Dodgers Sign Eric Gagne

The Dodgers have officially signed Eric Gagne to a minor league deal worth up to $1MM. Gagne makes $500K if he breaks camp with the Dodgers and he can earn up to $500K more in incentives based on games and games finished. 

Dylan Hernandez of The Los Angeles Times first reported the deal and noted that it was official (via Twitter). Tim Brown of Yahoo! Sports added detail on the terms of the deal (via Twitter).

The Rockies offered the 34-year-old Gagne a minor league deal as well, however he apparently preferred the familiarity of the Dodgers' organization. He's returning to where he enjoyed his most big league success, saving 152 games while winning a Cy Young Award during a three year stretch from 2002-2004.


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119 Comments on "Dodgers Sign Eric Gagne"


lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

I am really happy about this. I dont expect a lot, but he is a Dodger legend, roids or not

55saveslives
5 years 6 months ago

Further proof that roids are ok as long as they play for that fans team.

start_wearing_purple
start_wearing_purple
5 years 6 months ago

You didn’t realize that yet?

5 years 6 months ago

So true everybody forgave A-Rod why not Gagne at least he has been clean and is trying a new role he started for the Canadian league not great numbers but he is getting his game together.

5 years 6 months ago

Hah. No one forgave A-Rod. Manny and Ortiz got the free passes.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

One thing… Manny is the only one to really serve a suspension, of any importance at least. He’s the only one that lost money from his contract… He may have had it easier in the media, but overall he got a fair amount of punishment

start_wearing_purple
start_wearing_purple
5 years 6 months ago

No, just people in NY forgive ARod. Just as people in SF still deny Bonds was on anything, people in LA and Boston deny Manny did anything, people in St. Louis have forgiven McGwire… it’s relative based on the fan base and I think pretty much everyone is starting the see the whole thing as a joke anyway.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

really? Every LA fan that I know has no problem saying that Manny was on roids. Just as was Lo Duca and Gagne… I cant speak for other cities, but LA has accepted that players used steroids…

5 years 6 months ago

only yankee fans forgave him every one else still thinks hes a-roid

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

Everyone has accepted that 90% of the league was on steroids. But you know what, without steroids, where is baseball? I’ll answer my own question… its gone. There is no more because it became boring. It was the same thing and no excitement. With steroids, it took all the semi-fans and took them back. Who did they support, McGwire or Sosa or Bonds?

I dont think roids are good for the game, but they saved it.

Now, IMO, using roids to get a safe record is a little different than using them to get the most elusive record in all of baseball. But that’s a different conversation

55saveslives
5 years 6 months ago

LOL!!!

It’s ok to use roids to make yourself better, but it’s not ok to use roids to make yourself better??

The difference is, Bonds used because he was jealous and an egoist. Gagne used because he wasn’t good enough.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

no. It isnt OK to used roids either way!

However, i think people have more problems with Bonds because he used them to not just become the best at hitting that the game has seen in a long time, but also took the most respected record in baseball. Im sorry, but most people dont care about saves, partly because they havent been recorded since the start of the game…

With your last sentence, that’s a little harsh. To say Gagne wasnt good enough isnt true. He had good minor league stats, not great stats, but solid none the less.

gwrange
5 years 6 months ago

And you genuinely believe the latter reason is worse?

55saveslives
5 years 6 months ago

There is no better or worse. Cheating is cheating. It’s a shame that Bonds did, he was a guaranteed first ballot hall of famer without roids.

LastNameEver1stNameGr8est
5 years 6 months ago

If he never used steroids he wouldnt have even been as good as he was..so therefore he would just be another clean player

LastNameEver1stNameGr8est
5 years 6 months ago

If he never used steroids he wouldnt have even been as good as he was..so therefore he would just be another clean player

5 years 6 months ago

you know what dude people forget that the NFl had a huge steroids problem at one point until they started offering harsh punishments. Now, you don’t hear about a single player in the NFL using roids. that’s where the MLB will be 10 years from now i guarantee you. Even without the roids, players will still perform and people will still watch the games, just as they do in football.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

There is still a steroid problem in the NFL. Men are not supposed to be that big naturally…

Anyways, yea, the MLB will probably be done with steroids in 5-10 years.

But without steroids in baseball in the late 90s/early 2000s, there is no baseball. People were getting bored. Steroids saved the game..

5 years 6 months ago

in a sense you’re right but mlb’s popularity has decreased since that time period

p.s. if i see pujols home run totals drop like heltons did i will definetley think he was on steroids considering the steroids era is ending

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

I really do think that Albert is clean. Unfortunately, we thought the same thing about Manny, Arod and even Ortiz… Not saying that I expect Albert to be on roids, but there have been countless others who everyone thought and hoped was clean, and they werent…

5 years 6 months ago

If Pujols’ homer totals drop, why can’t it be because of aging? Helton has a bad back as well, and he’s still a great hitter. He just doesn’t go deep as often as he did in his 20’s.

5 years 6 months ago

Actually, men are supposed to be that big. Men are supposed to be hairy. Men are supposed to be gruff. At 350lbs, those guys still move and perform better than 99% of the general public. Do not believe the hype that we are supposed to be metro, thats wrong. There is a growing rate of infertility in America, low testosterone rates among males to go with weak libidos. And if I have read some of the stories right, most professional athletes do not have a problem procreating and leaving offspring in every city they visit. Dude, manboobs are not natural. You think those big pros live off of fast food? You think they don’t drink raw milk, grassfed meats, etc? Try that regimin and you will get bigger.

Great point on Steroids saved baseball, well said.

5 years 6 months ago

Let me say that better, men are supposed to be as big as it takes to fight and defend what is their own. If 6ft5 400lbs is what it takes to defend your own, then yes, men are supposed to be that big.

5 years 6 months ago

The key words in your statement are “Now, you don’t hear…”.

