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« Delgado's Option Set At $12MM | Main | Mets Rumors: K-Rod, Castillo, Pedro »
Jocketty Wants Right-Handed Slugger
According to John Fay of the Cincinnati Enquirer, GM Walt Jocketty lists a right-handed run-producing hitter as the Reds' top offseason need.
In our Reds Offseason Outlook, we suggested the Reds attempt to trade for Adrian Beltre. That could improve the team on both offense and defense. Commenters on that post noted that Chris Dickerson could play center field in '09, leaving a vacancy in left. Right-handed hitting left fielders on the free agent market include Manny Ramirez and Pat Burrell. The Reds could also consider Matt Holliday or Magglio Ordonez as trade targets. Payroll could increase to $80MM, which could leave the Reds with $20MM to spend.
As for the Reds' own free agents, Hal McCoy sees them attempting to re-sign Jeremy Affeldt, Jerry Hairston Jr., and Mike Lincoln.
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Any reason why you didn't throw Juan Rivera in there?
Dude's got legit 25-30 HR power.
Posted by: bseballcrzy17 | September 29, 2008 at 11:43 AM
The Reds will make a move for either Holliday, or Magg's, you can bank on it
Posted by: redhawk61 | September 29, 2008 at 11:52 AM
Rivera having slugged .438 this year while missing most of '07...I am not sure if he is the kind of run producer Jocketty is talking about (even if he might be a decent signing).
Posted by: Tim Dierkes | September 29, 2008 at 12:06 PM
Throwing Kelly Shoppach out there again. Hannigan is good behind the plate but Shoppach is good there as well plus bring a big bat capable of 20-25 HRs.
Cleveland and Cincy have hooked up on several trades in the past too...
Posted by: Hermie13 | September 29, 2008 at 12:19 PM
Tim -
That's also in basically 2 month's time. He's only been playing consistently since the end of July.
He may be a good fallback plan.
Posted by: bseballcrzy17 | September 29, 2008 at 12:50 PM
I would love to see the Reds go for Maggs...heck we'll take Dontrelle as a salary dump and see if he can come back to his old form in the NL
I still like Furcal to lead off
Posted by: GmblngPtchr20 | September 29, 2008 at 12:52 PM
I still like the Ordonez to the Reds idea. He would give them a consistent, professional hitter to place into a lineup that really doesn't have a great deal of patience, or experience. Giving Dickerson a shot in center wouldn't be a bad move, and the Reds could really be a solid team next season. They could afford to give the Tigers salary relief, as well as a solid hitting prospect (Valaika? Juan Francisco?) or two.
Another option, which is sort of a combination of the other options, would be to trade Edwin Encarnacion to the Mariners for Beltre and a little something, and then add Juan Rivera to take over in left. Beltre/Rivera wouldn't produce nearly as much as Encarnacion/Ordonez would offensively, but it would be a defensive improvement as well as far cheaper long term.
Posted by: scribbletone | September 29, 2008 at 12:53 PM
"I still like Furcal to lead off"
If the Reds could convince a (HEALTHY!!) Furcal to come to Cincinnati, that lineup would immediately become really, really interesting. With Phillips moving down in the order to like the 6 spot, and Votto, Bruce and Encarnacion in the middle of the order, they could some serious production out of that lineup with an elite leadoff hitter.
Posted by: scribbletone | September 29, 2008 at 12:56 PM
Who would the Reds have to give up to get Mags, assuming they take on his whole salary... I'll assume since the Tigers already have a reclamation project in Willis they won't want Bailey.
Posted by: start_wearing_purple | September 29, 2008 at 01:11 PM
I would guess that the biggest possibility could be Manny. I doubt that he will get what he is looking for in a long term contract, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him sign a big one year contract and try the market again after the 2009 season. If Maggs were a free agent, he would be great...but he isn't. Maggs would cost well more than he is worth for one year. And jocketty is a bigger moron than anyone we have had if he were to take Willis for anything. The only way that i give willis a chance is if they take alex gonzalez and ryan freel off our hands...taking his salary would be worse than signing a one year 3 mil contract to Corey Patterson.
Furcal could work, i still like Raul Ibanez as an option for LF
Posted by: coltholt | September 29, 2008 at 01:13 PM
GMs could benefit by going on this site.
I think the only move they should make is trading Bailey for Salty....
