The Rays’ Biggest Needs

The trade deadline is two months away, and it's time to start looking at the needs of contenders.  With the best record in baseball, you wouldn't expect the Rays to have many.

At 5.12 runs scored per game, the Rays rank fourth in the American League.  First base is one possible area to address, as Carlos Pena is down to .175/.299/.350 after a brutal May.  If he doesn't come around in June, the trade market could offer Paul Konerko, Adam LaRoche, and Lance Berkman.  Internally, Hank Blalock hit well in Triple A and the Rays have a couple of minor league veterans tearing it up in Dan Johnson and Chris Richard.

The Rays have mainly been using Blalock as their designated hitter lately.  If they look to make a change, Luke Scott and Travis Hafner could be two available DHs, though it's hard to imagine a Hafner deal given the $36.6MM remaining on his contract through 2012.  A Ty Wigginton reunion could be a low-risk move.  A guy like Jim Edmonds could be rented to DH against righties. 

The Rays appear to have weathered the loss of J.P. Howell, as the bullpen still has weapons like Rafael Soriano, Grant Balfour, and Joaquin Benoit.  The Rays might even be able to spare Andy Sonnanstine, who won 13 games in '08 and could help a team like the Cardinals or Mets.


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83 Comments on "The Rays’ Biggest Needs"


5 years 2 months ago

I think the RAYS biggest need is to get people to show up to that dump of a ballpark!!!

unbiasedhomer
5 years 2 months ago

And hey, it took all of one post to fall back on the tired attendance argument.

Never mind that Cincinnati’s in first place and draws less people, the two perfect games this year have drawn a combined 24k people or that San Diego (also in first place) would draw less people if it weren’t for the 50k Dodger fans at their series down there, it’s all the Rays’ fault.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

…You’re calling that “an attendance argument”?

What is he arguing exactly?

unbiasedhomer
5 years 2 months ago

Perhaps it’s not so much of an “argument”, but the main line of retort/insult/whatever you wish to call it from those snarky fans in other cities is how the Rays don’t draw.

Tropicana Field is absolutely a dump. I can say this from having attended multiple games there. To simply fall back on insulting the Rays’ attendance, though, is being lazy.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

I dunno man. I’m not really disagreeing with you, I just don’t think anyone else is either. You agree with him that it’s a dump.

It seems like an insult to Rays fans and that market, not the team.

ronny9
5 years 2 months ago

I am from the northeast and from May 14th to the 24th I was in Florida on vacation. During that time we were out and about the whole time. I literally counted 4 TB shirts/hats etc. (I made it a point to count them aloud to my girlfriend) and I didn’t see any Marlins gear at all. I don’t know if its the ballpark, the fans or the team itself but if you go to Mass you see 4 peices of sox gear every minute (let alone TEN DAYS), i went to Chicago two years ago and saw a boat load of both Cubs and White Sox gear everywhere. I live in Maine (population slightly over 1.3 Million) and there is more TB Ray gear here than in Florida (population nearly 19 Million) that is about 15 times what we have here in Maine so don’t give me the old people for the summer argument either.

What it comes down to is you have a first place team and two teams that for the last 3 years have been at the very least, competitive. Go to the games, watch your team play. Support the teams that are right there in front of you.

Or let them go somewhere else; there are a ton of markets that either could use a ball club or could support another one.

at the very least, don’t complain when people point out that you (as a whole fanbase) suck at supporting your club. Agree, disagree, either way; facts are facts. The seats are empty: good thing for the fans of these other teams or your team would already be bankrupt due to lack of support.

Don’t point fingers to other teams who are just as pisspoor or worse as a fanbase. Go to the games, that is what you all can do to help. And if you can’t afford to do that, how about buying a TB or Marlins hat.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

…Who are you talking to?

I’m not defending anything or pointing fingers. I not only hate Tampa, but all of Florida. I don’t live there and never have. I used to live in Boston. I agree with your entire comment.

The dude referred to an “attendance argument”. I didn’t see one.

ronny9
5 years 2 months ago

I wasn’t talking to anyone really, I just replied to you b/c you were the last one in the convo at the time..

I wanted to simply point out my observations from just a one and two weeks ago. It was very sad to see and anyone who thinks there isn’t a problem is sadly mistaken..

