Latest Phillies Rumors: Lowell, Rivera, Schilling

Wouldn't it be a possibility that if they got Rivera, that Myers would return to the rotation?

While Crede for Burrell would be a win for the Sox on the field, I can't see them adding that much salary in a deal that doesn't improve SS or CF. There would be no money left to sign a FA CF and trade for a good SS, and depending on Burrell's demands to waive his NTC, there might not be enough moeny for either.

Gillick has said that he doesn't like the prospect of a Victorino/Bourn/Werth outfield. (and for good reason; that could easily be one of the least productive outfields in the NL.) I don't really see Burrell getting traded, especially for the mediocre-at-best, injury-prone Crede. Garland I could see, though.

Crede apparently had a very successful surgery and is on rehab soon if not now. I think the only question is his production. In the Phillies line up he could put up a .285/25/90 season with gold glove defense(not an overstatement).

I doubt Gillick will take Kenny Williams' word on any players' health after the Garcia fiasco.

don't get me wrong, I'm not blaming the White Sox; the blame's all on Gillick.

..there were some rumors about burrell to the dodgers last offseason and i think they could pick up again this offseason after the horrendous offensive year for the dodgers..with a surplus of pitchin in LA why not offer burrell up for derek lowe..lowe would be perfect in CBP with that sinker of his and burrell would finally provide a power threat to the LA lineup..money is also close to matching so the phillies wouldn't have to worry about picking up any of it..it could be an easy transition for burrell as well with former teammates in lieberthal and wolf loving LA..MAKE IT HAPPEN PAT!..

I really like Crede. And there's no way in heaven or earth that I'd trade Pat Burrell for him.

With Burrell, you know what you're going to get: something in the neighborhood of .270/.400/.500 with around 30 homers and 100 RBI, every single year. With Crede, who knows. His 2006 season was very encouraging, but he still doesn't draw walks--a crucial element in the Phillies' attack--and we had a terrible experience with a plus-defender third baseman with back issues (David Bell). I wouldn't go down that road again.

Of all the proposals here, I could see Burrell for Lowe. He'd be a great #2 behind Hamels, piling up innings and throwing that sinker.

where would Burrell play on the Dodgers? with Pierre, Ethier, Kemp, and Loney you've already got guys in the outfield and at first.

How about Burrell going to the Padres? Chase Headley seems like a fit. That would free up some '08 salary for the Phillies to bring back Rowand and to go after Schilling.

Burrell is likely to outproduce all the Dodger outfielders, so sure why not? Id want to make sure I had another innings eater type lined up before Lowe I let go though.

if they move Burell for somebody that doesnt make too much money, they owe it to their fans to retain Rowand or get Jones or Hunter

Daveinexile,

With players like Ray Durham, Randy Winn, Dave Roberts, Barry Zito, Rich Aurilia and Bengie Molina on the team, I think they are in a win-now mode.

I just have heard too many rumors of Lowry being tradebait to be convinced that he's part of their long-term plans.

The phillies closed the season with a 103Million dollar payroll after all was said and done, and Dave Montgomery said it would be around the same or maybe higher come next season. Here is a list of free agents for the phillies with their 2007 salary, however some players came way of trade so they don’t have to pay their full salary so I did my best to come up with the salary the phillies were left to pay when they acquired the player The phillies have 11 FA on their team. Alfonseca(800K), Barajas(3M), Garcia(10M), Iguchi(1M), Lieber(7.5M), Lohse(1.2M), Mesa(600K), Nunez(1.295M), J.C Romero(800K), Rowand (4.35), Julio Santana (700K), Dobbs(800K), Werth(800K).

So if we read this report where the phillies have about 20-25 million to spend where should it go?? Looking at this team offense which was tops in the leagues in almost every statistical category there was two major flaws. One, it was a team that was 5th in MLB with 1205 STRIKEOUTS. Two, with runners in scoring position they were ranked 26th in MLB with a .259BA and led the league 384 SO.

