would have to be “ageing”.
~ Torii Hunter. He too is 32 already during the 2008 season, and has a large durability question attached to him. He has missed time previously, and it is felt that within 3-4 years his production will be minimal. Shoot, even worse than that, his production is questioned now because he generally doesn’t provide more than LgAvg offensive numbers ~ but that’s besides the point for this part of it. So, if Torii is already an injury risk now, 2-3 years from now when he is 34-35 do you think he will be in better health? He too is “ageing”.
…And honestly, we are talking 2010-2011 here and anyone over 30-31 years of age now will be 33-34 then. Most players believe it or not don’t last long after 35. Anyone expected to be 33-34 during the years we are talking about could very well be in the last couple years in the league ~ its ageing and its all over this club…

Wholly geese those got long. Type them up in Word and I type really fast, sometimes I look at them afterward and am blown away at their length… Well ideally you might be able to grasp the concepts though since I did my best to make sure they were as thorough as possible. If you cant then I’m not sure why either of us were even trying to hold a conversation with you…

Oh and AngelsFan ~ thank you! I was kind of surprised to see a rational statement from a Angels fan in the catching up I did was doing here. :) ~ props to you!

1) 4 months ago the Angels needed a big bat? They needed a big bat in October. They needed a big bat in April, May, etc. They tried to get one and would get one if it made sense in a trade. They even tried to get Soriano, who went to the Cubs when they offered more money and Arte didn't want to pay him that. So, you're wrong. Plus, Arte made a comment about A-Rod around 4 months ago, around June or July, so get your facts straight. How could you make up this stuff and insist the Angels were talking about ANY big bat? Arte was specifically talking about A-Rod when asked if they were going to pursue him. Also, who says the Angels weren't even going to pursue him? Ever heard of the word posturing? The Yankees were probably the only team willing to dish out $300 million, and A-Rod saw that nobody else was willing to pay him what he and Boras asked for, so he came running back. Who cares.

Also, the fact that they got Hunter and are probably going hard after Cabrera proves you wrong. If you think the Angels are worried about payroll, why did they get Hunter? Why would they still be after Cabrera?

You're also confused. Signing Hunter doesn't mean the Angels will hold on to Matthews, keep that in mind. This signing was so unexpected, it surprised almost everyone. The fact of that matter is that the Angels DIDN'T need a CF, and they got one. This was NOT a desperation signing, meaning there is probably more to it than meets the eye. We need a 3B, not a CF. So, how about you wait and let things play out before talking about the Matthews situation? You don't know what'll happen now to Opening Day. You could be surprised seeing Matthews wearing another uniform if/when he waives his NTC. He might even be suspended or the Angels could try to void his contract if they found out he used something after it became illegal. We'll see, but my bet is on a trade.

Now....

You still haven't answered how Richar, Owens, Erstad, Ozuna, Uribe, Pierzynski, Cintron, Andy Gonzalez, Hall Fields, (all had significant playing time, check it out) Dye, who had that career year in 2006 but reverted back to his career numbers and had an .806 OPS..and then they got a good player in Konerko, but Kotchman was the better player at a fraction of the price and Thome, who is 37.

Also, tell me how that team, who gave up 839 runs, would compare to our team?

You're doing something called "exaggeration" and something called talking out of your ass, since you got no basis to your statement. You fail to mention we have a YOUNG pitching staff, yes, young, and cheap young talent all over the place under club control for 5 years and more.

If you think a possible 2010 team of...

1B Kotchman
2B Could be either Izturis, Figgins(both are proven, and good..and Izturis is under club control for 4 years) or Aybar
SS Wood
3B Cabrera
RF FA signing
CF Hunter
LF Rivera or Morales. Morales is a capable 20-25 HR bat, who will be a FA in 2013.
DH Guerrero
C Napoli

Conger, Sweeney, Pettit waiting in the wings.

Then..

Lackey
Escobar
Weaver
Santana
Saunders

With O'Sullivan, Walden, Jung, etc. waiting in the wings.

K-Rod
Shields
Speier
Walden
Arredondo
Marek

Yep, looking at that team, it sure would compare to Uribe, Ozuna, Erstad, Richar, Owens, Gonzalez, Hall, who are, let me remind you again, terrible offensive players. The 839 runs their pitching gave up sure would compare to our pitching, right?

Again, if you want to make baseless comparisons, you go right ahead, but you're wrong. Anybody thinking logically could see that.

Oh, and "angelfan", perhaps you should check your facts regarding your comment on Napoli. Napoli had the 4th highest OPS out of any catcher in the AL, behind Posada, Martinez and Mauer. Napoli is a very good offensive catcher, and your comment about only his batting average and the fact that darkstar thanked you for pointing that out shows how you guys don't know what you're talking about. Napoli gets on base and is a power hitting catcher. But yea, comment about his .250 BA. Don't comment about the OPS.