I wasn’t pointing any fingers tho. I just hit reply; not to you but to the conversation.

5 years 2 months ago

Uh, it was clearly a shot at the fans & the ballpark. As far as Cincinnati’s attendace goes; they weren’t in the World Series 2 years ago and don’t have the 2 biggest road draws in baseball (Red Sox & Yankees) playing 18 games a year at their park. If Tampa could get a serious fan base they’d be able to make TONS of moves…hence what “The Ray’s biggest needs” are”.

Boz
5 years 2 months ago

if it aint broke dont fix it

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

It might not be broken, but it could sure be outperformed by 2 if not 3 other teams in its own division. The Rays have come back to earth a bit lately. Looking at possible acquisitions makes sense.

Boz
5 years 2 months ago

both boston and toronto are over achieving right now. Tampa has only the yanks to worry about. Pena will turn it around. maybe get some extra bullpen help but thats really it. no need for a “Big” acquisition

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Boston is overachieving? lol

Toronto I agree, but that doesn’t matter because while they’re overachieving, they’re handing the Rays losses. And that’s still the point — even if we imagine the Sox are overachieving too.

Boz
5 years 2 months ago

yes boston is over achieving. they are no longer the mighty team of yore with papi and manny in the middle of the lineup. every one expected their pitching to be good but we see now how good they are when they arent working with 4-5-6 run leads.

i would actually say that boston is over achieving more than toronto when you look at the teams closely. toronto has a pretty good core of young talent coming up and producing now, where as boston is old and overpaid. kind of like the yankees of the 2000’s

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

You’re right. I expected Boston to be 10 games under .500 at this point. They stink and have no talent. Surprised they’re still called a team. I would think they will end the year with the worst record in the AL but the Rays will continue on their pace to win 105 games in the toughest division in baseball. SUREYou’re nuts brother.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Ah, just an idiot then. I see. Carry on.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Depending on the cost, Laroche might actually be a good hedge.

unbiasedhomer
5 years 2 months ago

One would think the biggest acquisitions they could make would be related to bench depth. Bartlett’s injury/underperformance has forced the Rays to use Brignac more often, which takes away a bench bat. Shoppach’s eventual return will likely fortify the bench, as Navarro should (note: should) be sent packing, and either Jaso or Shoppach will be available. They may also benefit from another lefty in the bullpen, but so would about eight or nine other teams.

davidchu
5 years 2 months ago

the rays need a big bat imo, they should go for prince fielder, and give them selves 2 years with a shot at the world series. every sport has a team that develops the right way and when they make that game changer trade, its either too soon in he development cycle or too late, the rays imo are approaching that too late period.

5 years 2 months ago

I do like the Fielder idea…I hadn’t considered it but it does fit with their recent attempts in years past to go for big names.

AisoRed
5 years 2 months ago

What pitching would the Rays make available for Prince? We all know that Milwaukee needs all the pitching it can get…

04Forever
5 years 2 months ago

The start of every sentence would be “David Price”

AisoRed
5 years 2 months ago

Doesn’t sound like that would be easy for them to give up though…

04Forever
5 years 2 months ago

Its not, and they wont. If the Brewers would take quantity over quality its possible, but the Brewers shouldnt do that with their franchise player

AisoRed
5 years 2 months ago

I love Prince, but I know we have to shop him to be anywhere near contending. I just want us to get a good deal for him and I agree, I’d rather take quality over quantity.

Ferrariman
5 years 2 months ago

i’d think the rays would give up jeremy hillickson and a ptbnl, maybe another big name prospect if the brewers ate some salary.

AisoRed
5 years 2 months ago

Are any of these players owed money? We might be able to eat some of it.

aap212
5 years 2 months ago

They might ask for Price, but Hellickson is probably better than the best player they would get in another package.

04Forever
5 years 2 months ago

I agree with the Fielder trade for the Rays as well, but talks will start at Price and thats going to go no where, fast. Besides, you know there are going to be alot of other times going head first for Fielder as well, my team, the red sox, will also be ringing the phone line off the hook as well im sure

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

I sure hope not.