In my opinion, Aaron Rowand is not the perfect option to bring back to Philadelphia at 10M a season, even though I am a huge Rowand fan he SO 119 times last season which was 43rd most in MLB out of 250 everyday players. In a lineup that includes Ryan Howard (199SO) and Pat Burrell (120SO) that is too many SO for a 4-5-6 combo in a lineup. That money will be much better served on MIKE LOWELL who has averaged 83SO p/yr over his 8 year career. Also, LOWELL is as good defensively as ROWAND on a position to position comparison. LOWELL brings you about 50 less SO a year and with a .259BA with RISP a guy who puts the ball in play 50 more times is a lot more dangerous to a lineup that already lead the NL in runs last year.

Now that could possibly give you the best infield in MLB, but how will the outfield be? If Rowand is let go, the projected outfield would be Burrell(LF), Bourn(CF), Victorino(RF) which offers a lot of speed to a team who led MLB in Stolen Base %. The phillies should lock up Jason Werth and/or Gregg Dobbs. Both of who can play both corner OF positions and add good depth and power off the bench. With this kind of OF depth I believe the phillies should/would trade either Shane Victorino or Michael Bourne to get a SP. Dontrelle Willis and John Garland would probrobly cost a prospect as well as one of them. Then they can go out and sign a quality OF for 4-5M or make Werth/Dobbs a starter and have Roberson fill in as a bench player

If the phillies don’t go in that direction I see them making a strong run at bringing back Curt Schilling. Schilling loves Philadelphia and wanted to return here before signing with Boston a few years back. He also gives you that No. 2 starter you are looking for at the top of the rotation, and a big-game pitcher the phillies desperately need. To sign Schilling in my opinion it would take 2yrs/ 12 million per season. Now, people opposed to this would say that you rotation is becoming too old with Moyer and Schilling in it which is very true. However, if you read Pat Gillick comments this past week. He expresses how top pitching prospects Carlos Carrasco, Andrew Carpenter, and Josh Outman, Joe Savery wont be ready at least until 2009. Now if one of them four can turn out to be a #2, #3 starter you then have Moyer or Schilling’s spot replaced in the rotation. By that time Schilling contract, Burrell contract, and the money were paying for Thome contract to expire (approx. 30M), that can be spent on the big 2009 FA class of Johan Santana, Jake Peavy, Jeremy Bonderman.

With Myers staying in the bullpen, along with Gordon, Madsen, JC Romero(85% will be resigned), and Scott Mathieson(coming off surgery). The phillies will probrobly add a mid reliever to the bunch to fight over the 7th inning job. All in all I believe the phillies have a bright future as long as they can add key players to compensate for their weaknesses on offense and in the rotation

If you want someone tough to K, go for Crede. 50 K's in his 30 home run season.

Yeah, there isn't a huge problem with Rowand striking out a lot if he can put up the production he did. Still though, Crede swings a lot and depending on where he hits in the order he could get a lot of fast balls.

He's a good hitter, just not an overly valuable one.

We'll have to see what kind of production he brings before he can we can be sure. It depends on whether he can repeat 2006 or better it(which isn't out of the question at all). He drives in a lot of runs, which is valuable no matter how you look at it. Lots of doubles and homers when he's healthy.

It depends on if they can get a third basemen elsewhere. I'd rather have Crede and a Bourn/Werth platoon than Burrell and a Dobbs/Helms platoon.

How about Kevin Kouzmanoff for Michael Bourn?

I just don't get the love Mike Lowell is experiencing. Great year - yes. Can you count on it for the future - NO.

2007 .325avg .378obp .356risp
2006 .284avg .325obp .268risp
2005 .236avg .298obp .207risp

2007 Home/Away stats:
Home: .373avg .418obp .575slg
Away .276avg .339obp .328slg

Lowell's great year is really a product of his high BA and his high RBI's. He's suddenly a clutch hitter. Look at his career stats though and you see that he typically hits under his normal BA with RISP. Until this year he would be considered a choker.