I'm not a reds fan, but I have a ton of respect for Walt Jocketty
Posted by: prov1x41 | September 29, 2008 at 01:27 PM
Beltre to the Reds does make sense, but there's no way that it would be the Mariners "adding some." Beltre carries far more value than EE, so it would be the Reds "adding some" to that deal to make it work. I think the Mariners would rather get a young pitcher in return. Have the Reds given up on Homer Bailey yet?
Posted by: baseballismylyf4 | September 29, 2008 at 01:37 PM
Guys:
Have any of you looked at Ordonez's contract? With 460 PA next year, it becomes 3/$51M guaranteed thru his age 37 season. Plus, he's a pretty bad defender. Why should the Reds bail Detroit out of that terrible contract?
Posted by: sidnancy | September 29, 2008 at 01:38 PM
"Beltre carries far more value than EE"
Depends on how you define "value". While he's a better defender, he:
1. Hits only as well as EdE
2. Is 4 years older
3. Is owed $12M in '09
4. Is a FA after '09.
Encarnacion, on the other hand, will probably make in the neighborhood of $3M this coming season, and is under control for 2 more seasons.
Posted by: sidnancy | September 29, 2008 at 01:41 PM
Personally, I think it is foolish to trade for either Beltre or Holliday, unless a long-term contract is signed before the transaction. With that being said, I think the best option for either player is to wait until next offseason during FA to sign them. What' the Reds' rush? We aren't winning in 2009, but could be primed for 2010.
The Ordonez idea is crazy. The guy would instantly be the oldest player on the squad, and be a defensive nightmare, akin to Dunn in the OF. There is no way that the Reds should try to take that contract, even if he has a couple more productive years left in the tank.
I'd much rather see them take a chance on someone like Juan Rivera this offseason, and wait for the bidding for Holliday or Beltre next offseason.
Posted by: wanderinredsfan | September 29, 2008 at 01:50 PM
Beltre definitely does not carry far more value than Encarnacion. They similar hitters and Beltre is far better defensively, but in terms of overall trade value EE wins. Beltre is a FA after 2009, while Encarnacion is still under team control. Encarnacion is also younger and cheaper and there is reason to believe he will improve all around as a player. Beltre would likely see an uptick in his numbers by moving to Cincy and the NL, but Encarnacion will likely still improve as a hitter and has some nice potential. At this point, while Beltre will likely be the far better player in 2009, Encarnacion should/would be worth more in a straight up trade
Posted by: scribbletone | September 29, 2008 at 02:26 PM
Reds need a Right Handed hitting Left Fielder??
Two words: Josh Willingham.
He is Arbitration Eligible and even after winning, will NOT cost as much as Holliday or Ordonez.
As far as trading talent to get Willingham, he will ALSO not cost as much as Holliday or Ordonez.
So, based on Willingham's 2006 and 2007 stats, you would get a Right Handed hitting, Left Fielder that would put up 80% of Adam Dunn's RBI's, 80% of his Strike Outs but would only cost 1/3 (or less) of his salary.
Posted by: ctownboy | September 29, 2008 at 04:00 PM
Willingham? Hes coming off a bad season. Im sick of putting money down on people we dont know will produce.
We have pieces to trade, and our ML roster is pretty young meaning we cold trade some prospects and get good players. Maybe if the Marlins throw in Olsen or maybe even Gregg we can work on a nice trade, but I want someone I know will come to the plate and produce.
Manny? I mean maybe he's smart enough to realize he alone can help make the Reds much much closer to competing next year, not to mention the domino effect if Manny were to come with other free agents...not to mention we'd still have trading pieces. Manny would be able to seriously rack up his numbers due to the offense around him and not to mention how easy it would be for him to hit HRs and chase mildstones.
20 million a year for 2-3 years? For one of the best hitters alive? Surrounded by Bruce and Votto who wont make serious money til after that, along with Cueto and Volquez...we put up with Dunn's defense for a long time, and Manny's is better. It'll be pressure free in Cincy...
Posted by: GmblngPtchr20 | September 29, 2008 at 05:15 PM
Here is why Willingham makes sense.
The Marlins are going to HAVE to let some players go because they are NOT going to pay for everybody who is either already getting raises or going to be Arbitration Eligable. Because they are going to be over a barrel and because Willingham is NOT one of their major stars, they will probably be more willing to deal him than say Dan Uggla. Because of that, the asking price will NTO be as high.