04Forever
5 years 2 months ago

Frankly, I dont think Fielder is worth the likes of a potential ace, I dont think many position players are. The rare exception would be two guys, one named Albert and one named Hanley, neither is available. Im sure the Rays will still see if they can get him, but Im sure they will keep hitting the wall. Wiggington or LaRoche would cost less and produce until the end of the year when the Rays can take a step back and look at their situation and see if they want to go get a franchise defining bat. I think the Red Sox NEED the franchise bat now if they want to contend now and in the future

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Mostly agree. A big bat is important but not worth what it usually fetches in trade. Also, if it’s a franchise bat you’re after, I’d like one that could at least play a position reliably. Not loving Fielder for that role.

ronny9
5 years 2 months ago

Prince to the Rays for (I don’t know the Rays’ farm system) some (at least 2 of your best) pitching prospects and a major league ready position player. Good luck resigning him tho.

Put him in the 4 spot behind Longoria with that staff and the East will be over.

Bartlett SS
Crawford LF
Longoria 3B
Fielder DH
Zobrist RF
Pena/Blalock 1B
Upton CF
Brignac 2B
Shoppach C eventually when he comes off the DL

that is pretty scary.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

The only MLB ready position player the Rays have is Desmond Jennings and Reid Brignac. Not sure if the Brewers would want Reid seeing as they have Escobar, and Jennings is our #1 prospect, not no “filler” prospect.Jeremy HellicksonANDMatt MooreThat’s far too much for a half season rental. 10-12 years for .5 season? No chance.This goes against everything the Rays are about. Next topic.

AisoRed
5 years 2 months ago

Fielder has 1.5 years left…

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Does he? I apologize. I checked Cot’s and it said ’10 was the final year on his contract. Nonetheless, I think it would still be too much even if he had 2-3 years left on his contract.

ronny9
5 years 2 months ago

Than you are insane. Especially if you are a Rays fan. As a fan of the team to get a full year plus the rest of this year all of that time being such where the team should be very competitive for two guys who could be great but also might not be?

You do the deal, if the brewers call and say “i’ll give you Prince for Hellickson and Moore” you do it. Period.

What most fans seem to forget is that prospects are just unknown until they come to the big leagues and produce for more than a year. Until he has a major league track record he is a question mark. Some question marks are bigger and bolder and some are safer bets to be good than others; but your talking 285 or so games of Prince Fielder.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Sorry, I’m keeping Hellickson and Moore. Moore, without a doubt, it’s early on him. But Hellickson, you can pretty much see what you got. Especially his last 2 outings where it’s being reported he now has a cutter, you could find me calling him a #1 soon instead of a #2 or #3 in this rotation.

It would probably cost us more than these 2 guys anyways. I’ll hold on to the players we have, just my opinion.

14 years of good players > 1.5 of great players. Again, this is just my opinion.

5 years 2 months ago

Fielder would be a DISATER for the RAYS!
Not only would they have to empty the top tier of their farm for him, there is an ABSOLUTE ZERO chance they resign him.
Would be a total waste for the RAYS. If they wanted a power hitting 1B/DH type they could go after Konerko or Berkman for a fraction of the cost to their minor league depth.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

The Rays simply are not cut out to be perennial contenders in the AL East. They have to move in cycles and that means going all-out for 2 or 3 years to try to bring in a title or two before the young talent becomes to expensive to retain.

Iow, the fact that they’d lose Fielder after a couple years isn’t a sufficient reason not to move on him.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Desmond Jennings replaces Carl Crawford and that’s it. We’re basically fielding the same team in 2011 as in 2010. Not sure why people think it’s do or die for the Rays this season.Jeremy Hellickson and Desmond Jennings next season, trade a Jeff Niemann (example) and help fill some holes. Hell, we may even be BETTER next season.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Right, and you’d have Fielder in 2011, too. So it makes sense.

Are you implying that the Rays CAN become perennial contenders? Because if you’re not, you’re not disagreeing with me.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

We don’t need Prince to contend, even in the AL East. We’ve done fine up to this point without a power bat. Why give up 10 years of our 2 top pitching prospects for 1.5 years of Prince? The Rays will contend for a long time as long as they continue to manage the team in a smart manner, and that means not unloading two of your top prospects (in a system that’s top 3 nonetheless) for a rental. I consider a year and a half a rental, yes.