Come on Tony, do you know anything about performance enhancers? Have you done your research? Now, I am not saying that you haven’t, so don’t take this offensively due to first glance, but steroids are the bottom of the barrel at this point in the game. Balco threw it in our faces that there is an underworld of science being utililzed to maximize human potential. EPO, HGH, Insulin… and these are just a few of the names we know about, and as far as I am aware (unless corrected on here), not one of these are picked up on tests. Steroids will not be out of baseball in 10 years. Steroids are not out of Football. Steroids are in basketball. The most heavily doped sport in the world is cycling and there have been about a trillion “Live Strong” bracelets sold.

What exactly is cheating? You do realize that the current banned substance list and punishments wasn’t adopted till 2006 according to Wikipedia. Gagne’s run was 2002-2004 and do we even know if he used steroids, and in 2004 no players were reprimanded for use due to testing being on the old banned substances policy adopted in 2002? If I read correctly, he apologized for being a distraction after the Mitchell Report, not steroids.

Not trying to be offensive to you bro, just wondering why everyone is on the “anti steroid” bandwagon?

Hope Gagne has a solid season and can move into the setup role for Broxton! Get back on whatever conquered 2002-2004, LAD needs it and I like watching the results!

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

I believe they have tests for HGH and insulin. It is simple to test for those drugs and unless they can explain them(they have diabetes for example), they get suspended. That’s why Manny was suspended, sort of. He had very high testosterone levels and then couldnt explain the HGH prescription…

5 years 6 months ago

No, like I said, I am pretty sure that you cannot test for HGH, and there is no approved test for it in MLB. Regular Insulin can be purchased in any drugstore (although you might attract attention) and that is as strong a steroid (intravenous) that you can put in your body, there are other products like IGF-1 (Insulin Growth Factor) that can change DNA in your body! So, how is that tested for? If you use with less than controlled moderation, you can become diabetic, which allows you to utilize steroids. Wonder how many professional athletes are mild diabetics…? Erythropoietin, or EPO, look that up, its long and drawn out. The DBols, Andro, etc are liver and kidney killers and not for the top tier professional athlete any more. I find it very amusing to hear an athlete, like _______________, say they did not know what they were taking.

And on top of all this, Balco was testing samples of their clients all the time to make sure that they came back within standards (test sampling, pre-testing, whatever you want to call it.

Watch Pumping Iron (movie) from the 70’s and watch Lou Ferrigino take handfuls of pills from his dresser. DBols, Tranqs, etc. Liver and Kidney killers.

Again, watch the documentary: Bigger Stronger Faster, even though you are only 16, you need to know what is actually going on and what males are currently facing.

Seriously, most people have NO IDEA what they are talking about when it comes to PED’s. It is literally the blind leading the blind on this topic. I am a father and when this topic comes up, I will do my research accordingly to give my son the PROPER answer and not just what the media leads us to believe about Eric Gagne.

We are so worried about “cheaters” when our country is being overtaken with suppressents and pain killers. Who cares if they are on roids. I sure don’t and I think Eric Gagne should still be on them.

markjsunz
5 years 6 months ago

You are 16 years old. You never saw baseball without roids. I am not sure it saved the game, if anything the players, the owners and Bud Selig looked the other way. Only when congress told them to get there acts together did they name a few players who just happened to leak out and made those player sacrifical lambs. Baseball has has other scandals in the past, and there are other drugs the players use that baseball does not test for. I guess a mickey mantle on roids would have hiy 100 homeruns in a season, or Willie Mays, or maybe a guy like Roberto Clemente. The players took the money, they took the cheers, but they belong in the Hall of shame, not the Hall of fame.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

no I have not seen baseball without steriods. However, I have talked to family that were die hard yankee fans in the 80s that just lost interest. They felt it was the same thing and there was nothing different. Many people apparently felt this way as the game went through a patch in the early 90s where they had some of the lowest fanbases in a while.

I think it can be safely said that had steriods not come and the world wide story of Bonds, Sosa and McGwire(hell, my dad remembers late night talk shows talking about it everyday… they brought them on as guests and it brought baseball from what hockey and NASCAR were a few years ago… nearly dead to the American public.

And I didnt mean to make it seem that I thought the sandal of steroids brought the game back. No, it was the performance that brought people back. Im sorry, but unless you are a die hard fan, having 10 people hit more than 30 homeruns in a year for the whole league gets boring after a while. I personally cant say what I would have done/did, because I wasnt watching baseball in the early 90s. What saved the game was the chase. The chase of records. If all of a sudden you have a record that has stood since Roger Maris broke Ruth’s record, and now there are 3 guys who are chasing it, that chase will make fans that are on the bubble come back to the game….

5 years 6 months ago

I was trying to post this, so it might show up twice, but worded differently. Mark, he may be 16, but Mays and Mantle are not good examples concerning PED’s. Go research those names and then come back and see how you feel. You are most likely not old enough to remember baseball without PED’s and steroids. You may think you are, but you have most likely been watching tainted baseball all your life. Even the greats were tainted.

Clemente, dirty or clean, regardless is a name that nobody should try to touch. Saint.

markjsunz
5 years 6 months ago

I saw my first baseball game in 1960 if you are correct in what you are saying show some evidence, show some proof. If you do then I will be happy to tip my hat to you.

5 years 6 months ago

Since it won’t let me link, i’ll post for you.
Peter Gammons article.
Words from decades ago sum up PED problem

Sunday, February 22, 2009 | Print Entry

I don’t pretend to know the truth, or what Angel Presinal did for Juan Gonzalez or anyone else. Or what the coaches at some of the nation’s biggest high school football factories provide.

I do know that Christian Red’s Sunday piece in the New York Daily News was not only far more significant than the Mitchell report, but is the beginning of what will be an unfurling of the Latin underground that Mitchell ignored and that has apparently plagued baseball for the past two decades, or more.

I do know why Robinson Cano and David Ortiz and Alex Rodriguez have come to Presinal’s defense.

