Yankees Outfield Surplus

fyi, Joel Sherman is an idiot! No one in NY takes him seriously, nor should they! He is always wrong...both about predictions and the stories he reports from "unnamed team official"

"Swisher to the Cubs for A. Guzman and K. Hart."

Pains me to say it, but that might do it. Yankees shouldn't expect more than what they gave up for Swisher, but they gave up next to nothing when thinking of a player of Swisher's caliber, who's poor 2008 was heavily, heavily fueled by bad luck (BABIP way lower than his career norms, while hitting in a more hitter-friendly park than Oakland).

I have no idea what Swisher is worth right now, to be honest with you.

The Yankees absolutely f-cking stole Swisher from the White Sox. It's pathetic.

I wonder if Matsui to Angels would make sense. Morales at 1B, an OF of Rivera/GMJ-Hunter-Vlad with Matsui as DH (you can swap Vlad and Matsui between OF and DH). GMJ would become an overpaid 4th outfielder though.

Out of the three, Swisher is the one most likely to be traded because he's the one with the most positive trade value. Swisher to Oakland or Atlanta would make a lot of sense. Atlanta makes more sense though.
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I know this is all specualtion so I'm not going to chew any out for voicing an opinion (not like I'm an expert, right). But I can't see the Yanks trading a player who in essense is the most valuable to them just because they have an extra player in the DH/OF. The same reasons why people are saying Swisher makes the most tradeable commodity are the same reasons why he SHOULDN'T be traded. The Yanks are in a position of strength and are not trading to fill a need right now. The pitching staff looks good and they can either sign Pettitte or have an open competition for the #5. If anything whoever is traded should bring back a combo of a utility type player AND OF or SS prospects. If not then your trading just for the sake of trading. I think that Swisher goes ONLY if you get something high end. The arguement over "well we gave up nothing for him so we should ask for little in return" makes no sense at all. Nady provides another useful righty power bat and but a 1 year rental makes it tough to get equal value. Because he's a Boras client will make it tough because Nady will dra lots of interest in the open market but definetly isn't the kind of player the Yanks want to get into a bidding war over, especially at age 31. How about these trades:

Nady, Matsui, Kennedy (24), Horne (25), David Robertson (24)and Eric Duncan (24)

for

Maglio Ordonez, Dontrelle Willis and Joel Zumaya

Tigers want to decrease payroll and Ordonez is owed 09:$18M, 10:$15M vesting option (135 starts in 09), 11:$15M club option (no buyout). Willis is owed 09:$10M, 10:$12M. Nady replaces Ordonez in RF for 1 year and for a lot less. Matsui can platoon at DH with Sheffield for 1 year and then they're both FA's. They slide Guillen back to 3rd, Thames in LF and Granderson stays in CF. Kennedy and Horne add to a depleted pool of SP prospects for the Tigers. Robertson is a young flame throweing bullpen arm. Eric Duncan, though a dissapointment former 1st rnder, is still young (24) and still has potential and can play 1b and 3b.

Ordonez takes over for Nady in right with Swisher DH'ing or vice versa. Dontrelle can compete for the 5th spot or start in AAA as insurance if Hughes, Aceve, etc struggle @ #5. Zumaya is coming off of arm surgery.

Tigers assume 18 mil in 09 salary. Then clear that 18 mil plus Sheffs 14 mil after 2009 giving them 32 mil to play with in winter of 09.

Yanks assume Detroit's salaries of 28 mil in 09 and 27 in 2010.

2009 Line Up

Damon -lf
Jeter -ss
Tex -1b
Arod -3b
Ordonez -dh/rf
Posada -c
Cano -2b
Swisher -rf/dh
Gardner/Melky -cf

CC
AJ
Wang
Joba
Pettitte

Waiting: Hughes, Willis, Aveces, Igawa and Sanchez.