All I’m saying is, the Rays wouldn’t even be thinking about Prince if they were thinking about deals like Prince in the past. If that makes since. It’s the lack of Prince-like deals in the past that have made the Rays who they are to this day. Pass on Prince.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

The Rays do need a bat. They have been kinda lucky up to this point. When the Rays were doing their best they had just .200 average with bases empty and .300 with runners on. That is a flukish thing and the numbers have since changed to .230 without men on and .274 with men on. And since the first article (written on May 22) The Rays are 4-6. They were abnormally lucky with men on and a little unlucky without men on. They offense was more lucky and I remember my friend (who likes the Rays) talking to me about how the Rays would score in one inning of a game, but get 5+ runs in that inning to win it. I think the Rays offense is a little overrated and they DO need something if they want to contend.

BTW stat fun: Evan Longoria average in April and May in his first 3 years: .302. Average outside of those months: .270. Feel free to hate me when I say he is a first half hitter.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

Also the article that went over the Rays numbers with and without men on: link to draysbay.com

Pretty good read

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Stop adding their overlapping years together. You don’t have 10; you have 5 years of two players or 1.5 years of one. And aside from the proven > potential aspect, the answer to “why give those years up” is because their projected production down the line may not be nearly as valuable to the team as the 1.5 guy’s in the next 1.5.

The calculus of which is more valuable depends on things other than the projectable production those players would provide: team needs, especially.

If you have a surplus of young players and could use an established power bat, it could very well be in your interest to make the trade — EVEN when the bat is a short term asset and the young players would be controllable longer term.

All of this is especially true when you don’t have the budget to maintain a contending roster for more than a few years at a time.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

I keep hearing about a budget to maintain a contending roster, as if afterwards the Rays will blast off into oblivion only to never be heard from again.

That’s not, nor will it ever be the case. As long as they don’t go “all in”, for one year. Once any team makes it to the playoffs, it’s a crapshoot from there, I don’t think anyone can deny that the best team doesn’t always win.

The reason the Rays will maintain constant success is by not making trades like this. Sure, going “all in” seems like a novel idea, but in the end I don’t see a player like Prince providing any kind of large positive difference towards this team. None that would warrant letting go of 2 of the top 3 players in a farm system that’s considered one of the best.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

Trading a couple of prospects for an MVP bat is not going all in, mistah blue chip fetish.

The leap of faith required to think that the Rays can continue their abnormally high conversion rate of prospects to top players — and quickly enough to replace the developed talent they cannot afford to retain or replace through free agency — is simply not my bag. I like math.

I’d love to see the Rays stick around; I really would. But no team with their MO ever does. With a budget like theirs and a fan base that promises to keep it capped, success can only be cyclical. The success of those runs at contention and length of time between them depend largely on how hard they resist it. Do they overvalue prospects, as you do, such that they can only rarely see the developmental timing work out such that they are WS material? Do they trade young talent away too freely for big name rentals and future draft picks, such that they get a title or two and sink back to Baltimore status for awhile?

There’s a balance to be struck, for sure. Your position so far doesn’t show much balance, specifically because you don’t acknowledge the inevitability of the cycle. Maybe you’ll learn as the success rate of TB’s prospects comes back to earth over time. Or maybe I’ll be proven wrong. The latter would be more entertaining, but it’s never the good one to put your money on.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Please explain your “cycle” in more detail. I’m not sure with what you’re implying. That we’ll be good for 3 years and then suck or start over?We have Evan Longoria till he’s roughly 90 years old, James Shields till something like 2012, Price, Davis and Hellickson are all greener than green. The scouting department is top notch and we will always be adding in new top prospects throughout the years. Next year it’ll be Jennings (#6 BA prospect) and Jeremy Hellickson (#18 BA prospect). Then the year after that it’ll probably be another top prospect being woven into the team. Please elaborate on your “cycles”.

Each of those years the Rays will be contenders. The core guys from now will still be there, and when the time comes that they’re gone, a new core will be set. We have excess organization depth? No problems, the scouting department will kick in and dismantle someone else’s team to fill holes in ours. That’s the type of cycle I’m talking about..

Just look at the trade tree of Andrew Friedman since being with the Rays.

Delmon Young into Matt Garza & Jason Bartlett
Scott Kazmir into Alex Torres, Matt Sweeney, and Sean Rodriguez
Edwin Jackson into Matt Joyce

That’s the core of this team, and the future core of this team. What’d we give up? A pitcher who no longer has it that is commanding a hefty salary, a guy with a flash of success who now can’t even get hitters out in the NL, and a once “5 tools” player who never lived up to the hype.