Go to the Olympic Stadium in Santo Domingo most every morning during the winter and there are 50, sometimes 100 players working out. True to the heart of the Dominican players, those who are paid high salaries pay for the stadium and the expertise of Presinal so the young kids making minor league minimums or those looking for independent league invitations can get the same experience as the guys with the coin. Pedro Martinez once said, “The established Dominican players helped my generation — it’s up to us to do the same for the next generation.”

Presinal kills them with sprints and shuttle runs and hurdles and 220-yard dashes. Martinez has always credited him with the greatest, most painful massages he’s ever experienced. I don’t know if Presinal got Gonzalez the steroids that were seized in Canada, but I have gone to the stadium with Pedro and Ramon Martinez and Juan Guzman and Stan Javier and more than 100 other players and believe that, at the worst, most of them were innocently training. Could Presinal have obtained illegal drugs for some of the rich clients? Of course. As the Daily News reported Sunday, if you have the money, you have the way.

We are blasted with the stun guns of moral outrage. Bud Selig claimed he knew nothing of the PED world until he read about Mark McGwire’s andro in 1998; now he says he pushed the union for steroid testing in 1995. The incomplete Mitchell report never addressed where so many of the drugs came from, sticking with a couple of East Coast leaks and ignoring the underground steroids world of Latin America.

We now know that there are baseball players from the 1950s who had vision and other problems because of “red juice.” We read “Ball Four.”

John Perricone’s superb “Only Baseball Matters” blog this week recalled a 40-year-old piece by Bill Gilbert in Sports Illustrated. Here is an excerpt from Perricone’s blog:

“I have written — repeatedly — that I simply cannot believe that sportswriters only just recently discovered that athletes will use PED’s to improve their performance. I have stated again and again that the real reason — the ONLY reason — we have this ‘scandal’ in baseball, and nowhere else, is because of the recent assault on the venerated baseball record book. I didn’t read this Sports Illustrated article when it came out 40 years ago, because I was only 5 years old, but, it raises the same questions for me again:

How do these sportswriters expect me to believe that they haven’t known what’s been going on in the world of elite athletic competition over these last four decades? How can they ask me to be outraged when most of them have watched this problem develop, and waited over three decades to start sounding the alarm? Bill Gilbert, a writer I have never heard of, wrote this piece, a damning indictment of the widespread use of all sorts of PED’s. It was published in 1969, the same year we put a man on the moon:

… after it has been admitted that most citizens dope themselves from time to time, there remain excellent grounds for claiming that in the matter of drug usage, athletes are different from the rest of us. In spite of being — for the most part — young, healthy and active specimens, they take an extraordinary variety and quantity of drugs. They take them for dubious purposes, they take them in a situation of debatable morality, they take them under conditions that range from dangerously experimental to hazardous to fatal. The use of drugs — legal drugs — by athletes is far from new, but the increase in drug usage in the last 10 years is startling. It could, indeed, menace the tradition and structure of sport itself. … ‘Are anabolic steroids [a male hormone derivative that supposedly makes users bigger and stronger than they could otherwise be] widely used by Olympic weight men?’ rhetorically asks Dave Maggard, who finished fifth in the shotput at Mexico and is now the University of California track coach. ‘Let me put it this way. If they had come into the village the day before competition and said we have just found a new test that will catch anyone who has used steroids, you would have had an awful lot of people dropping out of events because of instant muscle pulls.’ … There are abundant rumors — the wildest of which circulate within rather than outside the sporting world — about strung-out quarterbacks, hopped-up pitchers, slowed-down middleweights, convulsed half-milers and doped-to-death wrestlers. Nevertheless, it is the question of motive and morality that constitutes the crux of the athletic drug problem. Even if none of the gossip could be reduced to provable fact, there remains ample evidence that drug use constitutes a significant dilemma, not so much for individual athletes as for sport in general. One reason is that the use of drugs in sport leads one directly to more serious and complicated questions. Is athletic integrity (and, conversely, corruption) a matter of public interest? Does it matter, as appreciators of sport have so long and piously claimed it does, that games be played in an atmosphere of virtue; even righteousness? If not, what is the social utility of games — why play them at all? Drug usage, even more than speculation about bribery, college recruiting, spit-balls or TV commercials, raises such sticky questions about the fundamentals of sport that one can understand the instinctive reaction of the athletic establishments: when it comes to drugs, they ignore, dismiss, deny.

… Setting aside ethical considerations for the moment, there are obvious reasons why athletes should use so many drugs. The most obvious is that there are more drugs available these days for everyone than ever before. Furthermore, we have all been sold on the efficacy of drugs. We believe that the overflowing pharmacopoeia is one of the unquestioned triumphs of the age. We have been sold on drugs empirically because we have tried them and enjoy the results. We have been sold by countless magazine and newspaper stories about wonder drugs — many of which later turned out to be less than wondrous — by massive pro-drug propaganda campaigns mounted by pharmaceutical manufacturers, by TV actors dressed in doctors’ coats and by real doctors, many of whom are very quick with the prescription pad. Generally, we have accepted rather uncritically the central message of this persuasive pitch — drugs are good for you.

… These days it is a cultural reflex to reach for a vial, an atomizer, a capsule or a needle if you suffer from fever, chills, aches, pains, nausea, nasal congestion, irritability, the doldrums, sluggishness, body odor, obesity, emaciation, too many kids, not enough kids, nagging backache or tired blood.

It would be surprising if athletes were not influenced by the same trends and tendencies that have the rest of us so high on drugs. … An example of how athletic pressure, ambition or maybe just ignorance at a sub-medical level can result in what charitably can be called dubious drug practices occurred a few years ago at the training camp of the San Diego Chargers. The story was told by Dave Kocourek, now an offensive end for the Oakland Raiders, but then a member of the Charger team.

‘I guess this anabolic steroid business must have started on the Chargers around 1963 or right in there somewhere. One guy I can remember who got involved was Howard Kindig. He came to us as a highly touted center and linebacker from Los Angeles State. He was long and lean and very quick, and they wanted to put weight on him, so in addition to using the weight program run by our weight coach, Alvin Roy, they started pumping him full of Dianabol [a popular anabolic steroid], and sure enough he gained about 30 pounds.’