"With the yanks apparently gunning for the title this year, would Swisher back to Oakland for Justin Ducscherer(sp) sound good? Sure up that rotation and Duke was lights out last year but an injury risk. He's in his walk year though, so expect him to keep killin it in 09."

Had the A's not traded for Matt Holliday, that works. Unless BB has some major flip planned at the deadline, of course.

And, the A's shouldn't pay more than the Yanks had to for Swisher. Swisher is worth more, but that Sox/Yanks deal should be used as leverage on the A's side. Duchscherer is worth more than Betemit/Marquez/Nunez. I use secondary pieces to put together a deal, possibly involving one of Pennington/Petit as a utility man, and some other lower level pitching prospects.

Although I wouldn't say Duke will continue to kill it in '09 if he was traded to the Yankees. Duke's success is heavily defense-aided, and the A's have a significantly better defense than the Yankees do.

YFS78-

That deal would actually be mutually beneficial for both sides. Tigers shed payroll, get rid of D-Trainwreck's horrible contract, while bolstering their bullpen and adding two OF/DH for the '09 season.

Although this makes Joyce/Jackson look even more absurdly stupid though, since the Tigers will need to fully restock their OF after '09.

The people that don't get why they're trying to move 2 of the outfield is, and they won't publicly come out and say it, but they're still going to be in on Manny. Hank said as soon as free agency started that he wanted him in pinstripes and i don't think that's changed nor would Hank pass up another chance to stick it to Boston.

The Yanks ARE evil, though...

"The people that don't get why they're trying to move 2 of the outfield is, and they won't publicly come out and say it, but they're still going to be in on Manny. Hank said as soon as free agency started that he wanted him in pinstripes and i don't think that's changed nor would Hank pass up another chance to stick it to Boston."

I actually agree with this.

A team like the Yanks(there will be a PR fallout if they don't make the playoffs) is well-advised to carry plenty of OF depth, especially when Damon and Matsui are injury prone and Nady is a suspected fluke. If two of those guys are traded, I would definitely pencil Manny in for pinstripes.

To me their is no leverage because the Yanks are not in a "must trade" situation.

I think Cash traded for Swisher with this thought in mind:

a) If we don't get Tex then Swisher is a viable option vs anyone else on the market.

b) If we get Tex then I can always use him in the OF and in 2010 he's an option for us to use when Damon, Nady and Matsui become FA.

Nothing has changed. The only question remains is the "theory" of going after Man-NY. Even still, you can keep Swisher and trade Nady and Matsui. What you get in return is the ?. But Cash shouldn't feel as if he has to "settle" for garbage.

Again, if you find a steal like a Babe Ruth card in a yard sale for $5 bucks and it's worth $2,000 would you walk into your local card store and settle for $50 just because you received a 1,000 % return? Or would you try to get a lot closer to it's real value?

To me their is no leverage because the Yanks are not in a "must trade" situation.

I think Cash traded for Swisher with this thought in mind:

a) If we don't get Tex then Swisher is a viable option vs anyone else on the market.

b) If we get Tex then I can always use him in the OF and in 2010 he's an option for us to use when Damon, Nady and Matsui become FA.

Nothing has changed. The only question remains is the "theory" of going after Man-NY. Even still, you can keep Swisher and trade Nady and Matsui. What you get in return is the ?. But Cash shouldn't feel as if he has to "settle" for garbage.

I don't disagree with anything you are saying, but keep in mind the Yankees (who are indeed evil, I think I should remind you) are the ones shopping these guys around. Cashman surely knows that it is a buyer's market on risky bats and that he isn't going to get a fantastic offer on any of them.

Well, just logged back on and I have read enough where perhaps I may have been over zealous in mentioning the Heyward trade earlier, but lets keep in mind this trade has been mentioned by sports writers, as well as other baseball people. Back in the summer of 08 there was mention of the braves acquiring Nady then. So you figure it out. Furthermore, the comments by braves fans on here speak in volume. Such resistance to consider what could be gotten for their robust collection of prospects. Let me ask you this. Has that proved to be prudent move by the brave's management? A lot of talk of them involved in multiple trades and signings and last I check they have netted nothing this off season. I wonder why. Perhaps they need to start getting creative or spend a little money.