That’s what the Rays are about, and that’s what will keep them alive as long as the current regime is in place.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

“Please explain your “cycle” in more detail. I’m not sure with what you’re implying. That we’ll be good for 3 years and then suck or start over?”

I thought I was pretty specific. Tampa doesn’t have the budget to maintain a playoff contender in the AL East year after year after year. What they are forced to do is content in cycles. They’ve been far better at planning for and executing this so far than Baltimore and Toronto, for example. Here’s hoping they can extend this run more than 2 or 3 years. But that’s what we’d be doing, see. Hoping.

Longoria for example is an amazing exception confirming a very solid rule when it comes to securing young talent of that caliber. 3, maybe 4 years inexpensively. Years 5 and 6 not dealbreakers but not a bargain. Then gone.

“The scouting department is top notch and we will always be adding in new top prospects throughout the years.”

“The core guys from now will still be there, and when the time comes that they’re gone, a new core will be set.”

Welp. There’s that wishful thinking thing again. At least you understand that this is the only way to stay in contention. You just seem in a wee bit of denial about the plausibility of selecting and successfully grooming top players with regularity required to contend on short dollars in the AL East of all places.

I mean you know this is about as bad as Boston’s going to be for the next long while, yeah? NY won’t slow down. Toronto’s working on an upswing of its own. Baltimore will never stop being a pain in the ass.

A couple of successful seasons have distorted your perception a bit I think.

bballstud16
5 years 2 months ago

So according to you, Desmond Jennings will just waltz up into the big leagues automatically bat over .300, steal 60 bases, hit 15 long balls, and plate in 70 runs? That seems like a lot to expect from a rookie. Expectations for this guy are way too high, and he will not seemlessly replace Carl Crawford as you say he will. That is just a ludacris thought. He will be a solid rookie, no doubt, but he won’t be as good as CC in his first couple years.

Why would you want to trade Nieman, who is perhaps our most consistent starter this year, for another unproven rookie?

This is why Jeremy Hellickson is expendable. There is not spot for him in our rotation now, or in the future. Put together a package including him, maybe a pitcher from one of our first round picks this year, and a Matt Moore or Alex Colome.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Jeff Niemann is a nice guy and all, but he’s do for some serious regression. His BABIP is .220, he generally will sit at .310. When that numbers start to regress, Jeff Niemann’s numbers won’t be so pretty any more. Be prepared for it.Niemann is a #5 starter at best in this rotation. Hellickson is a #2 or #3 in this rotation.Trading the better pitcher here (Hellickson), because Niemann is pitching over his head is stupid. The Rays won’t tell you this, but they know it. So don’t be shocked if you see Niemann gone. I’m just saying. You won’t miss Niemann and his 4.40-ish FIP when you see Hellboy, I can guarantee you that. Sell high, like what we should have done with Bartlett, we all see how that’s working out now. He’s got a near identical slash line to BJ Upton.

EDIT: Just so you know, you can’t just trade a player after you draft him, he’s got to be under contract for an entire year before you can trade him.

bballstud16
5 years 2 months ago

Oh I had no idea about that. Well there goes my scenario of trading our draft picks. I totally agree with you about Niemann in that he is not as good as he has been pitching. The guy isn’t a ‘sexy’ pitcher (for lack of a better phrase). I mean that he doesn’t have overwhelming stuff, he just gets the job done. I won’t even pretend to understand the stats you just gave me, but I do agree with your point about Niemann. I’m just saying that I’m a little unsure about throwing another rookie into this arms race for the playoffs. Depending on a rookie to take down the Yanks and BoSox is kinda scary to me (this year atleast).

I have seen what dumping a farm system to rent a player does to a team (look no further than the Brewers trading for CC) but I wouldn’t mind it in this situation. The Rays have a young lineup in the majors already, and their starting rotation isn’t going anywhere (hopefully). Trading some of our best prospects (who don’t really have a fit on the Rays in the near future anyway) wouldn’t be all that bad. We have a butt load of draft picks this year so if we depart with the likes of Hellickson, Moore, or Colome, we could somewhat replenish them with our numerous draft picks.

aap212
5 years 2 months ago

They need about two thirds of their lineup to start hitting up to their ability.