It’s a six-page article, one that you must read. I tried not to cut and paste too much, but, it’s that noteworthy.

Here’s what Gilbert wrote FORTY YEARS AGO!!!!

… ‘A few pills — I take all kinds — and the pain’s gone,’ says Dennis McLain of the Detroit Tigers. McLain also takes shots, or at least took a shot of cortisone and Xylocaine (anti-inflammant and painkiller) in his throwing shoulder prior to the sixth game of the 1968 World Series — the only game he won in three tries. In the same Series, which at times seemed to be a matchup between Detroit and St. Louis druggists, Cardinal Bob Gibson was gobbling muscle-relaxing pills, trying chemically to keep his arm loose. The Tigers’ Series hero, Mickey Lolich, was on antibiotics.

Bob Gibson? He’s one of the heroes these guys keep going on and on about.

… ‘We occasionally use Dexamyl and Dexedrine [amphetamines] … We also barbiturates, Seconal, Tuinal, Nembutal … We also use someanti-depressants, Triavil, Tofranil, Valium … But I don’t think the use of drugs is as prevalent in the Midwest as it is on the East and West coasts,’ said Dr. I. C. Middleman, who, until his death last September, was team surgeon for the St. Louis baseball Cardinals.

Team surgeon? TEAM SURGEON!!!! How could that be? How could it be that the teams knew anything about this? The owners are paragons of virtue, men of impeccable character, who want nothing more than for the players to be healthy, happy and living on the same block as their sons and daughters, right?

How could a five-thousand word article, published in Sports Illustrated — which, in 1969, was THE preeminent publication on sports in America – not have been noticed?

Of course it was noticed. It was noticed to the point where the use of drugs continued, flourished and was an acknowledged part of the world of sports worldwide. And no one wrote about it, no one talked about it, no one did an Outside the Lines special report, no one did anything.

And in that type of environment, eventually, the drugs were gonna work. We have an NFL right now that has running backs as big as offensive linemen from championship teams of just a decade or so ago. We have baseball players bigger than offensive linemen as well. We have huge, super-fast, athletes everywhere you look, because the training programs, coupled with the tremendous advances in sports medicine, legal and otherwise, work. And one reason we know that they work is that athletes will do anything, will take any risk to win. The mantra, win at all costs, isn’t a slogan for a sports drink. It is the water these men and women swim in: … The whole matter has been succinctly summarized by Hal Connolly, a veteran of four U.S. Olympic teams.

‘My experience,’ says Connolly, ‘tells me that an athlete will use any aid to improve his performance short of killing himself.’

But before you start worrying about saving the children — please God, somebody save the children — let’s get something straight here. There is some good in all this.

You wanna know how? Think of sports as the NASA of the human body. We all know about the major advances in the space program that have influenced our daily lives. There are major advances being made in health improvements for normal, non-athletes that have come from sports, including advances in weight training, surgical techniques, and yes, drug treatments. The sports world has been one giant chemical experiment for the last four decades — at least — and anyone who has been to a sports medicine treatment facility, or a gym, or a GNC, can see the results.

We all want to be better, and we all will do most anything to achieve that end. There’s nothing new about that. It’s part and parcel of being an American, and America’s influence is global. In the world of competitive sports, the end almost always justifies the means. Using PED’s is just one of the ways athletes place themselves in harm’s way. One of my favorite players just passed away. Brad Van Pelt was THE linebacker for the NY Giants when Bill Parcells and George Young drafted Lawrence Taylor. He died in his sleep at the age of 57, a familiar story for the families of retired football players. Retired athletes die younger, have many more physical problems, and generally live in a world of constant pain once their playing days are over.”

At the least, Perricone should make us all think. Alex Rodriguez’s admission doesn’t bring baseball to an end; it should help those who love the sport edge closer to the truth, and allow players who want level playing fields to force the union into finally allowing one.

I don’t know the whole truth, no one does. That list of the 103 other players who tested positive in 2003 is out there and could become public, and there will be more stories and revelations. But this is more complex than simple good and evil, just as there has been a lot of good in what Presinal has provided young athletes in a poor country.

Perricone criticized some writers who really care about baseball and their kids and what has become so ugly. But it’s not just Barry Bonds, Bobby Estalella and Alex Rodriguez — it’s societal, and as Bill Gilbert pointed out in the first year of the Nixon presidency, has been for generations.

Let’s not be hypocritical towards Gagne.

thegrayrace
5 years 6 months ago

Meh, I doubt it.

I was really into baseball from the mid-80s until the very early 90s, and then paid almost no attention to it through the mid-late 90’s when Sosa, McGwire, Bonds, etc. were breaking all the records. Only in the last 3-4 years did I start getting back into baseball.

The game would have survived just fine. It may not have made as much money, but it would’ve survived. Are you saying baseball is boring today because of the absence of those steroid-ridden sluggers? It isn’t boring now, and it wouldn’t have been boring then.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

I think it is very safe to say that baseball wouldnt be what it is now had steroids not been in the game. The fanbases would be percentages of what they are now… the game itself would still be the same, but there wouldnt be millions of people that were watching and cheering as if their life relies on their team winning. I can say that with complete confidence…

And I dont have a crystal ball to say that had this not have happened, this definitely would have happened. However, I do think that baseball would either be gone or close to gone without steroids…

ivdown
5 years 6 months ago

Crap, I definitely did not mean to like this. You are certainly one to talk.

55saveslives
5 years 6 months ago

LOL…come on ivvy…

You know you and all your homies have been dogging Bonds for years. Then once Gagne, LoDuca, Manny, Mota etc….come up positive, all of a sudden it’s ok.

switchhitingjesus
5 years 6 months ago

It will be a very interesting story to follow over the spring.