So, you take Willingham OUT of a Pitchers park and put him IN a hitters park and his production is going to increase.
By NOT trading away a LOT of prospects to get him and by NOT having to pay him a lot, like they would have to with Holliday or Maglio Ordonez, that leaves the Reds room to make a deal or deals at the trade deadline IF they are in contention and NEED something.
So, WHY trade away a LOT to get Holliday, who will probably just leave for Free Agency after 2009 or Ordonez who is one of the older players out there and who is, supposedly, not one of the better defensive players?
Why not just trade for a low key guy who is going to hit .260 to .270 with 20 to 30 Home Runs and 80 to 90 RBI's and who ALSO wont have to be paid a lot? Then, use the money saved to bolster the Bull Pen, since Reds' Starting Pitchers DON'T usually make it past the sixth Inning.
Posted by: ctownboy | September 29, 2008 at 07:08 PM
In order for the Reds to be a consistent winner they need to get 3 agile outfielders that can catch a ball in the gap. They need middle infielders that can pick the ball and corner infielders that can put up the big HR and RBI numbers and yet not be completely incompetent with a glove (Encarnacion). The catcher is a defensive oriented position and whatever offense he gives you should be a bonus. The pitching staff needs to be solid from top to bottom and filled with ground ball pitchers to keep the ball in our small ballpark.
With all of that being said I spend 14-15 million a year for 3 years to sign Derek Lowe and insert him into the 1 or 2 spot in the rotation. That makes the rotation and bullpen that much stronger.
I would then sign Rocco Baldelli to play LF. With his history of injuries I would hope that he could be signed for a reasonable price (4-5 mil). If Hairston is resigned you have Freel, Hairston, Dickerson, Hopper, and Baldelli to play CF and LF. They can bat 1-2 in the order and you can now steal bases and bunt. That puts Votto batting 3rd, Phillips 4th, Bruce 5th, Encarnacion 6th, Gonzalez 7th, and Hanigan 8th.
With this pitching staff and lineup the Reds will be involved in many 3-2, 2-1 games. However, they can now better manufacture runs because they have guys who bat for average. (Exception of Eddie, Freel, and Bruce) This lineup gives the Reds the best chance to win NEXT YEAR! Forget 2010, I want to win now!!! (Wow! I think I just sounded line Castelini).
Posted by: ricker26 | September 30, 2008 at 12:02 AM
Some good ideas on how to fix the Reds. How much money do they have to spend though?
Getting a big right-handed bat and improving defense....I'd make moves similar to this:
Trade for Kelly Shoppach of the Indians. Adds right-handed power and allows Hannigan to be a backup where he really belongs.
Sign Orlando Cabrera for SS. He's got great defense....him and Phillips would be one of the best double play combos up the middle in the league.
Sign Casey Blake for 3B and move Encarnacion to LF. Gives you better defense on the infield and another veteran bat capable of 20 HRs (plus he plays decent enough defense at 3B). Could also leave Encarnacion at 3B and use Blake in the OF.
Gives you a lineup of:
Dickderson - CF
Cabrera - SS
Votto - 1B
Encarnacion - LF
Bruce - RF
Phillips - 2B
Shoppach - C
Blake - 3B
Not too shabby if you ask me....and pretty doable as well....
Posted by: Hermie13 | September 30, 2008 at 12:04 PM
Honestly, I am suprised that Ordonez is the primary name mentioned in this thread. Pat Burrell is a much better choice. Check out his career stats. He is a 30+ hr, 90+ rbi guy. Perfect fit in LF. I do like the idea of Furcal, but Gonalez is back next year, provided he stays healthy. Hairston, Lincoln, Weathers and Affeldt should be priorities.
Give Hannigan, Dickerson, Hopper, Freel and Keppinger a chance to play.
Ideal lineup:
CF Freel/Hopper/Dickerson
SS Gonzalaez/Keppinger
2b Phillips
RF Bruce
LF Burrell
1b Votto
3b Encarnacion
C Hannigan
Keeping in mind, that the catcher position is a premium defensive position Hannigan should be ok. Maybe resign Bako too. The pitchers learn from him and he was originally drafted by the reds.
TRADE NO ONE!!!
Posted by: billzbubba | October 11, 2008 at 12:37 AM