04Forever
5 years 2 months ago

I think “need” is the wrong word for MLB’s best team, maybe a “wish list” is more accurate. I wouldnt want to trade away some fine prospects on which the team has built itself to bring in for just one big name that will probably be a rental, unless they go against their own history and were willing to sign a big name like Prince or Willingham to an extension

grant77
5 years 2 months ago

I just watched them play against the Jays last night and that lineup is WEAK once you get past Crawford and Longoria, nobody else really stands out as a threat at the plate. Some kind of DH, C, 1B, 2B, SS, RF or CF who can hit that they can plug into the middle of the lineup to protect Longoria would go a long way.

bballstud16
5 years 2 months ago

As a Rays fan, I would love for them to go out and get a Prince Fielder type player. Names such as Konerko and LaRoache are just very unexciting. First off, I don’t think the Rays have the money to pay Prince. They do have the prospects to make a deal however. If the Brewers want pitching, we could send over Hellickson (our big league ready pitcher in AAA), draft a pitcher with our first round pick, and maybe someone else. Yes Prince would walk in a couple of years, but I think this is the perfect move. It is an ‘exciting’ trade, and would really show fans that they are serious about winning this year, and its not all about money. If Pena gets his act together at the plate, we should keep him at first and Prince could be the DH. Pena is a gold glover; Prince not so much.

But like all the other years, this will never happen. The Rays may discuss this, but in the end they will never pull the trigger. They will settle for an old reliever on his decline.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

When the Rays start catering to their fans feelings with baseball moves, is the day the Rays will return to the cellar.

thegrayrace
5 years 2 months ago

I don’t think it would be such a terrible move. Don’t forget, depending on the Rays situation at the trade deadline next season, they could move Fielder and get prospects back for him. Or there are the draft picks. It isn’t like Fielder will walk and the Rays get nothing in return.

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

It’s certainly true that if any team were justified in ignoring what its fans want, it would be the Rays.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Like Trading Scott “5.33 xFIP / 3 years/$28.5M” Kazmir?

ReverendBlack
5 years 2 months ago

The Rays can certainly pay for Fielder next year. Paying him what he will want after that is a poor choice for almost anybody, Rays included. The picks they’ll get as compensation will serve them well in preparing for their next cycle [hopefully] a few years later.

04Forever
5 years 2 months ago

I do agree with the Rays needing to put some butts in the seats. When they play Boston and I watch the games I still see more Sox fans then Rays fans, and the Rays are the MLB’s best team, i dont understand it. Trading for a big player could change that a bit for awhile, but they definitely need to make some money if they want to keep up the pace in the future years

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

Rays fans need to realize these players are still prospects. Some of them feel like once these players hit the majors, boom, results. Remember Buchholz? His minor league stats, pitches, and physical attributes (size, weight) are almost IDENTICAL to Hellickson, yet it took Buchholz two and a half years after his initial callup before he made a consistent impact on the Major League Club. Another guy: Luke Hochever, who was considered a good pitching prospect who didn’t pan out. I think we have become spoiled from Austin Jackson, Ryan Braun, Evan Longoria, and Jason Heyward over the past few years that we don’t remember the guys who just plain don’t work out despite having the talent.

If the Rays feel they can win it this year Prince would be great for them. Yes it would take Hellickson, Jennings, more? for him but would you rather increase you chances of winning this year to very good or hope that all your prospects pan out in later years?
I want my 2010 World Series Trophy personally.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Now it’s Hellickson AND Jennings? Absolutely NO.
…”and more”. LOL.

Folks just need to save their time, this goes against everything the Rays are about.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

So far “what the Rays are about” has only given them one playoff appearance which netted them a world series loss.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Really with this?

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

How about the Marlin’s way? Pay barely league minimum, trade guys when they become expensive, and get tons of prospects to replace those players. How has that worked out recently? And now you see them paying Josh Johnson and Dan Uggla, something that they wouldn’t have done before (though there was pressure from the commish). When your way doesn’t bring you titles you need to change things up.
CC Sabathia almost single handedly brought the flawed Brewers to the playoffs. Now imagine an impact bat like Fielder being added to a team that is a lot better than those Brewers who had no pitching outside of Gallardo.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Honestly, name me one player worth a damned who the Rays have grown and dumped for salary purposes? Can you name one?