Guest
5 years 6 months ago

Well the good news is that we have another Comeback player of the year candidate in the NL. The second good news is that there are some pretty loyal Dodger fans Dancing in the Streets right now. Whether he pitches well or not, he is a Dodgers Legend.

TommyL
5 years 6 months ago

Game over…in a couple more innings if I don’t blow it.

But really, this is all about entertainment and this is entertaining. Now sign Pedro!

5 years 6 months ago

I do like the idea of Pedro resigning with the blue crew, he can be the fifth starter and switch off with Stults or JMac.

bobbybaseball
5 years 6 months ago

Piece of crap cheater!

vtadave
5 years 6 months ago

Now that’s original…sigh.

bobbybaseball
5 years 6 months ago

OK but in the case of Gagne, his whole career seems based on steroids, while at least a guy like Bonds was a damn good player even before he juiced up. Not that it makes Bonds any less of a cheater, but it kills me when teams think these guys will ‘bounce back’. Bounce back from what?

5 years 6 months ago

Come on BobbyB, how do you know Bonds career wasn’t based on roids? I seem to remember Canseco parading around back in the 80’s, and I think he might have been on something, but I am still crossing my fingers and hoping that he finally admits to it. Nobody knows, that’s the point.

I would just like Gagne to have another sweet save at Dodger stadium while my boy and I munch on Dodger dogs and $10 sodas.

bobbybaseball
5 years 6 months ago

Well, we don’t know for sure, I’ll grant you that. But given the way his body imploded, his home run results, and the testimony in the trial, where Bonds was jealous of the attention that McGwire and Sosa were getting, it seems fair to me to conclude that Bonds didn’t’ juice prior to his home run implosion. He was the best player, all-around, that I ever saw prior to his head ballooning up like a beach ball. He could run, play defense and hit so well, but could not have broken Aaron’s record w/o the steroids.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

Correct me if I am wrong, but it sounds like Bonds was that 5 tool player you build a team on pre-roids, correct?

If true, and looking at some stats, it sounds like he could have been one of the best hitters of all time w/o steroids. My guess is he got jealous of all the media attention that McGwire and Sosa got even though they werent that ‘complete player’, so he changed. He realized he wasnt gaining that much power naturally, so the roids became the option of choice.

Kinda sad, one of the best pure hitters became quite possibly the biggest laughing stock of the 2000s…

bobbybaseball
5 years 6 months ago

um…yeah.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

the reason I made such a broad post is because I didnt see Bonds in this time. When I starting watching Bonds, he was already pumping the roids(he was in the majors before I was born… so, yea)… sounds a lot like what Matt Kemp is now… that 5 tool franchise player.. hopefully Kemp doesnt get involved with steroids…

5 years 6 months ago

But you are drawing your conclusion on media led hearsay…? I’m not calling your deciphering less than adequate, just wondering why “ballooning” is something we think is automatically associated with “roids”. I can’t use Lance Armstrong as an example because he never tested positive, but how “ballooned” was Floyd Landis? Not at all, and he won the Tour De France only to have it stripped from him due to PED’s.

I remember Canseco being a 5 tool guy at one point also. We think that we can recognize the traits due to steroids from what the media leads us to believe. “ballooning”, “roid rage”, are all myths to be only steroid issues. Remember creatine? What does creatine do? Doesn’t it cause the cells to expand and hold more water therefore allowing more growth in the muscle since it retains a longer, larger pump? That’s specific ballooning. Remember Alou going to the hospital and MLB considering banning creatine since a kid in Brenham, Tx died and Alou being hospitalized (only to find out that they were taking 8x the recommended dose).

Yes, you are absolutely correct in saying that Bonds was a 5 tool guy! But, seems to me that Bonds always felt slighted in the MLB. I remember something about him not winning a 3rd MVP in Pitt and feeling very deserved of the award and being very vocal about it. And we then have to wonder what the term “fair” means when you say that you feel it’s fair to label and call names without proper review of facts concerning Bonds and PED’s. I absolutely hate Bond’s personality and arrogance and have never been a fan, but…. is it fair? No.

bobbybaseball
5 years 6 months ago

Media led hearsay? Really? How about his own testimony where he admits taking these drugs, only to claim that he thought they were flaxseed?

Anyone who thinks that Bonds, Landis, Armstrong and the like were simply guilty of media speculation has their heads up their arse.

5 years 6 months ago

Bobby, the difference is that Landis is guilty, the other two are not (as of yet). You see, Landis had the title stripped from him because he popped for doping charges (guilty). Bonds, has only admitted to using flaxseed (you’re right), and Armstrong is free and clear. Bonds has served no jail time even though we have all watched this case unfold in the public eye. Senators have taken it upon themselves to see that he is put away for a long time, but for some reason, still no jail time. So all of the bandwagon baseball purists, like yourself, grow restless and demand action, and when no action is able to be taken, you take it upon yourself to burn them at the stake due to your own impatience. Yes he took the clear, but if the US Govt can’t prosecute him, what makes quote bobbybaseball unquote think that they are then qualified to serve as judge jury and executioner? And yes, a lot of all news, including this, is media led hearsay. Have you ever been involved in a world current event firsthand and seen the media not report the truth? Obviously not, I on the other hand, have.

Take my opinion with a grain of salt if you want, but “piece of crap cheater” is funny in my opinion. since this is how this started. I appreciate the conversation even if we agree to disagree.

5 years 6 months ago

Seriously. The Dodgers have the best bullpen in the NL West. If he makes the team — which the odds are most definitely against — it’s more that it’s a good sign for him, frankly. Which again, I doubt.

thegrayrace
5 years 6 months ago

Forget the NL West, the Dodgers have the best bullpen in baseball. 2009 stats show it wasn’t even close.