Now, onto your foolish fantasies…

What is your malfunction dude? Lets see… 4 months ago, 4 months ago ~ what could have been taking place 4 months ago… Oh yeah, the trade deadline! Artie didn’t say that about ARod or whatever other crap youre trying to make up now, he said it about the rumors of guys like Dunn and Tejada being brought in! There were rumors that a “big bat” would be brought in, and after asked he looked them straight in the eye and said “I cant spend the money” ~ well, he said “4th payroll, not 4th revenue”. Wanna know why they didn’t get a “big bat” at the deadline, or before the season (like you even pointed out in your ignorance), or last season ~ they are trying to work within a budget!!! Get it, Payroll wont just go through the roof; they need to keep it tight…

So, lets keep the budget “tight” and go back over your lineup:
First and foremost on it though… *Cabrera wont be at 3B*! Last freakin weak we heard about ~him~ saying that ~he~ was preparing for the possibility of a move to 1B or LF this year! Get it? Even ~he~ realizes he is the worst fielding 3B in baseball and will be moved from that spot! You on the other hand insist that 3 years from now he will still be playing there? That’s you having your head so far up your rear that we cant even see shoulders…

But back to your lineup…
Lets take your 2010 team and add in some salaries to see what they might be paying this squad…

1B Kotchman (ArbEl - 6M-ish if he produces like you claim)
2B Could be either Izturis, Figgins(both are proven, and good..and Izturis is under club control for 4 years) or Aybar (lots of “coulds” there… Figgins is FA, would be making atleast 7M)
SS Wood (will be ArbEl ~ probably 2-3M
3B ??? (((anyone but Cabrera)))
RF FA signing
CF Hunter (18M)
LF Rivera or Morales. (Wasn’t Morales already traded? Rivera would be a FA)
DH Guerrero (20M)
C Napoli (ArbEl - 4M if he produces like you claim)
Conger, Sweeney, Pettit waiting in the wings.
Lackey (18M – might seem high, but its 2 years from now and is only what Zito got)
Escobar (15M), Weaver (Arb-El 5M), Santana (ArbEl 6M), Saunders (ArbEl 5M)
With O'Sullivan, Walden, Jung, etc. waiting in the wings.
K-Rod (13M), Shields (ArbEl 4M), Speier (ArbEl 3M), Walden, Arredondo, Marek

Ok, so between Kotchman, Wood, Hunter, Guerrero (or Cabrera), Napoli, Lackey, Escobar, Weaver, Santana, Saunders, K.Rodriguez, Shields and Speir you have spent upwards of about 115M for 13 players and still need a 2B, 3B, RF and LF, a bench and of course some proven BP arms I imagine. You also proclaim Cabrera will be on this team as well, if that did hold true then you are looking at about 135M already with all those holes still there. So, you better go back to the drawing board and get that down to about 100M max with the holes you still have and see what ya got left…

Plus, youre still in the fantasy land that they can just “trade or void” the contract of Mathews because “he will waive his No-Trade clause”… Yeah, that’s a grounded way of thinking…

And BTW, when your team is looking something like:
1B Kotchman (6M), 2B ???, SS Wood (3M), 3B ???, RF ???, CF beat up Torii Hunter (18M), LF ???, C Napoli (4M), DH beat-up Vlad (20M) with ~Conger, Sweeney, Pettit waiting in the wings.
With:
Escobar (15M), Weaver (5M), Santana (6M), Saunders (5M),
With O'Sullivan, Walden, Jung, etc. waiting in the wings.
&
Shields (4M), Speier (3M), Walden, Arredondo, Marek
…Which is about 90M already (yeah, adds up fast doesn’t it…)
Then how can you say that the 2007 WhiteSox were so much worse and in such a different situation? I mean they sure didn’t have comparable guys like Thome, Konerko, Dye, Garland, Buehrle, Vasquez, AJ, etc did they…

Really, please just get a clue man…

Did that person really say Gio Gonzalez is better than Nick Adenhart?

I suppose looking at the league around the players doesn't help. The Texas league was notably better than the Southern League.

There's no way to prove that Adenhart will be better than Gonzalez. And since Gonzalez's 2007 was so much better, he's the better prospect. That's just the way it is. I'm not the only one that thinks that.

http://www.projectprospect.com/top-100-under-25-83107/

See? A very credible, prospect focused site ranking the top 100 Angels under the age of 25. A few Angels, but then nowhere do you see Nick Adenhart. And then you see Gio Gonzalez. He's a better prospect right now and I'm not the only one who thinks so, so get over it.

No one is taking on GMJ's terrible contract.

Why are you blatantly rejecting darkstar's comments, calling him a liar? We aren't trying to dis the Angels, we are just trying to tell you how it is and yet you refuse to believe us.

I don't want to spoil your parade, but go ask anyone who knows anything about prospects, who has the higher ceiling, Adenhart or Gonzalez.

Also, go ask around who they would rather have. Ask who's the better prospect.

Go e-mail those guys at Baseball America or Baseball Prospectus. Please do that right now. You'll see what they'll tell you.

Go e-mail them right now and report back.

Your player doesn't compare to Adenhart.

I'm not knocking on Gonzalez. He's a decent prospect, but please, don't compare the two. It makes you look silly.

I just showed you someone who thinks Gonzalez is the better prospect. In fact, I've given you a lot of sources. You've given none.

He repeated AA once. What are you talking about? You're the one who kept saying he threw in the mid to high eighties.

Right now, a lot of people could go either way on Gio and Adenhart, but because Gio had the better season most people, from what I have read, think that Gonzalez is the better prospect. While some might disagree, this argument started because you were trashing the White Sox system, saying that they have nothing close to the Angels prospect wise. Well guess what? Gonzalez is arguably better and de los Santos is, by many, considered to be an ace in the making(and is a better prospect than Adenhart at this point). You've yet to give me anything on him either.

Also, Baseball America, and most other sites, haven't posted their top prospect lists. I *could* ask in an e-mail but I would only get an opinion from one person.