The best bet is to not shop these guys and hold onto them for the duration of the season. As we learned last season surplus is a good thing and you can never have too much depth. When that depth possesses the talent that Nick Swisher and Hideki Matsui harness its a great thing for the Yankees. I feel Swisher would provide them with the biggest bounty if he is indeed traded but the best bet is to head into 2009 holding on to everyone they have now offensively. The only trade i can see happening is Nick Swisher going to either the Braves or Reds where a player with the upside of Homer Bailey or Manny Acosta would have to be involved.

C - Posada = 110 - 120 starts, Molina = 30 - 40 starts, Cervelli = 2 - 22 starts
1B - Texeira = 150 starts, Miranda = 5 - 7 starts, Swisher gets 5 - 7 starts
2B - Cano = 156 starts, Ransom = 6 starts
SS - Jeter = 148 - 154 starts, Ransom = 8 - 14 starts
3B - Rodriguez = 154 - 158 starts, Ransom = 4 - 8 starts
LF - Damon = 100 - 110 starts, Matsui = 32 - 40 starts, Swisher = 20 - 30 starts
CF - Gardner = 92 - 102 starts, Swisher = 40 - 50 starts, Damon = 10 - 30 starts
RF - Nady = 118 - 130 starts, Swisher = 32 - 44 starts
DH - Matsui = 80 - 85 starts, Posada = 15 - 20 starts, Damon = 14 - 18 starts, Swisher = 8 - 10 starts, Nady = 8 - 10 starts, Jeter = 3 starts, Rodriguez = 3 starts, Texeira = 3 starts

Nady gets 128 - 140 starts
Posada gets 125 - 140 starts
Damon gets 124 - 158 starts
Matsui gets 112 - 125 starts
Swisher gets 105 - 141 starts
Gardner gets 92 - 102 starts
Ransom gets 18 - 28 starts
Melky rots in the minors (or is traded with Horne and Kennedy for a lefty starter)
Each one of these players can live with that kind of playing time, knowing they'll appear in at least 10 - 20 more games off the bench

I know ... much of this depends on player health and if someone gets hot/cold it throws the plan right out the window. However, there seems to be a lot of depth here with enough playing time to go around. If every start = 4.5 plate appearances, Matsui and Swisher can't really argue with 500 of them.
Again: Sh*tcan Melky.

Braves should def. go after Nady if they can get him for cheap. I will pass on Swisher. He strikes out too much and is unreliable. His defense is also average at best. Matsui would be an interesting fit. He can put up 20 HR's 100 RBI's if he stays healthy but the $13 MM contact that comes with him is a little high.

peavy for swisher hughes.... type deal anyone?????

As a Braves fan I say we should trade for Nick Swisher.

Yankees get:
Martin Prado - Super Utility
Todd Redmond - SP
Luis Valdez - RP

Braves get:
Nick Swisher - OF/1B

Jay212033: I'm not sure it would even take that much. Prado and a SP prospect might be all they are looking for.

Yankees don't need to add another SP. They can either sign Pettitte or let Hughes and others battle for the spot.

You may not want Swisher to get traded, but he and Nady have the most value. The Yankees are one of the only teams that can afford to have this expensive surplus sit on their bench so if they want to rid themselves of, say, Matsui, they'll need to eat a lot of salary. Many teams are cutting back right now so they may have to take back a bad contract to. Perhaps Matsui and cash to SF for Dave Roberts. They are not going to get a cheap quality prospect like Jonathan Sanchez for any of them so they may have to add to it or look for someone in the Jason Marquis line.

