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Red Sox Rumors: Crisp, Lugo, Burnett, Baldelli

By Tim Dierkes [November 7, 2008 at 12:11pm CST]

Nick Cafardo of the Boston Globe has the latest on the Red Sox.

GM Theo Epstein says there's one deal he might be able to do before the winter meetings, possibly involving Coco Crisp or Julio Lugo. The free agent market for center fielders and shortstops is weak this year.
Cafardo doesn't believe the Sox are in on C.C. Sabathia or A.J. Burnett, and he says they're unsure about Derek Lowe. However, Buster Olney says "there is an expectation within other quarters of the AL East that the Red Sox will get in on the Burnett bidding." Cafardo does see Boston adding a starter of some kind, possibly a Japanese free agent.
Catchers on Epstein's radar to varying degrees: Jarrod Saltalamacchia, Taylor Teagarden, Jeff Clement, Bengie Molina, and Ivan Rodriguez.
Cafardo says the Red Sox are "more than intrigued" by Rocco Baldelli, who could fill their fourth outfielder role if and when Mark Kotsay leaves.
Tony Massarotti discusses Mark Teixeira in-depth at his blog.

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yay baldelli, home team buddy!

Posted by: 04Forever | November 07, 2008 at 12:33 PM

Complete speculation but, wouldn't something like this work?
Saltalamacchia or Teagarden to the Red Sox
Coco Crisp to the White Sox
Nick Swisher to the Rangers

... then the Rangers spin Swisher to the Yankees for prospects like Horne and Marquez

Posted by: rossdfarian | November 07, 2008 at 12:34 PM

I hope the sox sign Pudge

Posted by: Zig | November 07, 2008 at 12:35 PM

Swisher's value has dropped, he isn't worth Horne or Marquez. Not to mention, if we don't sign Tex, we have other back up options. Thanks, but no thanks.

Posted by: Zig | November 07, 2008 at 12:36 PM

Theres no way the soxget salty or teagarden and only give up crisp...no way.

this is coming from a huge sox fan. we'd have to toss in atleast a pretty decent prospect

Posted by: xwoojinx | November 07, 2008 at 12:39 PM

id rather just deal with texas, 3-ways get to messy, they fall through to much.

Bucholz for Salty

raw for raw, we have to much pitching, they have to many catchers, makes to much sense that it will never happen

Posted by: 04Forever | November 07, 2008 at 12:42 PM

Seriously, Zig? I have to imagine if Williams had one of his zany moments, Cashman would move the iffy Marquez or soon 26 year old Horne for Nick Swisher in an instant. Possibly quicker.

Posted by: Not Joe Morgan | November 07, 2008 at 12:43 PM

"Swisher's value has dropped, he isn't worth Horne or Marquez."

What..? Swisher's value has dropped some, but most educated baseball people know that Swisher was a victim of really awful luck more than anything. His BABIP was extremely below his career average, even though his line drive rate was right in line with his career numbers. Swisher is a serious candidate to bounce back next season, and the White Sox should realize that and not deal him at a fraction of his full value.

Posted by: scribbletone | November 07, 2008 at 12:45 PM

If the Red Sox sign Baldelli, who is probably my fav player of all time because of all his heart and how he only cares about the team.....I will not be responsible for my actions.

Posted by: RaysFan | November 07, 2008 at 12:50 PM

Swisher could be had for less than Marquez or Horne. Don't get me wrong, I like swisher. But his BA dropped to .212, his OBP dropped to .332, and Slugging to .410.

Maybe it was cuz it was his first year in a new place? Maybe it was bad luck?
But his value has dropped nevertheless

Posted by: Zig | November 07, 2008 at 01:01 PM

Swisher hated Chicago and Ozzie Guillen which probably played a part. Also, I think the White Sox will try to get more because of how much they had to trade.

Posted by: RaysFan | November 07, 2008 at 01:05 PM

Love Rocco and he seems to be a perfect Red Sock. Have thought that since day one, I really think that makes a lot of sense and it ends up happening.

Buchholz for Salty makes way too much sense. Perfect deal it seems.

Posted by: CubbyFan23 | November 07, 2008 at 01:05 PM

Rocco loves the Rays and how they treated him like a human being when things looked real bad.

Something other teams probably wouldn't of done, especially the Red Sox.

If the Rays show interest, I can't see him going elsewhere. All it will take is incentives.

Posted by: RaysFan | November 07, 2008 at 01:10 PM

Buchholz for Salty makes great sense. I rather give Buchholz and someone else for Teagarden, but thats me.

I think Buchholz is gonna be a star somewhere, but I am too in love with Bowden and Masterson at this point to really care.

Besides, with Boston picking up Wake's option, and their desire to sign a 5th starter, Bowden or Buchholz will have almost no time to shine in the Bigs. Masterson got lucky with that bullpen role.