5 years 6 months ago

im not sure they have the best one in baseball that may be the red sox or angels

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

I think it could be really close. No team has as many power arms with great talent as the Dodgers. We have 3 guys with plus closer stuff, Broxton, Kuo and Belisario, Sherrill, a former closer in the AL East and Trancosso, who pitched in the 2nd most games last season and had a great FIP even though his ERA wasnt there… 3 guys who can strike out anyone in the league, a ‘proven guy’ who has somehow been able to get out of jam after jam and a sinkerballer who was great last season… If any team is on the level of the Dodgers, it’s close and they are almost undoubtedly not better..

5 years 6 months ago

right but some of the other guys in the dodger pen like the phillies pen, are relatively young and inexperienced and thats why this signing isnt exactly bad cause like halladay has been doing for the phillies young pitchers gagne might do the same for the dodgers

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

I agree. In fact, there is a picture on the Dodgers facebook page of Gagne stretching with Broxton. I know they are talking and if gagne had any tips about offspeed pitches, it will only Broxton…

Regarding the pens, I was just saying that the Dodgers have as much or more talent than just about any other team when talking about the pens.

Most Dodger fans who have commented on this thread are just warning the others to not expect Gagne to put together another streak like he did, for so many reasons…

Sent from my iPod

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

like thegrayrace said, the Dodgers have one of the best pens in baseball. They have 4 guys who could close on many teams, Belisario, Kuo, Broxton and Sherrill. Along with Trancosso, they have a lot of depth of high quality arms in the pen. Then 1/2 of their AAA is MLB ready and waiting for a shot, on the pitching side at least. They have a lot of depth.

Remember Cory Wade? He had a great 08 and then his 09 was horrible, partly because of injury and partly because of overuse. Now he is fighting to just get a look at for the pen, because so many people jumped him on the depth chart in just one year

Fredschickenshack
5 years 6 months ago

gagnes terrible without the juice plain and simple… i forgot he even exsisted… i wish him luck though cause hes gonna need it .

redsandyanksfan
5 years 6 months ago

well he was a starting in can am so maybe this could be a number 5 starter competion if he can do it unless they want him as relief

tyler41
5 years 6 months ago

Gagne isn’t gonna make it out of camp. he’s garbage and if he ends up in the dodgers bullpen thats a bad sign for LA

vtadave
5 years 6 months ago

Thanks Tyler. Us Dodger fans thought he was going to come in and win his second Cy Young this year. Crap.

flumesalot
5 years 6 months ago

Nice! Gold Star LOL for you sir :)

tyler41
5 years 6 months ago

well some of your compadres seem to like the idea of gagne comin back to LA. The dude hasn’t been anything more then what he was before the roids in at least 5 years.. whats there to be excited about?

bobbybaseball
5 years 6 months ago

Agreed.

Tommy_Blackjack
5 years 6 months ago

Last year, the signings of Jeff Weaver and Guillermo Mota were met with pretty much the same reactions as Gagne is now. Dodger fans, let’s see how it plays out. Worst case is he starts in the minors opening day. I hope like LD4YL that he can work a bit with Broxton and teach him his change up. I can picture it now, 100 mile heat followed by 80 mile change. Strike 3. Go Blue.

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

i think he has a changeup. what gagne should teach big broxton is that nice curve ball he used to have.

Tommy_Blackjack
5 years 6 months ago

I don’t think he does. I think he just has a fast ball, a slider, and a split he hardly threw after a while, at least that’s how it seemed.

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

no he does have a changeup to go along with all those pitches. i’m almost positive.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

he had what has been called a vulcan change. It puts extreme stress on the change if thrown w/o great mechanics. It is a change up, but sinks like a split… it is an amazing pitch when it’s working

5 years 6 months ago

“Almost positive” is exactly how I hope he shows up to Spring Training!

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

yeah your’e real funny man. what are you a giants fan?

5 years 6 months ago

Dude, think about it. Yes it’s a joke, but… I want to see the old Gagne back, hence the “almost positive” response. Not a Giants fan. I am actually pulling for Gagne this year. It will get real tiresome seeing him leave the stadium in his bentley if he sucks balls.

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

well good to know your not a giants fan.
well im pulling for the guy too but i just dont know if he can be successful in the majors next year.

vtadave
5 years 6 months ago

Yes, Gagne has a changeup. In his heyday, he’d be pumping fastballs at 95-98 and then mixing in a change that was 10 mph slower. Curves and sliders were in the mix, but relatively infrequent.

Now if you’re thinking he has no change NOW, who knows, you may be right, but how would you know that?

Tommy_Blackjack
5 years 6 months ago

I was actually talking about Broxton not having a change up.

Guest
5 years 6 months ago

HAHAHAHA.

flumesalot
5 years 6 months ago

I personally don’t care about the past steroids issue. If it was a current steroids issue? Damn right I’d care. With that said, please google the current article(s) on “extreme workouts” with Gagne, Russell Martin & Shawn Estes. Certainly not trying to cover for him for the past, but if you find & read the article in question, you’ll find these guys are busting their butts to do it the right way. I believe Gagne did the PED’s, but I also believe in second chances. All of them that used them are still a$$es; what sets Bonds, Palmiero, Clemens & McGuire apart are their varying degrees of denial. None of them—Gagne, Manny, A-Rod..ANY of them—should have ever put themselves in the position for bringing up this type of discussion. It is what it is. Oh and it’s not a “Giants thing”. Bonds hate (with the proper amount of respect for the natural talent) comes from being a Dodger fan. A “very clean” Willie Mays probably had suffered from the disdain of previous Dodger fans in retrospect, but at the same time the same Dodger fans looking back probably love & respect #24 as much as any Giants fan does. I do anyway. But for Gagne’s case, steroids or not, the sumbeech had a great change, great curve and a know-how I’d like to see him share with Broxton & Co. If he somehow beats the odds and makes the squad, Bonus.

Tommy_Blackjack
5 years 6 months ago

Not much I can add to that except bravo. Good post man.

gwrange
5 years 6 months ago

Extremely good post! One of the best I’ve seen in quite a while.