Scott Kazmir? Lol, he’s lighting it up.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

I didn’t say they acted like the Marlins. I gave an example of a club who has their own way of doing things and how they went against it.

bballstud16
5 years 2 months ago

I’m with D09- No way with Hellickson and Jennings. I would do Hellickson, Moore, and maybe some other fillers- but the second they ask for Jennings- the answer is NO. Fielder is good and all, but no way would I do this. There will be a spot for Jennings next year (for CC), unlike Hellickson’s situation where there is not an imediate need (our rotation is set, barring injuries or trades).

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

Unfortunately, to get an impact player you have to give up a lot of prospects and Hellickson + Moore isn’t enough at all I would guess. Moore has struggled this year in high A and has a high BB rate so I doubt the Brewers would take him as a major piece. He would be more of a filler you talked about. Plus it also doesn’t help that fielder has 1.5 years left on the FA clock because that is usually when value is highest (See the Texeira to Braves for Salthalamacchia, Andrus, Neftali Feliz, and 2 other prospects deal)
If you want Fielder I think they would have to give up Desmond and Hellickson.

bballstud16
5 years 2 months ago

Maybe they would have to, but I’m sure glad youre not the GM of the Rays.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

Heavens I would want my team to have the best chance of winning the world series. I’m guess a (if EVERYTHING goes right for him) player equal to Crawford (who hasn’t won it all with the Rays so far) and Hellickson (who is blocked by a crowded rotation and should be for a few more years) isn’t better that 1.5 years of Prince Fielder over .175 Pena even though you could trade him a year later and maybe get back 1 top prospect and might win you a World Series. I’ll be less of an idiot next time.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

The Rays will make room for Hellickson. Niemann is nothing special to keep Hellickson from taking his spot.

Niemann goes, not Hellickson. Wait for it.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

I do agree with that. It would be interesting to see how the Brewers value Neimann in comparison to Hellickson too. Especially given Neimann’s injury history

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Check Moore’s BABIP. He’s got to be the unluckiest pitcher on the entire face of the planet right now.

0.424 BABIP
3.06 FIP even with the unlucky BABIP

I’m not worried.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

He is still only in high A. and last I checked, a walk isn’t a ball in play. You need to do more in your minor league career than he has to be considered a blue chip prospect.

D09
5 years 2 months ago

Sure, his walks aren’t great right now. But he could be working on a new pitch, we don’t know. I’m not willing to let 10 starts change what he’s done as a whole. Check out the K’s, you can’t really teach that. You can fix the walks however.

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

Yes no doubt he is very talented but Neftali Feliz had similar numbers (4.0 BB/9, 9.0 K/9 and better numbers the year before) at age 19 (2 years younger than Moore but he was in rookie ball) and was still basically a throw in for the Teixeira deal. No doubt Rays will be unwilling to part with him if there was a deal but if they were I don’t think the Brewers will rate him as highly as some other players the rays have.

nictonjr
5 years 2 months ago

I see 3 things against Prince Fielder:

1. The 2 or 3 top pitching prospects the Rays would have to give up
2. Arbitration after 2010
3. Scott Boras

Can the Rays pay the $15 mil+ Fielder would get?? Will the ‘+’ be $5 mil?? The Rays have atleast 7 players due arbitration. Can they pay betwee 1/4 and 1/3 of their payroll for 1 year of Fielder???

jwredsox
5 years 2 months ago

Good comparison here: Josh Beckett and Mike Lowell to the Red Sox for Hanley Ramirez, Anibal Sanchez, and other barely mentionables.

As a Sox fan I hated watching Hanley light up NL pitchers and Lugo just imploding in Boston but I would never trade watching them win it all in 07 for Hanley. Beckett and Lowell gave Boston what they needed to get over the hump and they took advantage of it. And I’m not sure with Hanley+Anibal they would have won it all up to this point without other pieces. Rays are a very good team that may be that one bat away from getting over the hump and being the best team in the league maybe. The world series is worth your top 2 prospects and some other minor prospects, trust me.

Boz
5 years 2 months ago

snotty?

hahahahaha, i love how you assume i am a rays fan