Posted by: Charged | November 07, 2008 at 01:18 PM

Out of the young catchers I think Jarrod Saltalamacchia is the most MLB ready. But Teagarden would be nice to get aswell. Jeff Clement just doesnt wow me anymore. PLEASE theo do not get Bengie...he is so SLOW lol...o ya one more thing PLEASE THEO find a way to get Lugo out of Boston

Posted by: Larsen101 | November 07, 2008 at 01:21 PM

"Rocco loves the Rays and how they treated him like a human being when things looked real bad.

Something other teams probably wouldn't of done, especially the Red Sox"

That is an untrue statement. The Sox stood by Lester when he had cancer. How is that different?

Posted by: turnthe2 | November 07, 2008 at 01:24 PM

The only way to get Lugo out of Boston is to take a horrible contract. The names we always seem to hear about bad contracts....

- Eric Byrnes (D'Backs have Drew at SS)
- Luis Castillo (I think the Red Sox are set at 2B)
- Nate Robertson (Most likely but a pretty damn bad pitcher)
- Dontrelle Willis(I just don't see that 22 game winner ever returning)

Posted by: RaysFan | November 07, 2008 at 01:25 PM

Why not just get Clement if you don't have to give up Buch/Bowden/Bard ? That's what I would do, Clement still has great upside IMO.

Posted by: kinsler5 | November 07, 2008 at 01:26 PM

"Swisher could be had for less than Marquez or Horne. Don't get me wrong, I like swisher. But his BA dropped to .212, his OBP dropped to .332, and Slugging to .410."

Which is still just saying his AVG dropped since an AVG dip leads to OBP and SLG dips. Like Scribble said, this was because of his crazy low BABIP; 4th worst in baseball. That sort of thing usually works itself out.

(Normalize his BABIP to .300, spread the hits out without increasing HRs and his line is .262/.368/.462. He's still very good, just got unlucky. Kenny Williams is one of the few GMs I might think doesn't see that.)

Posted by: Not Joe Morgan | November 07, 2008 at 01:26 PM

Swish did not hate chicago or ozzie, he just hated sitting the bench. KW has stated that swish will start for the sox and also has stated seperately that he won't start in CF. I'm not a rhodes scholar but I'd say that either dye or konerko gets moved to make way for swish unless KW gets blown away with an offer for swish. Ie not coco or yanks minor leaguers

Posted by: trober81 | November 07, 2008 at 01:27 PM

What about Byrnes for Lugo if the Sox deal Crisp? Arizona could throw Lugo at 2B to replace Hudson and at the same time dump the Byrnes deal. Sox get a gritty Boston-esque player who can come off the bench for some spark and be a decent enough 4th/5th OF with quite a bit of upside.

Would either side do that?

Posted by: CubbyFan23 | November 07, 2008 at 01:37 PM

"What about Byrnes for Lugo if the Sox deal Crisp? Arizona could throw Lugo at 2B to replace Hudson and at the same time dump the Byrnes deal. Sox get a gritty Boston-esque player who can come off the bench for some spark and be a decent enough 4th/5th OF with quite a bit of upside."

The only way I see this happening is if we trade away Coco, and I really think it will be one or the other that goes. I would approve Lugo for Byrnes if Coco were to go, but if he stays, no. Its basically swapping a 20 million contract for another 20 million contract, and Byrnes is a proven player, whereas Lugo is just a waste of money whatever way you slice it.

Posted by: Charged | November 07, 2008 at 01:43 PM

Yes, Byrnes leaving the dbacks would open up the outfield for their good young players, and Lugo would fill a hole, but why not try to trade Byrnes for a prospect or prospects and resign O-Dog? it would be almost the same $ for him as Lugo and he's a better player....

Posted by: turnthe2 | November 07, 2008 at 02:04 PM

"Bucholz for Salty

raw for raw, we have to much pitching, they have to many catchers, makes to much sense that it will never happen"

raw ace potential >>>>>>> raw and possibly moving from behind the plate.

Plus you cannot have "too much" pitching.

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:08 PM

here is some thoughts:

Lugo to CWS for Vazquez+cash

Crisp to Phillies for Marson (so they can trade Victorino plus for Holliday)

Buchholz to TX for Salty(1B and C)

Bowden starts in Bullpen and if someone from Wake, Beck, Vazquez gets hurt he can slide in.

Sign Loretta and Baldelli and maybe Beimel or Eyre to fill out the bullpen with Bard coming in from Spring Training.