I wouldn't be suprised in the least to see the Yankee's keep all 4 of them this season. It is injury insurance and after the last few years that is a good thing. They most likely won't get an offer of what they need in return and it is probably of value to keep them.

Now, what they are really trying to do is aquire Manny and if they can make a trade first, they can get more in return. If they don't make a deal first, every team in the league will know they then need to make a deal and they will surely get a much worse deal. Even still, they should probably just keep an extra one of thos four on the bench for injury protection. It's not like they can't afford it.

Here's Swisher's contract info.

$5.3 million in 2009

$6.75 million in 2010

$9 million in 2011.

The club holds a $10.25 million for 2012, with a $1 million buyout.

So if we could get him and he puts up good numbers signed to that cheap contract he'd be a steal!

what if they could get peavy to fill out an already ridiculous rotation?

I think Swisher would fit nice for the Braves. I know the organization is weary of aquireing a long-term outfielder for fear that their prospects may be blocked but with his versatility you could move him to a different outfield spot or even move him to 1st cuz I think he's more comfortable there anyway. Then I'd sign Smoltz and Kawakami.

"trade matsui to tampa they have a surplus of starting pitchers and a good farm system"

The Yankees would heavily benefit from moving Matsui's contract. There is no way in h3ll a division rival takes on Matsui's contract AND gives up something of value.

Unless something could be worked out involving Matsui, Troy Percival(Rays' worst contract), and some fringe at best guys, with Yanks eating some of Matsui's salary.

"trade matsui to tampa they have a surplus of starting pitchers and a good farm system"

if they werent division rivals it would be perfect

"All I can say wow in regarding that comment. It pretty much speaks for itself."

d0uche that pretty much speaks for itself too. whats wrong with that proposal?

So lets say the Yankees trade Swisher. What will their projected staff look like?
1.J.Damon-LF
2.D.Jeter-SS
3.M.Teixeria-1B
4.A.Rodriguez-3B
5.X.Nady-RF
6.H.Matsui-DH
7.J.Posada-C
8.Robinson Cano-2B
9.M.Cabrea-CF
1.C.C.Sabathia
2.A.J.Burnett
3.C.Wang
4.J.Chamberlan
5.P.Hughes

M.Riveria-CL
B.Bruney-Su
D.Marte-MR
E.Rameriz-MR
J.Verez-MR
D.Robertson-MR
P.Coke-LR
...Beastly no doubt...

bkoke,

Why in the world are you making these ridiculous comments? I believe its pretty much a know fact that Yunel and Hanson are extremely more valuable than Swisher and Hughes.

wow braves fans are borderline ret@rded. hughes to charlie morton?

"Why in the world are you making these ridiculous comments? I believe its pretty much a know fact that Yunel and Hanson are extremely more valuable than Swisher and Hughes."

Hell one of those guys are more valueable than both Swisher and Hughes.

swisher has a career .805 OPS while escobar regressed from his rookie year to a .767 OPS while they both get on base about the same yunel makes better contact while swisher has more power. i take it back i will say that yunel is the more valuable player. saying that i will take hughes over hanson, or yunel (hanson was never part of any offer either). saying hanson is more valuable than both is ridiculous. what has hanson proved above AA? absolutely nothing.

hughes was dominating AAA and even the MLB at times at 21 while hanson was dominating A+ and good at AA. braves fans think he is the second coming of christ and need to get a clue

I totally with bravesfan23 and that's not becuz im a braves fan. It's cuz im not a fool. Ive watched both the Yankees and the Braves last season and Hughes hasn't been nearly has good as u proclaim. Yunel has the potential to be the best SS in the NL and to take Swisher over him is by far the most absurde thing ive ever heard

Dude you sound dumber and dumber by the second! While both were in the AFL this fall I seem to recall when they faced one another Hanson got the best of Hughes. Hanson dominated a hitters league against the best minor league hitters while Hughes was mediocre! You need to et a clue buddy!