As great as 2007 was for Lowell he was aided but insanely high home stats. Throw in that his away stats are pretty typical production for his past years and I can see why he wants to resign in Boston. If he were to go to a team like the Dodgers my money is a line like: .265/.320/.375. Not exactly $12m/year material in my mind.

Daveinexile,

I think that the Giants are trying to unload Lowry because his value is at it's peak and his good ERA is masking his horrible WHIP. He can't keep hitters off the basepaths and his absurdly low number of HR's SCREAMS of luck.

And so what if those contracts are holdovers? They still have to play them for the next two years. It's not like they magically go away and they're going to bench them all.

Trading away Lowry won't damage the rotation because they still have Cain, Zito and Lincecum and that's a pretty decent trio. Getting a player like Burrell (who, if you want to harp on the other vets having short term deals) gives you a one year rental to attempt to contend this year and helps give you a power bat in a line-up that pretty much is devoid of one. He replaces Bonds in LF and gives them someone to plug into the clean-up spot. If they get one more offensive cog and someone like Ray Durham or Dave Roberts rebounds, they can contend in that division IMO.

Saying they're not in a win-now mode would also kind of imply that they have young talent ready to develop which is simply not true offensively.

I'll post his full numbers this year:

.275/.329/.457/.786

30 2B 18 HR 74 RBI 32 BB 94 SO

But he really had a bad April:

.113/.171/.183

And our manager Buddy Black stuck with him so he gets props for that.

Thanks guys, you cleared a couple things up for me. I like the idea of it, but thought he was younger.

As for hearing that Bourn's problem would be getting on base, you're right. Specifically its whether he becomes a Juan Pierre lager, with a better arm and speed, or a Juan Pierre lite. The biggest problem is that he hits practically all singles, and going to PetCo certainly wouldn't help that.

JZA come back from the week end so I am a couple days late. The Giants core is on the mound. True Giants do not have the talented young core in position players. The Giants are not “ rebuilding” by choice. They are because their divisional talent level forces them to think longer term.

Their “savvy veterans” ( Sabean’s terms not mine) are very unsavvy. Check the 2-9 positions in the NL west again. Durham is showing all the signs of age catching up. Roberts can only be counted on for about 900 innings. That leaves Molina & Winn as the only position players not automatically on the bottom when compared to the rest of the division. The Giants currently have 2 ( maybe 3 position players) that are not on the bottom. The remaining vets are less talented then the handful of marginal prospects the Giants currently have up ( Lewis, Frandsen, Ortmeier, etc) so renting a position player for 1 year over the winter as no appeal to the Giants.

If the Giants think it’s a win now event they keep Lowry and make everyone else in the West chase pitchers like mad rather then try and catch up to the Rockies & Dbacks young offenses.

I am making no case for Lowry as a Cy Young. He is a very cheap young established lefty. A solid #3- #4 starter. I think we agree with that. I am under no delusion of his accomplishments. Were you and I might sell high Sabean almost never thinks that way. Sabean will think why lose 3 cheap years of a solid lefty for I guy I can sign next winter?

Also the Giants have no left side of the infield signed for the parent club with no heir apparent for either spot in AAA that Burrell does not address. Burrell , as much as I like him, is no Bonds or Vlad and he can only play one position at a time.

In Regards to PTB to the WSox for Crede...

It actually makes a good bit of sense for both sides. But it will cost them crede and a serviceable reliever, or a propsect who is 1 year away.

PTB is a great fit for the sox because not only will he be the best offensive OF on the WSOx, he also will provide a great DH against Lefties and in 09 when thome's contract expires, PTB can be the everday DH.

But: 1) PTB likes playing in philadelphia

2) PTB will probably not want to play for the Whitesox

Also, those who think the phils have to kick in extra money to get it done are seriously undervaluing what a team is going to pay for a guy who hits 100 Rbi's and 30 HR and an OPS above .840

Burrell is a steal and really, a very logical addition for the Whitesox.