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

The day Gagne or any of these steroid users should never be mentioned with Mays. Gagne is grossly overrated and has fizzled out like many similar steroid players. Good riddance to him he should not be remembered fondly, he should be remembered as a CHEATER, just like ARod, Manny, Raffy, Bonds and so on.

5 years 6 months ago

You’re right, the heroes of baseball could not have possibly been on anything… Ya, that seems like a very valid argument. Ya, Hank Aaron didn’t admit to amphetamine usage in his book… Ya, Mickey Mantle didn’t have to sit out a portion of the season in 1961 from an infection caused by a dirty needle used to inject steroids and speed… Willie Mays teamate testified that Willie kept “red juice” or liquid speed in his locker… Ya, Sandy Koufax didn’t admit to being high while pitching… Ya, your finger pointing and protests while shouting “cheater” are well put together and flawless…

$1961279
5 years 6 months ago

FINALLY…someone who “gets it”. Ever since there was pro baseball there have been PED’s…ever see shots of Ruth’s back muscles? And yes, to those asking, ‘roids were around back then and their effect’s were known, at least as far as the building physical size anyway.

Many here need to read Jim Bouton’s “Ball Four” and his other books as well…trust me MLB has never been all sunshine and rainbow farts…

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

Hey I never said anything about those guys. Ampetamines were used as early as the 20’s its no suprise players have been using for decades. The Waner brothers used to boast they played every game drunk and I have heard the stories about Koufax as well. But Gagne, statistically, seems like a blatant user.

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

gagne is overrated? i think you should be drug tested buddy.

Guest
5 years 6 months ago

Just like Luis Gonzales.

Lanidrac
5 years 6 months ago

I still can’t believe that the only save he blew in 2003 was the only one I really wanted him to convert: the 2003 All-Star Game. That’s just further proof as to how cursed the NL is in that annual contest.

5 years 6 months ago

A pitcher prefer Chavez Ravine over Coors Field? Impossible!

markjsunz
5 years 6 months ago

Gagne is finished, maybe he could be a batting practice pitcher.

DarthVader87
5 years 6 months ago

Good for him, he can probably teach Broxton a lot. This was a wise move by the Dodgers I think.

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

Batting practice nowadays, this won’t be enough to salvage the Dodger’s top 5 worst offseason in baseball.

flumesalot
5 years 6 months ago

I don’t get the top 5 worst offseason thing. They simply didn’t make too many changes. Also means the didn’t degrade that much either.

TommyL
5 years 6 months ago

Unlike the severely underperforming D-Backs, the Dodgers didn’t need to be filling gaping holes in their roster. They needed a second baseman to replace Hudson and some depth for a fifth starter. Period. Yes, it would have been nice to see Frankie throw a wad of cash at someone like Lackey, but I also see the long-term advantage of not doing so. The Dodgers will be just fine and are still the team to beat in the NL West.

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

The DBacks may have had more holes to fill yes, but to say the Dodgers are just going to breeze through the division is ridiculous. They have maybe the second worst rotation in the division, and their offense could run into problems with the tops of the rotations of their competitors. And maybe you forget, the Rockies did not finish far behind the Dodgers and neither did San Francisco. Those 2 teams are better this year, and healthier. The DBacks are definetly better. And you specified the two needs the Dodgers needed to fill, and they filled neither. Padilla is a huge risk at the 4, and yes he pitched well down the stretch, but there is a reason he is journeyman. The Dodgers might very well repeat in the West, but it is not guaranteed. They are one major injury from a complete collapse(Speaking of which, add Webb’s missing 22 game wins to last years season, and see where the DBacks end up)

I think the Rockies will win the West this year, with SF/LA/ARZ all being pretty close behind them.

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

“but to say the Dodgers are just going to breeze through the division is ridiculous”

he never said they were going to breeze through the division, he simply said that they are still the team to beat in the NL west, as they are.

ivdown
5 years 6 months ago

The Dodgers have done very little this offseason, true. Too bad for you that they are still the favorite in the NL West (with the Rockies as the only real threat right now) as they’ve lost only 2-3 games in terms of value with the replacements they will use for Hudson and Wolf.

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

They have no replacement for Hudson or Wolf. and Billingsleys health is far from guaranteed. Same with Kershaw’s status as a staff ace. The Giants, Rockies and DBacks have far better pitching. I feel like the Dodgers will lose more than 2-3 games this year. In fact, the division is strong enough to keep LA out of the playoffs. This is not to say the Dodgers can’t do it, but it can not be said LA didn’t have a disappointing offseason.

ThinkBlue10
5 years 6 months ago

it really wasnt as dissapointing as people think. Sure we didnt get the starter that we needed but was there anyone out there that we can really depend on?

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

honestly, who did you want them to sign? Lackey is not going to live up to that contract. He isnt an ace, and whether you like it or not, we dont need an ace. Want to know why? We have two that coming into their own. Their ages? 21 and 25. Yea, our FOR is OK.

Regarding Billingsley, anyone who has been following this story has realized he was pitching with a hammy injury. My guess is it was an injury he was told he couldnt injure further by pitching and would heal with rest. Hey, guess what he got during the offseason? Amazing, isnt it? Believe me, it isnt a coincidence that he cruised through the first 75 pitches and then imploded. His hammys gave out as the game went on, and for a pitcher who uses his legs for his power, that isnt good. You then must change mechanics which can either lead to injury or a 2nd half like Billz’s.

I really dont know what people expected us to do. You want us to give up Dee Gordon and Chris Withrow, or a combination of one of them with Chad Billingsley for Halladay… only to pay him 60M? What’s the point? We still have only 4 starters… Sam for 2B, what did you expect? Yea, Uggla would have been nice. But given that they were asking for Sanchez from the Giants, only God knows what they’d want from the Dodgers. Felipe Lopez would have been a nice pickup, but other than that, there isnt anything the Dodgers could have done…. And that was the extent of our holes. Replacing a mid 30s pitcher who had a career year and a pissed off 2B who hit for only 1/2 the season.