I do however think Hughes will have a good year for the Yankees. You know there was alot of pressure put on him Kennedy and Joba last year...Im excited to see Hanson come spring training time tho.

You used two key words HAD and WAS. Scouts HAD Hanson as a #2-3 starter BEFORE this past season. He has since added velocity and more movement on his FB and he started using his slider again, now those same scout say he's a potential #1-2 starter.

Hughes WAS the 4th best prospect in all of baseball.

How about I'll give him Kyle Davies minor league numbers as well. His career minor league ERA was 2.92!

5.90= Phil Hughes Triple A ERA last year.

2.05= Charlie Mortons Triple A ERA last year

YFS78-

I think we're both getting to the point that Swisher should not be traded this offseason. He wouldn't fetch full value, that is correct.

I'm saying that that's the most VALUE a club should be willing to pay for Swisher right now. A smart GM will use that bid as leverage. That is also the primary reason why the Yanks should NOT trade Swisher. I think we can call truce on this one. :-).
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Not a problem melonis_rex. I think people are reading the situation wrong. The Yanks are not in a "must trade" situation. Unless the Yanks get something back that's meaningful then a trade for either Nady or Swisher wouldn't make sense. No way I'm trading a potential 25 hrs/80 rbis guy for a utility players and fringe prospect. They would be of more value playing the whole season. Now as for Matsui, I might take less simply because of his contract but I would still want something I could use. A utility guy can be found on the AAA team.

What about:

Nady, Cabrera and Horne

for

Andru Jones, Delwyn Young and Chin-lung Hu.

The Dodger slash some payroll.

Jones is owed:

$12.2M signing bonus ($5.1M in 2008, $2.1M in 2009, $5M in 2010)

08:$9M, 09:$15M

Yanks assume his $17 mil 09 salary. Nady is set to make about 7 mil after arb. Dodgers stick Nady in LF the Yanks give Jones a shot in CF, with Swisher in Rf and Damon in LF. Young and Hu both start in AAA. Young is under control for a few years and can fight for a full time job in 2010. Hu can be a possible answer if Jeter is move from SS in a year or two.

Jones is headed into a walk year as well as Nady. Both are Boras clients and should be motivated to have good years. Reports are that Adru came into the Domincan winter ball in great shape w/ a chip on his shoulder ready to prove his worth.

LF-Damon
CF-Jones
RF-Swisher
4th Of-Gardner

why not trade nady and a prospect like alan horne to the braves for maybe 1 of hernandez, heyward, of shafner?? i think it would be a good deal

It would either be Hernandez or Schafer, hough I jus can't see that trade happening especially since Nady is a Boras client. Heyward is untouchable along with Freeman and Teheran.

so what about swisher and prospect for schafer or hernandez? maybe trade nady at the deadline when someone will really need him

I think your Swisher+prospect for Schafer or Hernandez proposal would have a better possibility of happening

if i were the yanks i would try to get a outfield prospect since we gave up tabata i like schafer alot him and we have pitching depth so they need to get positon prospects.

BravoMan,

I think you are right about Schafer being on the untouchable list. I forgot that he was included with Heyward, Freeman, and Teheran

i can see them making a deal though wether is be nady or swish but i hope they get schafer, and draft some good prospects this year

well they have a-jax but one could easially move to left. i hope they do it there gunna trade one of these guys hopefully we get something good

I am obviously saying Hernandez and others in the above post

I agree

Yanks have no need to make a trade. Damon/Swisher in LF/CF is not that bad. Both are plus corner OF's or minus CF's. Unusual combo but it can work.

While on pure baseball terms, I agree Matsui's value is low. This is a business.

Godzilla is still a huge marketing tool and could really help sell a West Coast team in Japan.

I'd love to find a way to make a deal with the Dodgers where we ended up with Kemp but I don't see it.

Maybe Matsui, Cabrera and a pitching prospect? For Kemp, I'd be willing to add a premium one.