Posted by: theJonathan | November 07, 2008 at 02:10 PM

"Swish did not hate chicago or ozzie, he just hated sitting the bench. KW has stated that swish will start for the sox and also has stated seperately that he won't start in CF. I'm not a rhodes scholar but I'd say that either dye or konerko gets moved to make way for swish unless KW gets blown away with an offer for swish. Ie not coco or yanks minor leaguers"

KW has stated several times Dye is going nowhere. Konerko has zero value, a NTC iirc, and is owed a decent chunk of cash. Swisher is by far the most moveable piece. KW has also stated he wants to add speed to the line up, crisp and/or lugo could easily be involved in a trade for Swisher.

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:10 PM

"Bowden starts in Bullpen and if someone from Wake, Beck, Vazquez gets hurt he can slide in."

Yes that makes sense, your 22 year old starter, prime for his first full season in AAA should actually start in the bullpen

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:11 PM

you can when you cant use it all and you lack in other areas, you can then, we were so focused on pitching pitching pitching, that we really forgot some other areas and got lucky in others.

"potential" could be best player in history and biggest bust in history, both players at their age and skill level right now can still go either way, they are both risky with heavy reward, thats why its perfect

Posted by: 04Forever | November 07, 2008 at 02:13 PM

Since when is Daniel Bard ready for the majors?

And how in the world is Crisp going to bring back Marson? He's quietly regarded as one of the best catching prospects in the minors.

Lugo for Vazquez is the only thing that makes sense, but CHW is dumping him for salary relief, they're not going to accept a bad contract in return and send cash.

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:14 PM

"you can when you cant use it all and you lack in other areas, you can then, we were so focused on pitching pitching pitching, that we really forgot some other areas and got lucky in others.

You think the Sox forgot about other areas because they were so focused on pitching? First of all, pitching is worth focusing on as intensely as they did. Secondly, I doubt such a focus resulted in an inability to improve the team.

Salty hasn't show anything but brief, very brief flashes of promise with the bat. He was incredibly over hyped coming from Atlanta and hasn't built on that hype. He also is likely to move from behind the plate, his build combined with his defense make him more suitable for 1b, in the eyes of some scouts.

I honestly think you just type something and hope it's true.

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:17 PM

"Swisher could be had for less than Marquez or Horne."

Maybe, maybe not. I think you're simultaneously undervaluing Swisher while overvaluing Marquez or Horne, both of which have seen their value plummet despite the fact they were originally products of the New York hype machine.

Career low babip combined with peripherals in line with career averages= candidate for bounce back

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:21 PM

ok, well im not gonna argue with you, but every post youve made on this thread has been tearing other people down on what they think, nobody was doing that until you started typing, so look alittle inward on that.

Posted by: 04Forever | November 07, 2008 at 02:22 PM

actually he can play 2B which is where CHW has no one to play, and Lugo just got injured and beaten out. He is still a average infielder at 2B.

So you are the same person who thinks that Marson should bring back what ? If they want to trade for Holliday, they are expected to START with Victorino, so where do they get a CF from?

Ok then he starts in AAA and when there is an injury he can spot start.

By the way, why is Bard not ready for the Majors in the Bullpen? Lester was dominant in AA and then came up the next season. Buchholz was pitching for AA and then next season came up to the Majors. He then started the next season in the rotation.

We don't need to baby a 1st round college and soon to be major league ready pitcher, it is only bullpen work, not specialist or setup man roles.

Posted by: theJonathan | November 07, 2008 at 02:23 PM

by the way Kenan go ask Kel if the Marquez and Horne post should even be in this comment section.

Posted by: theJonathan | November 07, 2008 at 02:25 PM

"ok, well im not gonna argue with you, but every post youve made on this thread has been tearing other people down on what they think, nobody was doing that until you started typing, so look alittle inward on that."

Because the majority of people here enjoy playing the role of arm chair gm without a single glance at any piece of statistical data, which could substantiate their claims so people like me won't make fun of them.

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:25 PM

"LMAO Treated him like a human being....you mean by declining to pick up his option when he was sick? That's why he's a free agent right now."

Shhh

The rays know how to approach the game the right way!

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:26 PM

"So you are the same person who thinks that Marson should bring back what ? If they want to trade for Holliday, they are expected to START with Victorino, so where do they get a CF from?"

Just because the Phillies would have a hole in CF doesn't mean you trade one of the best catching prospects in the game for Coco Crisp. Sure, I'd love to see it happen but it won't.

"Ok then he starts in AAA and when there is an injury he can spot start."

See this makes more sense, spot starting when necessary. Coming out of the ML bullpen isn't going to help Bowden as much as starting wherever he is needed.

"By the way, why is Bard not ready for the Majors in the Bullpen? Lester was dominant in AA and then came up the next season. Buchholz was pitching for AA and then next season came up to the Majors. He then started the next season in the rotation."

I expect to see Bard in 09. Not in April.

Posted by: Kenan and Kel | November 07, 2008 at 02:30 PM

Rocco Baldelli will not be in a Red Sox uniform. Book it.