Given your name, Im guessing you feel that Dbacks had an amazing offseason. But did they? They dealt Schezer, who seemed to be in that Matt Cain/Chad Billingsley mold for Jackson, who they will pay millions to almost undoubtedly regress… Then they will rely on a guy to come back from shoulder surgery and pretend he didnt miss a beat AND they need EVERY one of their young hitters to magically hit for the whole year… then, they are in contention. Not winning the division, in contention.

The Giants didnt really do anything to strike fear in anyone.. they still have no offense. And their second best pitcher, according to the advanced statistics(FIP compared to his ERA), he is going to regress, nearly a run in his ERA. That is huge. So, they added no offense and their pitching is going to get worse? Ok…

The Padres are rebuilding. The one thing Im worried about is how much they get for Agon…

The Rockies are the team that scares me. If anyone is going to beat us, it’s them…

One last point, that’s slightly off topic… isnt it kinda creepy how obsessed Jim Tracy is with the 04 Dodgers? It will be interesting if he does what he did with the Pirates… try to change players to be like his 04 team. If he does, the Rockies will fall out of contention(Note: I am not saying he will do this, just pointing out that every team he has managed since that team he has changed to be like the 04 Dodgers, no matter how different the teams are..)

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

I never said I think the DBacks had a fantastic off season. Giving up Scherzer is tough but Jackson could be an improved starter and if Kennedy, the former number 1 pick pans out, Josh Byrnes is gonna look like a genious. He could also end up the fool, but I can definetly see this trade working out well. And Kelly Johnson is a signing Im unsure of, so as far as Arizona goes, unless those 3 pitchers dominate, the team is prob not gonna make the playoffs.

As for LA, who wouldve I wanted them to sign? Pineiro. Bring back Wolf. Something. Padilla is not reliable and the 5th spot with them is a complete toss up. Might as well call up Cha Seung Baek.

lakersdodgersyankees4life
5 years 6 months ago

We did what we could with the money we had. We didnt have the money to resign Wolf or sign Pinerio… For some reason I have a feeling that Wolf wouldnt have taken 2/14-16, like he said. He realized he had one of his best years and if the two offers he had were 3/30 and 2/16, he’s taking the 3/30.

Pinerio? haha. Im happy he isnt with us. He had crappy year after crappy year and then Duncan convinced him to throw a sinker. The chances Joel is the same as last season… 5%. The chances he regresses… 85%. I just see no way he is as effective as he was in St Louis..

So, depending on how much Pinerio regresses, how much of a difference is there between Padilla and Pinerio? Padilla at least has good stuff, he is just crazy. Pinerio had to be taught the one pitch that made him successful last year. I’ll take Padilla over Pinerio… think of it this way. If Padilla is crazy and sucks, he is DFAd and its 5M down the drain. Pinerio regresses= 16M over 2 years down the drain. Which is worse?

And I think 25 of the 30 MLB teams have a competition for the 5th SP spot. When you have as much talent as we do for potential 5th starters, it isnt necessary to go spend extra money we dont have.

Regarding the Dbacks, I disagree. The only way he looks like a genious is if Jackson doesnt regress, IPK becomes a good starter and Scherzer sucks. That isnt going to happen, IMO. At least not all of that. Honestly, I dont think any of it will happen. Jackson got extremely lucky last season and will regress. IPK has shown nothing at the majors. And Ive always thought of Schezer as another Billingsley-type guy…

________________________________

dredinis21
5 years 6 months ago

I just don’t understand the double standard…especially in LA. I live in LA and hear it all the time. Gagne was GARBAGE prior to roids, to the point where people here in LA were calling for the Dodgers to trade him. He takes roids, dominates baseball, baseball starts to crack down on their steroid policy, and he returns to suckitude…but its ok because at least he wasn’t like Bonds. Add Piazza, Lo Duca, Dreifort, Kevin Brown and Beltre to your list of former Dodgers allegedly juicing…but again, its ok because they are Dodgers.

If you are going through the process of crucifying one, you must crucify ALL. If you start to judge them based on “intent” (Bonds is worse because he is breaking the most hallowed record in baseball…Gagne was just breaking a saves record, nobody cares about a saves record), then you will find yourself trying to read minds, which is silly. Did they juice or not? If so, what are your feelings towards ALL players that roided? Do you chastise your hometown hero the same way you chastise your rival’s players?

Dodgerblue18
5 years 6 months ago

For every single Gagne hater on this page I would just like to remind you that even though Gagne was in the Mitchell Report, you gotta realize that he also had 2 major arm surgeries as well. I will blame his problems on that over steroids anyday.

R_y_a_n
5 years 6 months ago

Sincerely,

A Dodger fan

I get that you want to defend your player, and the surgeries could very well have something to do with it, but the lack of steroids pretty obviously affected him. The lack of steroids could also be attributed to his injuries in the first place as well.

Dodgerblue18
5 years 6 months ago

Pretty obviously affected him according to who? Your case is as good as mine. Is that why Manny Ramirez didn’t hit as many homeruns in the second half of the season too? LOL I see far too many “coulds” in your response.

R_y_a_n
5 years 6 months ago

Pretty obviously affected him because when he wasn’t on them, he sucked, when he was on them, he was dominant and when he went off them again, he sucked.

Pretty simple.

coachofall
5 years 6 months ago

how is that sand you need to pull your head out of?

Dodgerblue18
5 years 6 months ago

This is a baseball website. If you don’t have a comment relating to baseball please refrain from hogging up the page with nonsense. Thank you.

tyler41
5 years 6 months ago

gagne never did anything before he started roiding so maybe his downfall cant all be blamed on roids but his success can probably be credited to that.. in my opinion

rockiesfan_303
5 years 6 months ago

Maybe the arm surgeries were required due to unforseen post steroid use breakdowns.

NateRego
5 years 6 months ago

Eric Gagne <3

SmackSaw
5 years 6 months ago

Good.