Posted by: melonis rex | November 07, 2008 at 02:43 PM

""LMAO Treated him like a human being....you mean by declining to pick up his option when he was sick? That's why he's a free agent right now.""

6MM for a bench player, regardless of how special he is, is way too much, for MOST teams. Rocco is just that, a bench player. Nobody will give him that much for one year, trust me.

Nobody here knows what was going on internally in terms of support, or what internal talks have gone on between Rocco and the Rays FO.

Posted by: melonis rex | November 07, 2008 at 02:46 PM

Sox will make the Willis for Lugo trade.

Sox will trade Coco for a respectable arm in the pen, or he won't be traded.

Sox will try to deal Lowell for hopes of Teixeira. In the end, nobody wants Lowell thus making the Teixeira dream done and over with.

The Sox will get one of the Texas Trio. If it's Teagarden then its Buchholz. If it's Salty then it's going to be Bowden.

Max Ramirez, might be the best offensive catcher from the group, in my opinion.

Mark that stuff down.

Posted by: soxcurse | November 07, 2008 at 02:59 PM

Coco plus choice of Zink (14-6 2.84) or Pauley (14-4 3.55) for Teagarden. Texas NEEDS pitching.

Definitely take the Lugo for Willis trade. Especially if Willis is willing to try his hand at setup man.

Posted by: Little Bear | November 07, 2008 at 03:53 PM

^^^ Why on earth would the Rangers need Coco? Hamilton, Cruz, Murphy, Byrd, and Bradley (granted he would be a DH if resigned)?? They have no need for him.

Also, you really think Zink or Pauley would haul back Teagarden? No. It would have to be Bowden or Buchholz plus maybe another prospect or two.

Posted by: Charged | November 07, 2008 at 04:20 PM

"Get ready cuz here it comes. How about Buchholz, Bowden, and Lowell(2/24) for Teagarden and ss Michael Young(5/80)? 2 top young pitchers and a 3b for 2 years for a young catcher and a fine,albeit, overpaid ss whose contract Texas would love to unload. Sox then either sign Teixeira or move Lowrie to 3b. Boston 1-9 would no longer carry any dead bats like Lugo and Tek. Make it happen Theo!"

Wow! Maybe then we can trade Julio Lugo for Ryan Howard, Chase Utley, AND Cole Hamels! Or or Roy Halladay, Vernon Wells, and Alex Rios for Coco Crisp! That would be soooo cool! We would have like half the allstar team!!!

Posted by: Charged | November 07, 2008 at 07:26 PM

hahahahahaha Charged.... ok lugo will be traded, crisp again will be going nowhere.

tex will NOT be in a sox uniform. Why not go get holliday? put him at 1st base? and no tht isnt for lugo or crisp.

third, tek will be resigned cheap or they will go get a proven vet to bring along a oung catcher, possibly shopach.

Baldelli is a gamer. just not the gamer who will leave his team for money elsewhere like some players in the bigs.

Posted by: gmac | November 07, 2008 at 07:55 PM

Terrible trade for the Red Sox. Young was an average SS offensively and a bad defensive one with a terrible contract to boot. 5 years at $80M makes JD Drew look like a bargain for the next 3 years at 3 for $54M or whatever exactly is left. And to give up our 2 best SP prospects??? Plus Lowell??? Just to get Teagarden and that??? I want no part of Michael Young, and no part of giving up Bowden and Buchholz. And way to leave out Young's mediocre at best .339 OBP.

Posted by: drchstrpunk | November 07, 2008 at 10:44 PM

The Red Sox should strongly go after Burnett, Teixeria, and Baldelli.

And what is this with people wanting Pudge? Your getting rid of Tek to get Pudge, that makes no sense at all. They both suck offensivly and are beat up. The Red Sox should trade away Crisp and maybe a prospect to get Bengi Molina or Jarrod Saltalamacchia.

Posted by: redsoxbaseball | November 08, 2008 at 12:56 PM

The Red Sox need to get rid of Lugo. I say the Lugo for Willis deal might be a good one. Salary dump for salary dump, but the Sox need a pitcher and Willis has a lot of upside. I don't see the 22 game winner coming back, but with the Red Sox personnel I see him turning around.

I also say if possible sign Varitek back for a one to two year small money contract. With that bring in Salty who has said he would "love to play with Jason Varitek." Phase in Salty with Tek as his mentor and you have a catcher for years to come.

Posted by: FiskVaritek | November 13, 2008 at 11:17 PM

Just an add on to that last comment Lugo could also go for Nate Robertson in the same kind of deal.

Posted by: FiskVaritek | November 13, 2008 at 11:24 PM

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Red Sox Rumors: Crisp, Lugo, Burnett, Baldelli

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